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AlternateNu posted:Speaking of which, I finally found time to grind mine up to max. What's a good moveset for the three secret bosses? You can do one of two builds - either go all-in on boosting magic damage and stuff like Spell Master to dish out big Megidoloans (good against the easier of the two secret bosses and for a very short phase of the harder boss) or go all-in on a crit build with One-Shot Kill and maybe Sword Dance if you have room. You 1000% need a maxed-out stats Persona with a crit build for the new hardest fight in the game. The second new secret fight is so easy you could just beat it using whatever build
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May 1, 2020 03:20
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radlum posted:I kind of miss the creepy vibes from Persona 3; I want the next game to be closer to that than the lighter tone of P5. I disagree. Pop culture is already saturated with cynical grimdark poo poo and so to me stuff that isn't like that is a breath of fresh air. RazzleDazzleHour posted:The second new secret fight is so easy you could just beat it using whatever build Yeah I was expecting more from a character that could literally rewrite the public's cognition on a whim
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May 1, 2020 03:53
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Theres a lot more of a balance between grimdark poo poo and light peppy and colorful stuff at the moment than there used to be. I remember in 2008/9 when Persona 4 came out the fact that its art direction was "what if pop music was a video game?" felt absolutely mind-blowing coming out at a time when Zelda felt like it had to be dark and edgy with twilight princess and Sonic made loving Shadow the Hedgehog use guns. Even with it not being as revolutionary and different as it was with 4 I hope 6 keeps the current direction because having the art direction be bright and peppy while the subject involves dark poo poo like suicides and demons is way more interesting than DARKNESS RULES for 80 hours.
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May 1, 2020 04:08
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BIG FLUFFY DOG posted:Zelda felt like it had to be dark and edgy with twilight princess DMorbid fucked around with this message at 04:22 on May 1, 2020 |
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May 1, 2020 04:20
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TP wasn't even OoT levels of creepy, to say nothing of MM levels of creepy
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May 1, 2020 04:44
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Is Haru's S-Link any good? I never had time for it in the first game and I'm a bit ahead of schedule right now so I'll probably have time for her this go round. I'm blanking on who to date right now lol, Makoto felt like such a good canon choice but I've forbidden myself from doing it again.
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May 1, 2020 06:30
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Deified Data posted:Is Haru's S-Link any good? I never had time for it in the first game and I'm a bit ahead of schedule right now so I'll probably have time for her this go round. I'm blanking on who to date right now lol, Makoto felt like such a good canon choice but I've forbidden myself from doing it again. The new girl's the new "canon" choice if thats what you want. She gets pushed on you INCREDIBLY hard in the 3rd semester ig thats what you want. Hifumi also has Makoto's adorably dorky failure to understand her fellow kids thing going on.
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May 1, 2020 07:01
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Fojar38 posted:I disagree. Pop culture is already saturated with cynical grimdark poo poo and so to me stuff that isn't like that is a breath of fresh air. It also feels like if you want things dark, Shin Megami Tensei already fills that niche. What I'd like from a Persona 6 is a storyline that moves away from the plot beats of 4 and 5, which felt quite samey in some respects. That being said though, Royal really improves on the interactions between the team on the original, particularly through the activities like darts and billiards. I'm in September now, and I still feel that Ann gets a raw deal and pretty much fades into the background after summer.
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May 1, 2020 08:22
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I do hope Persona 6 is gonna be a bit more like 3, but not in the dark sense, but more just the general way characters in 3 are handled. I never really felt attached to the casts of 4 or 5 in comparison to 3, and I feel like that's just because 3's cast feels like it has so much more agency overall. It's all just little things like some of the party members being unavailable because they're going to watch a movie together, or everyone (bar like, ken and koromaru) having their storyline be in the main game rather than social links and actually be dealt with throughout the entire length of the game, even if some like fuuka's really fell flat. I also just think that tying the Second Awakenings of everyone's Personas feels so much better to just be tied to the plot, and I really do love how like, basically everyone in 3 has some kind of 1-on-1 with almost every other party member and that when they do appear in a group, they don't get forced to just be part of "the friend group". Like, P5 does it a lot where characters like Ryuji or Ann are fantastic on their own or when they're with 1 or 2 other people, but as part of the group as a whole they just really fall flat and feel like they're just reduced to the dumb one, or the ditzy one.  P3's dynamic where everyone only barely tolerates eachother definitely doesn't need to be replicated but I just kinda want more from everyone, and whenever the group appears together in P4 and 5 I just don't find them that enjoyable.
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May 1, 2020 08:49
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I still want Persona 2's story and characters with good game mechanics.
