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I. M. Gei posted:Calico has finally figured out how the feeding syringe works and is sucking them dry like a boss. 
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Apr 24, 2020 05:19
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I. M. Gei posted:Calico has finally figured out how the feeding syringe works and is sucking them dry like a boss. Congrats on your new cats 
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Apr 24, 2020 07:33
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Okay so, this is a rough idea of my current schedule. • 1:00 to 1:30 - Feed kittens, attempt to burp them, and wipe their asses/privates so they can piss and/or poo poo • 1:30 to 4:00 - Rest; periodically check on heating pads to make sure they’re still on since they have that stupid auto shutoff and FOR SOME REASON MY NEXT DAY HEATING PAD ORDER FROM PETSMART IS STILL PROCESSING WTF  • 4:00 to 4:30 - Repeat All three kittens look to be doing okay to my untrained eye so far. I’d like to know what signs to look for that might indicate something is wrong though. A couple things: • I still have no idea if I’m burping the kittens properly, or what a burping newborn kitten even looks or sounds like. I should watch those Youtube videos sneakyfrog posted, and I will, but...... I’m sorry, I’m just so drat sleepy.  • I’ve only gotten two of the kittens to poop so far, and that was one time each. Another one pooped in the box not long after I brought them in, just before I started wiping them regularly, but I don’t know which one it was. Maybe it was the third one. At the very least, the paper towels are changing color when I wipe, so that’s probably good right? How often do regularly-fed, one-week-old newborn kittens normally poop? Like as in actually poop, as in brown stuff coming out the rear end?
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Apr 24, 2020 07:46
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You sound like you are doing fine. Being tired on that schedule is pretty normal. Weight is going to be the biggest indication of something being up. Weigh them daily and they should be gaining weight.
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Apr 24, 2020 12:59
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sneakyfrog posted:Weight is going to be the biggest indication of something being up. Weigh them daily and they should be gaining weight. One of them is down 0.10 oz from yesterday.  The other two are up 0.05 oz and 0.10 oz. Aren’t they supposed to gain half an ounce per day at this age? Should I go to the vet immediately?  EDIT: I am at the vet now. I. M. Gei fucked around with this message at 22:42 on Apr 24, 2020 |
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Apr 24, 2020 21:57
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 I’M BACK FROM THE VET AND THE KITTENS ARE JUST FINE!!  ... well they’re just fine as far as they can tell right now, at least. They’re too little to do much testing, but the vet said they all look great. Apparently I wasn’t feeding them enough formula, though. I started off feeding each of them 3 mL every 2 or 3 hours (which is about what a lot of online sources recommend), then yesterday afternoon I upped that amount to 4 mL, and I upped it again to 5 mL this morning (partly because I slacked a bit on the feeding intervals due to ME AM SLEEPY)...... but the vet told me I should up that to at least 6 mL now. I am having a bit of trouble with feeding. The feeding syringes are hard to aim into the kittens’ mouths, partly because the kittens aren’t always eager to eat and sometimes I have trouble getting them to open up, partly because the syringes are long and kinda unwieldy for such a delicate task, partly because the syringe holes are huge and not easy to get into a kitten’s lips, and partly because the kittens almost always have their heads and mouths pointing downward (and when I try to reposition them upward, the kittens get scared, squirm around in my hands, and generally are even less interested in eating). Even when they do want to eat, the formula doesn’t always go into their mouths; some of it drips out or otherwise gets ON them instead of IN them. I just ordered some nursing bottles from PetCo, but I won’t be able to pick them up until they open at 10:00 AM tomorrow. I’m hoping those’ll be easier to use. Please give me some advice on how to make this syringe-feeding poo poo easier, until I get those bottles in 14 hours.
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Apr 25, 2020 02:47
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I have no advice but bless you
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Apr 25, 2020 03:21
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I have experience bottle feeding baby bunnies and the best thing I’ve found is the Miracle Nipple. It’s much smaller than the ones I found at the store so it works better for teeny babies. I got it from Amazon.
