[Mafia] A Very Covid Voodoofly

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CCKeane: Jan 28, 2008; my shit posts don't die, they multiply

Voodoofly posted:

He is my first readthru.

Might not be until tomorrow morning

Technically it's tomorrow morning here, now.

# ? May 27, 2020 05:01

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# ? Apr 29, 2024 08:33

Dhaes: Dec 1, 2006; You realize, of course, that everything I say is horseshit.

merk: i would still like to request deadline pushed back 1 hour to 4 PST instead of 3 PST

merk posted:

some yellow for your attention

# ? May 27, 2020 05:02

Voodoofly: Jul 3, 2002; Some days even my lucky rocket ship underpants don't help

No idea, he hasn't posted enough to tell either way. But I have no problem voting someone because I think they are a liability to the town without any care in the world as to their alignment.

Also I have no idea how you thought his case on you was fine when he has never made a case and keeps saying tomorrow tomorrow?

# ? May 27, 2020 05:04

Pander: Oct 9, 2007; Fear is the glue that holds society together. It's what makes people suppress their worst impulses. Fear is power.

And at the end of fear, oblivion.

reading people now

cidrick comes across towny. Like, his push on voodoo is kinda nuts and his d1 content is light, but it's generally good and his evolution on past opinions looks legit.

Chili...I don't hate his D1 re-reading it as much as I did then. Being "the other potential lynch that got swung away from" makes him kind of a fulcrum for a lot of opinions, which colors things a bit. I'm hesitant to lynch him knowing that a significant chunk of it is curiosity rather than conviction.

Reading wins now.

I still really don't like keane for town. Until I go through him thoroughly I don't know if I can espouse this at a level more than gut, but just going through the others I see his posts pop up and they're kinda unsettling, like he's being very surgical about how he's posting.

# ? May 27, 2020 05:09

Hal Incandenza: Feb 12, 2004

Voodoofly posted:

No idea, he hasn't posted enough to tell either way. But I have no problem voting someone because I think they are a liability to the town without any care in the world as to their alignment.

Also I have no idea how you thought his case on you was fine when he has never made a case and keeps saying tomorrow tomorrow?

Nah he had two posts about me, although the second one was sort of a lot like wins "the three people who voted for Jam first are all scum" and not specifically about me.

I don't love wins either, he was kind of a "me-too" on spoonsy (although he did take the time to consolidate the points against him) and I think the case he made today is also pretty surface level and non-compelling. At least voodoo clearly is trying to analyze the play around the jam votes, wins is more just saying "look at these bad votes" and not really doing a real read

# ? May 27, 2020 05:15

Pander: Oct 9, 2007; Fear is the glue that holds society together. It's what makes people suppress their worst impulses. Fear is power.

And at the end of fear, oblivion.

Wins is an easy case. I don't mean that in any way other than he hasn't posted much, his reads tend to be really easy ones, he's only had 2 posts since mid-D1 and they're "here are three scum contingent on a theory that chili is 100% scum", which is...a really bad way to scumhunt?

And I know it's really rich coming from me after missing 90% of D1, but I kinda like to see not being around for deadline at least addressed. Wins is using the deadline behavior to shape his unifying theory of everyscum, when he wasn't even there to participate in it.

Like, he fits under the same heading as b-minus1, where it's play that doesn't seem at all useful to finding scum, but I dunno if that means he's scum. He's essentially a lurker D2 with a threadbare history.

Gonna keep looking. Could vote but doesn't feel *right* right now.

# ? May 27, 2020 05:23

Pander: Oct 9, 2007; Fear is the glue that holds society together. It's what makes people suppress their worst impulses. Fear is power.

And at the end of fear, oblivion.

CCKeane posted:

Here's my case on dy. :

1.) Set up spec that's useless:

This doesn't provide anything to town, and dy. continues this a few times through the early day. I pressed him for where he was going for with this, and he posted:

So I don't really see his angle of how this helps town root out scum - it feels like a lot of posts, and discussion points, but without anything that can tangibly help execute scum.

