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jokes posted:I didn't know this was released, so I looked up info on it. Yikes. Lufia 2 still holds up as a solid JRPG by the way. The actual Lufia 2, not this anime frankenstein. Parts of it weren't bad. Tia was fleshed out a bit more and was decent fun to play as, and the Old Cave is still a good roguelike. Some of the remixed tracks were primo. But that's about all the good I can say about it.
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Dec 17, 2019 21:42
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I always wanted to pick up that Lufia 2 remake since Lufia 2 is in my top 10 JRPG list, but doesn't sound like it's getting any buzz 
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Dec 17, 2019 21:50
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It's good, play it
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Dec 17, 2019 21:53
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Super No Vacancy posted:or a full 3d action rpg remake????? i'm still bummed we never got an FFIVDS style remake of 6 on 3DS
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Dec 17, 2019 21:58
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I'm gonna pretend you said FFIV Vita style
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Dec 17, 2019 22:27
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seiferguy posted:I always wanted to pick up that Lufia 2 remake since Lufia 2 is in my top 10 JRPG list, but doesn't sound like it's getting any buzz Terper posted:It's good, play it
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Dec 17, 2019 22:27
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Orcs and Ostriches posted:I kinda wish we lived in a world where FF6 had 20% more dev time and polish. I think FF8 is the game that needs a full remake the most but I'd really like for FF6 as is to have that. About 20% more dev time and polish makes sense. FF6 needs the Christian Whitehead treatment. Some fan who understands it inside-out to give it that final polish.
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Dec 17, 2019 22:34
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seiferguy posted:I always wanted to pick up that Lufia 2 remake since Lufia 2 is in my top 10 JRPG list, but doesn't sound like it's getting any buzz I remember Lufia 2 having the hardest dungeon puzzles ever. Probably not so as an adult, but thats what I remember of it. And that hosed up glitchy room where you get the sword.
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Dec 17, 2019 23:10
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Orcs and Ostriches posted:I kinda wish we lived in a world where FF6 had 20% more dev time and polish. We actually kind of do live in that world. The whole "World of Ruin" thing wasn't originally planned, but they were ahead of schedule so they decided "hey lets add a whole second world to the game because why not". The floating continent was supposed to be the final dungeon before they made that change.
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Dec 18, 2019 00:24
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TommyGun85 posted:I remember Lufia 2 having the hardest dungeon puzzles ever. Probably not so as an adult, but thats what I remember of it. And that hosed up glitchy room where you get the sword. I think it's one of the best examples I've seen of a puzzle-RPG.
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Dec 18, 2019 00:40
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gigglefeimer posted:It's a sign of a well developed battle system when you can't always coast through everything because of high stats. It evens the playing field and contributes to variety and complexity. See: FF2, where high HP can be a liability in the late game due to some foes dealing damage per hit proportional to your Max HP.
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Dec 18, 2019 01:16
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Super No Vacancy posted:I'm gonna pretend you said FFIV Vita style that'd just be a different looking version of the same game i can already play, though. if it's not going to provide a different experience why wouldn't i just play the old game?
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Dec 18, 2019 07:04
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Mega64 posted:See: FF2, where high HP can be a liability in the late game due to some foes dealing damage per hit proportional to your Max HP. The problem with that isn't that this inherently makes high HP a liability. It makes straight up no difference whatsoever, even. The problem is that they also heal themselves for that damage.
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Dec 18, 2019 22:04
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Dragonatrix posted:The problem with that isn't that this inherently makes high HP a liability. It makes straight up no difference whatsoever, even. And also that your healing does not necessarily scale with your HP, so you're expending a lot more resources to recover from % HP damage attacks with high HP than lower HP.
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Dec 18, 2019 23:00
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Mega64 posted:See: FF2, where high HP can be a liability in the late game due to some foes dealing damage per hit proportional to your Max HP. More specifically, you see this in X-2 where the game encourages flexibility, but players are still in an old-school mindset of being locked into a rigid strategy. Games that give the player more choice are often criticized for their difficulty spikes, which are usually caused by a player's preferred strategy not working so well for a particular situation and their refusal to change their strategy since it had been working up to that point for the most part. This is how you get people playing X-2 complaining that Angra Mainyu takes forever to kill (because they use an overly defensive strategy), that some random battles are harder than bosses (because some enemies are not so straightforward), that Mega Tonberry is OP (because their HP and Defense numbers are not high enough to tank its attacks), that it's unfair for Chac's Stony Glare to always petrify (because they're used to Ribbon removing status effects from the game) etc etc
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Dec 18, 2019 23:35
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gigglefeimer posted:that it's unfair for Chac's Stony Glare to always petrify (because they're used to Ribbon removing status effects from the game) that one actually is unfair tho. I don't know about you, but when I play a video game and get an item that says it does a really powerful thing, I expect it to, you know, do the thing, especially if I had to go out of my way to get it. it's entirely reasonable to expect it to do the thing and unreasonable for the game to then go "nah, it doesn't do the thing you expected it to do and built your gameplan around, because gently caress you is why. hope you like trial and error motherfucker"
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Dec 19, 2019 00:45
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fluffyDeathbringer posted:that one actually is unfair tho. I don't know about you, but when I play a video game and get an item that says it does a really powerful thing, I expect it to, you know, do the thing, especially if I had to go out of my way to get it. it's entirely reasonable to expect it to do the thing and unreasonable for the game to then go "nah, it doesn't do the thing you expected it to do and built your gameplan around, because gently caress you is why. hope you like trial and error motherfucker" That is extremely strong language for a superboss with a save point right before it who's gimmick depends on being able to inflict a status. It is extremely lame to completely nullify the game's entire status effect system with a single equipment slot.