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Apr 25, 2020 04:27
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I finally watched the Kitten Lady feeding video sneakyfrog posted annnnnnd YEP I’VE BEEN DOING IT WRONG THIS WHOLE TIME  I also need to get some new feeding syringes because apparently the ones the vet gave me loving suck rear end. Joburg posted:I have experience bottle feeding baby bunnies and the best thing I’ve found is the Miracle Nipple. It’s much smaller than the ones I found at the store so it works better for teeny babies. I got it from Amazon. This is something else I need to get. COVID has completely wrecked Amazon’s delivery times though, so I need to try to find a physical store that sells them near me.
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Apr 25, 2020 05:02
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glad things are working out. congrats on your instant cat herd
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Apr 25, 2020 12:32
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And now, a brief lesson on kitten feeding syringes, that should really go in the OP last decade because I had to learn it the hard way, but YOU don’t have to! - The syringe on the left is a dosing syringe from a Walgreens pharmacy, that a pharmacist gave me (two of!) for free in the middle of the 2020 COVID Boomer-B-Gon pandemic. - The syringe on the right is the “feeding” syringe that was given to me by our local 24 hour emergency vet (along with a starter pack of milk replacer formula powder) when I told them I had some tiny 5-day-old kittens to feed. The syringe on the left is mother loving excellent for feeding tiny kittens less than a week old. Note the small, tapering hole at the end, that is very easy to get into a small kitten’s mouth and is even shaped a little bit like a momma cat’s nipple. This is what you want to look for in a feeding syringe for tiny baby animals! It also does a great job delivering formula into a kitten’s mouth, and not onto their chins and all over your clothes. The syringe on the right is terrible loving dogshit. Actually, it’s even worse than dogshit. Calling the syringe on the right “dogshit” is an insult to actual canine feces. DO NOT USE THE SYRINGE ON THE RIGHT IF YOU HAVE A BETTER OPTION AVAILABLE. The end is too big and too bulky for a kitten to even get its mouth around comfortably, let alone suckle on, which of course means that any formula that comes out of it is more likely to end up on the floor than in the kitten’s belly, and the shape of it loving sucks rancid rear end. If you try to shove this thing in a kitten’s face, it won’t know what the gently caress. You want me to loving EAT out of this!? This poo poo isn’t shaped like mom’s nipple at all! How would YOU like it if I shoved a roll of quarters into YOUR craw and told YOU to suck it!? Bitch I got something hard you can suck on RIGHT HERE!! HOW’S MY “FORMULA” TASTE, MOTHA?!?!?
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Apr 25, 2020 21:00
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lol the one on the right is loving dogshit its a twist on injection syringe no wonder you were having a hell of a time. you need a new vet if they gave you that to feed a kitten with might be able to make do with the one on the right if you cut the plastic off the end but even then jaggy plastic bits plus kittens do not mix. TehRedWheelbarrow fucked around with this message at 21:08 on Apr 25, 2020 |
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Apr 25, 2020 21:06
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And while I’m here, I need y’all to recommend me a good heating pad for small kittens that doesn’t have a loving auto shutoff. Because I just got this thing at PetCo and it sucks. It puts out almost no heat at all. My instant-read thermometer says it gets less than 10° hotter than ambient room temp, which only puts it at like 80°, and that’s just in a tiny area in the middle. I need something with no auto shutoff, preferably that isn’t triggered by a pet’s weight since little 1-week-old kittens weigh almost nothing, and I need to be able to get it today at a physical brick-and-mortar store since Amazon’s (and every other online retailer on Earth’s) shipping times are all hosed up from The Coronnus.
