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No we're good, the main problem was trying to keep the offense going, defensively we're generally set. Also found out that vassalization does in fact work so gonna go around and make people submit.
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Apr 18, 2020 20:20
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quote:I’m just putting this one here to marvel at the champagne industry as a World Wonder.
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Apr 18, 2020 22:45
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Definitely not mad that Bourgeoisie shows up before feudalism and not after it. Nope not mad at all. Also Agricultural guilds were totally a thing and not just pulled out of the authors rear end. I mean civ games are far from perfect representations but still. Come on.
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Apr 18, 2020 22:54
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Ferrosol posted:Definitely not mad that Bourgeoisie shows up before feudalism and not after it. Nope not mad at all. Also Agricultural guilds were totally a thing and not just pulled out of the authors rear end. Jossar’s Playthrough – Medieval 2   We now start on the journey to making everyone left in the world our vassal. Wrub, who we’ve been at war with for quite some time, agrees to capitulate. Standard vassal stuff – permanently subordinate to us, can’t break free unless he reaches a certain size threshold relative to us (which he never will), defensive pact. We get to see inside his cities. Won’t be repeating this for everyone now that the point’s established.   Oh nice, free tech wonder. I use it to pick up Mountaineering, which lets you climb over and build stuff on Mountain tiles, previously unavailable. It also grants us the ability to build Machu Picchu, though I won’t be doing so for a long time.  Education is a tech that’s a lot more important for other religions than ours, though the group wonders you can build provide a lot of science.  Oh hey, just the right Wonder to take advantage of our new stance on Vassals.  A fairly large happiness and learning boost from Notre Dame here.  I have a Great Prophet research Belief (Resurrection) – I think it’s another thing like Aesop’s Fables where it provides a unique building that for all intents and purposes is just a worldwide reduction to Crime.  The University of Sankore’s an amazing building, though its bonus effect is sadly limited to just the buildings in the city.  Here’s Agricultural Tools, it lets you build Great Farmers. I’ve personally never found them to be all that great, although that may be because at this point in the game I’m slowly moving away from trying to perfectly optimize everything. It’s pretty hard to, with this many cities.   Hey there Shaka, you’re next on the list. And after sieging his capital for a bit, he agrees to become our vassal.   Some more wonders. The Salon here makes me really wonder if Bourgeois was supposed to be Renaissance era instead.  Armor Crafting would be useful for the Upgrade to Heavy Swordsmen, if we weren’t already crushing everything on the map.   Yunupingu joins the Great World Horde. This creates something of a problem. Everyone else that I can see is a minor power, who can’t be recruited. And I learned that the tech-pegging function apparently doesn’t work the same way for fully converted minor civilizations as it does for regular Barbarians. So being beaten out the first time around was just an unlucky fluke, but it means it will take ages for the rest of these guys to level up to the point where they can be vassalized. And destroying one just spawns a new minor somewhere else in the world who has to start over from the beginning.  And there we go. With the spawn rate of minor civilizations seemingly keyed to the main civilization limit, there is indeed no one else left to interact with. Colonizing new cities is a drain on my economy at this point, so there’s pretty much nothing left to do now outside of the occasional game of whack-a-barbarian and waiting for the slow passage of time.  Time.  Time enough to watch steel be converted from ores to ingot to finished product.      Time enough for the Mongolian civilization, which has never dealt with horses in any fashion up until this point apart from domestication, to invent all the intricacies of horsemanship just for a lark.   So much time in fact, that history itself decides to take a holiday. (Techs not mentioned: Paper, Perspective, Stained Glass, Charters, Floristry, Windmills, Yeomanry, Heraldry, Optics, Poetry.)
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Apr 18, 2020 23:56
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Hell yeah time to make some robot birds
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Apr 19, 2020 00:22
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Jossar posted:The "game" ends sometime in the next few eras if I have anything to say about it and basically becomes a simulationist sandbox from the Medieval/Renaissance Era onwards, so having stuff in space doesn't help for a decently long haul on Earth. Well folks, here we are. No bones about it: this is the most boring part of the C2C experience. I will try to make it interesting and there's stuff like the alternative timeline techs (of which Clockpunk is the 2nd, but you've already seen Megafauna Domestication in the other LP) to talk about, but there's only so much I can do without condensing things to the point of "1500 TURNS LATER AND WE'RE IN THE ATOMIC/INFORMATION AGE". Or maybe it comes across the same and the only difference is my behind the scenes boredom. 
