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This came in the humble mk thly choice thing. So what should I know going in? Is there a "getting started and not screwing yourself over" guide somewhere?
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Feb 22, 2020 18:10
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Saxophone posted:This came in the humble mk thly choice thing. So what should I know going in? Is there a "getting started and not screwing yourself over" guide somewhere? I got it through the same link and my biggest advice is holy poo poo get the turn based mod (and maybe the magic item crafting and bag of tricks mod if those things sound cool to you)
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Feb 23, 2020 00:27
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Yes, absolutely pick up the turn-based mod, and also don't be afraid to restart once or twice to get a feel for a character you really like. As a note, the classes you don't get a party member for are Druid, Monk, Slayer (since it wasn't in at launch) and Paladin, if you want to be a unique snowflake among your party (and some of those classes have archetypes that will let you be a real unique snowflake).
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Feb 23, 2020 01:16
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with how Owlcat designed the companions there's a certain "pressure" to be a frontline tank as a protagonist, if you only plan to use companions and zero mercs
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Feb 23, 2020 01:26
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I'd love it if WotR had a crafting mechanic to it. I'm playing with the Call of the Wild mod which comes with the Witch class and I'm also using the Craft Items mod so I can brew potions, which is rather useful in addition to being a logical skill for a witch to have. I know WotR will have the Witch class but without potion brewing it won't quite feel complete. They could add it as a stretch goal, but I'm guessing odds are most likely I'll have to get it as a mod.
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Feb 23, 2020 10:29
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I almost feel like it would be worth this sort of game having a 1 hour totally optional and not connected to the main plot in any way tutorial that consists of a 1 screen dungeon that just levels you up 5 times and in the process holds your hand to explain 'this is what coordinated fighting feats are for, this is what your priest can do now, this is what spells are good in this situation'.
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Feb 23, 2020 11:23
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I really wanna play this, but the swarms are killing me. literally I'm out of jars, and my melee torch attacks never seem to land 
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Feb 23, 2020 11:26
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just do something else that area is way poorly designed i think its intended to be a tutorial for swarms who A) actually arent a thing 95% of the game and B) so they're like incredibly hard cause youre dealing with attribute poisoning actual enemies in large numbers because gently caress you C)by the time youre in that 5% they are your party is way better equipped to deal with them than hoping for rd20s against tiny spiders
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Feb 23, 2020 11:31
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Yes I had the same problem. Ignore the cave, go check out that ruin you were told your rival was at. Then go check out the crossroads bandit camp and follow up on that. Then you'll encounter some slavers, deal with them. Now do some other stuff, maybe including that cave.
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Feb 23, 2020 11:34
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that whole sequence would have been much better to teach you about swarms if it was mostly just them but no it is also like a dozen grown spiders on top of that when your party isnt fully formed and also swarms aren't even really a thing in the entire game after that (they sometimes pop up but you have magical weapons and mages to deal with them all the torch bullshit basically ends at that cave)
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Feb 23, 2020 11:40
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The guy even sends you back because the first batch you get him isn’t fresh enough or whatever. I really don’t know what they were thinking with that quest.
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Feb 23, 2020 11:44
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yeah you can just go halfway, deal with two swarms or whatever which even a low level unoptimized party can do, grab the berries or whatever and head back but that's so very outside the crpg murderhobo code clearly you're there, in a cave, you keep pressing on and only then you really get hosed and if you somehow survive but dont go back immediately he tells you lol yeah go back and pick more though thankfully respawning isn't a thing in static maps
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Feb 23, 2020 11:50
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It's amazing how even after warnings added, free flask given, redesigning the cave so swarms and berries for quest are separated , people still get SWARMED out of the game. I guess if it was a bit below the map, like the ratfolk cave, people would not try to do it first thing in the game at least
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Feb 23, 2020 11:54
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Berke Negri posted:yeah you can just go halfway, deal with two swarms or whatever which even a low level unoptimized party can do, grab the berries or whatever and head back but That's basically what I did. Got the berries, went further in, took out a couple of spawns and got hit by two at once which I've not been able to down yet. I'll just leave. How long until this strength draining poo poo goes away? It didn't heal on rest like the description said
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Feb 23, 2020 11:55
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JamMasterJim posted:It's amazing how even after warnings added, free flask given, redesigning the cave so swarms and berries for quest are separated , people still get SWARMED out of the game. I guess if it was a bit below the map, like the ratfolk cave, people would not try to do it first thing in the game at least people will always try to clear a whole map if anything its absolute lunacy to think people wont poke their heads into every corner, especially if it starts out "manageable" especially since p:k has a lovely system in place to let you know if you "visited" a node or "cleared" a node even more so like an hour or two into a game
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Feb 23, 2020 11:58
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Berke Negri posted:people will always try to clear a whole map Yeah, it's loving weird how even if you load an autosave from entering an area, it counts it as visited when you may have done nothing in there yet.
