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WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001


Sounds like these NAND factories need some PLI handling. Have they tried using a capacitor

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DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness
Considering the power draw of the machinery, I'd imagine it's cheaper to take out an insurance policy / pay for guaranteed power from the utility company than it is to get a capacitor large enough to hold up against meaningful interruption.

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

What if the plates they used were...tectonic plates

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness
I'm not sure that would fit in my case, but I'm willing to try!

Lambert
Apr 15, 2018

by Fluffdaddy
Fallen Rib

Geemer posted:

Stop using Norton Ghost from 1999, then.

Not going to lie, this brought up a nice flash of nostalgia

dragon enthusiast
Jan 1, 2010
Just wanted to check before I impulse buy this, there's nothing wrong with this particular strain of M2 SSD, right?
https://smile.amazon.com/Samsung-860-SATA-Internal-MZ-N6E1T0BW/dp/B07822Z77M/

priznat
Jul 7, 2009

Let's get drunk and kiss each other all night.

dragon enthusiast posted:

Just wanted to check before I impulse buy this, there's nothing wrong with this particular strain of M2 SSD, right?
https://smile.amazon.com/Samsung-860-SATA-Internal-MZ-N6E1T0BW/dp/B07822Z77M/

It’s fine as long as you do want SATA and not NVMe (PCI Express based)

For the NVMe you want the 960/970

dragon enthusiast
Jan 1, 2010
I'm just trying to get a 1TB SSD into my PC before the supposed price hike, and that one happened to be cheaper than the normal SATA drives for reasons I haven't figured out yet.

Lambert
Apr 15, 2018

by Fluffdaddy
Fallen Rib

dragon enthusiast posted:

I'm just trying to get a 1TB SSD into my PC before the supposed price hike, and that one happened to be cheaper than the normal SATA drives for reasons I haven't figured out yet.

An HP EX920 (it's an NVMe drive) would be a way better choice at this price range.

makere
Jan 14, 2012

dragon enthusiast posted:

I'm just trying to get a 1TB SSD into my PC before the supposed price hike, and that one happened to be cheaper than the normal SATA drives for reasons I haven't figured out yet.

The actual NVMe drives can be bought with similar price and offer much better performance.

https://www.amazon.com/Silicon-Power-Gen3x4-000MB-SU001TBP34A80M28AB/dp/B07L6GF81L/

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

dragon enthusiast posted:

I'm just trying to get a 1TB SSD into my PC before the supposed price hike, and that one happened to be cheaper than the normal SATA drives for reasons I haven't figured out yet.

If you're just looking for a 1TB drive on any form factor the Crucial MX500 or WD Blue are even cheaper than the 860 Evo (and basically identical in all important respects). That way you don't need to dedicate a m.2 slot to a sata drive if you don't need to.

TITTIEKISSER69
Mar 19, 2005

SAVE THE BEES
PLANT MORE TREES
CLEAN THE SEAS
KISS TITTIESS




Klyith posted:

If you're just looking for a 1TB drive on any form factor the Crucial MX500 or WD Blue are even cheaper than the 860 Evo (and basically identical in all important respects). That way you don't need to dedicate a m.2 slot to a sata drive if you don't need to.

Would either of these be a good choice for a NAS? Plugged in by USB into my router, needs to be 750GB or greater, and 2.5" SATA. Whatever can deal with being up 24/7.

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness
Either would be fine. They'll still max out a SATA link which will still almost certainly max out the USB link to your router.

TITTIEKISSER69
Mar 19, 2005

SAVE THE BEES
PLANT MORE TREES
CLEAN THE SEAS
KISS TITTIESS




Decided I'm going to get one and a diskless NAS, I didn't realize my router is only USB 2.0 so I'm switching to Ethernet.

dragon enthusiast
Jan 1, 2010

Klyith posted:

If you're just looking for a 1TB drive on any form factor the Crucial MX500 or WD Blue are even cheaper than the 860 Evo (and basically identical in all important respects). That way you don't need to dedicate a m.2 slot to a sata drive if you don't need to.

A while ago the prevailing wisdom was Samsung or bust, is that no longer true?

Lambert
Apr 15, 2018

by Fluffdaddy
Fallen Rib
That hasn't been true in years.

TITTIEKISSER69 posted:

Would either of these be a good choice for a NAS? Plugged in by USB into my router, needs to be 750GB or greater, and 2.5" SATA. Whatever can deal with being up 24/7.

Yep. The MX500 even has power-loss protection.

Palladium
May 8, 2012

Very Good
✔️✔️✔️✔️

dragon enthusiast posted:

A while ago the prevailing wisdom was Samsung or bust, is that no longer true?

If that was true I wouldn't be using 4 SSDs all filled with Micron NAND since 2014.

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

nobody cares


dragon enthusiast posted:

A while ago the prevailing wisdom was Samsung or bust, is that no longer true?