2. Twisting words:

In reference to town selecting the role of oracle, I posted this:

And this:

And dy. responded by posting this:

This feels like a willful misinterpretation of how somebody would draft in a zero sum game like mafia.

3. Votes:

I made a joke vote here:

And dy. shortly after votes this way:

This feels like an immediate response to my post, but whatever. However, he still has a vote on me when he makes this post:

So I guess I don't know if dy. feels I'm pushing too hard, or if I'm trying too hard to keep it light. I also feel like this post is pretty mild! It feels set up to allow for easy backing off. So I'm happy with my vote on dy., thank you, good night.

This post still bugs me a lot.

Nobody asked keane to summarize his case on dy. Nobody asked him if he still felt good about his dy vote, making his final "So I'm happy with my vote on dy." seem really shoehorned in.

I get making a case to try to get a player lynched, but dy didn't have much heat, and 30 minutes later keane offers to swap to spoonsy:

CCKeane posted:

Alright I'm going to move to spoonsy if nobody else is around, since it seems like a lot of people aren't around.

keane was pushing the idea that dy was scum without pushing people to vote dy. He publicly announced there weren't enough people to do anything without trying to actually rally people.

It just seems contrived and formulaic.

CCKeane posted:

Hal Incandenza posted:
Eh it's still a way to get an extra lunch D1. If voodoo knew none of the scum had heat on them it would be a decent play. Or if voodoo thought his scumbros would always be lurking may as well use it when you can

If pander flipped scum eventually it would be worth revisiting but in general I agree it's more likely town

Eh, I don't think that would happen in channel. I think I'd probably consider Voodoofly more if Jammy flipped scum, but I'm not interested in considering Voodoofly today.

##vote Chili

That was before jam's flip, so I'm confused what you're getting at. If voodoo had gaveled jammy, and jammy had been scum, you'd think voodoo was hard bussing as scum?

# ? May 27, 2020 05:45

CCKeane: Jan 28, 2008; my shit posts don't die, they multiply

Pander posted:

Wins is an easy case. I don't mean that in any way other than he hasn't posted much, his reads tend to be really easy ones, he's only had 2 posts since mid-D1 and they're "here are three scum contingent on a theory that chili is 100% scum", which is...a really bad way to scumhunt?

And I know it's really rich coming from me after missing 90% of D1, but I kinda like to see not being around for deadline at least addressed. Wins is using the deadline behavior to shape his unifying theory of everyscum, when he wasn't even there to participate in it.

Like, he fits under the same heading as b-minus1, where it's play that doesn't seem at all useful to finding scum, but I dunno if that means he's scum. He's essentially a lurker D2 with a threadbare history.

Gonna keep looking. Could vote but doesn't feel *right* right now.

My case is that he is building the case contingent on chili being scum, and then not aggressively pressing to get chili executed. His post about why you are scum is based around chili being scum, but then he ends with saying he'd be okay with your execution. It doesn't make sense.

He's set up a situation where it's "If A is true, then B is true", and then casually dropping that that argument is sufficient to pursue B.

# ? May 27, 2020 05:46

CCKeane: Jan 28, 2008; my shit posts don't die, they multiply

Pander posted:

This post still bugs me a lot.

Nobody asked keane to summarize his case on dy. Nobody asked him if he still felt good about his dy vote, making his final "So I'm happy with my vote on dy." seem really shoehorned in.

I get making a case to try to get a player lynched, but dy didn't have much heat, and 30 minutes later keane offers to swap to spoonsy:

keane was pushing the idea that dy was scum without pushing people to vote dy. He publicly announced there weren't enough people to do anything without trying to actually rally people.

It just seems contrived and formulaic.

Eh, I don't think that would happen in channel. I think I'd probably consider Voodoofly more if Jammy flipped scum, but I'm not interested in considering Voodoofly today.

