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Cythereal posted:And Bella seems to have no interests or hobbies outside of getting married and being a good Mormon housewife. She doesn't seem to read, travel, play video games, write, play sports, or do anything that doesn't revolve around supporting her family. She does read, but she's only mentioned as being interested in a very small number of books. She's read Wuthering Heights so much that her copy is falling apart but doesn't seem to have learned anything from it. The closest she comes to another "hobby" is her motorcycle, which she dutifully admits to being part of her dangerous flirtation with a hot-blooded Native and willingly surrenders for her love.
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May 14, 2020 21:42
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The Quileute have a fundraising campaign to move their school to higher ground to protect against storm flooding if anyone can donate!
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May 14, 2020 22:09
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There's also the fact that immortal toddlers were very hard to destroy or contain because the maternal and paternal instincts they awoke in vampires were strong enough to go past reason. As such, it's valid to consider if an immortal, unaging vampire newborn, relatively helpless and instinct driven as it is, could have a stronger supernatural pull, and if this could be clouding Bella's mind. The fact that none of that ends up being the case is irrelevant to the moral quandary beforehand, since the accelerated pregnancy leaves very little time for research into what might result. The idea of forcing someone into an abortion is horrific, but so are the alternatives here, and it's crazy that the only rebuttal presented is 'shhh, it'll be fine'. That's not an actual discussion.
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May 14, 2020 23:54
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PetraCore posted:There's also the fact that immortal toddlers were very hard to destroy or contain because the maternal and paternal instincts they awoke in vampires were strong enough to go past reason. As such, it's valid to consider if an immortal, unaging vampire newborn, relatively helpless and instinct driven as it is, could have a stronger supernatural pull, and if this could be clouding Bella's mind. It definitely feels like Meyer was so intensely interested in making this a debate on abortion and pro-choice views that she completely forgot that she was writing supernatural fiction. The only people who are seen as having legitimate concerns about this (as we'll see in the second half of the chapter, especially) are portrayed as the bad guys here.
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May 15, 2020 00:38
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chitoryu12 posted:It definitely feels like Meyer was so intensely interested in making this a debate on abortion and pro-choice views that she completely forgot that she was writing supernatural fiction. The only people who are seen as having legitimate concerns about this (as we'll see in the second half of the chapter, especially) are portrayed as the bad guys here. I heavily suspect Meyer just doesn't find pregnancy or small children very interesting or appealing, so because Twilight is her fantasy the necessary pregnancy descriptions go full horror and everything is on fast forward to get it over with. Notice how quickly Reneesme can express her thoughts and desires!
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May 15, 2020 06:16
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quote:I didn’t see any of the vampires. I ignored my bike, standing all alone in the middle of the meadow. It wasn’t fast enough for me now. My dad would be freaked out—Sam, too. What would the pack make of the fact that they hadn’t heard me phase? Would they think the Cullens got me before I’d had the chance? I stripped down, not caring who might be watching, and started running. I blurred into wolf mid-stride. Just goes buck naked right in front of the entire Cullen family. quote:They were waiting. Of course they were. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2P5qbcRAXVk quote:I was halfway home before anyone recovered. Then they all started running to meet me. Those darn animalistic natives! quote:At first their anger was undefined, and I thought I was in for it. I was too messed up to care about that. They could do whatever they wanted to me for circumventing orders. Remember that we're supposed to not be on their side here. quote:They fear it, too. From Meyer's perspective, this is bad. We're supposed to not be on their side. We're supposed to accept Bella's faith that nothing bad will happen and this pregnancy is a good thing that must be saved. From the actual in-universe perspective, the Cullens are the most dangerous beings in the Pacific Northwest right now. The risk of an immortal child is so extreme that it would be morally correct to abort it. These things wipe out villages. If the Cullens let it loose, the entirety of Forks and La Push could be in danger. quote:I shook my head, rising slowly to my feet. I felt unsteady there—like the circling wolves were making me dizzy. The wolf beside me got up, too. His shoulder pushed against mine, propping me up. Sam is the true hero of this piece. quote:They don’t like it any more than we do. Also borne out by the evidence! Bella has been pregnant for 7 days and is already