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BonoMan
Feb 20, 2002

Jade Ear Joe
Quick broad question about TVs as monitors.

We have a 75" Samsung TU7000 in our conference room. The purchase was not vetted by me. The color is a bit washed out and not as accurate as it needs to be. Not to big of an issue as we're going to to do some color calibration with an xRite (it's hooked up to a PC).

But just as a stop gap, when I went to color settings to make some changes, I noticed most of the advanced color settings are grayed out and, when connected to a PC, I get a very limited array of settings I can change. Connect to a blu-ray player and they all are available.

What's the technological reasoning behind this?

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KS
Jun 10, 2003
Outrageous Lumpwad
Wondering if you might be seeing 4:2:0 because you don't have 4:4:4 enabled. Try the test pattern on https://www.rtings.com/tv/learn/chroma-subsampling

The ghosted out image options make me think it's in PC mode, though, which should enable 4:4:4.

Make sure you don't have HDR toggled on in Windows as that would definitely do it.

BonoMan
Feb 20, 2002

Jade Ear Joe

KS posted:

Wondering if you might be seeing 4:2:0 because you don't have 4:4:4 enabled. Try the test pattern on https://www.rtings.com/tv/learn/chroma-subsampling

The ghosted out image options make me think it's in PC mode, though, which should enable 4:4:4.

Make sure you don't have HDR toggled on in Windows as that would definitely do it.

Windows isn't showing the monitor.as HDR capable which is odd.

And the TV's menu system is embarrassingly barebones but this does give me something to chase down .

Fedule
Mar 27, 2010


No one left uncured.
I got you.

beep by grandpa posted:

At long last I have arrived - after 9 years of wanting an OLED display (when they were all $9000), in a few weeks I will finally be able to get my LG OLED.

I had my eye on the C9 for a while but now with the CX I'm wondering if it might be worth an extra couple hundred bucks to get the 2020 model and stand atop the mountaintop of OLED after all these years. I've watched a bunch of reviews comparing the C9 and CX over the last few days and they look to be just about identical with the exception of the bandwidth being slightly reduced on the HDMI throughput for the CX (with no real way to see the consequences of since there are no hdmi 2.1 cards yet), but that the CX is appreciably better at high motion (or low frame panning-shots?) with its improved BFI, though to be completely honest even though I consider myself pretty tech savvy...I am having a really difficult time understanding what BFI even does and for which conditions it it supposed to be best at. It is something I would definitely learn to get an eye for once I have it here, but it's hard to comprehend without a display to look at to compare with it on and off.

I plan to use it for gaming on console and movies, the girlfriend will use it for TV but I also have a powerful PC gaming rig that I'd use on the LG running between at either 1440p@120hz or 4k@60hz, which is what I'm most excited about. What do you think, thread? Is BFI upgrade on the CX worth another the extra ~$300 or just stick with the C9?

I don't know about BFI but if console gaming is of any interest to you at all (IE if you're ever going to buy a PS5 or Xbox sX in the foreseeable) then the CX with its HDMI 2.1 support is a valuable get since it will play very nicely with VFR on those consoles.

beep by grandpa
May 5, 2004

I think the C9 already has hdmi 2.1

which of course currently no one has any way to test :sweatdrop:

Taima
Dec 31, 2006

tfw you're peeing next to someone in the lineup and they don't know

beep by grandpa posted:

At long last I have arrived - after 9 years of wanting an OLED display (when they were all $9000), in a few weeks I will finally be able to get my LG OLED.

I had my eye on the C9 for a while but now with the CX I'm wondering if it might be worth an extra couple hundred bucks to get the 2020 model and stand atop the mountaintop of OLED after all these years. I've watched a bunch of reviews comparing the C9 and CX over the last few days and they look to be just about identical with the exception of the bandwidth being slightly reduced on the HDMI throughput for the CX (with no real way to see the consequences of since there are no hdmi 2.1 cards yet), but that the CX is appreciably better at high motion (or low frame panning-shots?) with its improved BFI, though to be completely honest even though I consider myself pretty tech savvy...I am having a really difficult time understanding what BFI even does and for which conditions it it supposed to be best at. It is something I would definitely learn to get an eye for once I have it here, but it's hard to comprehend without a display to look at to compare with it on and off.

I plan to use it for gaming on console and movies, the girlfriend will use it for TV but I also have a powerful PC gaming rig that I'd use on the LG running between at either 1440p@120hz or 4k@60hz, which is what I'm most excited about. What do you think, thread? Is BFI upgrade on the CX worth another the extra ~$300 or just stick with the C9?