##vote Chili

That was before jam's flip, so I'm confused what you're getting at. If voodoo had gaveled jammy, and jammy had been scum, you'd think voodoo was hard bussing as scum?
[/quote]

What? Yes, if Jammy, the person Voodoofly didn't gravel as scum but was voted off had flipped scum I'd be more suspicious of Voodoofly? Where the hell do you get a hard bus from this?

# ? May 27, 2020 05:50

CCKeane: Jan 28, 2008; my shit posts don't die, they multiply

Also how is posting a case about Dy. Not trying to rally toward a dy. Execution? Are you just deciding that I'm scum and then trying to figure out how my posts are scummy instead of vice versa?

Have I accidentally walked through a mirror and found myself in opposite land?

# ? May 27, 2020 05:52

CCKeane: Jan 28, 2008; my shit posts don't die, they multiply

Pander posted:

If I'm scum, I want oracle, assuming the person using it stays anonymous. There really isn't a town reason for not wanting a flip. If someone's so towny you'd want to prevent their lynch, then they'd be so towny that nobody would lynch them until the game's already lost.

Behold, Pander posts that he is scum! I am very good at mafia.

# ? May 27, 2020 05:56

Pander: Oct 9, 2007; Fear is the glue that holds society together. It's what makes people suppress their worst impulses. Fear is power.

And at the end of fear, oblivion.

CCKeane posted:

My case is that he is building the case contingent on chili being scum, and then not aggressively pressing to get chili executed. His post about why you are scum is based around chili being scum, but then he ends with saying he'd be okay with your execution. It doesn't make sense.

He's set up a situation where it's "If A is true, then B is true", and then casually dropping that that argument is sufficient to pursue B.

regarding the bolded, I ask "why"? It makes no sense as scum to set up this logical progression where chili is the focal point of all scummery and not vote him. It *does* makes sense if you're a towny irrationally attached to your case and assume it's not so much that B is contingent on A, but rather that B=A and it's therefore all the same.

I'd also argue you're using a subjective interpretation for "not aggressively pressing to get chili executed". Wins is barely posting today and his only case *was* pretty clear about chili being scum. Your point would be stronger if he had like 10 other posts today that weren't about chili at all, but here the lack of data make the conclusion that he doesn't actually want to see chili get lynched a reach.

# ? May 27, 2020 05:57

Pander: Oct 9, 2007; Fear is the glue that holds society together. It's what makes people suppress their worst impulses. Fear is power.

And at the end of fear, oblivion.

CCKeane posted:

What? Yes, if Jammy, the person Voodoofly didn't gravel as scum but was voted off had flipped scum I'd be more suspicious of Voodoofly? Where the hell do you get a hard bus from this?

Okay I misread what you were getting at. I thought you were saying if voodoo DID gavel jammy and jammy flipped scum, that you'd think voodoo was scum.

There weren't many posts before yours that actually addressed jam, so it stood out to me. I was trying to figure out who you were responding to when you brought up jammy out of nowhere.

# ? May 27, 2020 05:59

Pander: Oct 9, 2007; Fear is the glue that holds society together. It's what makes people suppress their worst impulses. Fear is power.

And at the end of fear, oblivion.

CCKeane posted:

Also how is posting a case about Dy. Not trying to rally toward a dy. Execution? Are you just deciding that I'm scum and then trying to figure out how my posts are scummy instead of vice versa?

Have I accidentally walked through a mirror and found myself in opposite land?

Sort of. I don't like how you read on a gut level, partly meta. Your tone just feels off from what I remember of you as town. So I start from the assumption you're scum, look for poo poo that doesn't smell right, and push you on it to see how you respond.

Maybe you make a contradiction, or maybe your answer makes sense. Won't know til I push.

# ? May 27, 2020 06:03

CCKeane: Jan 28, 2008; my shit posts don't die, they multiply

Pander posted:

regarding the bolded, I ask "why"? It makes no sense as scum to set up this logical progression where chili is the focal point of all scummery and not vote him. It *does* makes sense if you're a towny irrationally attached to your case and assume it's not so much that B is contingent on A, but rather that B=A and it's therefore all the same.

