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Fray
Oct 22, 2010

Arrath posted:

Another Aurora question:

The mismatch between BFC ranges and e.g. Laser ranges annoy me. Currently I have a 15cm laser with 300k range and the best BFC I can make tops out at 256. The next tech level will pump that to 320k. Noting matches ever.

Is it better to have fire controls that out-range the weapon, so you can lock on and get that tracking time bonus vs missiles/be in range bands where the CTH isn't garbage, or to have weapons that outrange the fire control so you start firing at ranges where the damage hasn't dropped off to dismal numbers?

A longer range fire control is always better, even if the weapon can't reach that far, since accuracy degradation is based on the FC range.

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Arrath
Apr 14, 2011


Fray posted:

A longer range fire control is always better, even if the weapon can't reach that far, since accuracy degradation is based on the FC range.

Thought so, thanks.

Dimitris
Apr 11, 2017

by Fluffdaddy
Command LIVE: Aegean in Flames has been announced: https://www.matrixgames.com/game/command-live-aegean-in-flames

TheDeadlyShoe
Feb 14, 2014

pretense is my co-pilot

Arrath posted:

Another Aurora question:

The mismatch between BFC ranges and e.g. Laser ranges annoy me. Currently I have a 15cm laser with 300k range and the best BFC I can make tops out at 256. The next tech level will pump that to 320k. Noting matches ever.

Is it better to have fire controls that out-range the weapon, so you can lock on and get that tracking time bonus vs missiles/be in range bands where the CTH isn't garbage, or to have weapons that outrange the fire control so you start firing at ranges where the damage hasn't dropped off to dismal numbers?

You should pretty much always take the best possible BFC range _and_ the best possible laser range for the technology/mount your using, except for very short ranged weapons. Even if the lasers outrange the BFC (pretty common with Spinals), you are trying to keep as flat as possible damage gradient since lasers lose damage over range. The only time you might be better off dropping your weapon range to match your BFC is on weapons that don't scale with range: mesons, particle beams, and microwave beams.

Then there's plasma carronades which are only effective fired at 10,000 km anyway

Dimitris
Apr 11, 2017

by Fluffdaddy
Climbing ever higher: Command PE v1.15 released - https://www.warfaresims.com/?p=5076

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy
oh my lord Combat-Mission-style WEGO turns for CMANO multiplayer?! here's hoping that makes it into the consumer product eventually

mllaneza
Apr 28, 2007

Veteran, Bermuda Triangle Expeditionary Force, 1993-1952




gradenko_2000 posted:

oh my lord Combat-Mission-style WEGO turns for CMANO multiplayer?! here's hoping that makes it into the consumer product eventually

The new CLI mode is going to be super useful for geeks in uniform. I also note that LUA scripts can communicate with more kinds of things over tcp/ip sockets, so this update is analyst heaven.

Fray
Oct 22, 2010

Fray posted:

I'm really hoping we get a queue for ground unit training. Or just a way to define/construct a higher level template that includes the subordinate templates and the field positions. Right now it's pretty tedious to make a build task for every single battalion or whatever, then drag it into the OOB spot and set the field position. God help you if you've created a force structure that's delineated down to companies or platoons.

Looks like the first one is coming next patch, thank god. I'm thinking once I need a break from combat mission I might do an LP. Kinda want to steal the "Earth is gone and now everyone's trying to survive" thing from Children of a Dead Earth.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Fray posted:

Looks like the first one is coming next patch, thank god. I'm thinking once I need a break from combat mission I might do an LP. Kinda want to steal the "Earth is gone and now everyone's trying to survive" thing from Children of a Dead Earth.

There was an interest check for a succession game once most of the new bugs got squashed, which looks to be about the point we're at. The next version is shaping up to be a new feature patch, with things like the ground unit queue and from the looks of it the new "eye of terror" style invaders.

V for Vegas
Sep 1, 2004

THUNDERDOME LOSER
Shadow Empire out June 4.

Saros
Dec 29, 2009

Its almost like we're a Bureaucracy, in space!

I set sail for the Planet of Lab Requisitions!!

How topical, me and Grey are playing a PBEM.

Lotti Fuehrscheim
Jun 13, 2019

Saros posted:

How topical, me and Grey are playing a PBEM.

Oh, great.

I bought Advanced Tactics Gold yesterday, full price, just to know where Shadow Empires is coming from.

