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Kart Barfunkel posted:Aka by the end of act one, he’s completely finished his character arc for the entire trilogy. That's not even a character arc.
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May 30, 2020 06:36
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CelticPredator posted:Well I guess since I’ve seen ROS I disagree. I haven't seen ROS but I've heard a plot summary/know that "Somehow, Palpatine has returned" and I agree. Kylo kills Snoke and sets himself up as the real villain. Fun! Rey's history being resolved as "Your parents were no one, and so are you." Interesting! Luke formed a New Jedi Order; he made a terrible, instinctual choice when he saw immense Dark Side potential in one of his pupils - one who shares his bloodline - knowing the chaos that could stem from that. Tragic, but also, consistent with what we've seen in the "Skywalker Saga" (as Disney is so eager to brand it) to this point! I don't think TLJ was a perfect film by any means - I've got a few issues with it - but I enjoyed watching it and remember leaving the theater a hell of a lot more excited than I was after TFA. "Wow, they didn't just do a copy/replace on Empire! The sequel trilogy might actually go somewhere new in the third act!" Also, this poo poo ruled. I know the timelines are all over the place and it takes some plot contrivances to make it work, but having every major arc to come to a head at once and get punctuated like this was a lot of fun. Rian Johnson deserves to make at least one Star Wars movie where he's not beholden to somebody else's half-assed plot setup.
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May 30, 2020 08:26
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If you liked TLJ but didn't like TRoS then I'm sorry the film didn't live up to your theory-crafted Youtube videos, you basement-dwelling manchildren.  Star Wars isn't about you. Have you considered you are a toxic fan?
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May 30, 2020 09:30
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Horizon Burning posted:If you liked TLJ but didn't like TRoS then I'm sorry the film didn't live up to your theory-crafted Youtube videos, you basement-dwelling manchildren. Checking to see if you're a Gnarlacious Bro alt rn
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May 30, 2020 09:39
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FunkyAl posted:I never watched this show, but I'm curious to find out if they saved the cheerleader Pro tip: Do not read up on Hayden Panitierre's actual life for the past decade
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May 30, 2020 10:08
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Luke shoulda been even more like Space Zizek. Snotty, picking at his shirt, endlessly referencing un-PC jokes about how Alderman should have fought back.
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May 30, 2020 10:52
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PeterWeller posted:That's not even a character arc. It’s the closest thing he gets to one.
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May 30, 2020 11:26
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JethroMcB posted:Also, this poo poo ruled. I know the timelines are all over the place and it takes some plot contrivances to make it work, but having every major arc to come to a head at once and get punctuated like this was a lot of fun. It absolutely did and I still laugh whenever I see someone post some unreadable wall of text about how it ruins the lore or whatever
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May 30, 2020 13:52
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TLJ tries to get away with the Rogue One thing where an action packed finale makes up for the rest of the movie being a disjointed mess, but it really doesn't manage.
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May 30, 2020 15:06
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As soon as Carrie Fisher died they should have re-shot or re-edited TLJ to have Leia die instead of Luke.
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May 30, 2020 16:44
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The Luke parts of TLJ are the best things to come out of the sequel movies.
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May 30, 2020 16:57
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The Last Jedi and Ghostbusters 2016 forced me to reevaluate my maxim that any movie chuds hate will automatically be good.
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May 30, 2020 17:55
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Kart Barfunkel posted:It’s the closest thing he gets to one. I'd argue that "I wanna run away" -> "I wanna run away with this girl I met" -> "I wanna join the cause" is more of an arc. But I wouldn't argue that it's an interesting or well developed one.
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May 30, 2020 18:41
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OctoberCountry posted:It absolutely did and I still laugh whenever I see someone post some unreadable wall of text about how it ruins the lore or whatever Being genuinely shocking and a great visual isn't in contradiction with breaking the setting. It's pretty much exactly the same thing as what JJ does with abusing the plot and setting to make a cool scene work, just better executed and without being repeated a bunch of times in a row like in ROS.
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May 30, 2020 18:52
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Edit: Nvm
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May 31, 2020 11:44
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PeterWeller posted:That's not even a character arc. Finn is the DnD character played by a guy who shows up only randomly and barely knows the rules and just wants to roll some dice without any complication, and when he's not around the other players just have him autopilot through encounters so that he's not a meaningfully different character when the player shows back up.