basically at the 8 month mark, with the fetus growing so fast and strong that it's injuring her with its kicks. This is such an unexpected variable that the wolves are being very prudent and practical. quote:Jake, buddy, this is a big problem, Quil said. We can’t just ignore it. Make Sam the protagonist instead. quote:This is crazy, I said. This afternoon you were afraid to put the pack in danger. Note how Jacob has no real concern for the implications of an immortal child and what it could do to their home. He's only against Sam and the rest of the pack because he wants to find a way to let Bella live in spite of the Cullens' dogged refusal to acknowledge that the risk is great enough to overrule Rosalie and Bella. Rosalie herself is obviously only so protective because of her own desire to have a child, left behind and amplified from the circumstances of her murder. It would be very easy for another writer to turn this on its head and make Jacob the wrong one here. Effortless, in fact. quote:That did it. I leaped away from Seth, toward his sister, with my teeth bared. I was about to catch her left hind leg when I felt Sam’s teeth cut into my flank, dragging me back. Meyer is trying really hard to make Sam seem like the bad guy here and it's just not working. If anything, the Cullens could be considered the villains now for their utter refusal to face the evidence in front of them. quote:Sam paced in a tight circle around the two of us. In case this seems extreme, remember that they've had access to all of Jacob's memories of what just occurred. They've seen how Rosalie is murderously protective of Bella and her impending demon child, and how the rest of the family (Emmett, especially) will fight to the death for her if she enters a battle. Especially with how crazy tense she is right now, even approaching to negotiate would be difficult. quote:The pack rumbled in nervous agreement. The tension had everyone’s fur standing on end. The pacing was quicker, and the sound of the paws against the brackish floor was sharper, toenails tearing into the soil. Sam is, in fact, a selfless hero working for no purpose other than to save Forks and La Push. quote:I saw that he would face Edward himself; Edward’s ability to read our thoughts made him the greatest threat in Sam’s mind. Sam would not let someone else take on that danger. Then Carlisle needs to overrule Bella and Rosalie to stop a murderous vampire baby from destroying Forks! quote:This was wrong. chitoryu12 fucked around with this message at 06:50 on May 15, 2020 |
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May 15, 2020 06:47
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chitoryu12 posted:Also borne out by the evidence! Bella has been pregnant for 7 days and is already basically at the 8 month mark, with the fetus growing so fast and strong that it's injuring her with its kicks. This is such an unexpected variable that the wolves are being very prudent and practical. I can't help but wonder if this is wish fulfillment on Meyers' part, skipping how long pregnancy is and all the ugly, uncomfortable, boring parts.
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May 15, 2020 12:28
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I do kinda like the idea that a bunch of werewolf kids are routinely on the agenda of the reservation's elder meetings. Review of minutes from last month, ongoing concerns about a dilapidated property, grant application to overhaul water system, werewolf update and consideration of claims.
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May 15, 2020 15:21
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Cythereal posted:I can't help but wonder if this is wish fulfillment on Meyers' part, skipping how long pregnancy is and all the ugly, uncomfortable, boring parts. Not to mention all the uncomfortable, frustrating, inconvenient parts of infancy. Its very much a wish-fulfillment book for moms. Your intuition is always right (and even more accurate than the knowledge of doctors), everyone on the family dotes on you to the point of cheerfully giving you houses, cars, childcare, etc.
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May 15, 2020 15:59
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I'm still cross that she's acting like Alpha wolves are a real thing when that's been essentially disproven. Wolf packs are just familes. Ugh.
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May 15, 2020 16:03
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Is there anyone in this thread who read this as teens, or have family or friends who did? I’ve read overall descriptions on how some fans reacted to this book, and the pregnancy specifically, but never individuals describing how they took seeing characters they cared about handled this way.
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May 15, 2020 17:37
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May 15, 2020 20:29
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SUPERMAN'S GAL PAL posted:Is there anyone in this thread who read this as teens, or have family or friends who did? I’ve read overall descriptions on how some fans reacted to this book, and the pregnancy specifically, but never individuals describing how they took seeing characters they cared about handled this way. I read them as a middle schooler/high schooler and liked them well enough for a while. But I don't remember what I actually thought about Breaking Dawn besides it being dumb enough i started seeking out anti-twilight stuff.