Jossar fucked around with this message at 01:34 on Apr 19, 2020 |
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Apr 19, 2020 00:42
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Grapplejack posted:Hell yeah time to make some robot birds Unfortunately those are actually just guys in wing-powered aircraft. Considering that there are sci-fi animals in the game the lack of bird robots is a major oversight 
zetamind2000 fucked around with this message at 02:00 on Apr 19, 2020 |
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Apr 19, 2020 01:58
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Can you post some of the descriptions for the wilder techs?
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Apr 19, 2020 02:18
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Honestly I'm not sure why you went after the Celts. Now you have no one to scheme against and it is just waiting. In fact, that is kind of the biggest glaring problem with this mod. Civ already has the issue of a long period of nothing happening if the difficulty level is on the low side and you take everyone over, this mod just makes that problem a million times worse.
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Apr 19, 2020 07:29
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Jossar’s Playthrough – Clockpunk/Medieval 3   As soon as you get the ability to build stuff with Clockpunk, you gain access to the Ornithopter, the game’s very first aerial unit. It’s good for conducting bombing and bombardment runs, with the biggest advantage being that no one has any real way to oppose it for a very long time. You also get the ability to build this manufactory with an awful pun in its description, and some additional science/hammers.   Further production requires construction of the Clockwork Workshop. The Ornithopter Aerie gives a city the ability to support and heal more ornithopters and a slight trade boost. As for the Clockwork Golem…   By pure stats it’s only slightly better than a Heavy Swordsman, but where it really shines is in it specials. In exchange for being awful on most non-standard terrain it has a much higher bonus when it comes to city attack and the chance to perform collateral damage to a lot of your opponent’s units. It’s an excellent city breaker. There’s one more uninteresting building which is “more clocks” and a few more units which get unlocked during the Renaissance that I’ll show off. Though those are probably the nuttiest of all.     A lot of techs are researched at this point which help deal with increasing levels of crime/disease. I really don’t think increasingly complex torture devices are helping to fight crime though. Rat Catchers are notable for letting you build a building which removes a Pests building entirely.    So while Cogs are the first ship that can eventually become Ocean-worthy, the first immediately Ocean-worthy ships are unlocked in Compass. I build a few and send them out to explore the rest of the map.  Portugal here is sending out all these Trade Caravans even as a minor civilization, which I thought was pretty cute.  Zululand asks for one of my cities, and I decide that with all the problems with maintenance I’m having it’s worth it to hand the city over to a vassal. Science takes a momentary dip but bounces back up in a few turns. Will probably do this for a few cities on the edge of the civilization if vassals ask, not too many though. Also there’s a new minor power that spawned somehow, so I give up on trying to figure out on what the rules for these things are. And that’s the last notable thing that happens before the Renaissance hits. Small-ish update, but figured I should try and show off as much of Clockpunk as possible and avoid having the update title have too many backslashes. (Techs not mentioned: Executions, Usury, Tournaments, Anatomy) Jossar fucked around with this message at 16:24 on Apr 19, 2020 |
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Apr 19, 2020 14:47
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Peachfart posted:Honestly I'm not sure why you went after the Celts. Now you have no one to scheme against and it is just waiting. It is a problem in vanilla Civ4, so there's only so much the mod can do, but yeah it definitely depends on your play style. If you go hard on warmongering, then it'll be tricky to have a real challenge by this period, let alone the Atomic era. If you focus more on building and fine-tuning your empire, then you'll likely have a somewhat comparable rival(s) to trade or sit in a Cold War with but still likely to buckle if you push hard enough. Jossar posted:
In addition to fighting crime, the torture buildings also ramp up disease in trade-off. Considering that Doctors are pretty underwhelming if one hasn't been deliberately pursuing health traits and wonders, at least until you can replace them with Monks that aren't even on the promotion chain and have to be built separately, and I think it's the mod's attempt to recreate a Black Death like experience. Just like once you get to the late Industrial era, if you build all of the factories available then the unhealthy penalties will far, far outstrip the healthy building bonuses, creating a heavy polluted feel to most cities. Geshtal fucked around with this message at 17:40 on Apr 19, 2020 |
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Apr 19, 2020 17:15
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Playing through the next update and despite my previous gift of a city to one of my extant allies, the game wouldn't shut up about granting independence to some of my overseas territories as vassal states to the point where I did it just to get it to leave me alone. They're perfectly loyal and things have definitely picked up by trimming off the fat, but I can't help but think that if things go off the rails eventually, this may have been a better way to create a future enemy than having just left the AI alone with how incompetent at city planning most of them were. Also I guess that's one way to replicate the "feeling" of an era.