Sorta. Samsung came out on top for overall value, but even when it was the king, drives like the x400 (now the WD Blue) and some of Micron's drives were perfectly acceptable.

The number of drives providing great overall value has exploded since then.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

TITTIEKISSER69 posted:

Would either of these be a good choice for a NAS? Plugged in by USB into my router, needs to be 750GB or greater, and 2.5" SATA. Whatever can deal with being up 24/7.

SSDs are fine with being on 24/7, and for a small home NAS a dram-less drive would be functionally identical. So you could step down to the BX500 for even less money.


dragon enthusiast posted:

A while ago the prevailing wisdom was Samsung or bust, is that no longer true?

At that time Samsung was selling fast, quality drives and undercutting everyone but the mystery no-names. And we weren't sure about the whole SSD reliability thing because OCZ's huge failure rates and the Crucial M4 buggy firmwre were still a recent memory.

What's changed since then:
* Drives by other high-tier companies like Crucial & WD are cheaper while being basically identical to Samsung
* We've found that modern SSDs are pretty drat reliable, even from a smaller company that doesn't make their own NAND. Adata is commonly recommended ITT as a good cheap option.
* Samsung saw that there were lots of people who thought "samsung or bust" and decided to charge extra for it

Palladium
May 8, 2012

Very Good
✔️✔️✔️✔️

Klyith posted:

* Samsung saw that there were lots of people who thought "samsung or bust" and decided to charge extra for it

Samsung SSDs are an idiot tax as far as I'm concerned. My Crucial M550 1TB with good ol' MLC was cheaper than the 840 Evo planar TLC trash back in mid 2014, and my recent Micron 1100 2TB, EX920 1TB and SX8200 Pro 2TB are all at least 2x GB/$ over the Samsung parts at time of purchase.

Palladium fucked around with this message at 12:39 on Jan 7, 2020

isndl
May 2, 2012
I WON A CONTEST IN TG AND ALL I GOT WAS THIS CUSTOM TITLE

Palladium posted:

Samsung SSDs are an idiot tax as far as I'm concerned. My Crucial M550 1TB with good ol' MLC was cheaper than the 840 Evo planar TLC trash back in mid 2014, and my recent Micron 1100 2TB, EX920 1TB and SX8200 Pro 2TB are all at least 2x GB/$ over the Samsung parts at time of purchase.

Kinda unfair to compare current generation SSD pricing to pre-crash pricing, everything is cheaper than 2014 prices now.

I have a Samsung SSD in my laptop but at the time of purchase it was neck and neck with the Crucial and just happened to be slightly cheaper on Amazon that day. Then a couple months later prices got slashed again. :unsmith:

Shaocaholica
Oct 29, 2002

Fig. 5E
Is samsung Rapid mode BS in 2020? Shouldn't that be something the OS kernel should be optimizing for?

Dogen
May 5, 2002

Bury my body down by the highwayside, so that my old evil spirit can get a Greyhound bus and ride
It’s always been bs

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Shaocaholica posted:

Is samsung Rapid mode BS in 2020? Shouldn't that be something the OS kernel should be optimizing for?

Rapid trades safety for speed in a way that the OS won't. Cached writes in memory means they're not guaranteed. And on the read side, windows does pre-cache speculative data into empty ram, but Rapid is way more proactive. Good if it's speeding things up, bad if it's clogging IO by being too aggressive.

I wouldn't call it BS exactly but I do think it is of questionable value to most people. And unlike buying a high-end nvme drive when a regular sata would be indistinguishable for the use case, there's a downside other than wasted money.

Xenomorph
Jun 13, 2001
Rapid sounds cool in theory (insane cache size), and it certainly looks good in benchmarks, but I don't recall seeing any real-world differences with it enabled.

With it on, I wonder if it's making things faster just as much as I wonder how more at-risk my data is in the case of a power-loss during a big write.

priznat
Jul 7, 2009

Let's get drunk and kiss each other all night.
Need the enterprise SSDs with the big phat caps for power loss data retention.

Then it would be cool!

NVRAM drives are smokin fast

Shaocaholica
Oct 29, 2002

Fig. 5E
It just seems kind of inefficient to cache files to ram outside of the OS doing it.

Not sure how default windows does it but at work in linux if I access a file over the network cold it goes as usual but after that its almost instantaneous since its cached and I don't think I've ever ran into limits like file size so even big rear end files are cached as long as I have free mem. And I'm sure the OS is checking if its been updates on the network but most of the time that's not an issue.

Like in windows if you open a 2GB photoshop file the next re-open of that file should be significantly faster if you have the spare memory and without any gimmicky 3rd party IO hacks.

Zorak of Michigan
Jun 10, 2006

priznat posted:

Need the enterprise SSDs with the big phat caps for power loss data retention.

Then it would be cool!

NVRAM drives are smokin fast

Let's just to back to the days when enterprise SSDs were big bricks of RAM with batteries sized to last several days.