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May 15, 2020 23:04
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Chapter 11: Two Things at the Very Top of my Things-I-Never-Want-To-Do List Kill me. quote:Sam started moving the others into formation while I was still on the ground. Embry and Quil were at my sides, waiting for me to recover and take the point. You weren't super concerned about that when you first roared up to the Cullen mansion to kill as many of them as possible! quote:My mind began to work with theirs, to think in unison, as we dealt with these fears. Automatically, I pushed up from the ground and shook out my coat. Actually Jasper only spent like 70 years fighting. quote:I’ll take point, if you want flank, Quil offered. There was more excitement in his mind than most of the others. When Quil had watched Jasper’s instruction those nights, he’d been dying to test his skill against the vampire’s. For him, this would be a contest. Even knowing it was his life on the line, he saw it that way. Paul was like that, too, and the kids who had never been in battle, Collin and Brady. Seth probably would’ve been the same—if the opponents were not his friends. "18 and up." quote:I just shook my head. I couldn’t concentrate—the compulsion to follow orders felt like puppet strings hooked into all of my muscles. One foot forward, now another. All phrases I'm sure Quil will be using with Claire. quote:I could see how easy it would be—to think about nothing more than my part. It wasn’t hard to imagine attacking Jasper and Emmett. We’d been close to that before. I’d thought of them as enemies for a very long time. I could do that now again. Though again, nothing seems to really stop that body from being forcibly directed in a highly destructive manner since there's no real morality-based selection process for the Alpha. quote:So what if Sam was wrong now? There was nothing anyone could do. No one could dispute his decision. As Jacob says, he hasn't earned anything. He gets leadership by birthright as soon as he wants it. quote:I’d never wanted to lead the pack. I didn’t want to do it now. I didn’t want the responsibility for all our fates resting on my shoulders. Sam was better at that than I would ever be. So Sam has a full hive mind but doesn't even notice when a member of his pack suddenly turns Alpha and breaks free of his control? quote:No, I told him again. And 100% of him "thinking it through" was him just realizing that he's too horny for Bella, overriding any serious real concerns about her monster baby. quote:This isn’t about them, he snarled at me. This is about Bella. She has never been the one for you, she has never chosen you, but you continue to destroy your life for her! I see now that the circumstances of one's birth are the only thing that's relevant. quote:Is this it, then, Jacob Black? His hackles rose and his muzzle pulled back from his teeth. Paul and Jared snarled and bristled at his sides. Even if you can defeat me, the pack will never follow you! "Or her" I always have to add as an afterthought because gently caress Leah. quote:His tail whipped back and forth as he recoiled from the judgment in my words. Then he took a step forward so that we were toe to toe, his exposed teeth inches from mine. I hadn’t noticed till this moment that I’d grown taller than him. I should point out that at no point do the vampires ever have their impulses to feed derided as "primitive" despite being equally or more irresistible. quote:I focused all my energy to control that reaction. I would not fall into a pointless, destructive fight with Sam. He was my brother still, even though I was rejecting him. Oh yeah, this is the start of the long colonialism metaphor! quote:I flinched. Yes, the formatting for werewolf telepathy chapters is as aggravating as it seems to get correct. quote:I turned my back on him, and a chorus of howls tore into the air around me. First: the native turns his back on his dilapidated home and outdated traditions in favor of the white man's large mansion and wealth. quote:Today had begun like any other day. Made it home from patrol with the rainy sunrise, breakfast with Billy and Rachel, bad TV, bickering with Paul… How did it change so completely, turn all surreal? How did everything get messed up and twisted so that I was here now, all alone, an unwilling Alpha, cut off from my brothers, choosing vampires over them? You may be shocked, but this plot tends to fling itself wildly in all directions! quote:The sound I’d been fearing interrupted my dazed thoughts—it was the soft impact of big paws against the ground, chasing after me. I threw myself forward, rocketing through the black forest. I just had to get close enough so that Edward could hear the warning in my head. Leah wouldn’t be able to stop me alone. Jacob just instantly violates his principles as soon as he gets a chance. quote:I’m not ordering anyone to do anything. I’m just telling you what you already know. In other words, Meyer is making this up as she goes and the rules don't matter.
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May 18, 2020 15:39
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I kinda like the idea of the Alpha writing a letter of condolence to the loved ones of a KIA werewolf, narrated in the style of Ken Burns' Civil War. Of course that would mean there's the possibility of a toddler getting a letter stating that her fiance fell in battle against a demon fetus, which would probably be weird as hell to find in a scrapbook while packing for college.
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May 18, 2020 17:44
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For all you Old World of Darkness fans, you don’t how how badly I wanted to make a whole splatbook where the Prince of Seattle calls on anyone possible, potentially even supernatural beings that are normally enemies, because an upstart would-be new Clan of Kiasyd offshoots is about to allow a massive abomination be released upon the world and it’s going to take all the bullshit superpowers possible to stop them and the fake Garou protecting them.
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May 18, 2020 18:29
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Grammarchist posted:I kinda like the idea of the Alpha writing a letter of condolence to the loved ones of a KIA werewolf, narrated in the style of Ken Burns' Civil War. Of course that would mean there's the possibility of a toddler getting a letter stating that her fiance fell in battle against a demon fetus, which would probably be weird as hell to find in a scrapbook while packing for college. Kindest thoughts young Claire, I hope this letter finds you in good temper and clean diapers. I write with grave news, quill has fallen, and he will not return. He has ventured to the rainbow bridge, to await your coming. I can only pray you live a long life, well. He died young, for our kind, but his love of watching you on the beach was already nearly creepy enough for a restraining order. In mournful sympathy and utter relief, Sam
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May 18, 2020 19:04
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Honestly loving losing it over here at the mention of the rainbow bridge.
