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Base damage is subject to strength and skill multipliers so it should be valued more than enchantment bonuses, and more valued if you have high strength and high weapon and fighting skills. Learndb has this under slaying heuristic:quote:+2 enchantment is roughly +1 base damage for a 2h weapon, +3 enchantment is roughly +2 base damage for a 1h weapon. (The difference is because you'll have more weapon skill if you're using a two hander.)
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Jun 16, 2020 06:09
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Only glowing/runed weapons can have a +/- Just in case that got missed in all the other discussion. If the weapon isn't blue (magic) or bright white (artefact), then there's no need to check it for bonuses.
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Jun 16, 2020 13:10
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Pakistani Brad Pitt posted:Are there situations where auto-explore is flat out unsafe? all exploring is dangerous I hate this drat game so much add this to your rc file: explore_auto_rest = true rest_wait_percent = 80 also, try to get in the habit of holding shift when manually exploring - its annoying at first, but it will save lives Charun fucked around with this message at 17:02 on Jun 16, 2020 |
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Jun 16, 2020 16:46
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Charun posted:rest_wait_percent = 80 kaschei posted:Base damage is subject to strength and skill multipliers so it should be valued more than enchantment bonuses, and more valued if you have high strength and high weapon and fighting skills. Learndb has this under slaying heuristic: bees x1000 fucked around with this message at 17:34 on Jun 16, 2020 |
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Jun 16, 2020 17:10
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bees x1000 posted:explore_delay = -1 alias O to F1 so you can play one handed add this to o-tab conjurers: automagic_enable = true automagic_fight = true
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Jun 16, 2020 17:11
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bees x1000 posted:why are damage calculation still so drat obtuse in this game? version .25 and counting and it remains impossible for newbies to weigh the difference between two weapons. Honestly, the game really could use an Angband style damage calculator when you look at a weapon. You know, something like "In your hands, this weapon will deal X damage. With +Y Strength, you would instead deal Z damage." That sort of thing.
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Jun 16, 2020 17:32
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Speleothing posted:Only glowing/runed weapons can have a +/- Thanks, this is all I was looking for, I'm still at that noob stage of just grokking the rules.
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Jun 16, 2020 17:42
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bees x1000 posted:what does this do? rests you up to 80% health before exploring. you can make it 100 if you want to play safe, but its a lil wasteful on food
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Jun 16, 2020 19:33
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bees x1000 posted:why are damage calculations still so drat obtuse in this game? version .25 and counting and it remains impossible for newbies to weigh the difference between two weapons. I'm still confused about damage calcs - like, when does a rapier out stab a dagger? Should I keep training a skill after I hit min delay? When, if at all, should I switch to long blades? Should I bother with quick blades if I'm mostly stabbing?
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Jun 16, 2020 19:47
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Stabbing is a whole different beast, but let's go through these points.
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Jun 16, 2020 20:18
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Arzaac posted:Pain brand also kind of works this way, but the flat damage is heavily influenced by your necromancy skill so it's typically not as useful.
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Jun 16, 2020 20:30
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Huh, I've never done that but I guess it makes sense. Necromancy is a pretty good spell school too, so it's not like you're wasting experience going down that road either. At any rate, the important thing to keep in mind is that Pain isn't going to be as good as Electrocution until something like 10 Necromancy. And they've got different resistances, so it's honestly nice to have both if you can somehow manage that.
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Jun 16, 2020 20:43
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I’ve never ascended one, because I’m bad at stabbers, and I don’t know how it’d handle Tomb, but it’s fun midgame.
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Jun 16, 2020 21:00
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I like training weapons a few levels beyond mindelay in case of drainage
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Jun 16, 2020 21:43
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Arzaac posted:Stabbing is a whole different beast, but let's go through these points. Wait, how is stabbing capped at 30 damage? Last time I ascended a stabber I one hit killed many monsters with way more than 30 hp and took out about 2/3 of Gloorx Vloq's health bar
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Jun 16, 2020 21:48
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SirSamVimes posted:Wait, how is stabbing capped at 30 damage? Last time I ascended a stabber I one hit killed many monsters with way more than 30 hp and took out about 2/3 of Gloorx Vloq's health bar This definitely seems fishy. I've one-shot the Royal Jelly before with a stab, which by the way if you haven't done it, is extremely hilarious.