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Feb 23, 2020 12:06
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yeah in my second playthrough i basically never popped my head in to check out an area without n FAQ for the node open beforehand to know was this just going to be a haste party or will i actually get wrecked because there's a CR 50 enemy there for some reason
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Feb 23, 2020 12:22
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Avalerion posted:The guy even sends you back because the first batch you get him isn’t fresh enough or whatever. I really don’t know what they were thinking with that quest. This only happens if you take too long in returning them to him. If you grab them and go straight back to the Trading Post he'll take the first batch. It's still a dumb mechanic they added with no indication that it's a timed quest from the moment you pick the berries, though. edit: Swarms are really annoying in this but their biggest weakness is their speed tends to be abysmal. If you've cleared out space behind you it's usually best to just kite backwards as you lob whatever aoe or spells at them you can.
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Feb 23, 2020 12:30
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running back with the berries before they "spoil" is also a thing that is never a thing with any other quest either after that has big first draft energy going on
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Feb 23, 2020 12:39
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Another place you can get hurt badly is the Tranquil River Bend that is full of Boggarts, those guys hit like mack trucks in the early game and their boss is around level 14 and hits like a truckasaurus instead. Of course, if you're a savvy player you'll use stuff like Grease to great effect in that place since those guys doesn't seem to be able to not slip on it  At least it's a good place to get rings of protection and cloaks of resistance for your guys early. (With the turn-based mod on)
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Feb 23, 2020 12:57
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To get the berries you have to pass a nature check too and it failed for me a bunch of times. It hurts you when you fail too, yay. As it's your first quest given as a sidequest it's not surprising everyone goes to do it, why wouldn't you?
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Feb 23, 2020 13:12
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The funny part is at this point I just play solo characters. My strategy for that cave is one scroll of delay poison (bought from Jhod) and those free starting alchemist flasks. Run around, toss 'em at the swarms, ignore the spiders. They need 20s to hit me anyways. If I'm playing a class with expeditious retreat or a monk, it's trivially easy. Usually takes 6-8 fire flasks. I remember fearing that place my first play.
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Feb 23, 2020 16:15
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Koorisch posted:Another place you can get hurt badly is the Tranquil River Bend that is full of Boggarts, those guys hit like mack trucks in the early game and their boss is around level 14 and hits like a truckasaurus instead. If you know The Grease Magic, yeah, Tranquil River Bend is a fantastic place to get EXP and fat stacks of cash. I wouldn't go there before level 3 (and that boss is a pain in the rear end no matter how you slice it), but their reflex saves are not that high for some reason and you can sell all those masterwork weapons for a ton of money and the +2 Greatclub turns Jaethal into a beast. Also for the spider cave: it's worth pointing out the quest itself can be completed without fighting any swarms. But yes, it is a rough first draft of a 'swarm tutorial' area that if anything just drives people away.
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Feb 23, 2020 18:28
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Berke Negri posted:people will always try to clear a whole map I'd say this also keys into the bigger problems in almost all CRPGs of (a) having no way to know what enemies there are or what their stats are like without getting close enough that they start attacking you, (b) it then being impossible to escape or delay a fight because gently caress you if you don't want every single combat in this deeply realistic RPG to be a fight to the death, and (c) the hardcore fanbase somehow thinking those first two points are good things. Like, even the tabletop, as bad as it is at it, has mechanics for escaping or ending fights without everybody on one side or the other having to die first.