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Apr 19, 2020 17:22
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Starving from success, huh?
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Apr 19, 2020 18:52
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Jossar’s Playthrough – Clockpunk/Renaissance 1  It calls itself the Renaissance Era, but really it’s everything from that point up until the 1800s or so. My free tech choice isn’t so important, but what you know what is?  Gunpowder! Home to some of the first black powder based unit types, although they’re not particularly great until a later tech. But more importantly for our purposes Gunpowder unlocks our first tanks.  The Da Vinci Tank is probably the most over the top Clockpunk unit both in terms of design and the fact that while the average strength unit at this point in the game is 14-15 Strength, one fresh out of the box is Strength 26. It also has Blitz so it can attack multiple times in a turn. This is less ridiculous than it initially seems because we’re about to hit the part of the game where unit strength starts ramping up dramatically, and when infantry catches up it has the advantage of actually being able to defend properly, but for half the era this thing has no competition when it comes to offense.  For comparison here is a Heavy Crossbowman, though it’s not as unfair as it seems because defensive penalties can stymie an offense terribly if you’re unprepared. Metallurgy also comes with the next stage in Siege Weaponry and our second to last Clockpunk unit.  The Repeating Crossbowman really feels like it should be some kind of Chinese cultural special unit rather than a Clockpunk unit. It’s got Blitz, doesn’t play by the normal Ranged unit rules because it’s offense rather than defense focused, and has a huge anti-melee bonus. All of these add up to a unit that’s really good when fighting against Melee units… just as your non-Clockpunk opponents would be taking the opportunity to switch over to the Gunpowder tree (though for obvious reasons we’ll delay researching that for a while). If you can catch them during the move it’s powerful but there’s better things you could be doing with your time.  Astronomy unlocks a good science building and is when earlier era ships would unlock the ability to move across Ocean tiles.  At this point I finally give in to the game’s insistence and liberate the formerly Celtic continent under the rule of Hammurabi of the Babylonians. He’s a vassal state and has a +10 bonus from independence plus other factors so don’t expecting him to declare a civil war any time soon. I lose a bunch of science in the process, but the massive money gain means that after reinvesting to get 100% science funding, I’m back to where I was and with a healthy budget.  Navigation is a tech that would be a game changer if the map had more ocean tiles for ensuring trade between continents separated by the ocean. As things are, it’s mostly a speed bump with some nice unit upgrades/promotions.  Banking (which is actually a Medieval tech) provides Banks, a very good wealth generating building, but also comes with the Certified Civic. The benefits we’re getting from our previous one are negligible enough that I switch them out for loadsamoney.  we have determined that eating people is bad please do not do it (Secularism is actually a really good civic if we were playing an “all religions” style playthrough, though sadly it’s less useful for us here.) ___________________________ Okay I was debating on whether to shove these in the not-mentioned list but they’re actually significant so let’s get them out of the way as quickly as possible:     Jurisprudence introduces the next level of crime reduction including the Guillotine. It also comes with the Supreme Court which I’ll discuss in a bit. Leadership allows for more buildable generals, more modern war dogs/cats and training facilities, and the Confederacy civic. The latter being an upgrade to the City States civic. Colonialism allows for the creation of settlers who provide higher levels of population from the start, so even without the Great Bath of Mohenjo-Daro you can have cities which aren’t totally useless from the word go.   The Printing Press brings with it a large number of Education related buildings and also the Paper Money civic.   Anyways the Supreme Court. Apart from being really good it lets you pass National Laws via a Judge, mostly banning certain types of buildings. I find that most of these laws tend to be not worth it, but the smoking ban is pretty good especially since I already don’t have many if any of those kinds of buildings.  I’m on another run of Medieval techs I skipped over. I’m trying not to prune every religion that shows up, but if you really want to do so then you can train Inquisitors to root them out of cities.    I research Papacy and decide that Free Church is enough of an upgrade to be worth it in terms of switching over. I am immediately accused that I was persuaded to switch away from the guidance of the Prophets of the Sun by a demonic wizard fantasy novel series. Yeah, I think on top of everything else that’s enough for now. (Techs not mentioned: Astrolabe, Coal Mining, Cartography, Weather Forecasting, Parliaments, Heliocentrism, Cryptography) Jossar fucked around with this message at 21:50 on Apr 19, 2020 |
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Apr 19, 2020 21:47
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Ah yes, there's what we were waiting for. This had seemed like it was being all too decent.quote:quote:quote:
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Apr 19, 2020 22:38
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Complications posted:Ah yes, there's what we were waiting for. This had seemed like it was being all too decent. Also fits with the clockpunk poo poo, completely ignoring the 'punk' to fetishize an era of genocidal colonialism and exploitation.