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Apr 25, 2020 21:13
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https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B...9e8928b76e80f60 that one
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Apr 25, 2020 21:16
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sneakyfrog posted:lol the one on the right is loving dogshit Yeah that's definitely the wrong type of syringe. Most vets should have the slip tip type in addition to the luer lock. Wonder if it was some new person that just grabbed the nearest syringe or something. You have to be very careful with heating pads, they can cause burns if they get too hot. You may already know this but definitely give the kittens room to get away from the heating pad if its too hot. It should be half warm box, half not warmed box. Again this may all be info you already have but just in case... https://veterinarypartner.vin.com/default.aspx?pid=19239&id=4951456 http://www.hdw-inc.com/tinykitten.htm
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Apr 26, 2020 09:42
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It fills me with shame to say that I am having trouble waking up in the middle of the night to feed my babies, so what should be a 2 hour feeding interval is more like 5 hours. I’m so sorry. I’ll try to do better.  On the plus side, all 3 kittens are eating (and pooping) a lot more now that I switched to not-lovely syringes. That’s good right? P.S. How do I know if a less-than-2-week-old kitten has diarrhea? Dixville posted:You have to be very careful with heating pads, they can cause burns if they get too hot. You may already know this but definitely give the kittens room to get away from the heating pad if its too hot. It should be half warm box, half not warmed box. I just moved them to a bigger box. There are 2 heating pads in there right now, I’ve got the heat on both set to “Low” (second-lowest setting on both, just above “Warm”), and they’re both covered with two layers worth of towel. At first when I moved them the kittens tried to bury themselves under all the towels, but then I put an extra towel on top of them as a blanket and they seem to love it. They also deliberately seek out spots where the heating pads aren’t covered by towels whenever one appears, so I’m making sure to minimize those. I’n kinda wondering if the pads are giving off too little heat now. I. M. Gei fucked around with this message at 13:55 on Apr 26, 2020 |
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Apr 26, 2020 13:52
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When I've fostered bottle babies before we've used a SnuggleSafe pad for them. It's not electric at all, but it's a plastic disk thing you heat in the microwave and then it will stay at the right temp for about 8-10 hours. I'm not sure if they have them available at pet stores though, I've only ever seen them on Amazon. Also that dipshit who gave you a luer lock syringe to feed kittens doesn't know what the hell they're doing. Keep track of their weight daily, that's going to be the best indicator that they're doing well. Teeny kittens like that grow FAST, their weight should always be higher than the last time you checked. If their weight stays flat or starts to drop that's an indication that they're not doing well. ALSO, don't take it too personally if you end up with a kitten that doesn't make it. Keep in mind that the cat species survival strategy is putting out huge numbers of kittens with the expectations that many will die- unlike us humans, whose evolutionary strategy is small numbers of high-quality offspring. Kittens die. A lot. It's sad and it sucks, but even with the best possible care it happens. It doesn't mean you failed if it happens.
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Apr 26, 2020 14:25
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sneakyfrog posted:just a syringe is fine. just keep at it. Quoting this so I can find these videos in my post history. Apparently I’ve been wiping them wrong this whole time too
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Apr 27, 2020 08:51
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Actually while I’m here, please recommend me good organic unscented baby wipes that I can use on tiny kittens’ peeholes and buttholes without harming them. Kitten Lady recommends using those, but COVID has utterly hosed my ability to find the ones she uses in the video online.
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Apr 27, 2020 09:04
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I've always just used ordinary tissues to potty the bottle babies  If things get a little messy we just use a washcloth with warm water to clean them up
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Apr 27, 2020 16:14
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Kitten Lady also says that they’re supposed to pee every single time you wipe, but every now and then mine don’t. Like just now. And their poo isn’t yellow like her’s either, it’s brown or clay-orange. Are either of these things I should worry about?
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Apr 27, 2020 16:19
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I am getting a bit concerned about my calico baby. She seems a bit less active and vocal than normal. I’m not sure if that’s just a passing thing or not, but she has pooped a little more often than the other two kittens over the past couple of days. Could she be dehydrated from diarrhea? What do I give a dehydrated <2-week-old kitten? Is just water okay? Am I not feeding her often enough? Please help me! I know kittens die all the time from unpreventable poo poo, but I still want all of these ones to live dammit!
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Apr 27, 2020 23:17
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I. M. Gei posted:I am getting a bit concerned about my calico baby. The internet has remedies for dehydration including Pedialyte but I have no experience with those and would suggest to call the vet, who can do subcutaneous fluids.