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Feb 23, 2020 19:29
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It's especially bad in D&D and similar systems like Pathfinder with spell preparation and pre-buffing. All those in-combat tactics are nothing compared to the power preparation with defend from elements and spells vs specific types of enemies. It's fine when it happens through the story, like when you're told about trolls and fire and acid. But then you randomly meet some electric sprite and party wipe comes unless you've prepared and then it's a trivial fight. Devs probably tried to overcompensate for save scumming and now it feels like in original campaign you are supposed to savescum or know what's coming.
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Feb 23, 2020 20:18
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I reinstalled Kingmaker and now with the mod manager installed and two mods I used to run (Turn Based and Bag of Tricks) it hard locks at the main menu. The mod screen comes up but I can't click anything and have to kill task. I tried updating the manager and the mods. Anyone have that?
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Feb 23, 2020 22:53
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FuzzySlippers posted:I reinstalled Kingmaker and now with the mod manager installed and two mods I used to run (Turn Based and Bag of Tricks) it hard locks at the main menu. The mod screen comes up but I can't click anything and have to kill task. I tried updating the manager and the mods. Anyone have that? Reminded that the mods work with the latest version of the game. I am currently messing around at 2.08 fix (GOG) and they work. If you are running a version before 2.07, it might be the cause. Otherwise, not sure.
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Feb 24, 2020 01:15
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ilitarist posted:It's especially bad in D&D and similar systems like Pathfinder with spell preparation and pre-buffing. All those in-combat tactics are nothing compared to the power preparation with defend from elements and spells vs specific types of enemies. It's fine when it happens through the story, like when you're told about trolls and fire and acid. But then you randomly meet some electric sprite and party wipe comes unless you've prepared and then it's a trivial fight. Devs probably tried to overcompensate for save scumming and now it feels like in original campaign you are supposed to savescum or know what's coming. yeah my second playthrough which i still haven't finished went just about 100 times smoother knowing all the gotchas in the game my first run my kingdom was always at the brink of collapse and id waste BP on all those trap projects relevant to the main story (like "find where the trolls are coming from" etc) and it took a long time until i realized "delay poison" actually means gently caress you, poison. i also had no clue clerics could swap in heals for every spell so would always waste slots second run any time a crisis crops up i solve it within a week and then have like 200 days until the next ancient curse to go around, clear out nodes, upgrade the kingdom and do some tenebrous depths the last of which is terribly easy as long as you pack some delay poison and resist energy, communals and know when the damned wild hunt is going to crop up and you need some freedom of movement casts
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Feb 24, 2020 01:17
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tithin posted:How long until this strength draining poo poo goes away? It didn't heal on rest like the description said Resting should heal 1 point of attribute *damage* per 24h (although it's possibly per rest in the game, I don't recall). You can also heal 1d4 of it with each cast of Lesser Restoration/swig of Lesser Resto potion, and all of it at once with one cast of Restoration (but that costs diamond dust). *drain* doesn't ever heal on its own and you need real Restoration to get rid of it ; but I don't think spider swarms do that poo poo as it's more of a "giant undead pain in the dick" thing to do.
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Feb 24, 2020 06:25
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Now add drow to Wrath of the Righteous! Seriously though, turn based in WotR is going to be amazing, especially with poo poo like Kineticist which requires massive micromanagement and Paizo's unholy lust for fiddly poo poo.
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Feb 24, 2020 06:38
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Berke Negri posted:second run any time a crisis crops up i solve it within a week and then have like 200 days until the next ancient curse to go around, clear out nodes, upgrade the kingdom and do some tenebrous depths Eh, I dropped the game first time when I've sorted out trolls and magical portal (it's only temporary as I understand but you have to wait for long) and then I went around all those nodes doing the same fights again and again. I was extremely irritated with the fact that every fight can end in party wipe and it seems I can't do anything about it, but if I spend several minutes on applying buffs then I win with auto-attack with enemies never ever hitting me. It's like Tower Defense game only I do the same level with the same tower configuration. Then there were locations I was never supposed to go, at least I think that a gang of ancient elementals is supposed to convey that message. I had some quests like hire the alchemist but it has bugged out so I literally had nothing to do. I guess now I'd try that random dungeon at that point of the story, or would just calmly wait. What I mean is it's not that this gameplay system is too hard but that it's only hard the first time. So that random dungeon iron man might be the right application of those systems, otherwise you're stick in a loop of realizing you're finally having a fight that is not trash, reloading, preparing so that tough fight is trash fight, then getting back to trash fight. When there's a time pressure you at least have some incentive to not rest too much. ilitarist fucked around with this message at 08:02 on Feb 24, 2020 |
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Feb 24, 2020 07:21
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https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/owlcatgames/pathfinder-wrath-of-the-righteous/posts/2764136 Meanwhile there was a reveal of another companion. So she's like a renown Pathfinder character, like Amiri, right? Something in her appearance tells me she's a tank so I wonder if we'll have a more balanced party this time. Cause as I understand Valerie is your companion in Chapter 1 no matter what so you always start with a tank but apart from her there's no one you'd really want in a frontline, maybe Harrim, that dwarven cleric?.. I mean you're quite limited in story companions you can use, even if your main character is a dedicated tank you're probably still sticking with Valerie.
