|
Yeah, you only have to do one sidequest to proceed, and you can automatically knock that off by just talking to Chadley with any of his requirements fulfilled.
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 02:25
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 25, 2024 21:58 |
|
|
The mayor.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 02:38
|
|
|
Platinum Trophy obtained! God drat this game’s fun. Here’s to hopefully some DLC in between titles even if it’s just more VR missions. The combat is just so much fun.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 02:59
|
|
|
I'd love a doc that let you use the oldschool 3d models. Or just a shader that made them look that way.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 03:03
|
|
|
Detective No. 27 posted:Using a cat robot to undermine your company is the most galaxy brain thing that Reeve could have done. yeah he owns
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 03:03
|
|
|
FF7 is my favorite game, and I went into this with reservations, because I really didn't like anything they did for 7 after the original game itself. I think Advent Children is a bad movie in particular. So my thoughts on the changes (the ending in particular).. If you don't want to see a bunch of complaints, then feel free to just scroll on. I pretty much hated it. One of my favorite parts of the original was the end of the Shinra building and they ruined most of the impact. The end is some eerie, horror movie type poo poo. Following a mysterious blood trail only to come upon President Shinra's dead body impaled by Sephiroth's sword who is nowhere to be seen. But here they put in Too Much Sephiroth and then they cap it off with the whole defying destiny stuff. No Rufus speech and he now feels almost pointless after what was faced at the end. Sephiroth is a very mysterious figure in the early game. There's a lot of confusion as to whether he's even real or alive. They overuse him this time to a ridiculous degree. It reminds me of Advent Children where they bring him back for no real reason other than fanservice. His story arc with Cloud was done. Nothing was gained by fighting him again in that movie, they just knew people wanted to see Sephiroth, and that's how I felt here. He was way too present and in the foreground. Like they even play One Winged Angel which was a badass and capstone moment of the original for the finale and they used it up already. His scenes aren't interesting and don't really add anything to the story as of now. The ending was so... bombastic that I don't really know how they're going to escalate without getting comical, and I fear they're setting this up to keep Aerith alive which would completely destroy an important emotional moment from the original. The idea that death sometimes comes out of nowhere and it's not always heroic or intentional. Just happens, and leaves you empty. Of course there's no guarantee they're doing that so I'm not going to preemptively complain, it's just a worry given what we've been presented with. The fact that so many people, basically every named character, survive the plate collapse diminishes the horror and severity of the event, especially keeping Wedge and Biggs alive. I really felt nothing for just about every sidequest and new character. I have no emotions for the Angel of the Slums, or Leslie, or the patrol kids. Roche felt especially pointless. They don't flesh anything out or develop the main cast in any way. The padding really became ridiculous, such as the weird underground Shinra facility, and dear god Hojo's lab. Moving those huge arms in the slum tunnels might be the most boring thing I've done in a game in a long time. That stuff I can forgive if they hadn't deviated so hard at the end. I understand why people might be excited to see how new stuff plays out, but I don't trust them to do it well. The hopes I had for this game were based in the fact that they would be mostly constrained to the original story and they're kicking it to the side. Maybe I'm in the minority who actually just wanted to see the original game with updated graphics and maybe fleshing some things out. I have very little faith that they can pull off the rest after this. I'll be happy to be proven wrong. Unrelated to story stuff, I just wasn't too into the battle system. After a few hours I turned it to classic which honestly wasn't much different than easy because the AI is too defensive. My main problem was the ATB was too slow to fill for the characters you weren't controlling. I wish it would be quicker and maybe have them use some stuff on their own. I will go over some stuff I liked, though. I think the main cast is pretty spot on, from characterization to voice acting to design. The actual written dialogue is pretty good, and surprisingly funny at times. Barret stole the show. A fear I had was that they might lean too hard on the FF7 compilation characterization