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Dec 19, 2019 00:51
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Then maybe the problem is the existence of the ribbon in the first place.
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Dec 19, 2019 00:58
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Hellioning posted:Then maybe the problem is the existence of the ribbon in the first place. Maybe, but it's definitely a problem to complain about not being able to trivialize 1/3 of a superboss' attacks.
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Dec 19, 2019 01:37
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Truth be told, oldschool JRPGs are not traditional RPGs as much as they're puzzles disguised as combat system. Half of it is intentional to sell guides and call centers that will tell you how to kill any boss with one simple trick, half of it is unintentional result of a bad design. The fact that there are stats that didn't work for example is something that no QA tester is accountable for. There are formulas that work that simply don't do anything. And there's no measurable way to identify that in-game. Also the school of "ailments are useless on the bosses where you need them the most, except for one that is arbitrary and changes every boss" is a terrible, terrible design that went on for too many games and again, serves no purpose other than inflating the need to get external help.
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Dec 19, 2019 02:07
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Elentor posted:Truth be told, oldschool JRPGs are not traditional RPGs as much as they're puzzles disguised as combat system. Half of it is intentional to sell guides and call centers that will tell you how to kill any boss with one simple trick, half of it is unintentional result of a bad design. Yeah, it's definitely a problem that people approach X-2 with a wrong mindset. The game teaches you from the beginning with Songstress that status effects work, and Scan shows the vulnerabilities of enemies.
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Dec 19, 2019 02:39
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I feel like it's newer JRPGs that tend to be more puzzle-like, in that the designers pay a lot of attention to how the systems interact and try to create interesting gameplay interactions you can take advantage of. Oldschool RPGs are by contrast randomly slapped together nonsense that sometimes just expects you to grind forever until you outlevel everything. Which to this day is how a lot of people think it's "supposed" to be.
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Dec 19, 2019 02:47
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So anyone else ever get the weird mental image where the middle of the much accepted modern One Winged Angel orchestral cover of Cloud and Sephiroth just throwing down their swords and just doing a cheek to cheek Tango? Because that bit is just bizarre to hear coming out the blue between the choral chants and drumming. Sorry in advance if I seeded your mind with this.
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Dec 19, 2019 02:53
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Clarste posted:I feel like it's newer JRPGs that tend to be more puzzle-like, in that the designers pay a lot of attention to how the systems interact and try to create interesting gameplay interactions you can take advantage of. Oldschool RPGs are by contrast randomly slapped together nonsense that sometimes just expects you to grind forever until you outlevel everything. Which to this day is how a lot of people think it's "supposed" to be. They were always puzzle-like, the difference is that everything back then was slapped together as you said, and also very experimental. In contrast modern JRPGs have been following formulas either in or outside the genre and after online games a lot of things that work and don't work were far more exposed. Edit: And also they were too easy for anyone to notice. Elentor fucked around with this message at 03:17 on Dec 19, 2019 |
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Dec 19, 2019 03:13
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If you haven’t beaten FFV at level 25, you haven’t really played FFV. FFV, to me, is the pinnacle of old school JRPG combat systems/class systems. Seeing people have high enough HP to survive multiple casts of Almagest baffles me. Grinding in a single player game? What an unfun way to play video games. Grinding, to me, is a punishment for not being able to figure out what’s good.
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Dec 19, 2019 05:54
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FFV is the one with most longevity, definitely. The other ones suffer from a huge issue: FF6/7/8/9/10 could have been great combat games if iterated upon a lot. I'd say 10 needs a modernization and more content (even though it had plenty), probably 9 and 6 need the least polish as far as the raw systems go, FF7 could use more content and fix some useless formulas, and 8... well, 8 is its own thing. They're kinda all missed opportunities. I don't like the FF9 combat in FF9 (too slow-paced and so on) but I think it has my favorite system in a vacuum. I find ironic that FFV stood the test of time. I love it.
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Dec 19, 2019 06:18
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X-2 is the natural progression of V.