Inglonias
Mar 7, 2013

I WILL PUT THIS FLAG ON FREAKING EVERYTHING BECAUSE IT IS SYMBOLIC AS HELL SOMEHOW

Bremen posted:

There was an interest check for a succession game once most of the new bugs got squashed, which looks to be about the point we're at. The next version is shaping up to be a new feature patch, with things like the ground unit queue and from the looks of it the new "eye of terror" style invaders.

Confirmed features so far in the next update include the following:

  • Ground force construction can be queued
  • Extragalactic invaders are back and will function like 40K daemons, warp rifts included
  • Hotkeys for pretty much every button along the top of the tactical map

Inglonias fucked around with this message at 14:06 on May 8, 2020

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Inglonias posted:

Confirmed features so far in the next update include the following:

  • Ground force construction can be queued
  • Extragalactic invaders are back and will function like 40K daemons, warp rifts included
  • Hotkeys for pretty much every button along the top of the tactical map

My main point was that we seem to be at the end of the emergency bugfix patches and Steve is setting up for a more thorough features/ease of use patch, so it's probably time to decide if we want to run the succession game now or wait for the new version. Given he'll probably run a test campaign for the invaders and his work rate pretty much entirely depends on his personal enthusiasm since it's just a hobby, that could be anywhere from two week to six months.

Inglonias
Mar 7, 2013

I WILL PUT THIS FLAG ON FREAKING EVERYTHING BECAUSE IT IS SYMBOLIC AS HELL SOMEHOW

Bremen posted:

My main point was that we seem to be at the end of the emergency bugfix patches and Steve is setting up for a more thorough features/ease of use patch, so it's probably time to decide if we want to run the succession game now or wait for the new version. Given he'll probably run a test campaign for the invaders and his work rate pretty much entirely depends on his personal enthusiasm since it's just a hobby, that could be anywhere from two week to six months.

Not gonna lie, when I initially made my post, I had missed yours entirely, so I added the quote in later to pretend that I wasn't just repeating what you had said.

There, I've both made a fool of myself and admitted that I have done so.

Fray
Oct 22, 2010

Bremen posted:

My main point was that we seem to be at the end of the emergency bugfix patches and Steve is setting up for a more thorough features/ease of use patch, so it's probably time to decide if we want to run the succession game now or wait for the new version. Given he'll probably run a test campaign for the invaders and his work rate pretty much entirely depends on his personal enthusiasm since it's just a hobby, that could be anywhere from two week to six months.

I'll probably wait a while longer to do an LP, if I do one. Both to avoid colliding with Saros' and in the hope that ground combat gets some more work. The new system feels like the classic grog case of complexity over usability.

Bold Robot
Jan 6, 2009

Be brave.



Kind of a longshot but does anyone know if it is possible to play Aurora C# in Wine? I want to try it but would rather play it on my Mac laptop than my desktop PC. I've had success running other grog games in Wine, like WitP and RTW.

Saros
Dec 29, 2009

Its almost like we're a Bureaucracy, in space!

I set sail for the Planet of Lab Requisitions!!

I haven't even installed Aurora C yet and I'm kind of distracted by shadow empire so don't wait for me.

Arrath
Apr 14, 2011


Fray posted:

I'll probably wait a while longer to do an LP, if I do one. Both to avoid colliding with Saros' and in the hope that ground combat gets some more work. The new system feels like the classic grog case of complexity over usability.

Fun to watch guys on the Aurora forums build accurate TO&E for...well, god knows why.

Meanwhile my brain goes "Okay you have troop ships with 10,000 ton capacity, that'll be a 5k tank division and a 5k infantry division"

But also, 10k tons worth of spinal laser STO units for planetary defense cause my ships can carry it, why not?

Turns out that is rather pricey and takes like 4 years to train a single formation :v:

TheDeadlyShoe
Feb 14, 2014

pretense is my co-pilot

hot tip, never use higher armor for STO weapons, they straight up multiply the cost so a medium static is 2x the price of a light static

(arguably you should never use medium or heavy static i guess)

Arrath
Apr 14, 2011


Well thats good to know, thanks. Guess its time to redesign those units.

Honestly the biggest reason I miss PDC's is the ability to slap down arbitrarily huge sensors on any body i feel like with a freighter. I want a continuous ring of active sensors in the asteroid belt. tyvm.

ZombieLenin
Sep 6, 2009

"Democracy for the insignificant minority, democracy for the rich--that is the democracy of capitalist society." VI Lenin


[/quote]
Is a remake of Fighting Steel or GNBNA too much to ask from grog devs? I have fun with most modern naval warfare sims, but really? If we are being 100% honest that market is over saturated at the present moment.