The BFI is better on the CX but it's very YMMV if you'll like the feature. In my experience, most people have historically not found it worth the downsides. Personally I can see the backlight oscillation caused by the tech, so it's completely unusable for me. I have no idea if that's common though. BFI also significantly decreases max brightness.

Another upside of the CX is that lower bit rate upsampling is apparently improved, if that matters in regards to the content you watch.

However there are several weird issues with the CX firmware including black crushing in some situations and things of that nature, although this should be fixed at some point.

The C9 is also noticeably brighter, though you probably wouldn't care or know unless they were side by side.

Honestly there's no fuckin' way I would pay $200 more for the CX but that's just me. I'm not even sure I would pay the same price for the CX. The C9 is extremely good and arguably better. I personally value HDR brightness over whatever improvements the CX is rocking.

beep by grandpa posted:

I think the C9 already has hdmi 2.1

which of course currently no one has any way to test :sweatdrop:

Yes not only does it have HDMI 2.1, it has a superior implementation with 8GBPs additional bandwidth. Though it is very unclear if that will matter in real life.

beep by grandpa
May 5, 2004

Thank you friend that's what I needed- Based on this I will get the C9!

Sure the issues with the CX could be fixed with future patches but that's not worth the amount of money being asked for to gamble on it to find out in weeks/months times when the C9 is a sure bet.

Fedule
Mar 27, 2010


No one left uncured.
I got you.
In that case I have a question. I swear I remember there's supposed to be at least one thing specifically added to CX relative to C9 that's supposed to be at least a medium-sized deal specifically for the next console generation. I haven't been scrutinising all of this because I'm not about to upgrade until the PS5 is actually out, but I thought it was HDMI 2.1. I guess it isn't. So what is it?

beep by grandpa
May 5, 2004

Fedule posted:

In that case I have a question. I swear I remember there's supposed to be at least one thing specifically added to CX relative to C9 that's supposed to be at least a medium-sized deal specifically for the next console generation. I haven't been scrutinising all of this because I'm not about to upgrade until the PS5 is actually out, but I thought it was HDMI 2.1. I guess it isn't. So what is it?

Depending on how long ago you recall seeing this, the only thing that springs to mind may be the availability of variable refresh rate (gsync but not freesync)? While VBR was always intended to be native to the 2020 models, it didn't come with the C9 at launch initially but was patched in later.

Pirate Jet
May 2, 2010
Hi. I’m a big dumbass and I made a dumb decision. I thought the cleaning solution I used on my LED monitor would be fine for my OLED television. It was not. Nothing is broken or scratched but it is a bit streaky and it’s noticeable in dark scenes. What’s the best way to clean these? Am I hosed forever? It’s an LG OLEDE855PUA.

FilthyImp
Sep 30, 2002

Anime Deviant

Fedule posted:

In that case I have a question. I swear I remember there's supposed to be at least one thing specifically added to CX
Probably AutoLow Latency mode, so it'll just know to be in game mode or not

Taima
Dec 31, 2006

tfw you're peeing next to someone in the lineup and they don't know

FilthyImp posted:

Probably AutoLow Latency mode, so it'll just know to be in game mode or not

No. The C9 has full HDMI 2.1 that is objectively better than the CX.

Auto low latency mode is good btw, I use it pretty much every day on my C9, as Nvidia GPUs support it, and HDMI 2.1 VRR.

seiferguy
Jun 9, 2005

FLAWED
INTUITION



Toilet Rascal

A Proper Uppercut posted:

My Sony with chromecast built in does this too, I'm pretty sure if you hit the volume button on your phone (or whatever you're casting with) it will change the tv volume. I only noticed because we use a sound bar and it was sounding echo-ey because the TV speakers had turned up.

Yeah, that seems to have done it. What I was streaming was always at max volume.

Tacier
Jul 22, 2003

I don’t need the CX to be better. I just want it to be cheaper. Like, 65” for $1700 by Black Friday. I believe in you LG.

Taima
Dec 31, 2006

tfw you're peeing next to someone in the lineup and they don't know
The C9 will probably be that price during black friday, and it's just as good or better, so I think you're good to go.

Paul MaudDib
May 3, 2006

TEAM NVIDIA:
FORUM POLICE

Taima posted:

The C9 will probably be that price during black friday, and it's just as good or better, so I think you're good to go.

is c9 inventory really going to last all the way to black friday?

(I guess it's lasted this long and that still surprises me... guess it's the rona.)

SweetMercifulCrap!
Jan 28, 2012
Lipstick Apathy

BonoMan posted:

Windows isn't showing the monitor.as HDR capable which is odd.

And the TV's menu system is embarrassingly barebones but this does give me something to chase down .