where Cloud is mopey and Aerith is a princess, but they successfully kept Aerith's sass and Cloud's dorky-ness. Cloud actually has some of the best lines in the original ("You look like a bear wearing a marshmallow.") and “I know. Nailed it. Moving on.” is on that level. If there's hope for the games going forward, it's that they keep these things up. At least even if they bugle the story hardcore the character moments could still be good. They managed to do Wall Market well. They could have easily hosed it up and made it offensive. Even if I didn't care for the battle system overall, it's pretty cool to see in action. Tifa is awesome and playing her was the most fun part of the combat. The graphics are pretty fantastic and not just for a console game. The music is still great, though some tracks were maybe a bit too remixed. Up until the end I was impressed with how faithful a lot of it was. Especially in environment design. It's amusing to go "this layout is so familiar, I wonder if there's a materia still around here?" and have it actually be there. Cats. Also for all of Cloud's sweet flips and one-man-army type battles, Aerith stone cold staring Hojo down as he says horrific poo poo about her mother is the most badass thing anyone does in the game. I'll probably still play the next one because I could always be surprised, and I'm weak and have no willpower. Adus fucked around with this message at 03:15 on Apr 21, 2020 |
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 03:10
|
|
|
drat this Wutai theme that's playing on this radio in ch 14 is so good I've been just standing here listening to it.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 03:21
|
|
|
That Honey Bee show sure is something 
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 03:45
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/Starlightchi/status/1251976570849251328 bonus content: https://twitter.com/Starlightchi/status/1252298768025743360
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 03:53
|
|
|
I'm enjoying the hard mode quite a bit, it's just challenging enough so far without me wanting to smash anything at all, starting chapter 8 now.... HP up materia is your friend and using the right materia for the battles seem to be key
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 04:04
|
|
|
Although I think I had more fun playing the game than you (mainly because the battle system finally clicked for me and it became fun to play), I think we agree on pretty much everything else. Word of advice: don't go to the spoiler thread. I say that because most of the discussion there is about how rad it will be if the plot goes off the rails and Aerith survives. While there's definitely a bit of curiosity in me about where the next episode will go, I'm mostly apprehensive because I know the ending of this one set it up to go anywhere but where there original went. I'm in the same boat with you about wanting a more plot-faithful remake and was extremely disappointed by the time Chapter 18 ended. I started having my doubts when Sephiroth first appeared, naturally, because that was a red flag that the game was only going to hit the major plot points without keeping the minor details intact. I was ok with brushing off how some things changed in service of having a more fleshed out world and how some things were added whole cloth (like Ch 4) even if they weren't great, but when it came down to having a debate with President Shinra about principles and then a fakeout Barrett death culminating in a Kingdom Hearts-style gigantic final boss in a void dimension was a bridge too far. The overarching question is how do you follow that up? The Nibelheim flashback at Kalm is ostensibly next, but we've already seen so much Sephiroth (and even fought him off) that it won't have the same impact. Likewise, knowing what the final boss was like in this game, what's next? Everything except fighting Sephiroth for real will just pale in comparison. And without the Whispers to keep the plot on track, it should be logically easy for it to go horribly wrong. I mean, without them Cloud wouldn't have gone on the Sector 5 bombing run and ultimately wouldn't have met Aerith. If he did meet her, he was seconds away from decapitating Reno until they showed up. There's more, but the aftermath without the whispers would have already given us something completely different and if they ultimately end up following the original's plot much more closely with deviations as necessary given the new style of presentation (fully 3D vs isometric screens) then you have to ask why the first installment had to go to all the trouble to justify minor deviations if the main plot is untouched. My biggest disappointment is simply that for as faithfully as many details were recreated to make this game they weren't used in tandem with a faithful retelling of the story. I'm not gonna play the next episode until I get a feel for how badly things deviate from the original and maybe I'll pick it up on sale? I might end up as weak-willed as you because I also have a big soft spot for FF7.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 04:20