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May 31, 2020 19:55
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Tulip posted:Finn is the DnD character played by a guy who shows up only randomly and barely knows the rules and just wants to roll some dice without any complication, and when he's not around the other players just have him autopilot through encounters so that he's not a meaningfully different character when the player shows back up. This is painfully accurate
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May 31, 2020 21:06
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ONE YEAR LATER posted:The Luke parts of TLJ are the best things to come out of the sequel movies. I don't know how anyone can disagree with this. It was the logical evolution of the character and Hamill played it extremely well, regardless of his personal feelings. TLJ wasn't perfect but it got this right if nothing else. That it got so blatantly rolled back on RoS just shows just how badly this whole thing has been managed.
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Jun 1, 2020 18:49
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Mat Cauthon posted:I don't know how anyone can disagree with this. It was the logical evolution of the character and Hamill played it extremely well, regardless of his personal feelings. TLJ wasn't perfect but it got this right if nothing else. I mean, even TLJ was kind of between a rock and a hard place because TFA set it up as "Luke has fled the galaxy in cowardice because his pupil turned into space hitler 2.0 and his best friend robot is in a coma out of despair" or whatever. I don't know a lot of ways to resolve that set up that wouldn't have Luke coming off at least somewhat bad given that he abandoned everyone, laying that at the feet of Johnson seems unfair at the very least. But I think Luke being played like a cynical bastard was great work by Hamill and he got his cool moment before dying.
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Jun 1, 2020 19:17
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Asgerd posted:The Last Jedi and Ghostbusters 2016 forced me to reevaluate my maxim that any movie chuds hate will automatically be good. FWIW, you've at least still got Mad Max: Fury Road, Into The Spider-Verse, Captain Marvel, Wonder Woman, Birds of Prey, and The Force Awakens (if you don't think about it too hard) to point to in favour of said maxim. Also TLJ is good OP.
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Jun 1, 2020 21:37
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TLJ is bad, please do not erase history.
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Jun 1, 2020 21:42
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Up Circle posted:TLJ is bad, please do not erase history. kill it, actually
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Jun 1, 2020 21:50
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CelticPredator posted:kill it, actually TLJ has made it plenty clear that history is pretty swell, the present sucks and needs to die.
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Jun 1, 2020 22:06
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Well too dang bad
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Jun 1, 2020 22:14
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nine-gear crow posted:FWIW, you've at least still got Mad Max: Fury Road, Into The Spider-Verse, Captain Marvel, Wonder Woman, Birds of Prey, and The Force Awakens (if you don't think about it too hard) to point to in favour of said maxim. Also TLJ is good OP. Please share the secret good version of Wonder Woman that you got to see
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Jun 2, 2020 01:14
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SolarFire2 posted:As soon as Carrie Fisher died they should have re-shot or re-edited TLJ to have Leia die instead of Luke. Why not both? Let the past die: Kill it. If you have to.
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Jun 2, 2020 02:29
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Chuck Buried Treasure posted:Please share the secret good version of Wonder Woman that you got to see Wonder woman and not Captain Marvel?
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Jun 2, 2020 03:03
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ungulateman posted:Wonder woman and not Captain Marvel? I never actually saw Captain Marvel 
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Jun 2, 2020 03:56
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Wonder Woman is fine, but the villain reveal is really dumb.
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Jun 2, 2020 06:16
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Chuck Buried Treasure posted:Please share the secret good version of Wonder Woman that you got to see No.
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Jun 2, 2020 06:21
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Wonder Woman rules. It has a weak character villain, but a strong thematic villain: war. It's like Iron Man in that way. Obie may not be the strongest villain, but the thematic villain is the arms industry. (Too bad Marvel lost sight of that, but Disney's gonna Disney).
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Jun 2, 2020 07:51
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Bogus Adventure posted:Wonder Woman rules. It has a weak character villain, but a strong thematic villain: war. It's like Iron Man in that way. Obie may not be the strongest villain, but the thematic villain is the arms industry. (Too bad Marvel lost sight of that, but Disney's gonna Disney). the flaw of both is that the villian is just the bad wrong version of the concept. the hero isnt their opposite or an alternative or someone who rejects what the villain stands for, just the good and cool rehabilitated versions of capitalist imperialism. the films are about reform and how this time it's different.