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May 18, 2020 20:32
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"Many times throughout this accursed conflict has Quil expressed to me his heartfelt desire to purchase a farm upstate, where he might run and play with the frivolity of a youth long since past. It is with deepest regrets that I write to inform you..."
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May 18, 2020 21:18
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quote:He got up and started trotting toward the east. No time to argue about it now. We should be moving right along before Sam… That's totally why you followed him. quote:Run wherever you want. Makes no difference to me. Meyer is trying to frame Seth as the precocious annoying younger brother character, but none of his behavior has come off as nearly annoying enough to deserve everyone telling him to gently caress off. Least of all when compared to Quil being an overt pedophile and Paul alternating between "douchebag bully" and "uncontrollable rage monster." quote:And then we were across the road and moving through the forest that ringed the Cullens’ house. Could Edward hear us yet? I wonder if the vampires use their vampire senses to just walk around their house and do all their work with the lights off. quote:“Jacob? Seth? What’s going on?” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vkDhtK0S894 This is pretty much exactly what Jacob and Seth gave Edward, complete with dramatic camera angles. quote:“They want to kill Bella?” he snarled flatly. Emmett and Jasper falling prey to their primitive impul-- Oh wait, what's that? I'm sorry, I just got a report from my earpiece. Because they are white, they are not displaying primitive impulses of violence and are actually completely reasonable. quote:Emmett and Jasper rocked back on their heels; Emmett turned to Edward while Jasper kept his eyes locked on us. At their speed, they'll be back within seconds with one phone call. quote:I’m going to go take a look, Seth said. Run the western perimeter. And immediately crashed into a tree and off a cliff. quote:Edward and I stood facing each other in the dark meadow. I could hear Emmett muttering into his phone. Jasper was watching the place where Seth had vanished into the woods. Alice appeared on the porch and then, after staring at me with anxious eyes for a long moment, she flitted to Jasper’s side. I guessed that Rosalie was inside with Bella. Still guarding her—from the wrong dangers. "The last time is when you graciously offered to raw my wife." quote:I thought of what he’d asked me for earlier today. When it came to Bella, there were no lines he wouldn’t cross. Yeah, you would. Stop making my jokes canon quote:He thought about it and then nodded. “I suppose you’re right about that.” Why are we having this conversation now quote:Sorry I didn’t do any good today. Told you she wouldn’t listen to me. I'm calling my mom to come pick me up. quote:You had to try. I get it. She any better?  quote:They may go around. Did they go to Oregon? quote:“We should take up a defensive position,” Jasper said. This might be the shortest Dead Herring in the books, because a few lines later... quote:Anxiously, I raced along the western border. Wouldn’t it be just peachy if I couldn’t take care of Seth for one freaking night? What if something happened to him on my watch? Leah would shred me into kibble. So either: A) Meyer actually tried to fake out the audience with a vampire ambush but couldn't hold it together for even a paragraph. B) Jacob thought that Carlisle and Esme would kill Seth for no reason. quote:Why’re you so down, Jake? I’ll bet Sam won’t bring the pack tonight. He’s not going to launch a suicide mission. "He's basically the worst." quote:Edward’s name brought other memories boiling to the surface. Seth read them in astonishment. He's freaking out about Jacob saying he'd kill Edward, but not Jacob agreeing to violently bone his wife to get her to agree to an abortion? quote:Shut up, shut up, you idiot! They’re going to think the pack is coming! Midnight Sun is a pretty horrifying place! quote:He looked over his shoulder, back into the house, and I saw a shudder run through his whole frame. He waved me away without looking in my direction again and then moved out of my view. "Not as great as Jacob sacrificing his entire dignity tonight, though." quote:“Yeah, I know. I’m just jealous. Wish I was out there.” It puts into perspective why Robert Pattinson did all of his acting the way he did if he read all the books. Breaking Dawn released at the beginning of August 2008, only 3 months after filming wrapped on the first Twilight film, so the actors had almost all of the story already available to them during film and Pattinson was personally given the publicly available draft of Midnight Sun before its leak. He had a very detailed look at how terrible it all was to drive his performance. quote:“What does Jacob think?” Carlisle asked. A charitable interpretation is that Rosalie is so violently protective of a possible non-murderous baby that the rest of the family is unwilling to risk an abortion because they'd likely have to kill her and Emmett. This, in turn, makes Rosalie the true bad guy in this story. quote:I paced quietly in front of the house. Each pass brought me a little closer. The dark windows were like a TV set running in some dull waiting room—it was impossible to keep my eyes off them for long. Did they super speed a hospital room? quote:She choked a little in her uneasy sleep, and both Edward and Rosalie moved in to hover over her. Her body jerked, and she whimpered. Rosalie smoothed her hand across Bella’s forehead. Edward’s body stiffened—his back was to me, but his expression must have been something to see, because Emmett wrenched himself between them before there was time to blink. He held his hands up to Edward.
