|
G-III posted:The thing that pisses me off the most about the sequel trilogy is how brightly Boyega shined in TFA only to be sidelined into an almost joke of a character for the TLJ and RoS. Such wasted potential. He's sidelined into a joke character half an hour into TFA
|
#
?
Jun 4, 2020 18:33
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 19, 2024 13:07 |
|
|
Cant imagine why this got scrapped
|
|
#
?
Jun 4, 2020 19:02
|
|
|
He’s an engaging actor, but Finn was kind of a wasted character out of the gate. Why set him up as a defected Stormtrooper but then basically characterize him as a 12 year old boy?
General Dog fucked around with this message at 19:20 on Jun 4, 2020 |
|
#
?
Jun 4, 2020 19:18
|
|
|
punishedkissinger posted:Also, why would Amidala signing a piece of paper make an invasion legal? What is going on with the Galactic Republic here? The treaty says that it's okay for the Trade Federation to basically take control of the planet and its government. The treaty would have to be ratified in the Senate, and Nute Gunray believes Darth Sidious has enough influence over the Senate to do what he says when he says "I will make it legal."
|
|
#
?
Jun 4, 2020 19:40
|
|
|
Ingmar terdman posted:Cant imagine why this got scrapped “Putting Rose on-screen again? No can do” - some producer, probably
|
|
#
?
Jun 4, 2020 19:52
|
|
|
General Dog posted:He’s an engaging actor, but Finn was kind of a wasted character out of the gate. Why set him up as a defected Stormtrooper but then basically characterize him as a 12 year old boy? It tracks that someone abducted as a child (toddler?) and indoctrinated to be a Stormtrooper for his entire life would be a little stunted as far as social development and what not but as others have pointed out they discard any sort of ethical quandaries or internal conflicts Finn should've had in order to turn him into a sympathetic protagonist. Aside from his expositionary dialogue about First Order weapons or whatever he basically never references it and no one questions that a Stormtrooper would 100% reject all of his training and beliefs basically overnight. If the explanation is "the Force did it", well they obviously don't go anywhere with that. Just a waste of what could've been a cool storyline, some interesting character development, and a talented young actor.
|
|
#
?
Jun 4, 2020 22:27
|
|
|
There's also the fact that every stormtrooper could be another Finn, which none of the movies do anything with(except the episode 9 ex-stormtroopers who already left the First Order). Episode 8 seemed like it at least wanted to (I heard there was supposed to be a stormtrooper rebellion sub-plot that got Moused out) but in the others everyone including Finn is like mowing down stormtroopers with a machine gun and poo poo
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2020 00:12
|
|
|
Speaking of (maybe not as much) unrealized potential: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iv9B1T33i4w I feel like I was aware of this as something in development in the past but I had no idea the whole series was made. Interesting that George buried it apparently for the sake of new creators but holy poo poo imagine if we got figures based on this instead of more loving Funko Pops.
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2020 00:21
|
|
|
2house2fly posted:There's also the fact that every stormtrooper could be another Finn, which none of the movies do anything with(except the episode 9 ex-stormtroopers who already left the First Order). Episode 8 seemed like it at least wanted to (I heard there was supposed to be a stormtrooper rebellion sub-plot that got Moused out) but in the others everyone including Finn is like mowing down stormtroopers with a machine gun and poo poo Yeah the original Finn/Phasma fight had him convincing the troopers under her command to turn against her. There's also a really weird deleted scene where a stormtrooper, played by Tom Hardy doing a ridiculous southern accent, recognizes Finn while they're infiltrating Snoke's ship and he realizes that the First Order has covered up the fact he defected. Also Tom Hardy slaps him on the rear end because Rian Johnson. OctoberCountry fucked around with this message at 00:28 on Jun 5, 2020 |
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2020 00:25
|
|
|
Bongo Bill posted:The treaty says that it's okay for the Trade Federation to basically take control of the planet and its government. The treaty would have to be ratified in the Senate, and Nute Gunray believes Darth Sidious has enough influence over the Senate to do what he says when he says "I will make it legal."