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May 1, 2020 08:52
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Pesmerga posted:It also feels like if you want things dark, Shin Megami Tensei already fills that niche. What I'd like from a Persona 6 is a storyline that moves away from the plot beats of 4 and 5, which felt quite samey in some respects. That being said though, Royal really improves on the interactions between the team on the original, particularly through the activities like darts and billiards. I'm in September now, and I still feel that Ann gets a raw deal and pretty much fades into the background after summer. Ann gets demoted pretty harshly after Makoto and Futaba join. She just doesn’t have much to contribute to the group’s plans at all after the first two dungeons. Even Yusuke and Haru have more to add to the increasingly heavy conversations than she does. To her credit, she doesn’t seem to have any vocal insecurity about her now lower position like Morgana or let fame get to her head like Ryuji, so that’s something over her fellow founding members. BIG FLUFFY DOG posted:Theres a lot more of a balance between grimdark poo poo and light peppy and colorful stuff at the moment than there used to be. I remember in 2008/9 when Persona 4 came out the fact that its art direction was "what if pop music was a video game?" felt absolutely mind-blowing coming out at a time when Zelda felt like it had to be dark and edgy with twilight princess and Sonic made loving Shadow the Hedgehog use guns. Agreed. P3 was so far up its own rear end trying to be depressing sometimes that you could see why humanity as a whole was giving up the will to live while P4 went too far into the happy fun times that you’d forget entirely about the serial killer you were hunting. The story and characters can be improved and I like to see the group gain more agency without the main character, but I like where we are now in tone. Also, yes, Royal really, really wants you to pick Yoshizawa despite her being a non-entity for almost the entire plot.
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May 1, 2020 12:33
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Remakes of late 90s games are suddenly in vogue. Give me a complete reimagining of Persona 2.
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May 1, 2020 18:28
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Geostomp posted:Also, yes, Royal really, really wants you to pick Yoshizawa despite her being a non-entity for almost the entire plot. She's also the only character who outright confesses to Joker with no prompting. Turning her down after her big life affirming speech sure is going to be a thing this playthrough. 
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May 1, 2020 18:43
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Sydin posted:She's also the only character who outright confesses to Joker with no prompting. Turning her down after her big life affirming speech sure is going to be a thing this playthrough. Is it ever explained why she gets so attached to Joker so quickly? I know her self-confidence is practically nonexistent, but she gets this weird obsession with the idea of being indebted to him long before he really does anything of note to help her. I mean, she follows him to thank him for trying to give her his seat on the train for God’s sake.
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May 1, 2020 18:57
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I don't think the game ever outright confirms it but my assumption is that Joker is the only one who treats her normally, since everybody else is either enamored or annoyed with her honor student star athlete status, or are aware of the incident with her sister and tread lightly around her. Also Joker is the only one who doesn't know she's really Sumire and just treats her as if she really is Kasumi - particularly after the school cleanup where he sees her school ID. But then who am I kidding, the real answer is because Joker is a male protagonist in a JRPG, and therefore every attractive female of note in the game must be drawn to him like a magnet.
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May 1, 2020 19:09
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Even though Yoshizawa is largely inconsequential to the plot for most of the game, I liked her interactions with Joker and felt like their relationship was built up well enough over time. I totally understand the feeling they're pushing her on you a bit too hard at times, but I liked her storyline overall and the romance scenes were pretty cute. Also, her rank 8 confidant scene is amazing and I still want that outfit as DLC. For every character.
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May 1, 2020 19:22
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I get it, but every other potential love interest only shows interest after he at least does something important for them before that point. Yoshizawa just seems to fall for him despite barely knowing him. It would probably be better if she had at least some interaction with more characters than him or Maruki. Morgana doesn’t count, since he only acts as Joker’s mouthpiece with her. Honestly, I think the main problem I have with her is that she has so little chance to speak to anyone other than Joker and she mostly just fawns over everything he does when they’re together. It’s just super nice or deeply depressed with little inbetween. I was hoping for some bonding about everyone rejecting them for rumors or being fellow transfers in a new area, but it felt like all of that was skipped in favor of her automatically loving him and Joker just kind of nodding along.
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May 1, 2020 19:24
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My main problem with Yoshizawa is that the trailers and marketing kinda lied about her role in the game. Like they built her up to be this almost antagonistic force who despised the Phantom Thieves, but no it turns out all of that dialogue is taken from one scene where she's at a cafe with Joker and Akechi and they're just idly discussing if they support the thieves or not, and Yoshizawa is all "eh not really but if you do then hey whatever floats your boat." Her refusal to join up after awakening her power also comes off less as she's vehemently against what they're doing, but rather that she's already got way too much poo poo going on in her life to pile more on top. She's fine as is I guess - I do think a lot of her interactions with Joker are sweet and her role in the final palace is compelling - but I thought she was going to be a lot more fascinating a character then she ultimately ended up being.