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Feb 24, 2020 09:56
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Depending on your choices when speaking to Jamandi in the Prologue, you either end up with Valerie or Harrim (Lawful vs Chaotic choice) and then with either Linzi or Jaethal (good vs evil). Seelah, while being a sword and board character is not really built like a tank from the presets Paizo gives you (10 dex, feats like Power Attack and Vital strike later on), but Owlcat could make adjustments. And if they do not, if you get her early on, you can make her whatever you want. At least, unlike Valerie, she will not be burdened by the shield she is supposed to carry for the first 2 levels.
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Feb 24, 2020 10:04
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Valerie joining you comes down to making a lawful choice in the tutorial, otherwise you get Harrim. You can get her early if you rush to the tomb and pass a diplomacy check otherwise you’l find her in a dungeon later on. Rerongar can make a decent tank if you dip scaled fist, I asume so can Nok Nok being a dex character but he’s relatively late. I’ve seen people turn Amiri and even Linzi into a workable tanks funnily enough. Avalerion fucked around with this message at 10:15 on Feb 24, 2020 |
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Feb 24, 2020 10:11
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Well, naturally those who really know the systems can do wonderful things with it but those who don't know intricacies of the system will see that the only people who wear medium or heavy armor and use shields are Valerie and Harrim. I don't know Seelah's stats but it's clear that Owlcat will have to prepare her for tank duty or it will feel like a trap choice.
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Feb 24, 2020 10:32
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I checked out Amiri’s pnp stats vs what we got and it looks like they put her racial into con instead of str and had her pick toughness instead of power attack, so yea they seem open to stuff like that. A bigger issue might be sword and armor tanks in general being (arguably) a trap. Dunno if that’s for pathfinder in general or a kingmaker specific problem because of the endgame being so touch attack heavy tho.
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Feb 24, 2020 10:51
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Jaethal makes for a great tank for most of the game. It's pretty easy to just give her some levels in TSS so she can use heavy armor and (eventually) tower shields without penalty. She has high strength, can self-heal and as an undead she's outright immune to almost all of the afflictions in the game which is a HUGE boon considering how annoying poisons or ability and level drain can be. She also gets the unique ability to summon some undead warriors which can bog down attackers. She won't be as good as a proper monk tank but she works for a lot of the games content. I am hoping Owlcat don't make touch AC so vital in the endgame again.
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Feb 24, 2020 13:32
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Kobal2 posted:Resting should heal 1 point of attribute *damage* per 24h (although it's possibly per rest in the game, I don't recall). You can also heal 1d4 of it with each cast of Lesser Restoration/swig of Lesser Resto potion, and all of it at once with one cast of Restoration (but that costs diamond dust). There's a setting in the options to make it so every single drain fixes when you rest. There's really no reason not to use that because otherwise it makes the early game absolutely suck (and the late game, stat drains are bad) I've stopped backing the kickstarter because the enhanced edition just isn't better, or isn't enough better. There's still loads of annoying punishing decisions and I can't imagine they'll be going away with the new game.
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Feb 24, 2020 13:36
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Oh hey I've reached the point in the game where I have items that give a dodge AC bonus, which is not the same as a deflection AC bonus, which is not the same as a magic AC bonus and remember they DON'T STACK unless they do I hope this is all clear.
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Feb 24, 2020 13:36
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It’s not... that bad, honestly. No bonus of the same type stacks, the only exception is dodge which does. But in usual pathfinder fashion I don’t know if the game ever tells you this or just expects you to know.
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Feb 24, 2020 13:41
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