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May 19, 2020 13:51
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I'm still catching up, but I just wanted to thank you for suffering through this for us, chitoryu. Just some thoughts so far: - I still feel really sorry for Charlie, even through his bout of out-of-characterness when he laughed off Jacob assaulting Bella. He had so much bad poo poo happen in his life. Renee was lovely to him and turned Bella against him. Bella was already terribly selfish from a young age, and only got worse. Bella constantly mocked Charlie's attempts at being a good parent by always thinking the worse of him, and breaking all the reasonable rules he's set. Bella has so little regard for him that she doesn't think how her becoming a vampire would hurt him. - Everything about Leah is so much better than Bella. She's got an actual love triangle with a tragic bent where she's the one who didn't get together with the guy she loved. She can transform into a wolf and fight alongside others. She doesn't take poo poo from anyone but she never comes across as a terrible person for it, just really angry at how the world shits on her. In the hands of a competent writer, she'd be the protagonist of her own book. - Something I noticed is that Bella constantly looks down on the wolves while raising the vampires on a pedestal. While Meyer tries to make it sound as if Bella is worried over the two groups, she always writes how the vampires are all agile and strong and brutal. By contrast, Bella often thinks the wolves would get themselves killed if they stood up to vampires. There was also that time where Bella wondered if Leah thought Sam injuring Emily's face was poetic justice. I dunno, it just comes across as rather racist, especially with how Meyer mishandled the Quielutes. - I got to the part where Bella finally realizes that becoming a vampire means she'd end up being a bloodthirsty monster who would kill people just to sate her thirst... And it's a footnote on her attempt to manipulate Edward into having sex while she's still a human. 
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May 19, 2020 14:12
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Robert Pattinson said that he views the series as Stephenie Meyer writing out her own weird sexual fantasies, which seriously creeped him out with the attention she gave him. It really does feel like her drive to put all of her own personal poo poo on the page has completely crippled any attempt she could make at writing decent urban fantasy. Even the characters constantly make bizarre decisions or go insane because it's the only way to push the book in the direction of either her fantasy or her Mormon morality against any logical progression. And if you think the book is racist now, hoo boy it keeps going.
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May 19, 2020 14:20
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chitoryu12 posted:Robert Pattinson said that he views the series as Stephenie Meyer writing out her own weird sexual fantasies, which seriously creeped him out with the attention she gave him. It really does feel like her drive to put all of her own personal poo poo on the page has completely crippled any attempt she could make at writing decent urban fantasy. Even the characters constantly make bizarre decisions or go insane because it's the only way to push the book in the direction of either her fantasy or her Mormon morality against any logical progression. He's loving savage and pulls zero punches on how much he hates the Twilight series. https://www.standard.co.uk/insider/...d-a4432611.html quote:Pattinson was asked by WOIO if he had taken any mementos from the set of Breaking Dawn - Part 2, the final film in the Twilight series, to remember the series by.
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May 19, 2020 14:27
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https://www.cinemablend.com/news/2496478/twilights-gregory-tyree-boyce-is-dead-at-30 RIP guy who almost smushed Bella and then disappeared right after that.
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May 19, 2020 15:53
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I bet there's some Bigfoot enthusiast with trail cams capturing blurry, out-of-focus photos of all these shenanigans. Giant wolves running around, a white couple pushing an ICU bed through the forest at 60 miles per hour, etc.
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May 19, 2020 16:07
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MorgaineDax posted:https://www.cinemablend.com/news/2496478/twilights-gregory-tyree-boyce-is-dead-at-30 Goddamn, I've had so many actors die during my threads.
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May 19, 2020 16:21
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Proteus Jones posted:He's loving savage and pulls zero punches on how much he hates the Twilight series. I used to think it was kind of crappy of him to poo poo all over the movies that launched his multi-million dollar career. Then I read that recent GQ story and realized that becoming a megastar at 20 basically ruined his life. It stopped him from having the career that he wanted, and turned him into a hermit. e: if anyone hasn't read it or seen it on twitter, absolutely read that article, especially the bit about Piccolini Cuscino. hyperhazard fucked around with this message at 17:37 on May 19, 2020 |
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May 19, 2020 17:32
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hyperhazard posted:I used to think it was kind of crappy of him to poo poo all over the movies that launched his multi-million dollar career. Then I read that recent GQ story and realized that becoming a megastar at 20 basically ruined his life. It stopped him from having the career that he wanted, and turned him into a hermit. God what a loving tool that manchild is. I also lol at GQ putting the designer and cost of the clothing in all the photos but not telling you what the item is called beyond “pants” or ”blazer” with the “price available upon request” being the cherry on top.