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Apr 27, 2020 23:28
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wheatpuppy posted:A quick check for dehydration is pinch a little skin - if it flattens immediately she's ok fluid-wise, but if it takes a minute she's probably dehydrated. I don’t really know what “immediately” means in this case, but her skin seems to be flattening back out right away when I pinch it. Except on the neck area, but I think that might be normal since there’s a bit of extra skin around there. The inside of her mouth is slick too, which according to the vet means she’s getting enough food, although I just fed her about 45 minutes ago so I don’t know if that means anything yet. Also when I last fed her, she didn’t appear to do much active suckling, at least compared to the other two. Actually she turned her head away from the syringe a few times, even as I had just started to feed her; I kinda had to force her to get a healthy-sized meal. Kitten Lady says that sometimes you may have to force a kitten to eat for one reason or another, but it’s still a bit worrying. EDIT: I’m about to weigh the kittens in the next 20 or 30 minutes, so we’ll see what happens then. If she’s gained less than 0.30 oz since yesterday, then I’ll probably just say gently caress it and take her to the vet. I. M. Gei fucked around with this message at 23:59 on Apr 27, 2020 |
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Apr 27, 2020 23:53
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WELP SHE LOST 0.2 OZ SINCE YESTERDAY SO WE’RE AT THE VET NOW Somebody just took her back to an exam room Fingers crossed!
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Apr 28, 2020 00:54
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Praying for you and your kittens.
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Apr 28, 2020 01:00
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You're doing the absolute best you can for them. You couldn't have done anything better for them in the last week or so. Whatever happens I hope you know that, and I really hope the kitten will be okay.
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Apr 28, 2020 01:58
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Okay I’m back. Turns out the kitten WAS dehydrated, and her body temperature was on the low side too. The vet is gonna keep her overnight, give her subcutaneous fluids, keep her heated, deworm her, and feed her, and I’m gonna pick her up early tomorrow morning. There may or may not be a follow-up visit to to the regular vet after that so they can show me how to do something or other with a feeding tube. As far as her prognosis...... I didn’t get to see the doctor in person, but his attendant said he didn’t really give an indication one way or another how kitten’s chances looked, but she told me that she took the fact that he didn’t say kitten WOULDN’T make it to be a good sign. They told me I could call as often as I wanted throughout the night to check on her, so I might do that; if I do, I’ll post any updates they give me. I. M. Gei posted:Fingers crossed!
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Apr 28, 2020 02:05
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I am so relieved and hope your kittens continue to grow and thrive and that she gets to come home safe.
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Apr 28, 2020 02:07
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......... I have completely hijacked this thread, haven’t I?
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Apr 28, 2020 02:09
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Yes, and that's okay. I think you're the only goon fostering or rescuing animals right now. Keep telling us about it, don't feel bad, and if a goon is reading this and you're fostering or adopting, tell us about it!
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Apr 28, 2020 02:10
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Please tell me the EXACT temperature at which 1-week-old kittens get burned, because right now I can’t tell if my heating pads are hot enough. I just had one kitten go to the vet with low body temp, I don’t want another!
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Apr 28, 2020 03:08
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I. M. Gei posted:Please tell me the EXACT temperature at which 1-week-old kittens get burned, because right now I can’t tell if my heating pads are hot enough. I just had one kitten go to the vet with low body temp, I don’t want another! Kittens cant thermo-regulate, so any heat is good heat unless your boiling them. A normal cat temp is anywhere from 99-102 give or take .5. If you can treat them like reptiles, give them a heating pad around the high end suggested 90, and then a space for them to crawl away to if its too hot. If you can spare the cash get a chicken incubator so they can get a constant temp and airflow.