I'd also argue you're using a subjective interpretation for "not aggressively pressing to get chili executed". Wins is barely posting today and his only case *was* pretty clear about chili being scum. Your point would be stronger if he had like 10 other posts today that weren't about chili at all, but here the lack of data make the conclusion that he doesn't actually want to see chili get lynched a reach.

Buddy, any other words you want to put in my mouth, because I feel like you're not reading my posts, and it's bizzare that you're defending wins so hard here.

Maybe chili isn't scum and wins does want him executed!

But it's absolutely scummy and bad to set up a chain execution and then not chain the executions in the right order! How is that not scummy to you?

# ? May 27, 2020 06:04

Pander: Oct 9, 2007; Fear is the glue that holds society together. It's what makes people suppress their worst impulses. Fear is power.

And at the end of fear, oblivion.

CCKeane posted:

Also how is posting a case about Dy. Not trying to rally toward a dy. Execution? Are you just deciding that I'm scum and then trying to figure out how my posts are scummy instead of vice versa?

Have I accidentally walked through a mirror and found myself in opposite land?

My issue with your dy case was that it was weak for how long it was, which makes it seem more out up for appearance than effect. Ending it with "I'm happy with voting for dy still" just kinda reads like mild guilt. In a world where nobody was making GBS threads on you for voting Dy, it looks weird.

# ? May 27, 2020 06:06

CCKeane: Jan 28, 2008; my shit posts don't die, they multiply

Pander posted:

Sort of. I don't like how you read on a gut level, partly meta. Your tone just feels off from what I remember of you as town. So I start from the assumption you're scum, look for poo poo that doesn't smell right, and push you on it to see how you respond.

Maybe you make a contradiction, or maybe your answer makes sense. Won't know til I push.

My gut is that you are more interested in throwing poo poo at the wall and seeing what sticks than making meaningful contributions.

You're like a failed carpenter, Pander.

# ? May 27, 2020 06:07

CCKeane: Jan 28, 2008; my shit posts don't die, they multiply

CCKeane posted:

You're like a failed carpenter, Pander.

You're making bad posts is what I'm saying.

# ? May 27, 2020 06:07

Pander: Oct 9, 2007; Fear is the glue that holds society together. It's what makes people suppress their worst impulses. Fear is power.

And at the end of fear, oblivion.

CCKeane posted:

My gut is that you are more interested in throwing poo poo at the wall and seeing what sticks

That's literally the definition of scumhunting.

# ? May 27, 2020 06:07

CCKeane: Jan 28, 2008; my shit posts don't die, they multiply

Pander posted:

My issue with your dy case was that it was weak for how long it was, which makes it seem more out up for appearance than effect. Ending it with "I'm happy with voting for dy still" just kinda reads like mild guilt. In a world where nobody was making GBS threads on you for voting Dy, it looks weird.

It looks weirder to argue that somebody making a case and trying to push an execution toward their scummiest read is a bad thing? IDK man this is super strange and I feel like you're desperately trying to manufacture a case on me.

# ? May 27, 2020 06:09

Pander: Oct 9, 2007; Fear is the glue that holds society together. It's what makes people suppress their worst impulses. Fear is power.

And at the end of fear, oblivion.

CCKeane posted:

It looks weirder to argue that somebody making a case and trying to push an execution toward their scummiest read is a bad thing? IDK man this is super strange and I feel like you're desperately trying to manufacture a case on me.

so you're just gonna pretend

quote:

Ending it with "I'm happy with voting for dy still" just kinda reads like mild guilt. In a world where nobody was making GBS threads on you for voting Dy, it looks weird.

didn't happen?

# ? May 27, 2020 06:11

CCKeane: Jan 28, 2008; my shit posts don't die, they multiply

Pander posted:

That's literally the definition of scumhunting.