Fantastic Foreskin
Jan 6, 2013

A golden helix streaked skyward from the Helvault. A thunderous explosion shattered the silver monolith and Avacyn emerged, free from her prison at last.

Need a ramcorder.

Lungboy
Aug 23, 2002

NEED SQUAT FORM HELP
I've just bought a new system to upgrade my ancient Q6600-based PC. I was intending to use current storage (old crucial sata SSD boot drive, mixture of sata and ide bulk storage) for the time being and grab an M.2 later in the year but with Nand prices looking like they might rise i figure it might make sense to get it now. I'm looking at 1TB drives, but wondered if there's a real difference between drives like the Rocket Q/WD Blue/Crucial P1/Intel 660/Adata SX6000 and the more expensive drives like the Rocket/Black/MP510/SX8200 etc? As a comparison a Rocket Q is £100 vs a Rocket at £120, with the rest being more in either bracket.

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

Lungboy posted:

I've just bought a new system to upgrade my ancient Q6600-based PC. I was intending to use current storage (old crucial sata SSD boot drive, mixture of sata and ide bulk storage) for the time being and grab an M.2 later in the year but with Nand prices looking like they might rise i figure it might make sense to get it now. I'm looking at 1TB drives, but wondered if there's a real difference between drives like the Rocket Q/WD Blue/Crucial P1/Intel 660/Adata SX6000 and the more expensive drives like the Rocket/Black/MP510/SX8200 etc? As a comparison a Rocket Q is £100 vs a Rocket at £120, with the rest being more in either bracket.
The biggest difference is drives like the WD Blue are m.2 interface but are actually SATA drives

So you will max out at 550MB/s

The Intel 660p is a PCIe drive so you can get peak speeds of say 1,800MB/s, but sustained write performance won't quite match up with more expensive drives lik the Samsung Pros or WD Blacks

Then, the ADATA SX6000 will come up short in benchmarks against say, the ADATA SX8200, but in day to dayuse you might not realyl notice a difference.

https://www.extremetech.com/computing/294767-at-a-glance-adata-xpg-sx6000-pro-review

Lungboy
Aug 23, 2002

NEED SQUAT FORM HELP

Bob Morales posted:

The biggest difference is drives like the WD Blue are m.2 interface but are actually SATA drives

So you will max out at 550MB/s

The Intel 660p is a PCIe drive so you can get peak speeds of say 1,800MB/s, but sustained write performance won't quite match up with more expensive drives lik the Samsung Pros or WD Blacks

Then, the ADATA SX6000 will come up short in benchmarks against say, the ADATA SX8200, but in day to dayuse you might not realyl notice a difference.

https://www.extremetech.com/computing/294767-at-a-glance-adata-xpg-sx6000-pro-review

Ah sorry, i meant the Blue SN550, the nvme one. I think the rest are all nvme. Thanks for the SX6000 link, although those are more expensive than the full featured Rocket.

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness
If £20 is important to you, and you were living with a Q6600 for this long, the performance difference probably isn't something to worry about.

If £20 is ignorable to you, I'd vote for the 8200 Pro or similar and remove storage as any sort of potential bottleneck for the next decade.

tight aspirations
Jul 13, 2009

If I just want to use it for windows/gaming, I won't notice much difference between this drive and a more expensive ADATA NVME, will I?

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness
Not enormously, no. It will be slower, but not massively so in daily use. The biggest bits are that it'll still need a normal SATA connection, instead of slotting into a M.2 slot. Also good luck getting any warranty support if it goes bad at some point.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week
Normally, you will never notice the difference between a sata ssd and nvme for windows/gaming.

Random industrial SSD with no independent performance numbers anywhere on the internet? Who knows. It's got a marvell controler and dram at least.

I'd only get a no warranty mystery disk if it's a drat good bargain. I don't know UK prices tho.

tight aspirations
Jul 13, 2009

Thanks to the both of you. For comparison's sake, it's about the same price as a 1tb Adata sx8200 pro.

Chilled Milk
Jun 22, 2003

No one here is alone,
satellites in every home
What’s a good sale price on a decent (doesn’t have to be great) 2tb nvme drive? Just browsing today, I see around $220.

I don’t need one immediately but also I don’t want to bother waiting/checking around for weeks to save less than like 10%

Fantastic Foreskin
Jan 6, 2013

A golden helix streaked skyward from the Helvault. A thunderous explosion shattered the silver monolith and Avacyn emerged, free from her prison at last.

Considering you can get 1tb for ~$100, ~$200.

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Stickman
Feb 1, 2004

I think proper good NVMes like the Sabrent Rocket and ex950 were down around $210 at Black Friday. SSD prices have gone up, though, so we probably won't see deals like that for a while. QLC drives like the 660p were $190-200 for a while, but have gone up $30+ since the beginning of January.

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