|
|
|
I think the spoiler thread consensus is less hype about Aerith living, and more amazed that they managed to inject tension into whether Aerith will or won't die. the 20 year old video game spoiler meme
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 04:25
|
|
|
The combat system is designed for you to constantly switch characters, if passive ATB growth were as fast as Active Battling then it wouldn't have that effect
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 04:27
|
|
|
Adus posted:That stuff I can forgive if they hadn't deviated so hard at the end. I understand why people might be excited to see how new stuff plays out, but I don't trust them to do it well. The hopes I had for this game were based in the fact that they would be mostly constrained to the original story and they're kicking it to the side. I'll say this is one of the only fully-negative takes I've read, but regarding the ending, you are definitely not in the minority as far as reactions across the internet are concerned. I think a disproportionate number of people here on SA are into it and/or are at least willing to give it a shot and see how it all plays out, but for the most part it seems like most takes are "this is incredible for 30 hours and then an unforgivable betrayal at the end." So don't feel alone, I guess? For my part I feel very conflicted. I'm in the "I'll give it a shot and see where this goes" camp but given the choice I'd have preferred it to just follow the plot from here onward with deviations on the same scale as what we got in this game. I'm totally on board with new characters, significant detours, rewritten sections like how they rewrote Wall Market, all of that. That we're throwing out the idea that it has to follow the Big Picture plot from now on is somewhat interesting and exciting but also disappointing and worrying for me, so I really, honestly don't fully know how I feel yet. Actually, hell, even Really Big Detours or significant changes I'm cool with as long as it's still the story of Final Fantasy VII and not a parallel universes/alternate timelines colliding, time travel shenanigans story wearing FF7's clothes. And maybe it could still be that! We have no way of knowing yet, I guess, which excites some people but also worries me. That said I adored almost everything about the game up to that point, which is where I think we disagree. There were a couple of pretty egregious filler moments like the second sewer trip but they didn't ruin the game for me, and I thought the character writing, world details, and combat were so crazy good that I can forgive a whole lot when it comes to filler and padding. homeless snail posted:I think the spoiler thread consensus is less hype about Aerith living, and more amazed that they managed to inject tension into whether Aerith will or won't die. the 20 year old video game spoiler meme Yeah, this is perhaps a fine distinction but it's worth making. I think, by and large, people who are the most excited by the ending are excited that they don't know what's coming next when they thought they'd be in for just a retread of a story they know like the back of their hands. Now it's all up in the air. Anything's on the table. Aerith might live, or she might die the same way, or she might die a different way, and nobody knows. That's what people in the spoiler thread seem excited about (applied to the whole plot, too, not just to Aerith's fate). Harrow fucked around with this message at 04:33 on Apr 21, 2020 |
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 04:28
|
|
|
It's ok to want a faithful retelling of the original storyline. It's also ok to want to see the storyline taken in a new direction. Just no more of the "FF7R's leads hate their fans and are denying them a "true" remake of FF7 out of spite" stuff please.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 04:36
|
|
|
CharlieFoxtrot posted:The combat system is designed for you to constantly switch characters, if passive ATB growth were as fast as Active Battling then it wouldn't have that effect Yeah, I originally thought that I wanted ATB to charge more quickly for characters you don't control (especially after just playing the demo) but now that I've played through the full game and dabbled in Hard mode, I really like how it currently is. Constantly swapping characters works really well and adds a welcome amount of variety and dynamism to the combat. It definitely takes a while to click--that intersection between "ATB gates every action but basic attacks" with the rest of the combat being fully real-time action is a little strange at first--but once it clicked I loved it. anakha posted:It's ok to want a faithful retelling of the original storyline. 