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2020 02:11
|
|
|
Cheesus posted:Was that Palpatine's original move? To speak up against ratifying the treaty signed under obvious duress by his own home planet and be the one calling for a vote of no confidence against Valorum? I interpret him as just improvising a lot. Even just talking with Gunray, when he gets bad news, he says things like "This may work to our advantage." Because Naboo is his own planet, he can see both sides' hands and choose the play that will work out best for him. The general shape of the plot is fixed, however: goad the Trade Federation into threatening the peace and getting away with it, so that the people of the Republic have an enemy and don't trust their leaders to handle it, all the while preventing them from being actually defeated. In an environment like that, the galaxy will just keep getting full of anger and hatred, which he believes he will create abundant opportunities for him to exploit.
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2020 02:43
|
|
|
Bongo Bill posted:I interpret him as just improvising a lot. Even just talking with Gunray, when he gets bad news, he says things like "This may work to our advantage." Because Naboo is his own planet, he can see both sides' hands and choose the play that will work out best for him. The general shape of the plot is fixed, however: goad the Trade Federation into threatening the peace and getting away with it, so that the people of the Republic have an enemy and don't trust their leaders to handle it, all the while preventing them from being actually defeated. In an environment like that, the galaxy will just keep getting full of anger and hatred, which he believes he will create abundant opportunities for him to exploit. it's like he belives in a mysterious force that has the ability to guide and shape destiny, and that he can manipulate it to benefit his side in a conflict
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2020 10:06
|
|
|
OctoberCountry posted:Yeah the original Finn/Phasma fight had him convincing the troopers under her command to turn against her. One of the most annoying things in the films is that in both TLJ and RoS, Finn has to board a First Order ship, and it's never relevant to the plot that he used to be part of them. Like, I'm not even asking for a full Stormtrooper rebellion plot, or him dealing with the trauma of returning to the place where he was abused - just something that indicates the writers remembered what his back-story's meant to be, have him know his way around or use an access code or something! Hell, have a scene like in ANH where they have to bluff their way through a situation, only because Finn actually knows First Order procedure, he can actually pull it off!
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2020 10:43
|
|
|
Angry Salami posted:One of the most annoying things in the films is that in both TLJ and RoS, Finn has to board a First Order ship, and it's never relevant to the plot that he used to be part of them. Like, I'm not even asking for a full Stormtrooper rebellion plot, or him dealing with the trauma of returning to the place where he was abused - just something that indicates the writers remembered what his back-story's meant to be, have him know his way around or use an access code or something! Why establish stakes or character traits when the heroes can just get on the Star Destroyer with an awesome special collector's coin (available for purchase at Disney's Star Wars: Galaxy's Edge) that you only just introduced in the previous scene?
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2020 12:56
|
|
|
Totally forgot about the admiral's magic coin. One of the many five minute mini-plots The one thing I'll hand to ROS is the two location lightsaber duel, which of course was building off of the force skype from TLJ. The choreography is kinda whatever but it reminds me of the Brackett draft of the cave vision where Vader shows Luke the galaxy and is pulling stars out of the sky and stuff
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2020 17:01
|
|
|
Ingmar terdman posted:Totally forgot about the admiral's magic coin. One of the many five minute mini-plots Yeah the fight was hampered a bit by the fact that while it’s visually arresting to be teleporting back and forth, they’re not really interacting with either environment. Being in two places at once has limitless choreographic possibilities and they whiffed on it
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2020 19:40
|
|
|
Might be a stretch but rey being in kylo's bedroom seemed like the beginnings of an idea, and it being shiny and white and not spooky seemed like some kind of idea as well. Love scraping the bottom of the barrel to posit whether a movie is trying to say anything
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2020 20:09
|
|
|
Angry Salami posted:One of the most annoying things in the films is that in both TLJ and RoS, Finn has to board a First Order ship, and it's never relevant to the plot that he used to be part of them. Like, I'm not even asking for a full Stormtrooper rebellion plot, or him dealing with the trauma of returning to the place where he was abused - just something that indicates the writers remembered what his back-story's meant to be, have him know his way around or use an access code or something! In TLJ boarding the First Order ship is Finn's idea, specifically because he used to work on it and can find his way around
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2020 21:28
|
|
|
Remember in TFA when it was revealed Finn was just a janitor.
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2020 21:59
|
|
|
So what the gently caress is Project Maverick really and when can I play X-Wing Alliance 2?