On some TVs, you have to enable HDR for that input somewhere in the settings.

Based on the TV blacking out most of your settings, what I assume is happening is the TV is auto-recognizing it as a PC RGB input and automatically put its black/color space levels at High/Full, while Windows is assuming its a TV and automatically putting out Low/Limited levels. You can force RGB Full in Windows but the location of where to do it varies depending on your PC. For me I have to go into the Intel Graphics display options. Alternatively, on your TV you can change your RGB levels to Low/Limited to match Windows. Sometimes this is called "Black Level".

BonoMan
Feb 20, 2002

Jade Ear Joe

SweetMercifulCrap! posted:

On some TVs, you have to enable HDR for that input somewhere in the settings.

Based on the TV blacking out most of your settings, what I assume is happening is the TV is auto-recognizing it as a PC RGB input and automatically put its black/color space levels at High/Full, while Windows is assuming its a TV and automatically putting out Low/Limited levels. You can force RGB Full in Windows but the location of where to do it varies depending on your PC. For me I have to go into the Intel Graphics display options. Alternatively, on your TV you can change your RGB levels to Low/Limited to match Windows. Sometimes this is called "Black Level".

I forgot to add that I did force it in Windows! It helped a bit.

Asema
Oct 2, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
Hey as a person who has never had bigger than a 21' dumb tv due to being a dumb idiot who never stayed in one place and lack of actual money that's looking into getting the first "big screen" so I can stop watching movies/netflix on my computer monitor, has the OP been updated?

From the last couple of pages I'm probably going to do a 55' but I don't know what's good or what's not please help

FilthyImp
Sep 30, 2002

Anime Deviant
How much money are you willing to put in?

If you're not moving for a while and think $2k is decent but not going to break your bank then get a C9/Cx and be happy with the best picture around.

If you just want a decent new TV that you can move around a bit, get a TCL and marvel at how Roku somehow beats everyone else's app selection.

Something between the two? The Samsung P Series Quantum X has a really bright panel and good local dimming.

Asema
Oct 2, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
So the LG OLED 55" 2020 is what I was looking at but it's popped up under the Amazon's choice ordeal and I wanted to make sure it's actually pretty good. What's the difference between OLED and OLED-CX though?

1500-2000 is the range I've put away for this tv, and then I've been told that I should get a soundbar which I have no experience with either. I'm a dumb baby.

beep by grandpa
May 5, 2004

Asema posted:

So the LG OLED 55" 2020 is what I was looking at but it's popped up under the Amazon's choice ordeal and I wanted to make sure it's actually pretty good. What's the difference between OLED and OLED-CX though?

1500-2000 is the range I've put away for this tv, and then I've been told that I should get a soundbar which I have no experience with either. I'm a dumb baby.

Read this whole page starting from the top of this page to your post as I went over some of the key details showcasing the difference. Long story short you're probably better off with the C9 (2019) model

Asema
Oct 2, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

beep by grandpa posted:

Read this whole page starting from the top of this page to your post as I went over some of the key details showcasing the difference. Long story short you're probably better off with the C9 (2019) model

I know this is a different sort of conversation but what's the big comparison between the B9 and C9? I'm being thrown a lot of suggestions and not really a lot of explanation (outside of this thread, thank you friends for typing this all up and explaining)

FilthyImp
Sep 30, 2002

Anime Deviant

Asema posted:

I know this is a different sort of conversation but what's the big comparison between the B9 and C9?
C9 has a second gen processor. So it may get a little longer shelf life because of that. You likely won't see a difference now, however. But it's possible some theoretical implementation of *something* in 3 years won't make it to the B9 because of the older processor.

The Cx has a slighly less capable HDMI 2.1 implementation but that doesn't really mean much now. All can do variable refresh rate, which is likely something for the next gaming gen.

In practice it's like saying "Do I want the Tesla (B9), Tesla with dual motors (C9) or the Tesla with Long Range that maybe will do superdrive better (Cx)."

Asema posted:

I wanted to make sure it's actually pretty good.
It's that good. I went from a 3 year old Samsung 55" to a lightly used B9 65" and the OLED's HDR alone makes it worthwhile.

My wife was giving me poo poo about getting a bigger TV we didn't need and once she sat down to watch Coco she was sold. And she is not a tech person by any means.

The only thing *maybe* missing from making this a 100 is that it doesnt have the bleeding edge implementation of Digital OTA that's being phased in and probably won't be used or seen for 5 years. And it has some judder during scenes with panning motion.
The big drawback to OLED is the potential for burn-in if you do nothing but watch FOX news all day or spend 18 hours straight in a game with static menus for weeks at a time. It does include software tricks to mitigate that damage, but it's a possibility. The OLED components will also degrade a bit over time so that means by year 8 it'll be dimmer or the color won't be as uniform.