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 04:36
|
|
|
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 04:37
|
|
|
My take on any potential fuckery: Think of it this way. They literally could not hit the same note with fans that they did during the original scene where she died. So.... the only possible way they could hit that note is to either 1)Cast doubt or 2)Just not do it. Maybe even kill someone else. This has been my prediction for what they do since before this remake even existed. Artistically, they have to do it.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 04:39
|
|
|
anakha posted:Just no more of the "FF7R's leads hate their fans and are denying them a "true" remake of FF7 out of spite" stuff please. Especially since they're quoted back in, like, 2015 as saying they want old fans to be just as surprised with new things as they were in the original, and that a retread would be boring. They love the fans so they're giving them new stuff!
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 04:42
|
|
|
Oh whoops I didn't even know there was a spoiler thread or I probably would have posted that in there.Harrow posted:Yeah, I originally thought that I wanted ATB to charge more quickly for characters you don't control (especially after just playing the demo) but now that I've played through the full game and dabbled in Hard mode, I really like how it currently is. Constantly swapping characters works really well and adds a welcome amount of variety and dynamism to the combat. I kind of figured that was the intention but it didn't feel very good to me. I'd rather just have agency in playing the character I want primarily while tossing abilities from the others. But it seems to work for a lot of people so I'm not going to claim it's poorly designed. Just didn't gel with me.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 04:44
|
|
|
Adus posted:I kind of figured that was the intention but it didn't feel very good to me. I'd rather just have agency in playing the character I want primarily while tossing abilities from the others. But it seems to work for a lot of people so I'm not going to claim it's poorly designed. Just didn't gel with me. Yeah, I get you. People like different things. Also it's probably good that you didn't post that in the spoiler thread, at least today. There was just a very long argument (that I was partially responsible for perpetuating, I have to admit) about some of the things you brought up that I think a lot of the thread is real fatigued by. Maybe tomorrow if you want to discuss it more 
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 04:47
|
|
|
Veryslightlymad posted:My take on any potential fuckery: I don't agree with this at all. By your logic everything that gets remade has to diverge from the original material to be effective. I didn't go into this remake saga hoping to be surprised by plot twists, just seeing a more polished of something I already love. Aerith's death would still be an emotional moment, especially with everything looking so much more realistic. My feelings right now aren't so much "Oh man, maybe she'll live!" and more "Ugh, maybe she'll live...".
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 04:55
|
|
|
Adus posted:I kind of figured that was the intention but it didn't feel very good to me. I'd rather just have agency in playing the character I want primarily while tossing abilities from the others. But it seems to work for a lot of people so I'm not going to claim it's poorly designed. Just didn't gel with me. I liked the battle system because I felt the game differentiated the characters' skills and abilities well enough that they each brought something different that I liked into each fight. Barret as the ranged tank, Tifa as the combo wreck-your-face monster, and Aerith as the support and setup. I loved switching between the three in every fight. Strangely enough, I didn't like using Cloud too much in battles - his general-purpose approach actually made we want to switch to the more specialized characters and stay with them, and his counterattack specialties were built more for boss fights then general battles.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 04:56
|
|
|
anakha posted:I liked the battle system because I felt the game differentiated the characters' skills and abilities well enough that they each brought something different that I liked into each fight. Barret as the ranged tank, Tifa as the combo wreck-your-face monster, and Aerith as the support and setup. I loved switching between the three in every fight. I liked using Cloud's counters in regular battles because the counterattack from Punisher Mode hits a pretty large AoE and you're still functionally "blocking" while you swing as far as I can tell. But by the end of the game I was controlling Tifa as often as I could, really. She's just really something special.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 05:03
|
|
|
Adus posted:I don't agree with this at all. Having never played OG FF7 for more than an hour or two, if I could read the entire synopsis of the plot of FF7R from a geocities website put up in 1998 I'd be really mad about it. The specific point about Aerith's death in OG FF7 is that it was at the time a shocking moment and a significant chunk of its impact came from its shock value. Following plainly in OG FF7's footsteps would have been a massive letdown, since there's no way to recreate that shock if literally the entire world knows it's coming. Veryslightlymad is absolutely correct: they could not have hit the same notes with fans as the original scene. So they didn't even try, and good on them for it.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 05:03
|
|
|
The ending is cool because now there’s actual tension as to whether Aerith lives or dies instead of it being a sure thing and if they decide to kill her they can make it shocking all over again
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 05:06
|
|
|
Adus posted:I don't agree with this at all. Augus posted:The ending is cool because now there’s actual tension as to whether Aerith lives or dies instead of it being a sure thing and if they decide to kill her they can make it shocking all over again
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 05:14
|
|
|
Copying over my post from the spoilers thread since it seems relevant to this discussion:anakha posted:Pure speculation: Aerith's speech in Chapter 18 about taking on Fate might also be covering up her 'selfish' want to survive because while she knows letting Fate have its way will result in a pyrrhic victory for the Planet, she's all 'gently caress that, I want to live'.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 05:14
|
|
|
Yeah there are so many things in the combat system that incentivize you to switch, like if this were a pure action RPG I would be pissed by how many stunlocks and interrupts there are, but those kind of force you to switch characters to keep the pressure on. Also I'm at (one of?) the final boss(es) and I'm pretty sure the big cutscene attack was supposed to set their health to zero instead of me sitting here pinging down the last 1% with ranged attacks and magic lol?