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May 19, 2020 18:19
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MorgaineDax posted:https://www.cinemablend.com/news/2496478/twilights-gregory-tyree-boyce-is-dead-at-30 I was Team Tyler’s Van back then and I’m Team Tyler’s Van today. Poor guy.
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May 19, 2020 18:48
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Chapter 12: Some People Just Don't Grasp the Concept of "Unwelcome"quote:I was right on the edge of sleep. At least we finally have a POV character who isn't having weirdly prescient dreams for no reason every night. quote:And then Seth’s piercing howl broke the early morning quiet. Our true hero arrives. quote:Stop whining, Seth. You’re such a baby. Can Jake just gently caress off forever? quote:I took a deep breath, filling my lungs until my sides bulged. Then, when I was sure I wasn’t going to scream, I exhaled in a gust. I have a sinking feeling this chapter is going to be really aggravating to read. quote:Shut up, Jacob. Oops, I’m sorry—I meant, shut up, most high Alpha. In case you forgot, Leah was Sam's beloved girlfriend until he imprinted on Emily, who he nearly killed when she tried to reject the imprinting, and got forced into his pack by random chance of birth. It shouldn't be the least bit surprising that she's taking the first opportunity to abandon him. quote:I gritted my teeth and tried to get my head straight. "You're honestly worse than Sam in some ways." quote:That wasn’t true. There was an edgy kind of excitement in her mind. She was unhappy about this, but she was also riding some weird high. I searched her mind, trying to understand. You don't loving say, Black quote:We were interrupted by Seth, thinking his explanation at Edward. Leah whined anxiously. Edward’s face, framed in the same window as last night, showed no reaction to the news. It was a blank face, dead. Not to divert from my defense of Leah here, but she literally just did. The entire reason she's here is that she betrayed her pack. quote:I wanted to throw my head back and howl, like Seth had before. This isn’t your pack! This isn’t even a pack. This is just me, going off on my own! What is it with you Clearwaters? Why can’t you leave me alone? This book is so loving mean-spirited. It's miserable and cruel to the one person who's interestingly tragic enough to be a compelling protagonist. quote:I felt the pain in the three little words, and it was more than I would’ve guessed. I didn’t want to feel that. I didn’t want to feel bad for her. Sure, the pack was rough on her, but she brought it all on herself with the bitterness that tainted her every thought and made being in her head a nightmare. Ah yes, a great excuse! "She has a ton of trauma, but she brings it all on herself by not just turning off her emotions!" quote:Seth was feeling guilty, too. Jake… You’re not really gonna send me away, are you? Leah’s not so bad. Really. I mean, with her here, we can push the perimeter out farther. And this puts Sam down to seven. There’s no way he’s going to mount an attack that outnumbered. It’s probably a good thing.… You were just telling her she ruins everything half a second before. quote:You know I don’t want to lead a pack, Seth. The only place this poor girl needs to go is out of this story and save herself. quote:Thought this was about Seth, I thought sourly. And you're just so put-upon by having to not be a dick to her for no reason, right? quote:Leah didn’t like me, so it wasn’t such a chore having me wish she would disappear. Uhhh let's tone down on that language here. This book has enough racist implications already. quote:I don’t know if I’d go that far, she thought. She tried to make the words tough, aggressive, but there were big cracks in her show. I’m sure I’d give killing myself a few good tries first. I just feel so uncomfortable reading all of this. Meyer's given us the most tragic, believable, sympathetic character for no reason other than to tell us that she's actually bad and have everyone abuse her for having feelings. quote:I sighed. It's really telling that all of the people who are defending Bella and her demon spawn to the death have no real logical or moral ground for doing so. All of the Cullens who would ordinarily be on the side of an abortion are blocked by Rosalie suddenly becoming murderously insane (or Meyer just saying they don't support an abortion for no reason except to provide some balance to the sides), Jacob is still in love with her, Seth is too fond of the Cullens to stop their reckless actions, and Leah is just trying to get away from Sam and saw an opening to run away. quote:Leah cocked an ear to the west.
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May 20, 2020 15:56
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The Leah conversation reads a lot to me like an attempt at friendly banter but Meyer really undercuts it with references to some really genuine trauma. It also doesn't help that she doesn't seem to be consistent with formatting or expressing the dialogue for the wolves. Sometimes the PoV character seems to have some private thoughts and sometimes the others pick up on it. It would work well for having intentional and unintentional thoughts but some of the stuff that's fine for banter seem to be intended as private where it comes across as mean and genuine dislike. Has Meyer confirmed no one likes Leah and is just horrible to her because she's unhappy and they're all stuck in her head? Or did she just handle the dialogue really badly? Also yeah, there is 0 reason to support Bella's decision here and pretty much the only decision she's made that really drives the plot is only possible as a choice because Rosalie is equally insane. I'd actually be interested to read an alternate ending where the main characters survive the demon child: Jacob has to come to terms with being imprinted on a murderous creature with 0 ability to develop beyond infancy, Edward sees his one love gone and the Volturi called down and Carlisle has to kill half his own coven to stop the creature from wiping out Forks. Bella gets turned into a vampire by Edward and her child kills Charlie, wipes out half the pack and Jacob does trying to protect it. Basically everything I can imagine with how this could go is really loving bad.