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Dec 19, 2019 06:25
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Elentor posted:FFV is the one with most longevity, definitely. The other ones suffer from a huge issue: FF6/7/8/9/10 could have been great combat games if iterated upon a lot. I'd say 10 needs a modernization and more content (even though it had plenty), probably 9 and 6 need the least polish as far as the raw systems go, FF7 could use more content and fix some useless formulas, and 8... well, 8 is its own thing. They're kinda all missed opportunities. I liked the pure turn-based combat of FFX the most of any FF game but yeah it suffers from most of the optional combat-based content being the monster arena. You can spend a shitload of time there but it gets pretty repetitive. I like that they leaned way into “you can become crazy OP if you want to” where the old damage limit is just 10% of your potential, but it would be nice if there was more than just the one optional dungeon plus some superbosses for you to use it.
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Dec 19, 2019 06:42
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gigglefeimer posted:X-2 is the natural progression of V. It is, yeah. I wish I liked X-2 more. I don't think it's bad, it just did not align with my preferences for the gameplay. The Cheshire Cat posted:I liked the pure turn-based combat of FFX the most of any FF game but yeah it suffers from most of the optional combat-based content being the monster arena. You can spend a shitload of time there but it gets pretty repetitive. I like that they leaned way into “you can become crazy OP if you want to” where the old damage limit is just 10% of your potential, but it would be nice if there was more than just the one optional dungeon plus some superbosses for you to use it. X is my favorite turn-combat system as well. I agree with everything you said. I wish it had more content - it may have a lot of content, but it's just really repetitive.
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Dec 19, 2019 07:45
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gigglefeimer posted:That is extremely strong language for a superboss with a save point right before it who's gimmick depends on being able to inflict a status. It is extremely lame to completely nullify the game's entire status effect system with a single equipment slot. being able to do that is actually perfectly reasonable for a rare item that requires either thorough exploration or achieving some egregious challenge, which ribbon mostly is. the easiest ribbon you can get in x-2 is by doing an extra bevelle puzzle in chapter 3, and the other ones require either a combination of rng and loads of gil or beating angra mainyu. if you get all three, you absolutely deserve to sidestep one (1) bonus boss' petrify gimmick, especially when 1) it still hits hard with its other attacks, so it's not like you're immortal even then 2) x-2 is a game with that stupid loving "petrified characters permadie when hit" mechanic
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Dec 19, 2019 12:42
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fluffyDeathbringer posted:being able to do that is actually perfectly reasonable for a rare item that requires either thorough exploration or achieving some egregious challenge, which ribbon mostly is. the easiest ribbon you can get in x-2 is by doing an extra bevelle puzzle in chapter 3, and the other ones require either a combination of rng and loads of gil or beating angra mainyu. if you get all three, you absolutely deserve to sidestep one (1) bonus boss' petrify gimmick, especially when 1) it still hits hard with its other attacks, so it's not like you're immortal even then 2) x-2 is a game with that stupid loving "petrified characters permadie when hit" mechanic Uh, there are other ways to get status protection in X-2 besides Ribbon, you know. Gold Anklet protects against petrify and it's a store bought accessory in chapter 1, not to mention getting it from garment grids and dressphere abilities. All I'm getting from you is that you want X-2 to be easier, which, well, OK lol
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Dec 19, 2019 14:28
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Don't think you can get away with saying anything even slightly derogatory about FFX-2, no matter how subjective, without gigglefeimer coming to correct you.
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Dec 19, 2019 14:51
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I didn’t like FFX2. It felt like a riff on a FF game, in both setting/tone/dialogue/story and in the combat. And not a fun riff, it was all just a bit extra and weird which I didn’t really dig. Some people REALLY appreciate that though.
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Dec 19, 2019 15:21
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Schwartzcough posted:Don't think you can get away with saying anything even slightly derogatory about FFX-2, no matter how subjective, without gigglefeimer coming to correct you. maintaining an account for five years to just post about a single video game is interesting branding if nothing else
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Dec 19, 2019 15:30
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jokes posted:I didn’t like FFX2. It felt like a riff on a FF game, in both setting/tone/dialogue/story and in the combat. And not a fun riff, it was all just a bit extra and weird which I didn’t really dig. Some people REALLY appreciate that though. Yeah it's a lot different to other FF games since it's actually good
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Dec 19, 2019 15:33
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Edit: I am an idiot who can’t post in the right thread.
Pesmerga fucked around with this message at 16:13 on Dec 19, 2019 |
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Dec 19, 2019 15:36
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Schwartzcough posted:Don't think you can get away with saying anything even slightly derogatory about FFX-2, no matter how subjective, without gigglefeimer coming to correct you. I can respect the hustle. Also yes X-2 is great. Though I do think there was more to the discussion about "what makes random encounters good" that got sidetracked that I wish people would expand upon.
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Dec 19, 2019 15:56
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Pesmerga posted:Turley has won her libel action against Unite and Skwawkbox, which is nice. Weirdest FF crossover yet
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Dec 19, 2019 16:10
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Sakurazuka posted:Weirdest FF crossover yet Ahahahaha, sorry, wrong thread.
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Dec 19, 2019 16:12
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Schwartzcough posted:Don't think you can get away with saying anything even slightly derogatory about FFX-2, no matter how subjective, without gigglefeimer coming to correct you. Weird shitpost.
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Dec 19, 2019 16:16
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