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 05:17
|
|
|
CharlieFoxtrot posted:Also I'm at (one of?) the final boss(es) and I'm pretty sure the big cutscene attack was supposed to set their health to zero instead of me sitting here pinging down the last 1% with ranged attacks and magic lol? Nah, it's supposed to do that. It's also supposed to slowly lean forward so you can hit it in melee. I finished it off with a Braver myself.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 05:19
|
|
CharlieFoxtrot posted:The combat system is designed for you to constantly switch characters, if passive ATB growth were as fast as Active Battling then it wouldn't have that effect Pretty much every complaint I’ve had with the battle system has been solved by switching more.
|
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 05:28
|
|
|
Strobe posted:Having never played OG FF7 for more than an hour or two, if I could read the entire synopsis of the plot of FF7R from a geocities website put up in 1998 I'd be really mad about it. Her death results in some important character development for Cloud and kind of the entire party. Do we have to consider any main character death in media a shock value stunt? To me it was a really unHollywood-like death. It just happens. There's no sobbing final words, there wasn't really any leadup, kind of like how people can die in real life (except they likely aren't impaled by swords, at least these days). You wouldn't remotely get the same resonance from a block of sterile text simply listing a thing happens. You're not obligated to change a story when remaking something just because it's ingrained in pop culture. You can make the thing interesting and add new stuff without massively diverging from the main plot. It's a story I like, I was looking forward to experiencing it in a new way. I mentioned before the end of the Shinra building is a favorite part of mine and I was looking forward to seeing how they did it, and they really dropped the ball. I'm glad people are enjoying it, and I don't think they changed it to be spiteful like apparently some people have claimed, but I disagree that they HAD to do it and it wasn't what I was wanting. I'm not really excited for the future games based on what they did at the end there, but I'll be happy to be proven wrong.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 05:38
|
|
|
Adus posted:I don't agree with this at all. I'm going to cross-post this from the Spoilers thread: Onmi posted:Just to post more to head off the "NOMURA!" Rage train, like... everyone involved is on board with this stuff. This is exactly the issue. They could recreate it exactly, and it would be a case of "ah, this is nostalgic, how nice" but it wouldn't create any tension, it wouldn't bring any surprises or evoke any new emotions. They wanted to give fans more than that, and it's not a case of them just changing stuff to piss people off.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 05:42
|
|
|
I'd never claim they were changing things to piss people off. I get their reasoning and who knows if I was in their position maybe I'd be doing the same thing. I think a lot of my worry comes from my feelings toward all the post original FF7 being pretty negative so I just don't know if I trust them to do new FF7 content that's good. The way they handled this ending was not good, so my faith has not been restored yet.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 05:53
|
|
|
i mean, this game was new ff7 content that was good
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 05:55
|
|
|
idk i just want to hang out a bunch with cloud and his friends and this game did a ton to prove they get how to write them properly so im stoked for whats next
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 05:56
|
|
|
Yeah, the fact that almost everyone agrees that they nailed the characters and feel that people loved from the original for 95% of the Remake doesn't give you any confidence?