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 04:44
|
|
|
CelticPredator posted:Remember in TFA when it was revealed Finn was just a janitor. Janitor to death squad commando seems like an odd career path, but I guess it does explain the general ineptitude of stormtroopers...
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 05:15
|
|
|
I don't know how or why I know this but IIRC Yoda ran to Dagobah because he already knew that Dark Side cave-tree was there and its powerful Dark Side emanations would allow him to hide from the Sith's Force senses. I might be wrong. One thing I do know for sure is that the little snake that came with the original toy Yoda was dope as gently caress, and when someone was trapped in the little quicksand pit on the Dagobah playset you did NOT want to see that snake crawling towards you.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2020 18:15
|
|
|
JonathonSpectre posted:I don't know how or why I know this but IIRC Yoda ran to Dagobah because he already knew that Dark Side cave-tree was there and its powerful Dark Side emanations would allow him to hide from the Sith's Force senses. I might be wrong. Not just the tree, the whole planet was strong in the Dark Side (whatever that means) and could mask him. The tree was just one place it collected.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 00:59
|
|
|
JonathonSpectre posted:I don't know how or why I know this but IIRC Yoda ran to Dagobah because he already knew that Dark Side cave-tree was there and its powerful Dark Side emanations would allow him to hide from the Sith's Force senses. I might be wrong. That was old EU, current canon, he was drawn there (with R2!) and talked to Liam Neeson so I guess he decided to go back: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7ra7GebAks
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 02:10
|
|
|
I figured he wanted to immerse himself in The Living Force so he went somewhere wild and untamed. Also somewhere so dense with life is a good hiding place, but he only needs a hiding place because he couldn't either defeat Palpatine or die trying, because he'd hosed up and couldn't stand for anything. Get back to your roots in the swamp and purge The Man from your soul
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 04:33
|
|
|
Yeah, it was old canon (Originally written in the Thrawn Trilogy, Heir to the Empire) that Yoda went to Dagobah because it was strong in the Dark Side, and could mask his presence. I think the book also stipulated there was a Dark Jedi that Yoda defeated. Luke actually goes back to Dagobah in that book and finds an artifact of said Dark Jedi, but I can't remember what it does. The Clone Wars as hinted in the Thrawn Trilogy still seem more interesting than what we got.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 15:45
|
|
|
Crazy Joe Wilson posted:Yeah, it was old canon (Originally written in the Thrawn Trilogy, Heir to the Empire) that Yoda went to Dagobah because it was strong in the Dark Side, and could mask his presence. I think the book also stipulated there was a Dark Jedi that Yoda defeated. Luke actually goes back to Dagobah in that book and finds an artifact of said Dark Jedi, but I can't remember what it does. It turned out to just be a remote control for a spaceship. A crimelord tried to hold up Yoda with his spaceship, failed and then retired to join weird space monks.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2020 23:25
|
|
|
J_RBG posted:The dead gently caress!
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2020 00:34
|
|
|
I just figured it was his home planet
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2020 00:45
|
|
|
Crazy Joe Wilson posted:The Clone Wars as hinted in the Thrawn Trilogy still seem more interesting than what we got. Not really. And random force negating slugs break the setting far more than midichlorians or hyperspace ramming.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2020 02:42
|
|
|
punishedkissinger posted:Is Harrison Ford like a huge rear end in a top hat or something? He just seems so uninterested in being in a major motion picture throughout the entire series, but especially in Jedi. look at this terrible opinion. it belongs in a museum edit: he was that way in Jedi because he was written to be that way. his character served like no purpose beyond being saved. edit 2: cue SMG stumbling through the door, adderall powder still on his nostrils: "THAT'S NOT TRUE HE EMBODIES SEXUAL REPRESSION AND THE PINNACLE OF FREUD'S THEORIES ON---" (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST) Grandpa Palpatine fucked around with this message at 00:29 on Jun 12, 2020 |
|
#
?
Jun 12, 2020 00:27
|
|
|
It's been said before but by the time you get to the end of Empire the only thing that really matters is Luke and Vader. Their issues are just too cosmic and they are off in their own zone to even have the rest of the cast matter, so they are all sent on hikes in the woods Han's good in a skirmish and good at talking himself out of situations but when they are connected with the bulk of the rebel forces he's basically just another face in the crowd In a horrible, horrible camouflage duster
|
|
#
?