Basically the TV hits perfect black levels, which means the picture is really loving rich. It doesn't have the brightness of something like the Quantum X, but I havent really found I've needed it. The app selection does leave some to be desired (Roku blows it completely out of the water).

Sound bar wise, it's up to your budget and preferences. Some people prefer a good 2.1 or 3.1 receiver/speaker system. Some are fine with a 2.0 sound bar, and others need the Atmos-enabled 7.1.2 systems to feel complete. If you do get a bar, I would say get something with a subwoofer. Because those LFE's are the things that make the biggest difference to home viewing.

FilthyImp fucked around with this message at 23:42 on Jun 1, 2020

Asema
Oct 2, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
I guess this is my big next question, are protection plans still a loving scam or should I get one lmao


anyway I got the C9 2019, so now I gotta look into a soundbar and I should be good for moving into this new house, please help

Asema fucked around with this message at 06:19 on Jun 2, 2020

Taima
Dec 31, 2006

tfw you're peeing next to someone in the lineup and they don't know

Paul MaudDib posted:

is c9 inventory really going to last all the way to black friday?

(I guess it's lasted this long and that still surprises me... guess it's the rona.)

No way to know I guess but there have been no supply issues so far.

Historically, the previous year’s OLED lasts until at least the black friday the following year, generally speaking. I wouldn’t be super surprised to see C9s into Q1 2021. That being said, the new OLED is especially weak this year, so maybe people would snap them up more than usual. I think you would generally be pretty safe waiting though.

Residency Evil
Jul 28, 2003

4/5 godo... Schumi

FilthyImp posted:

Basically the TV hits perfect black levels, which means the picture is really loving rich. It doesn't have the brightness of something like the Quantum X, but I havent really found I've needed it. The app selection does leave some to be desired (Roku blows it completely out of the water).

This is mind blowing: sometimes I think my TV has turned off in between scenes.

Josh Lyman
May 24, 2009


Josh Lyman posted:

I ordered this and unfortunately, even though it's well designed, it only raised my TV by 3" and I need 5" to clear my center speaker.

I then ordered this one: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B078MBL6KM/ which would just barely give me the 5" clearance but my shipment was missing some of the sticky pads so I'm returning it, but it's also poorly designed because the vertical leg and the horizontal foot don't quite align (it's a design defect, not a manufacturing one) which means the edge digs into your media console.

The stands that have a single central post aren't tall enough. There are a couple 2 leg stands that I think would be tall enough but they're $20 more, but I feel like I don't have any other options. :smith:

This: https://www.amazon.com/Atlantic-Universal-Adjustable-Heavy-Table/dp/B01N1HXPVI/ or this: https://www.amazon.com/TechOrbits-Universal-TV-Stand-Adjustable/dp/B08112HP12/

e: Got the first one because the second one, despite having a more elegant design, it appears only the bottom 2 VESA mounting points would be supporting the weight of the TV instead of all 4. Also the shiny silver ends on the feet would be distracting.
The stand came in but this just looks so imposing. I’d almost rather just use the original stand legs and just put them on blocks or something to elevate them by 5.5”.

Josh Lyman fucked around with this message at 15:31 on Jun 2, 2020

EL BROMANCE
Jun 10, 2006

COWABUNGA DUDES!
🥷🐢😬



Why don’t you just mount the speaker above the TV?

Taima
Dec 31, 2006

tfw you're peeing next to someone in the lineup and they don't know

FilthyImp posted:

In practice it's like saying "Do I want the Tesla (B9), Tesla with dual motors (C9) or the Tesla with Long Range that maybe will do superdrive better (Cx)."

This analogy is... not good. And not that it matters but I don't think Tesla Superdrive is a thing that exists.

Bottom line, there's basically no reason to buy a CX right now unless you want the smaller 48 inch form factor, or potentially if you spend all day watching low bitrate content (in which case it would be pretty weird to buy an OLED, so I'm ready to call that a wash).

The B9 is frankly extremely close to the C9 but has a bit slower processor/somewhat less RAM/ materials are a bit lower quality. I would argue that TONS of people are actually great candidates for the B9.

The main reason you don't see wider recommendation of the B9 is that OLEDs are expensive enough that most people affording them will spend a couple notes to get the upgraded version. Objectively, the vast majority of people would struggle to tell the difference in real world. And there are major outlets like RTings who have been saying for a while that the B9 is the better pick overall value-wise.