Any reason you felt like selectively editting my post to remove the second part where I accuse you of being uninterested in making meaningful contributions?

# ? May 27, 2020 06:11

CCKeane: Jan 28, 2008; my shit posts don't die, they multiply

Pander posted:

so you're just gonna pretend

didn't happen?

I just said I'm still fine with voting Dy.? This is nothing and it's a normal thing to say?

# ? May 27, 2020 06:12

Pander: Oct 9, 2007; Fear is the glue that holds society together. It's what makes people suppress their worst impulses. Fear is power.

And at the end of fear, oblivion.

CCKeane posted:

Any reason you felt like selectively editting my post to remove the second part where I accuse you of being uninterested in making meaningful contributions?

Because it wasn't loving true.

CCKeane posted:

I just said I'm still fine with voting Dy.? This is nothing and it's a normal thing to say?

In some contexts it's normal, but in the specific context where you were the only one talking about dy, mentioning how you're still happy with your vote sounds like you're trying to convince yourself or something. It's like a tl;dr for a case you knew would convince nobody. I mean, it was a painfully formatted case that boiled down to "dy did setup spec and voted me because he didn't like my posting".

# ? May 27, 2020 06:17

CCKeane: Jan 28, 2008; my shit posts don't die, they multiply

These are all bad posts and I think Pander is scum. His defense of wins here is weird and frankly his posts directed at me feel based on trying to build a case on me than figuring out if I'm scum or not, including cutting off a quote of mine to make my statement appear significantly different in intent. I won't be responding to Pander anymore, it's unfun and I don't think he is town.

I think I'm thinking Wins and Pander are scum. Chili could be scum, I guess I'm coming around to b- a bit, but eh. I'm neutral on my dy. read right now, he said something like he was feeling off his game and I can see that, I suppose.

# ? May 27, 2020 06:21

Pander: Oct 9, 2007; Fear is the glue that holds society together. It's what makes people suppress their worst impulses. Fear is power.

And at the end of fear, oblivion.

I cut your quote off because I disagreed with you. It wasn't something I did to misquote you so as to make you seem scummy. I throw poo poo at people to get them to respond, that's how I scumhunt, and I disagree about it's substance. I want the truth.

# ? May 27, 2020 06:25

CCKeane: Jan 28, 2008; my shit posts don't die, they multiply

Is there a spooky ghost in the thread? I can almost hear something, like a light voice on the wind...

# ? May 27, 2020 06:27

mega dy: Dec 6, 2003

Yeeeeeeaaaah Pander not reading great there.

# ? May 27, 2020 06:27

Pander: Oct 9, 2007; Fear is the glue that holds society together. It's what makes people suppress their worst impulses. Fear is power.

And at the end of fear, oblivion.

dy. posted:

Yeeeeeeaaaah Pander not reading great there.

It's really frustrating because it feels like he's trying to brush off the stuff he doesn't want to address by reframing everything. I don't remember him acting like this as town ever.

I really don't think I'm being unduly harsh to him or trying to take him out of context, so ghosting me seems kinda excessive.

# ? May 27, 2020 06:43

Dhaes: Dec 1, 2006; You realize, of course, that everything I say is horseshit.

CCKeane posted:

I think I'm thinking Wins and Pander are scum. Chili could be scum, I guess I'm coming around to b- a bit, but eh. I'm neutral on my dy. read right now, he said something like he was feeling off his game and I can see that, I suppose.

huh. well, thats a thought. i dont know why i didnt consider it before, but pander makes sense as scum with wins and b-

of the two i think wins is the flip i'd like to see most w/r/t pander

i agree with keane / dy, that whole exchange was filthy

# ? May 27, 2020 06:49

Dhaes: Dec 1, 2006; You realize, of course, that everything I say is horseshit.

i think i had some blinders on with pander. i'll try to look into it more tomorrow as it is pretty late here

# ? May 27, 2020 06:50

CCKeane: Jan 28, 2008; my shit posts don't die, they multiply

I feel like I am remembering the last few notes of a song I sung as a child, as it disappears into the fog of long lost memories.