Jun 12, 2020 02:13
|
|
|
Grandpa Palpatine posted:look at this terrible opinion. I just wanna be clear, I was sincerely asking and not just saying he was an rear end in a top hat. It sounds like he isn't from the responses I got.
|
|
#
?
Jun 12, 2020 02:24
|
|
|
Crossposting from the Sci fi wi fi thread My partner and I saw ROS a few weeks ago, and he really liked it, to my surprise, and vastly preferred it to TLJ. He thinks RJ really hosed up the narrative direction of the series and if the ideas and plot threads in ROS had been given more time to grow the end result would have been a lot more harmonious. He's the kind of guy that views films as a part of a greater extended universe, and is fine with important details relevant to the plot or story being lodged in a comic book or video game somewhere There's certainly a bit to unpack there. IMO, as individual movies in a vacuum, despite being a terrible film TLJ is the best of the ST by dint of trying to not be derivative of Star Wars, and aspiring to create something original, even if hamfistedly and ineptly. But I think having two directors with opposite takes on SW really hurt the overall...call it narrative cohesion, of the trilogy. JJ was clearly not interested in recreating the wheel. He wanted, for lack of a better phrase, a theme park experience. Come watch the new generation of rebels fight the empire, full of lightsabers and nostalgia, look, the millenial falcon, isn't that cool?! RJ wanted to make an actual movie, and welp, turns out those two approaches didn't mesh. It certainly didn't help that RJ relegated Finn to a glorified extra and got rid of JJs mystery boxes (that presumably were meant to have a payoff of some sort that now never happened). Either commit to the theme park experience, or try and do something original with the setting, don't half rear end that poo poo. There's a lot that can be said for the various ways the three ST films suck, but if they'd written out some sort of direction or plan it would have gone a long way to smoothing out the uneven experience of the ST. Not to absolve JJ in any way, his movie was a whole different kind of mess, especially the Luke plot. I do wonder though, how much executive meddling there was. Finns role becoming smaller and less important each film almost surely feels like such a decision.
|
|
#
?
Jun 12, 2020 03:09
|
|
|
Ford, like Guinness, didn't particularly like the character or role. He isn't trying post-esb
|
|
#
?
Jun 12, 2020 03:11
|
|
|
I don't think it's a good idea to put plot elements in a film whose only purpose is for someone else to make them interesting later. Given that Snoke in episode 7 is a yelling hologram which Domhnall Gleeson tells the plot to, episode 8 cutting him in half so the actually interesting character can be the baddie is a fine payoff
|
|
#
?
Jun 12, 2020 03:30
|
|
|
2house2fly posted:I don't think it's a good idea to put plot elements in a film whose only purpose is for someone else to make them interesting later. Given that Snoke in episode 7 is a yelling hologram which Domhnall Gleeson tells the plot to, episode 8 cutting him in half so the actually interesting character can be the baddie is a fine payoff Now see, I partially agree with you, but then the payoff in ep 9 is that they bring back palpatine (somehow) instead to replace him. Like, the setup in TFA is terrible, but tossing all that setup out meant they had to walk it all back in ep 9, because they wanted a nice theme park experience and having it finish with the noble knight(s) climactict showdown against the evil wizard doesn't get any more theme parky
|
|
#
?
Jun 12, 2020 03:39
|
|
|
If you took me aside in 2017 after seeing Last Jedi and asked me to predict one thing about the next movie, it would be that Kylo Ren has scenes where Luke’s ghost speaks with him. It’s the the one very clear sequel setup in Last Jedi, and after all, Kylo has no one else left to talk to. Add that to the fact that their grudge is still unresolved and that Luke really still has some explaining to do, and it seems like a no-brainer. But instead RoS ignores that handoff, and the only person Kylo has to talk to is Rey via Force Skype, even though Last Jedi pretty explicitly shows Rey willfully shutting him out.
|
|
#
?
Jun 12, 2020 04:05
|
|
|
*After thinking deeply about star wars on a mountaintop for 100 years* They hosed up
|
|
#
?
Jun 12, 2020 04:12
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 19, 2024 13:07 |
|
|
just watch gundam instead chars counter attack is basically what rise of skywalker should have been
|
|
#
?
Jun 12, 2020 04:51
|
|