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy
I played through the first scenario of Unity of Command 2 after picking it up on its V-E Day sale and goddamn what a good game. I actually felt like I had crisp and clear control of what I was doing rather than trying to work out a puzzle or throwing men at the wall and seeing what sticks.

Please please please make an East Front DLC.

BBJoey
Oct 31, 2012

they've mentioned they'd like to bring the more complex supply system to the eastern front and the latest patch included Operation Unthinkable complete with modelled T-34s and IL-2s, so I feel like it's only a matter of time

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy
Played through the second scenario and was ONE TURN SHORT of taking Bizerte on time. Game still owns.

One thing I did notice is that the game automatically detected graphical settings that pegged my RX 580 at 100% with everything turned up to maximum (16x anisotropic filtering, the works) and I noticed that my card was running at full clip and was hitting 80 C from the hot air drafting out of it. I turned down stuff to medium and turned off most effects and things were much cooler with barely a noticeable change in image quality. Just something to keep in mind.

To be fair, the game does look beautiful.

Cabbage Disrespect
Apr 24, 2009

ROBUST COMBAT
Leonard Riflepiss
Soiled Meat


Are all bridges survival-of-the-fittest in Graviteam or is this somehow my fault? These units were pretty bunched up and I admit to the cardinal sin of issuing a new order as they were about to cross the bridge. Even so, I wouldn't expect this particular batch of nazis to get their halftracks hung up on the railings, bulldozed into the river by the slightly less incompetent tracks behind 'em, and--if dismounted--avoid the bridge entirely, preferring to mill about its pylons in helmet-deep freezing water.

Fuligin
Oct 27, 2010

wait what the fuck??

to elaborate on what's already been posted, Unity of Command II got a huge update adding thirteen alt-history scenarios in new paths for the grand campaign, culminating in an absolutely wild Unthinkable against Uncle Joe. Also lots of small balance changes and tweaks to conferences, etc. Game continues to be fantastic, and i am indeed psyched for the ostfront DLC

ZombieLenin
Sep 6, 2009

"Democracy for the insignificant minority, democracy for the rich--that is the democracy of capitalist society." VI Lenin


[/quote]

Fuligin posted:

to elaborate on what's already been posted, Unity of Command II got a huge update adding thirteen alt-history scenarios in new paths for the grand campaign, culminating in an absolutely wild Unthinkable against Uncle Joe. Also lots of small balance changes and tweaks to conferences, etc. Game continues to be fantastic, and i am indeed psyched for the ostfront DLC

Meh. Not my cup of tea. I tried, I really did... until I realized it was a puzzle game with grognard/war gaming decorations.

Chuck_D
Aug 25, 2003

Mr. Showtime posted:



Are all bridges survival-of-the-fittest in Graviteam or is this somehow my fault? These units were pretty bunched up and I admit to the cardinal sin of issuing a new order as they were about to cross the bridge. Even so, I wouldn't expect this particular batch of nazis to get their halftracks hung up on the railings, bulldozed into the river by the slightly less incompetent tracks behind 'em, and--if dismounted--avoid the bridge entirely, preferring to mill about its pylons in helmet-deep freezing water.

Pretty much par for the course for GT. Issue your troops some swim trunks and go about your business.

HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?


ZombieLenin posted:

Meh. Not my cup of tea. I tried, I really did... until I realized it was a puzzle game with grognard/war gaming decorations.

UoC 1, sure. But 2 is just a good, well designed game with fantastic scenario design.

Fuligin
Oct 27, 2010

wait what the fuck??

ZombieLenin posted:

Meh. Not my cup of tea. I tried, I really did... until I realized it was a puzzle game with grognard/war gaming decorations.

i still have no idea what this means lol

SlyFrog
May 16, 2007

What? One name? Who are you, Seal?

Fuligin posted:

i still have no idea what this means lol

Probably that it's not really a wargame, as much as it is a mathematical puzzle where you find the right solution, and that tanks, infantry, etc. are basically just thin veneers to give you a reason to solve the puzzle.

Popete
Oct 6, 2009

This will make sure you don't suggest to the KDz
That he should grow greens instead of crushing on MCs

Grimey Drawer

SlyFrog posted:

Probably that it's not really a wargame, as much as it is a mathematical puzzle where you find the right solution, and that tanks, infantry, etc. are basically just thin veneers to give you a reason to solve the puzzle.

So it's a video game?

mllaneza
Apr 28, 2007

Veteran, Bermuda Triangle Expeditionary Force, 1993-1952




ZombieLenin posted:

Is a remake of Fighting Steel or GNBNA too much to ask from grog devs? I have fun with most modern naval warfare sims, but really? If we are being 100% honest that market is over saturated at the present moment.