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May 20, 2020 17:06
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MrNemo posted:The Leah conversation reads a lot to me like an attempt at friendly banter but Meyer really undercuts it with references to some really genuine trauma. It also doesn't help that she doesn't seem to be consistent with formatting or expressing the dialogue for the wolves. Sometimes the PoV character seems to have some private thoughts and sometimes the others pick up on it. It would work well for having intentional and unintentional thoughts but some of the stuff that's fine for banter seem to be intended as private where it comes across as mean and genuine dislike. When Sam imprinted on Emily, the reason she rejected him was because of Leah, to the point that she would tell him to go back to Leah. When he turned into a wolf and mauls her for the suggestion, she later tells him it wasn't his fault - the implication being it is her and Leah's fault to making him upset. Emily only starts going out with Sam because he threatened to kill himself if he's asked to go back to Leah again. So on top of everything else, Leah has Emily's assault on her conscience as well as the alpha saying he'd rather be dead than with her. I get so angry at "well they aren't forced into it, its just hard NOT to love someone who loves you so utterly!" defense when one of the most prominent examples of an imprinting relationship has near-murder when the imprinter is rejected. I'm sure Emily felt she would survive rejecting him again. Totally.
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May 20, 2020 18:03
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chitoryu12 posted:[Leah bares her feelings.] 
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May 20, 2020 20:07
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It's bad enough that this woman exists and has problems, but Jacob has to hear about these problems. What a burden. For Jacob.
Shwoo fucked around with this message at 14:34 on May 21, 2020 |
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May 21, 2020 03:32
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The book's malice for Leah is horrifying, but I chuckled at the mental image of Edward staring out the window of a darkened house like the world's mopiest ghost.
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May 21, 2020 06:48
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Just imagine if Leah had shifted first and was the Alpha.
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May 21, 2020 14:13
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quote:Leah was trying—for Leah. She kept her jibes to a minimum as she raced around the circuit, but it was impossible not to be aware of her smug mood. I thought of the whole “two’s company” saying. It didn’t really apply, because one was plenty to my mind. But if there had to be three of us, it was hard to think of anyone that I wouldn’t trade her for. Paul, the douchebag who literally tried to murder Jacob's crush the first time he saw her because she puzzled out that werewolves are a thing, is less hated than Leah. How the hell did this get past the editors without question? quote:I changed into my other form when I was a few yards from the lawn. I hadn’t been planning to spend much time human here. But I hadn’t been planning to have Leah in my head, either. I pulled on my ragged shorts and started across the lawn. Edward rapidly zipping between "dramatically flopped over the furniture" spots in the house every few seconds like an Animaniacs character, wailing. quote:It had been a while since I’d slept—since before my last patrol. I could really feel that now. I took a step forward, sat down on the porch steps, and slumped against the railing. Please, never bring up that moment ever again. quote:We sat in silence. I could hear the others in the house. Emmett, Alice, and Jasper, speaking in low, serious voices upstairs. Esme humming tunelessly in another room. Rosalie and Edward breathing close by—I couldn’t tell which was which, but I could hear the difference in Bella’s labored panting. I could hear her heart, too. It seemed… uneven. Not in this book! quote:“She’s family to you?” I asked Carlisle. It had caught my notice before, when he’d said I’d helped the rest of his family, too. This is not a normal baby quote:I wanted to be angry with him, but he was making it hard. It was like he was throwing my own words back at me, just scrambled up. They’d sounded right before, but they couldn’t be right now. Not with Bella dying. Still… I remembered how it felt to be broken on the ground under Sam—to have no choice but be involved in the murder of someone I loved. It wasn’t the same, though. Sam was wrong. And Bella loved things she shouldn’t. Meyer will continue to be vague about how vampires work, likely to save her time on thinking. quote:Bella’s heartbeat throbbed and faltered, giving an agonizing emphasis to his words. What it wants is so blindingly obvious that I'm surprised Carlisle hasn't tried it. Like, it's downright out of character for him not to realize it. quote:I felt the same way I had yesterday, when I’d seen the black stains across her stomach—furious, and a little crazy. Jacob just told the reader outright what it is. quote:My skin was all hot and prickly. I breathed slowly in and out, focusing on that to calm myself. Rosalie, who we once lauded as having reasonable issues with Bella, is now so crazy that she's refusing to even let Carlisle