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Jun 2, 2020 08:07
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Yeah, comes to mind that Athena is generally conspicuously absent from about any incarnation of Wonder Woman's idea of the Greek gods, and you realise probably because Diana herself (despite the name) has taken up basically that role as the sanitised liberal war goddess.
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Jun 2, 2020 08:48
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If Marvel ever introduces Hercules and if they ever include Ares I hope they also have the balls to somehow include Ares' "You want the other god of war" speech,
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Jun 2, 2020 09:35
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Grendels Dad posted:If Marvel ever introduces Hercules and if they ever include Ares I hope they also have the balls to somehow include Ares' "You want the other god of war" speech, in some versions of the myth, hercules was created intentionally created by zeus to win the gigantomachia, a separate conflict from the titanomachia. the gigantes were not unusually large physically, but rather were mortals with such indomitable spirit and overwhelming aggression that not even the olympians were a match for them in battle. e: brushing up on it on wikipedia for fun. it seems the gigantomachy is also the most important conflict in greek myth. its kind of crazy how little it figures in our understanding of it. like theres this whole race of mortals who are cousins of the titans and have loving superpowers and they fight the gods and like nope, most people just confuse it with the titanomachy. Hodgepodge fucked around with this message at 10:15 on Jun 2, 2020 |
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Jun 2, 2020 10:07
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Force Awakens is an enjoyable 'empty calorie,' kind of movie that doesn't hold up to scrutiny very well but understands how Star Wars is supposed to FEEL and the thematic underpinnings that are supposed to drive it, and it delivers both in abundance if you don't scratch beneath the surface too hard. Its one of those kinds of movies that deserves to be called a "love letter," to its source material, and while it could have been a better movie in every way VERY easily, I can't condemn it too hard. The Last Jedi is brilliant, and while it is not a virtually perfect movie like New Hope or Empire, it's clearly superior to every other movie in the "skywalker saga," in terms of themes, character development, clever use of established tropes and lore for the franchise, acting, and moments that are memorable for being good rather than hilarious trash. Yes that includes Jedi (though only barely, Jedi is also good). Its flaws are superficial in comparison to its successes and I find the need many of its defenders have to concede that its got its share of warts silly. Its ground that doesn't need to be conceded because those warts don't do anything to substantively mar the film. Rise of the Skywalker is a bizarre gumbo of mixed intentions that tried to jam three movies into one movie's runtime, tried to walk back Last Jedi while also NOT walking back Last Jedi in the vain hope of pleasing both sides of a really stupid argument they should have just ignored, and tried to tie its predecessors together into a singular vision but couldn't think of a smart way to do it and thus fell flat when it did it in a stupid way. However, I did like the middle third of the movie rather a lot, most of the stuff on Poe's old planet was good and even with the Last Jedi Retcon crap everything to the end of the Death Star Ruins duel took Rey and Kylo's individual arcs and relationship to a satisfying conclusion, even if where it went once those arcs were finished was stupid. It makes me think that JJ could have written an entire good trilogy if he'd stuck it out the entire way and didn't try to put both his sequels into one film. But then we wouldn't have gotten The Last Jedi, so gently caress that. Sanguinia fucked around with this message at 10:20 on Jun 2, 2020 |
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Jun 2, 2020 10:13
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check out this awesome poo poo from the 5th century poem Dionysiaca:quote:[Dionysus] roasted the Giants' bodies with a great conflagration, an image on earth of the thunderbolt cast by Zeus. The torches blazed: fire was rolling all over the head of Encelados and making the air hot, but it did not vanquish him—Encelados bent not his knee in the steam of the earthly fire, since he was reserved for a thunderbolt.
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Jun 2, 2020 10:22
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Hodgepodge posted:check out this awesome poo poo from the 5th century poem Dionysiaca: *Sheev cracks his knuckles*
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Jun 2, 2020 12:38
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Chuck Buried Treasure posted:I never actually saw Captain Marvel It's extremely loving boring even for a marvel movie
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Jun 2, 2020 13:13
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Yeah, comes to mind that Athena is generally conspicuously absent from about any incarnation of Wonder Woman's idea of the Greek gods, and you realise probably because Diana herself (despite the name) has taken up basically that role as the sanitised liberal war goddess. What do you mean by any incarnation? Are you talking about the comics? Athena has been a major player there as an occasional ally albeit a manipulative one.
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Jun 2, 2020 13:18
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