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Jun 16, 2020 21:53
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That's because it's not just the damage bonus. The damage bonus is something calculated only for short blades, and is capped at 30. This is then followed by a stabbing multiplier, which is why stabbing damage gets so ludicrous. Hitting a paralyzed enemy while you're at max Stealth/Short blades can result in a 1102.5% damage bonus. The bonus, as far as I can tell, is mostly there to ensure Short Blades are actually better at stabbing than the other weapon types.
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Jun 16, 2020 23:27
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I've 'stabbed' Cerebov with the dark maul before. That was funny.
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Jun 16, 2020 23:35
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Short blades get a flat damage bonus to stabs that caps at 30, which is then multiplied by the stabbing multiplier. The flat bonus is one of the very few things in the game that’s not random, which is why tier 1 stabs are a guaranteed one-hit kill against anything at high levels. If stabs only used your weapons base damage and applied a multiplier, you could still roll a 1 for damage, and barely scratch your enemy. Stabbing is more complicated than other play styles. And it’s deceptive for new players. The assassin class, for example, is not a stabber. You need spells to back you up and let you disable targets. Enchanter is the archetypal stabber, though other classes can branch into it fairly early (particularly earth elementalist).
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Jun 17, 2020 02:41
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Thanks for all this info! I'm not really into the brute fighter so I started stabbing with an octo + Dith as I liked the idea of being a tentacle monster emerging from the shadows, but got a bit frustrated, so I tried a mage instead and found myself tending towards stabbing anyway. Now I'm playing spriggan enchanter with the Wu Jing and it's awesome. Nothing can touch me unless I let it, and then I die.
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Jun 17, 2020 07:20
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quote:I started stabbing with an octo + Dith as I liked the idea of being a tentacle monster emerging from the shadows
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Jun 17, 2020 07:25
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One of the best races for stabbing is Vinestalkers, because they benefit a lot more from fast attacking weapons due to their antimagic bite. Every time they attack, they have a chance of biting the target. This applies antimagic effects and restores mana, and they also have spirit shield innately. Between this and their obscene health regeneration, Vine Stalkers are extremely difficult to kill. If they they have a Quickblade and access to Haste, they can attack every 0.2 AUT, each time having a chance to proc their bite and restore magic that is used as a shield.
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Jun 17, 2020 07:28
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SirSamVimes posted:One of the best races for stabbing is Vinestalkers, because they benefit a lot more from fast attacking weapons due to their antimagic bite. They look cool. I might try them once I get a bit better at the game - I'm still relying heavily on the ability to just run away from anything dangerous
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Jun 17, 2020 07:57
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Vinestalkers are one of the best races but definitely tricky if you don't lean into their perks and know ways to get around their lack of device healing.
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Jun 17, 2020 08:10
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The Vine Stalker answer is never be a blaster mage and always be worshipping Ru.
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Jun 17, 2020 16:09
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bees x1000 posted:The Vine Stalker answer is never be a blaster mage and always be worshipping but really, so should everyone
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Jun 17, 2020 16:11
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*laughs in gozag*
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Jun 17, 2020 16:19
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I'm going to do a vine stalker as my next character. Been a long time and as much as I love playing Abominations it is time for a switcheroo.
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Jun 17, 2020 19:32
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I enjoy going VsBe to get a pile of quick blades early on, and then transitioning to Zin for the end game.
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Jun 17, 2020 20:50
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my preferred VS loadout is demon whip + shield + midweight armor.