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Apr 19, 2020 23:02
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For more hilarious racism you should see each culture group's different unit models. The african culture group gets it very bad when compared to any of the others with things like their arquebusier being a guy in a leopardskin loincloth. Even in the medieval era it takes for loving ever to get units that don't look like jungle tribesmen.
zetamind2000 fucked around with this message at 23:11 on Apr 19, 2020 |
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Apr 19, 2020 23:05
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A lot of quotes seem like they were literally the first result pulled from Google for the relevant keyword. Then you get the Ian Smith one and you know someone was aching to put it in. That one was lovingly selected for the purpose.
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Apr 19, 2020 23:38
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kw0134 posted:A lot of quotes seem like they were literally the first result pulled from Google for the relevant keyword.
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Apr 20, 2020 00:02
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Eh, I think with Civ VI they aimed for "cheeky" and missed a decent amount, but at least it was germane. There's a lot of stuff in the mod that cut-n-paste from a paragraph of Wikipedia that doesn't even remotely make sense.
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Apr 20, 2020 00:17
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kw0134 posted:Eh, I think with Civ VI they aimed for "cheeky" and missed a decent amount, but at least it was germane. There's a lot of stuff in the mod that cut-n-paste from a paragraph of Wikipedia that doesn't even remotely make sense. Whoever did the civ 6 quotes just remembered the Leonard Nimoy “beep, beep, beep” line and forgot every other quote was series so that could be the punchline.
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Apr 20, 2020 00:48
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Civ V already had "the meek shall inherit the Earth -- but not its mineral rights" as the greatest spoken quote in a Civ game, it was all downhill from there.
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Apr 20, 2020 00:51
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kw0134 posted:Civ V already had "the meek shall inherit the Earth -- but not its mineral rights" as the greatest spoken quote in a Civ game, it was all downhill from there. beep... beep... beep...
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Apr 20, 2020 00:57
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The Smith quote is extremely appropriate for the tech it represents imo, it's the core belief that made that entire enterprise possible spoken by one of its most fervent and horrific followers I mean it also requires you to know that he was the PM of Rhodesia and what that is, but
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Apr 20, 2020 00:59
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Is that Building Brazil? What?
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Apr 20, 2020 01:45
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Building cultures, if I had to guess.
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Apr 20, 2020 01:47
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Yeah, Cultures are always included as buildings which you have to build, and then get the actual culture as a resource, which is the flag that allows you to build a particular set of heroes/units. Anyways... Jossar’s Playthrough – Clockpunk/Renaissance 2 Update Mood: “People like infrastructure, right?”  The first part of the update is the sum of techs that aren’t important now, but will be in the next Era. Coal Mining from last update’s Techs not mentioned list revealed Coal. Scientific Method reveals Oil and Natural Gas. These will be huge resources in the next phase of the game so it’s good to be able to find and start planning around them now.   Corporations likewise is the foundational tech for what will become Religion 2.0 in the next era/Atomic Era. But right now it’s useful for adopting Capitalism, an upgrade to our current Workforce civic. I’m not really sure what to make of the bonus happiness you get if you still have Slavery up under Capitalism.  Whoops. Managed to destroy Portugal by culturally surrounding it. Well, at least that’s one less thing for the AI to keep track of, though it will continue to keep spawning Minor Civs.  Chemistry is a mixed bag tech that provides a lot of little bonuses to science, food/hammers, health/disease. Not sure what the connection is to improved ships, but I’ll take that too.   Okay, Stock Brokering is pretty boring, but the one thing it does, it does well. We are kind of hitting the point (if we haven’t already) where money is in ridiculously abundant supply but you can always use it to hurry up buildings.     What follows are a series of technologies focused on civics.    I wait for a bit before adopting a lot of them in one fell swoop. The agriculture one’s there but I missed a shot, and now we’re pretty much nearly entirely at civics par for the era after being a hobbled mishmash of them for a long, long while.  Okay I have no idea if this one becomes useful down the line. I’m going to assume that somewhere in all these rocks there’s at least one I’ll need for some industry/mining complex later. (There's actually a lot of cool science buildings here though.)  A very powerful Wonder. Mostly for the science, all the tech knowledge gives me is Camelid Domestication and Megafauna Domestication, saving me a fraction of a turn’s worth of beakers later down the line.   Hot Air Balloon brings with it the last of our Clockpunk units, the Zephyr. Regular Hot Air Balloons are a purely defensive unit usable for scouting, but this one can conduct bombing runs as well.  Unlike the Ornithopters, which are purely city bound and have to take off and return for their bombing runs, these guys can fly around. Let’s go on a tour!  Aaaaaah! Pull down, pull down! (Techs not mentioned: Divine Right, Critical Thought, Patent Rights, Mercantilism, Enlightenment, Calculus, Acoustics, Physics, Naval Cannon.) Jossar fucked around with this message at 03:40 on Apr 20, 2020 |
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Apr 20, 2020 01:55
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...did you fly the balloon into space? Is that what's happening?