# ? May 27, 2020 06:57

Pander: Oct 9, 2007; Fear is the glue that holds society together. It's what makes people suppress their worst impulses. Fear is power.

And at the end of fear, oblivion.

Fwiw I was thinking about what you said Keane, and I'm sorry if I'm making it unfun for you. I'm having trouble destressing to go to sleep right now and I think it was caused by you saying that. I'm playing mafia again, which I generally havent done much lately, cause I try to enjoy it without getting all stressed about it. I think I'm failing that and will check tomorrow to make sure I don't cross lines and make this a bad experience for you or anyone.

This post reads like garbage cause I don't parse my thoughts well on the phone, apologies for that.

# ? May 27, 2020 06:58

Dhaes: Dec 1, 2006; You realize, of course, that everything I say is horseshit.

did pander ever expand / explain that whole "scum before me in the draft" thing?

pander, if you haven't, could you do so?

# ? May 27, 2020 07:00

b-minus1: Jul 24, 2008; She's a maniac, maniac
on the floor
And she's dancing like she's never danced before

Pander posted:

I'm very confused about how b-minus1 feels about voodoo. He initially said he found voodoo towny, then said he came out looking the worst, then is definitely leaning town.

Super inconsistent. In a vacuum b-'s play has been absurd.

I'm still looking because I'm not convinced. Something about it just gives me a gut feel like he's earnest, but just not coming through with a consistent level of thinking about things.

I flip flopped on voodoo after I reread the eod posts and convinced myself that pander and voodoofly were scum and were working together to get another townie lunched after the dayvig. I no longer believe this

# ? May 27, 2020 10:43

b-minus1: Jul 24, 2008; She's a maniac, maniac
on the floor
And she's dancing like she's never danced before

I should say, pander could stillbe scum, but I really don�t think voodoo is

# ? May 27, 2020 10:44

Chili: Jan 23, 2004; college kids ain't shit; Fun Shoe

Don't want to put b- at -1 just yet, but consider this a phantom vote

# ? May 27, 2020 12:31

b-minus1: Jul 24, 2008; She's a maniac, maniac
on the floor
And she's dancing like she's never danced before

I�m probably going to be the lunch today and that�s fine. I�m by btw.
I just reread wins and although there isn�t a lot of content, I did find myself agreeing with him more often than not.

wins32767 posted:

Is Pander my first choice no? But if we can't mobilize Chili, I think we're pretty likely to catch scum with Pander and Hal based on how that swing went down. Hal most especially.

It seems like most of us at some point or another have expressed suspicion of hal and pander yet they have received few votes overall. I really think we need to flip one of them.

# ? May 27, 2020 12:37

b-minus1: Jul 24, 2008; She's a maniac, maniac
on the floor
And she's dancing like she's never danced before

Motherf*ckin autocorrect. I�m vt

# ? May 27, 2020 12:38

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# ? Apr 29, 2024 08:33

b-minus1: Jul 24, 2008; She's a maniac, maniac
on the floor
And she's dancing like she's never danced before

Votecount for Day 2

b-minus1 (4): Dhaes, dy., Cidrick, Hal Incandenza

wins32767 (2): CCKeane, Chili

Hal Incandenza (1): Voodoofly, b-minus1, ~~Voodoofly~~

Pander (0): Chili, ~~Chili~~

Chili (0): Dhaes, ~~Dhaes~~, Cidrick, Voodoofly, ~~Voodoofly~~, ~~Cidrick~~

Not Voting (3): Pander, Voodoofly, wins32767

With 10 alive, it's 6 votes to execute. The current deadline is May 27^th, 2020 at 6 p.m. EDT -- that's in about 9 hours, 54 minutes.

# ? May 27, 2020 13:06

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > The Game Room > [Mafia] A Very Covid Voodoofly

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