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Apr 28, 2020 05:49
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Vet called, kitten didn’t make it  I’m not entirely clear on the exact cause, but it sounded like low body temperature played a big part. I know little kittens die all the time, but it wasn’t loving supposed to happen on my watch god dammit! Mostly I’m just sad and angry. Angry at myself for not doing something about the dehydration sooner, angry at that other vet for telling me to turn the heat on my heating pads down lower (no really, THEY’RE ACTUALLY GETTING BURNED EVEN IF IT LOOKS LIKE THEY loving LOVE THAT HIGHER HEAT, HONEST   ), angry at myself again for actually listening to that decrepit old geezer vet telling me to turn the heat down lower, angry at all heating pad companies for making that goddamn loving auto shutoff feature in every single pad and giving me no option whatsoever to turn it off, angry at myself a third time for not hauling my rear end to turn the heating pads back on more often than I did when they shut off, angry at Amazon and COVID for completely loving all shipping times everywhere on Earth so my good non-shutoff heating pad couldn’t get here faster, angry at my tiny rear end country shithole town and the brick-and-mortar stores therein for not having non-shutoff heating pads in stock, angry at God for letting this happenJust angry Angry and sad as gently caress and hoping to Christ that it wasn’t even slightly my fault The other two kittens seem to be doing well and in good spirits, so that’s something, but even one kitten dying loving sucks. I turned the heat back up on their heating pads, and I’m gonna keep it that way, and anyone who DARES to loving open their idiot degenerate untermensch mouth to tell me I should turn it back down without feeling it with their own hands can go gently caress themselves with a white-hot railroad spike, OR I’LL DO IT FOR THEM
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Apr 28, 2020 10:11
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It sounds like you're doing everything right, Gei. You're not working with good odds to begin with as newborn kittens do best with their Mom, but you're trying your earnest damndest to keep them alive and well. You just got hosed over by an idiot vet who gave you terrible advice, and it is very much not your fault. One of the hardest lessons to endure is learning it's possible to do everything right and still fail .
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Apr 28, 2020 10:42
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It may also help to look at it from the perspective of how many days you have extended their lives in a caring and loving enviroment. Presumably if you had not found them when you did, they would have had little to no chance of living another 24 hours. Every single day you buy them is a entire gift of life you and only you are responsible for them getting. You didn't loose a kitten, you gave that kitten another few days of living in the best care and loving enviroment it could have ever hoped for.
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Apr 28, 2020 12:17
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I don't think it's worth it to be angry at anyone, or yourself, here. I've never fostered cats myself, but from what I've seen, the unfortunate fact is that some kittens just won't make it regardless of the quality of care. Especially in isolated/inbred feral groups, a fair number of kittens will be born with invisible but serious birth defects that may be incompatible with life; it's very possible that there's just nothing you could have done. You gave that kitten as much time as you could, time filled with warmth and comfort, and that's something to be proud of.
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Apr 28, 2020 13:06
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:/ sorry to hear about that. A lot of times they dont make it, and just know you did everything you could. part of the perils of very young kittens is just the soul crush of losing one, and it can be very hard on people. you an only do your best and from what it sounded like you were doing pretty well. there is no magical perfect formula for making things go perfectly much like anything else, you prep, you plan and do your best and sometimes life is just like gently caress you. i know this is all newish for you so please dont internalize it as being your fault or that you failed in some way. you are doing good, sometime life just shits on your best intentions.
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Apr 28, 2020 13:08
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I. M. Gei posted:Vet called, kitten didn’t make it
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Apr 28, 2020 21:28
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It's called Fading Kitten Syndrome and basically it means sometimes they just don't make it. It wasn't your fault or the vet's fault, honestly when I first read she was slow to eat like the others I was worried because that's usually a sign that something is wrong internally. You fought for her as hard as you could and gave her the best life she could have had given her circumstances. She got to be warm and full and free of pain for her short time here. That's all a kitten can ask for. It's gonna hurt and you'll always wonder if there's something you could have done but you really did the right things and try not to beat yourself up about it. Kittens are always a coin toss, like Marchegiana said cats very often have underdeveloped kittens because their survival strategy is to have large litters where only a couple survive. Even professionals lose kittens, it's unfortunately just how cats work.
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Apr 28, 2020 22:42
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