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Khanstant posted:What do you mean by depth here? Hard to imagine a system more shallow than turn-based menu combat. Turn-based menu combat can absolutely have depth. See: SMT Of course I'm not exactly looking for SMT combat in my Mario RPGs but y'know
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Jul 17, 2020 17:29
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Amppelix posted:Oh yeah i forgot about this but it makes total sense. A lot easier to immediately dismiss a game when you've never even had a chance to try it. It also looks pretty similar and doesn't fix any of the fundamental flaws at a glance. Didn't like the combat? It's the same. Didn't like the lack of variety in characters or settings? Doesn't look better. Is the writing better? Maybe, but you can't tell that at a glance. Harrow posted:Turn-based menu combat can absolutely have depth. See: SMT honestly I don't think SMT is that deep. Just hit weaknesses and throw out debuffs on anything tough. I don't hate it but I can't think of many JRPGs that are "deep".
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Jul 17, 2020 18:00
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I’m not through the opening part of the prologue yet but the dialogue is absolutely hilarious. On par with TTYD “Is everyone from your kingdom also a face?” 
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Jul 17, 2020 18:14
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Color Splash had a really REALLY lovely opening where it front loaded 90% of the toads in a bland setting. After Morton goes to hell the games quality ramps up greatly. I'm kind of finding the same thing here to a lesser extent. Up to the earth temple I was just flat out unsure if this was going to be any good, but just got to the save outside the water temple boss and yeah I'm kind of loving it? Even if a handful of these puzzles are making my peanut brain pop a little. My biggest complaint would be the fact I'm loving up pretty hard here and there on puzzles and getting womped by enemies- but I never seem to go below max HP. I feel like I just have to spend 100-200 coins on toads and they'll toss me a 50+ heart and give me a step in the right direction if I really need it so my health never really goes anywhere. Compound it with the health accessory acting as soft HP (I have +10, this gives me 10 'armor' to use that recharges every encounter) I'm just kinda... never in danger. I know I can kneecap myself to a certain extent but I think it would be nice to ask the toads to do a specific thing instead of throwing a million health items at me so I can at least see what danger looked like if I used that feature.
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Jul 17, 2020 18:15
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I do like them bringing back the “audience cheering for you, and you can pay them to get a buff” mechanic from TTYD.
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Jul 17, 2020 18:37
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One of the early reviews (Polygon) described the combat as “rediculously punishing”. Are ya’ll finding that to be the case?
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Jul 17, 2020 18:45
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Rock My Socks! posted:One of the early reviews (Polygon) described the combat as “rediculously punishing”. Are ya’ll finding that to be the case? No, that was colour splash.  I wouldn't put much stock into what polygon says.
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Jul 17, 2020 18:58
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Are encounters less frequent since they seem longer? One thing that I can see being grating is spending a minute on a same-y puzzle before every encounter. I'm remembering the other thing that burned Color Splash for me; having to scroll through my cards, fill with paint, drag them up, etc each turn. It got old.
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Jul 17, 2020 19:11
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Something to note is while the first few bosses are easy. They start lasting a fair bit longer as time goes on.
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Jul 17, 2020 19:20
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It's not too old to rag on Polygon for their DOOM preview?
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Jul 17, 2020 19:22
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Color splash fixes plenty of sticker star's flaws though. Like the reason i stopped playing ss was because of the complete lack of guidance on loving anything in the game, and the resulting infuriating puzzle experience. No action command tutorials, no hints for what things to use ever, no hints for where to find things, etc. You regularly run into situations where it's impossible to tell if you're missing the thing you need for a puzzle, or if it's one of the ones you've already found but don't happen to have on hand. Want to get them? Well loving backtrack through the level for the 20th time to pick it up again! Oh, that wasn't the correct one? To bad, you just wasted fifteen minutes of your time and now you'll waste ten more looking for another one. Rinse, repeat, etc. They fixed this entire mess in colour splash. You can just buy things you've already found, and the game actually properly hints at all its puzzles and makes pretty sure you won't be missing anything progress-necessary or backtracking incessantly. Acerbatus posted:I wouldn't put much stock into what polygon says.