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 05:57
|
|
|
Adus posted:Her death results in some important character development for Cloud and kind of the entire party. Do we have to consider any main character death in media a shock value stunt? To me it was a really unHollywood-like death. It just happens. There's no sobbing final words, there wasn't really any leadup, kind of like how people can die in real life (except they likely aren't impaled by swords, at least these days). You wouldn't remotely get the same resonance from a block of sterile text simply listing a thing happens. Your posts are full of "they didn't have to" and "you're not obligated to" and it really comes across as a whiny version of "I didn't want them to", which is a valid opinion on its own but you're really trying hard to make it feel unsympathetic. If you tell me that none of the impact of Aeris's death is because it was unexpected and sudden, I'm going to call you a liar to your face. The impact is significantly lessened, and the game would be worse (much worse) for following in lockstep with the original.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 06:08
|
|
|
And the thing is, even if you don't think Aerith's death is made impactful by its unexpected nature... they do.quote:In early planning stages of Final Fantasy VII, Aerith was to be one of only three protagonists; herself, Cloud and Barret. During a phone call to Kitase, it was suggested that at some point in the game, one of the main characters should die, and after much discussion as to whether it should be Barret or Aerith, the producers chose Aerith. Nomura stated in a 2005 Electronic Gaming Monthly interview: "Cloud's the main character, so you can't really kill him. And Barrett... well, that's maybe too obvious." While designing Final Fantasy VII, Nomura was frustrated with the "perennial cliché where the protagonist loves someone very much and so has to sacrifice himself and die in a dramatic fashion to express that love." He found this trope appeared in both films and video games from North America and Japan, and asked "Is it right to set such an example to people?" quote:Kitase concluded: "In the real world things are very different. You just need to look around you. Nobody wants to die that way. People die of disease and accident. Death comes suddenly and there is no notion of good or bad. It leaves, not a dramatic feeling but great emptiness. When you lose someone you loved very much you feel this big empty space and think, 'If I had known this was coming I would have done things differently.' These are the feelings I wanted to arouse in the players with Aerith's death relatively early in the game. Feelings of reality and not Hollywood." quote:According to Nomura, "death should be something sudden and unexpected, and Aerith's death seemed more natural and realistic." He said: "When I reflect on Final Fantasy VII, the fact that fans were so offended by her sudden death probably means that we were successful with her character. If fans had simply accepted her death, that would have meant she wasn't an effective character."
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 06:14
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 25, 2024 21:58 |
|
|
Schwartzcough posted:Yeah, the fact that almost everyone agrees that they nailed the characters and feel that people loved from the original for 95% of the Remake doesn't give you any confidence? I mean even I agree with this and it's why I'm not fully checked out yet but I'm not that confident, no. I'll still give them the chance to win me over. The ending was overdone for the first part of what is to be at least 3 games, and featured wayyy too much Sephiroth. I just don't really know how they can escalate without getting stupidly ridiculous. Strobe posted:Your posts are full of "they didn't have to" and "you're not obligated to" and it really comes across as a whiny version of "I didn't want them to", which is a valid opinion on its own but you're really trying hard to make it feel unsympathetic. If that's what it seemed like I was saying then I misspoke. I think there's a difference between Aerith's death being 'sudden and shocking' and being 'sudden for the sake of shock value'. I'm not really looking for people to agree with me or sympathize with my position. Just participating in the discussion. If anything it's nice that it's not just an echo chamber. But I think it's fair for me to disagree when someone says 'artistically they had to [change things]'. You can prefer that they did and be happy with it, but it's still subjective. I would have preferred they didn't.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2020 06:21
|
|