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May 1, 2020 19:28
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Pesmerga posted:I'm in September now, and I still feel that Ann gets a raw deal and pretty much fades into the background after summer. I don't think the game needed to be longer or anything, but I feel like Ann and Ryuji really compete for character space in a way that hurts both. They're distinct as characters, but since they both join at basically the same time, for basically the same reason, neither really gets a time to shine on their own. Ryuji is louder than Ann, so he feels more of a presence later, but it's mostly a negative one, where Ann can pretty easily fade into the background.
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May 1, 2020 19:31
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Geostomp posted:Is it ever explained why she gets so attached to Joker so quickly? I know her self-confidence is practically nonexistent, but she gets this weird obsession with the idea of being indebted to him long before he really does anything of note to help her. I mean, she follows him to thank him for trying to give her his seat on the train for God’s sake. Shes a teenage girl and Joker is quiet, tall, and hot.
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May 1, 2020 23:18
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Ultiville posted:I don't think the game needed to be longer or anything, but I feel like Ann and Ryuji really compete for character space in a way that hurts both. They're distinct as characters, but since they both join at basically the same time, for basically the same reason, neither really gets a time to shine on their own. Ryuji is louder than Ann, so he feels more of a presence later, but it's mostly a negative one, where Ann can pretty easily fade into the background. I was thinking "Well, maybe she's the Thieves' cheerleader" but that's kinda snaked by Ryuji, too. It's a shame they couldn't add in more places where the group needs to be good with people.
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May 1, 2020 23:35
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Dawgstar posted:I was thinking "Well, maybe she's the Thieves' cheerleader" but that's kinda snaked by Ryuji, too. It's a shame they couldn't add in more places where the group needs to be good with people. I could see Ann as the “heart” of the group to keep the others on the right track, but that doesn’t fit either. The group stays pretty upright morally outside of Mona and Ryuji’s little September issue, so that position isn’t necessary. Even if it was, she isn’t nearly assertive enough to override the others, even if she wanted to. I guess she’s the peacekeeper? She tends to pipe up when arguments happen? That’s all I’ve got for her. Sydin posted:My main problem with Yoshizawa is that the trailers and marketing kinda lied about her role in the game. Like they built her up to be this almost antagonistic force who despised the Phantom Thieves, but no it turns out all of that dialogue is taken from one scene where she's at a cafe with Joker and Akechi and they're just idly discussing if they support the thieves or not, and Yoshizawa is all "eh not really but if you do then hey whatever floats your boat." Her refusal to join up after awakening her power also comes off less as she's vehemently against what they're doing, but rather that she's already got way too much poo poo going on in her life to pile more on top. Yeah, I agree. I don’t dislike her, she’s fine enough, but I was expecting more than “cute, nice, and troubled” after all the fanfare. Even during the one Palace we get her in, Dark Akechi letting his nihilistic insanity flag fly steals the show from her. Geostomp fucked around with this message at 00:05 on May 2, 2020 |
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May 1, 2020 23:55
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BIG FLUFFY DOG posted:Shes a teenage girl and Joker is quiet, tall, and hot. And generally not an rear end in a top hat either - I think most of your responses to her range from "neutral" to "wanna bone" basically. Honestly the problem with the romances isn't that all these people might be attracted to Joker, it's that no one is allowed to be queer. It's understandable that most folks are pretty happy to be hit on by the good-looking, clever, mysterious dude who just solved their biggest life problem through being Super Extra in some imaginary world.
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May 2, 2020 00:16
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Most of the adults I know of would not seriously consider dating a teenager no matter how great he is. Especially if they're a teacher and the teenager is one of their students. ...At least I hope they wouldn't.
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May 2, 2020 00:17
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Sure, fair enough. I guess my feeling is just that in a game about rebellion I don't mind if that kind of forbidden romance is in there as an option I won't engage with, but it does serve to make the lack of queer options really glaring, since it prevents a "strong social stigma" argument.
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May 2, 2020 00:24
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Katsura Hashino is apparently the principle driving force of the weird homophobic undertones in SMT and Catherine and he's stated that after P5 he wants to move on to other projects so maybe Persona 6 will actually provide us with some LGBT romance options.