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Apr 20, 2020 02:41
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The balloon sadly cannot be flown into space. However it can be flown to the very edge of the mountain chain which marks the border between the Earth and space and stare at the abyss.
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Apr 20, 2020 02:44
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Jossar’s Playthrough – Renaissance 3 Battlefield Medicine is a good tech if you’re still bringing healing units to accompany your fighters so it doesn’t take a quarter of an era for them to heal back up to full.  Microbiology improves disease control, but otherwise starts a trend of lots of little techs that come with a science/education building to help science really ramp up at this point.  Case in point Biology, though it’s special because it also has the dual function of tanking your education by getting rid of old myths/stories to make sure that you don’t ignore all the new buildings.  Some cities with administrative centers, like the capitol, are starting to get the ability to farm a 3 tile radius rather than 2 tiles, which is another good reason not to engage in Infinite City Sprawl.  Zoology also exists in the same vein as the other science building based techs, but really you're just here for this cute world wonder.  Assyria finally develops into a full civilization! Time to beat it up until it becomes our friend.  Remember how I said this was the point when unit strength started ramping up? Before this, the standard Gunpowder unit was 15 Strength, now it’s 20 and starting to develop a few more promotions. Oh hey, new trait. (Techs not mentioned: Matchlock, Martial Arts, Crop Rotation, Botany, Paleontology, Dueling.) Jossar’s Playthrough - 6th Trait Vote Okay yeah, that wasn’t really a lot of content so I’m just going to include the trait vote with the main post this time. Probably should’ve fit it all in the previous update, but I didn’t know if I would get it done before I fell asleep. Such is life. One Positive and one Negative trait to vote on. Positive So in addition to your standard vote to add a new Positive trait or remove an old Negative trait we finally have access to a third option, adding advanced Positive traits.     These traits are placed in addition to their regular trait on our profile, but I believe in practice the original version is superceded by the more powerful version. If that interpretation is correct, a lot of what you see here is a doubling of the relevant original effects. But some parts of the trait aren't changed at all. Negative The reverse is true for negative traits. You can add a new Negative trait or remove an old Positive trait or convert Zealous I to Zealous II.  Getting rid of the relevant advanced trait reduces it back to its original status, it does not remove it entirely. Voting lasts until each option has 7 votes or 7 PM EST today. Jossar fucked around with this message at 05:31 on Apr 20, 2020 |
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Apr 20, 2020 05:24
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Aerial and convert Zealous I to Zealous II
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Apr 20, 2020 05:39
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overmind2000 posted:Aerial and convert Zealous I to Zealous II Praise! :clap: The! :clap: Sun! :clap:
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Apr 20, 2020 14:24
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Scientific and Zealous II hahaha scientific progress goess wooooosh
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Apr 20, 2020 17:30
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Aerial and Naive
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Apr 20, 2020 18:49
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Seafaring II, Zealous II
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Apr 20, 2020 18:50
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Servetus posted:Aerial and Naive Seconding this for no other reason than it sounds massively unwise.
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Apr 20, 2020 19:01
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Seraphic Neoman posted:Scientific and Zealous II
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Apr 20, 2020 19:03
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Seraphic Neoman posted:Scientific and Zealous II
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Apr 20, 2020 20:12
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Jossar posted:
This dilemma is lifted word for word from the browser game NationStates.
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Apr 20, 2020 22:23
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Civilized II and Zealous II. Double up on the double down.Obliterati posted:This dilemma is lifted word for word from the browser game NationStates.
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Apr 20, 2020 22:34
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