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Jun 17, 2020 21:02
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Decided to give .25 a shot, wanted to feel out the current state of evoking. HuAr. Decided to worship Hep, bad idea: boots of running meant my dude could never keep up and he didn't often survive the tremorstone spam. https://crawl.kelbi.org/crawl/morgue/beesx1000/morgue-beesx1000-20200618-002820.txt got some good drops, was facerolling the bottom of vaults when quote:46658 | Vaults:5 | Paralysed by a sphinx for 7 turns
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Jun 18, 2020 01:45
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Secret follower tip: ctrl-e makes autotravel pace itself to your slowest follower. Useful for yred, hep, beogh, and more! Note this doesn't apply to manual movement, so runboots/etc aren't a waste.
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Jun 18, 2020 05:24
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Something I always thought was cool about the original Crawl were the races that changed the rules of gameplay in a substantial manner, such as ghouls which didn't starve but could rot and mummies which traded the ability to drink potions for the ability to eventually grind to maximum level in every skill due to having no food clock (back when that was a real hindrance and mattered.) Gooncrawl has been pretty good about including things like that, like the Djinn which joins MP and HP into a single shared thing, but maybe we could have more? I would invite everyone to give suggestions, just throw things at the wall and see what sticks. Something that I have been thinking about is a race which doesn't level up, but instead has an ability to permanently gain single points of maximum HP or a randomly chosen stat on killing an enemy. It would take some fiddling with the proc rates to make this work out to about the same-ish power level that other races reach by endgame, but I think it would be possible to make that work.
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Jun 18, 2020 06:24
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Sil did something similar; a bunch of veteran players did self-challenges, and one guy modded the starting xp to something huge but made everything drop 0x afterwards. So like you start at clvl15 and can assign your xp from there, but that's it - you're done, you have to scavenge from the floor and use your wits to clear zot. Allows for some interesting builds (or it did in Sil, at least) as the early game is irrelevant and you can jump strait to hyper specialized builds that you can't normally build into, eg all xp into invo+evocations.
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Jun 18, 2020 06:50
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I think an options screen which exposes the rc options (or at least a template rc file) would be a helpful feature for newbies Also, can someone give me tips to deal with the animated weapons in elf? They're immune to all my enchantments, hit me pretty hard, and are stupid fast. At the moment, I'm just spending all my wands on them.
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Jun 18, 2020 10:18
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Charun posted:tips to deal with the animated weapons in elf? They're pretty tricky if you're not a pure blaster or pure melee-blender, and I've found that 1) they're often well-worth using some resources on, like evocables or piety, dependent on your situation, and 2) the Hall of Blades in particular is best Left The gently caress Alone unless/until you want to trawl it for a quickblade, lajatang, or exec axe, and if you're not built for pure non-elemental damage output, maybe not even then. At least elves respond to poison and trickery. Granted, I'm especially bad at the parts of the game that matter, but I feel like the HoB threatens me existentially more often than even the end vault does.
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Jun 18, 2020 11:01
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Sounds like you're an enchanter; I don't think they see invis so that's a good option for stabbing or facetanking. Other options include burning consumables as you're doing, or just not clearing the minibranch as it's eniterly optional. edit: tukima's dance!
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Jun 18, 2020 11:02
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Yeah, there's really no good way to deal with them other than to have something that can affect them and hits hard and fast enough. As a primary enchanter, you're really just kind of boned there.
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Jun 18, 2020 11:03
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Serephina posted:Sounds like you're an enchanter; I don't think they see invis so that's a good option for stabbing or facetanking. Other options include burning consumables as you're doing, or just not clearing the minibranch as it's eniterly optional. if they're susceptible to tukima I'm gonna  edit- nope, no worky invis should be doable, always forget about that when I don't have an evokeable for it. Thanks! Charun fucked around with this message at 11:24 on Jun 18, 2020 |
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Jun 18, 2020 11:17
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I tend to either get a good long blade or else pick up Iron Shot or a similar spell on my enchanters, and dancing weapons are one of many reasons why. Enchanters need a backup plan for stuff with too much MR to enchant, and it's a good idea for that plan not to be elemental damage since a lot of stuff with ludicrous MR also has a bunch of other resists(and as you get deeper in the dungeon, that stuff also tends to see invisible).
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Jun 18, 2020 21:53
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