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May 2, 2020 00:33
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Hashino was supposed to be done with persona and working full time on project re fantasy after vanilla P5 came out, but then he was still the director on royal so I guess that arrangement didn't stick 
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May 2, 2020 01:06
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No Mods No Masters posted:Hashino was supposed to be done with persona and working full time on project re fantasy after vanilla P5 came out, but then he was still the director on royal so I guess that arrangement didn't stick He didn’t direct P5R though?
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May 2, 2020 01:12
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Oh you're right, I misread a rapid google search for persona royal director and went with it. Maybe he's making good on his threat, and we can look forward to an excruciating trans panic character awkwardly shoehorned into re fantasy when it comes out in 2027
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May 2, 2020 01:14
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Might also explain how they toned down the homophobia in Royal, though I wish they'd just managed to remove it entirely, sigh.
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May 2, 2020 01:38
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The last semester of Royal and everything to do with Maruki have so much more nuance than anything in the base game and it gives me hope that a potential P6 without Hashino in the director's chair could be even better.
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May 2, 2020 02:52
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When does Yoshizawa join the team? If at all?
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May 2, 2020 02:59
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Tabletops posted:When does Yoshizawa join the team? If at all? In January.
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May 2, 2020 03:01
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I know the localization of this game can be rough in spots, but it truly is a miracle that the support party member speaks Gamer and somehow isn't the most cringe-inducing thing. Granted, a lot of that is due to Erica Lindbeck's charm. We got lucky.
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May 2, 2020 03:11
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TheLoser posted:I know the localization of this game can be rough in spots, but it truly is a miracle that the support party member speaks Gamer and somehow isn't the most cringe-inducing thing. Beep-boop Also: I hungerrrrrr!
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May 2, 2020 03:25
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Sydin posted:The last semester of Royal and everything to do with Maruki have so much more nuance than anything in the base game and it gives me hope that a potential P6 without Hashino in the director's chair could be even better. When was the last time a JRPG or a video game had a villain whose motives were understandable enough that half the fanbase seems to think they were actually doing the right thing and argued passionately for it and the other half thought the opposite and argued passionately for that too?-
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May 2, 2020 03:55
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ChaosArgate posted:In January. So late... That makes me sad 
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May 2, 2020 04:05
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BIG FLUFFY DOG posted:When was the last time a JRPG or a video game had a villain whose motives were understandable enough that half the fanbase seems to think they were actually doing the right thing and argued passionately for it and the other half thought the opposite and argued passionately for that too?- Fire Emblem Three Houses was like, last June.  I’m sure there are more that came after but that’s the first one that came to mind.
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May 2, 2020 04:14
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Tabletops posted:So late... That makes me sad The advertising was pretty misleading about Yoshizawa’s impact on the story and character.
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May 2, 2020 04:43
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Party members competing for relevance is something I talked a lot about in the previous thread but basically, as the stakes continue to grow, the "smart" characters naturally have to sort of take over the discussions because it's through them that you formulate plans and stuff. P4 had the exact same problem, except Naoto didn't join you until like, October. But, that was mostly okay because the game's plot goes basically nowhere until then, so the team's general stupidity doesn't get in the way. The groups biggest discovery until Naoto's joining, the revelation that the killings and kidnappings aren't actually related to the Yamano case and are actually based on who appears on TV, is only found out because [KANJI FINDS A PIECE OF PAPER AFTER HE BULLIES SOME RANDOM KID THAT LISTS KIDNAPPING VICTIMS AND THEIR TV APPEARANCE DATE, THEY COULDN'T EVEN FIGURE THAT OUT THEMSELVES]. All their other predictions are basically outright wrong or just totally misguided. But, that's okay because the game isn't really about the killings anymore, it's more about the group dynamic. So, the team gets way more time to just be themselves so you don't miss them as much when they start to get less and less lines because Naoto has to take over the story. In P5 though, the stakes are constantly rising and the story needs the Naoto-equivalent, Makoto, to join late May/early June, which is like four months before you would normally meet Naoto. Not only that, immediately after she joins you get Futaba, who really fills the exact same role of knowing a ton of stuff and being able to do a ton for the explicit purposes of moving the story forward. So, you've spent significantly less time with the main cast before they're already being shoved to the side for more big-picture plot happenings because, just like in P4, the founding members aren't very good at participating in the more high-stakes plot discussions. Ann/Ryuji/Morgana getting the short end of the stick is the natural result of the story being such a bigger scope in terms of stakes and global importance. Then compare P5 with the polar opposite, P3, where there is almost no big-picture story and so the entire game is character work and so no character gets left behind in terms of development except for some weird reason Fuuka
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May 2, 2020 05:00
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