Ultimate Admiral: Dreadnought is still in alpha and already fun.
Rule the Waves 2 makes you CNO, DNC, CiC, and Navy Minister for a great power in 1900.
Naval Battles Simulator is in a really rough Early Access phase, but it's WW2 at sea on a global scale.

Then there's that dead sexy WW2 USN carrier sim we've seen some videos on.

Fuligin
Oct 27, 2010

wait what the fuck??

SlyFrog posted:

Probably that it's not really a wargame, as much as it is a mathematical puzzle where you find the right solution, and that tanks, infantry, etc. are basically just thin veneers to give you a reason to solve the puzzle.

O well i guess that clears that up then

SlyFrog
May 16, 2007

What? One name? Who are you, Seal?

Popete posted:

So it's a video game?

Probably, yeah.

Fuligin posted:

O well i guess that clears that up then

Good, glad I could help.

Flannelette
Jan 17, 2010


Mr. Showtime posted:



Are all bridges survival-of-the-fittest in Graviteam or is this somehow my fault? These units were pretty bunched up and I admit to the cardinal sin of issuing a new order as they were about to cross the bridge. Even so, I wouldn't expect this particular batch of nazis to get their halftracks hung up on the railings, bulldozed into the river by the slightly less incompetent tracks behind 'em, and--if dismounted--avoid the bridge entirely, preferring to mill about its pylons in helmet-deep freezing water.

They are better than before they don't bunch up on them now and you need to move by road march order them over them but it's realistic that trying to drive armored vehicles over rural bridges is a disaster, why the proper bridges were so important. I asked the dev once about it and he just posted photos of halftracks and tanks tilted off the sides of bridges until I conceded. They shouldn't be able to swim in the ice water though.

Ceebees
Nov 2, 2011

I'm intentionally being as verbose as possible in negotiations for my own amusement.

SlyFrog posted:


Good, glad I could help.

In, say, ATG, the ai will get it's initial forces, decide how to deploy them, and then you have to make tactical and strategic decisions about how you're going to respond to that. The decision space in every turn is huge.

In UoC1, every level is arranged such that there's really only one plan that leads to you completing all the objectives in their time limits. You aren't making tactical decisions, you're trying to identify what the person who made the level wants you to do, and then how you're supposed to go about doing it.

That difference between identifying then exploiting the weak points of an emergent system versus finding the intended authored solution that's built in to the scenario is why people call UoC1 a war themed puzzle game.

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy
insofar as I agree that UOC 1 is a "puzzle-themed wargame" (and that UOC 2 is far less of one), I do think that the difference mostly boils down to:

* how far one can diverge from the "ideal solution"
* whether the "ideal solution" can be gleaned from organic gameplay (as opposed to repeated plays)

because if you're playing, say, a Market-Garden scenario, then you're already committed to dealing with the paradrops as they happened, and the terrain involved, which necessarily is going to push you down a certain approach

or like, if you're assaulting Tunis, then the Germans are necessarily going to form some kind of defensive line at Mareth, and the British are necessarily going to try and find a way around that, because that's just how the map looks, and trying to diverge from that would require expanding the scope of the game to a strategic level, or creating alternate-deployment scenarios

I suppose a good counter-example of this is Decisive Campaigns offering "free setup" as an option where entire corps and armies can be shifted from their historical dispositions

or maybe the John Tiller games that offer two to three different takes on the same scenario with a different force deployment here or there, or simply captures such a large geographic and temporal space that you can control which approaches to Moscow will be taken with which units

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Cabbage Disrespect
Apr 24, 2009

ROBUST COMBAT
Leonard Riflepiss
Soiled Meat

Gewehr 43 posted:

Pretty much par for the course for GT. Issue your troops some swim trunks and go about your business.


Flannelette posted:

They are better than before they don't bunch up on them now and you need to move by road march order them over them but it's realistic that trying to drive armored vehicles over rural bridges is a disaster, why the proper bridges were so important. I asked the dev once about it and he just posted photos of halftracks and tanks tilted off the sides of bridges until I conceded. They shouldn't be able to swim in the ice water though.

Got it, thanks! I had some vague knowledge that armored vehicles + narrow crossings over water = bad times and, I suppose, am willing to accept that Water Nazis are grog jank that will never be fixed since it accidentally models actual operational concerns a concrete representation of this abstract principle. I'll try telling 'em to road march over.

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