perform medical procedures to figure out the pregnancy. quote:“You’re losing me, Doc. Can you dumb it down?” It means vampires have Klinefelter syndrome! quote:“I thought it meant that our species were almost completely different. Less related than a lion and a house cat. But this new life—well, it suggests that we’re more genetically compatible than I’d thought.” He sighed sadly. “I didn’t know to warn them.” The number of biologists Meyer consulted for research is likely equal to the number of therapists. quote:I sighed, too. It had been easy to hate Edward for the same ignorance. I still hated him for it. It was just hard to feel the same way about Carlisle. Maybe because I wasn’t ten shades of jealous in Carlisle’s case. "None of this bullshit even matters." quote:“I’m sorry. I should have asked.” Would you say, perhaps, that the natives of this land are closer to the earth? More in tune with their pagan selves? quote:“Bibbidi-Bobbidi-Boo,” I mumbled. He was just like Bella with all the magic garbage. Legitimately surprised this version of Rosalie didn't hiss like a cornered cat and take his arm off. quote:Carlisle shifted, twisting to look expectantly at the door. Edward was through the door first, with Rosalie right on his heels. His face was, like his voice, no longer dead. He seemed intensely focused. Rosalie looked suspicious. "That loving demon." quote:“We haven’t actually addressed that angle,” Edward went on. “We’ve been trying to get Bella what she needs. And her body is accepting it about as well as one of ours would. Perhaps we should address the needs of the… fetus first. Maybe if we can satisfy it, we’ll be able to help her more effectively.” The greatest vampire surgeon in the history of the world, with centuries of knowledge, never once considered "Maybe the partially vampire baby would drink blood." quote:Rosalie hissed under her breath. She wasn’t suspicious anymore. Her revoltingly perfect face was all lit up, her eyes wide with excitement. “Of course,” she muttered. “Carlisle, we have all that type O negative laid aside for Bella. It’s a good idea,” she added, not looking at me. I want to imagine the Cullens just have a fully stocked hospital in their house just in case Bella has yet another tragic accident or decides she needs to become a skydiver or something. quote:“Hmm.” Carlisle put his hand to his chin, lost in thought. “I wonder… And then, what would be the best way to administer.…” If you want to get really technical, his idea was "death and blood", so that could also be taken as letting Bella kill a few people. quote:I ignored her and watched Carlisle. That same ghost of hope that had been in Edward’s face was now in the doctor’s eyes. He pursed his lips, speculating. Bake it into black pudding, you wimp! quote:“I plan to ask her what she thinks. I just wanted to run it past Carlisle first.” In his defense, Jacob doesn't know about Rosalie's past. In Meyer's not-defense, the audience is fully aware and doesn't really need to have things spelled out this blatantly. quote:Huh. I wouldn’t have thought the ice-cold Barbie would have a maternal side. So much for protecting Bella—Rosalie’d probably jam the tube down Bella’s throat herself. I miss the old Rosalie that I could like. quote:I dragged myself up from the stairs and followed after them as they disappeared into the house. I wasn’t sure why. Just morbid curiosity, maybe. It was like a horror movie. Monsters and blood all over the place. Again, cartoon characters. quote:“What’s going on?” Bella demanded in a scratchy whisper. Her waxy hand twitched up—like she was trying to protect her balloon-shaped stomach. I thought Bella's character was to cry, gasp, and faint dramatically while other people did all the work? quote:Edward stepped around Rosalie, no humor touching his intense expression. I was glad for that. It helped, just a little bit, that he was suffering worse than me. He took her hand, not the one that was still protecting her swollen belly. "Something only those dirty foreigners do." quote:Well, at least he was giving it to her straight. Chill. quote:“So, who’s going to catch me a grizzly bear?” Bella whispered. You live with a doctor and the first thing you think of is "All right, who do I need to drain?" quote:“I’m not here as a donor, Bells,” I grumbled. “’Sides, it’s human blood that thing’s after, and I don’t think mine applies—”
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May 21, 2020 16:22
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At this point I'm expecting Carlisle to start using chromosomes like some kind of power level. "The reading is off the chart. Over 20,000. Even Master Yoda doesn't have a chromosome count that high."
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May 21, 2020 19:51
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Isn't Meyer a mother? How do you give birth multiple times and not know how fetal nutrition works? Does she think a fetus is literally in a woman's stomach, gobbling up food? Even worse, why does her doctor character seem to think that fetuses have access to the digestive system? Is it poking a straw through the amniotic sac and into the stomach? Is Mormon sex ed this bad?
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May 21, 2020 19:54
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Given the baby crazy on display here its astonishing Rosalie never made a vampire child.
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May 21, 2020 20:07
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