As OLEDs continue to inch downward in price (especially in the next few years as Samsung steamrolls into the market) the lower-end implementations of the tech will become more popular, because again, the main thing propping up the higher end models is effectively just that the people buying them want the best and aren't particularly price sensitive as an overall market. That will change (and is currently changing) as more people get into the tech.


FilthyImp posted:

The big drawback to OLED is the potential for burn-in if you do nothing but watch FOX news all day or spend 18 hours straight in a game with static menus for weeks at a time.

Burn in tech on current gen OLEDs including the 9 series is so good that it's becoming borderline impossible to get burn in. In fact you can find almost no reports of it happening, even in C9 store units displaying the same content for thousands of hours.

The only real exception is using an OLED as your primary computer monitor, but frankly, that's probably fine too unless you're just sitting in Excel spreadsheets 24/7.


Residency Evil posted:

This is mind blowing: sometimes I think my TV has turned off in between scenes.

Sure, I mean it has. The pixels literally turn off. I agree that it's very great.

Taima fucked around with this message at 18:21 on Jun 2, 2020

Asema
Oct 2, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Taima posted:

The main reason you don't see wider recommendation of the B9 is that OLEDs are expensive enough that most people affording them will spend a couple notes to get the upgraded version.

This is what I did! I was literally like "ey it's not that much more expensive' lmao

I was told to get this soundbar, and wanted to run by you nerds because I am again a baby who knows nothing: https://www.amazon.com/Polk-Audio-Ultra-Slim-Universal-Subwoofer/dp/B07H1B3PY9

Fedule
Mar 27, 2010


No one left uncured.
I got you.
Oh man. Learning that I was wrong about HDMI 2.1, VRR and the C9/X has messed me right up.

I was holding out. I've got a plan. I was gonna get a CX during Black Friday, after getting a PS5, and probably also after moving house.

Now I learn that after all this time the C9 is not only on par but actively superior (in a way that I would definitely care about), and cheaper, and probably not on shelves for a whole lot longer...

...I don't like being in this position at all.

Josh Lyman
May 24, 2009


EL BROMANCE posted:

Why don’t you just mount the speaker above the TV?
Mount the center speaker to the wall? Given the positioning, wouldn’t I need some kind of articulating arm that would look even worse.

If nobody else thinks it looks imposing, I can get over it.

GreenNight
Feb 19, 2006
Turning the light on the darkest places, you and I know we got to face this now. We got to face this now.

Josh Lyman posted:

Mount the center speaker to the wall? Given the positioning, wouldn’t I need some kind of articulating arm that would look even worse.

If nobody else thinks it looks imposing, I can get over it.

I think it looks fine. If you don't get over it, maybe upgrade to a 77" :D

Tricky Ed
Aug 18, 2010

It is important to avoid confusion. This is the one that's okay to lick.


Fedule posted:

Oh man. Learning that I was wrong about HDMI 2.1, VRR and the C9/X has messed me right up.

I was holding out. I've got a plan. I was gonna get a CX during Black Friday, after getting a PS5, and probably also after moving house.

Now I learn that after all this time the C9 is not only on par but actively superior (in a way that I would definitely care about), and cheaper, and probably not on shelves for a whole lot longer...

...I don't like being in this position at all.

The thing is that there are no 12 bit HDR 120Hz 4k sources that currently exist to use up all that 48GBps of bandwidth the C9 has. It's also important to note that the screen on both models "only" displays 10 bit HDR, which both models' ports can support at 120Hz 4k. It's all theoretical at this point and there's nothing out there a consumer (or reviewer) can plug in to both tvs to try to see the difference.

It might be a Problem! It might not! We're all guessing here.

BonoMan
Feb 20, 2002

Jade Ear Joe

Josh Lyman posted:

The stand came in but this just looks so imposing. I’d almost rather just use the original stand legs and just put them on blocks or something to elevate them by 5.5”.



lol this thing looks like it just activated and is a few seconds from hopping off the credenza and killing you

bull3964
Nov 18, 2000

DO YOU HEAR THAT? THAT'S THE SOUND OF ME PATTING MYSELF ON THE BACK.


I think your problem is you bought too small a TV for the space/furniture :D.

GreenNight
Feb 19, 2006
Turning the light on the darkest places, you and I know we got to face this now. We got to face this now.

That's why I said he needs a 77"

Josh Lyman
May 24, 2009


bull3964 posted:

I think your problem is you bought too small a TV for the space/furniture :D.
That’s a 65” if you can believe it.

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Grim Up North
Dec 12, 2011

Josh Lyman posted:

If nobody else thinks it looks imposing, I can get over it.

I'm gonna say it op: It looks terrible.

Can't you stuff the speaker into that insanely wide credenza?

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