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Jul 17, 2020 19:31
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Amppelix posted:Color splash fixes plenty of sticker star's flaws though. However, it does not change the fundamental one. It isn't remotely fun to play.
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Jul 17, 2020 20:06
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Well that's just like your opinion man. I obviously can't change your mind on that but i did take objection the the "didn't fix anything fundamental" statement.
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Jul 17, 2020 20:20
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Rock My Socks! posted:One of the early reviews (Polygon) described the combat as “rediculously punishing”. Are ya’ll finding that to be the case? I kind of touched on this but it's in a weird place right now where you get some puzzles and you feel clever, but every here or there it just *vomits* enemies at seemingly random and with absolutely no guidance Good loving Luck. The thing is the game doesn't want you to die. Bribe the toads to give you a hint on where to start moving the puzzle? They'll throw a 80% full heal your way. Get injured in a long treck through a part of the world? There's benches dotting the land for you to full heal. Then there's the Secret Coffee Shops, or the hearts in boss battles that get you back to full with minimal effort. You get the poo poo absolutely beat out of you sometimes but the game just struggles to punish you for it. As for the question on battle speeds I'd say they're pretty speedy and take like 40 seconds to a minute for me. Early on they're 10 seconds but as it's asking me to move things with 3 turns I've found it taking longer and longer. The only time I groan when getting into a fight is when it's 3 goombas on the overworld and the two don't join in for a Wave Battle (clears all 3 at once) like they should, so I have to return to the overworld each time. They're pretty brisk so far. Also after the Red Streamer the enemies will come pre-jumbled so you no longer see what formations they want you to make. You have to just wing it and craft your own by eye sight.
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Jul 17, 2020 21:09
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One thing I have really enjoyed is the soundtrack, the battle theme in particular!
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Jul 17, 2020 21:26
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Rock My Socks! posted:One of the early reviews (Polygon) described the combat as “rediculously punishing”. Are ya’ll finding that to be the case? I did Game Over, actually from falling in a bottomless pit You are tasked with completing the puzzle round perfectly. But if you fail, you get no attack boost, and combined with an ill-timed action command, all the enemies could survive. And if they're angry spinys, you could lose half your health But when you Game Over, you just get sent back to your last save, which is either a block or back to the entrance of an area. I believe the game is going more for an action/puzzle thing, and they don't want battles to wage on for more than 2 or 3 turns (and if you complete the puzzles correctly, it should be one turn) ThisIsACoolGuy posted:I kind of touched on this but it's in a weird place right now where you get some puzzles and you feel clever, but every here or there it just *vomits* enemies at seemingly random and with absolutely no guidance Good loving Luck. I ask Olivia for a hint, it pauses the whole puzzle 🐱💻
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Jul 17, 2020 21:27
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Olivia is just amazing as the partner
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Jul 17, 2020 22:54
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Can you pause during a battle?
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Jul 17, 2020 23:50
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Rock My Socks! posted:Can you pause during a battle? Asking for a hint essentially achieves this, you can also go Home
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Jul 18, 2020 00:10
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paper mario and the boring game
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Jul 18, 2020 00:14
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I think the battle system is fine as a nice distraction from adventuring and whatnot but god it becomes downright terrible when you have encounter after encounter after encounter. The ninji house is misery incarnate despite being a fun theme. Dozens of battles against Ninji's who counter the hammer, so it's just making straight lines to jump on the entire time. I was told I missed 3 ninja masters and to try again and gently caress that.
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Jul 18, 2020 00:36
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I’m curious on the consensus here. I found this game mostly charming, but weighed back by the inane decisions to never allow characters unique designs or names and the aversion to RPG elements with little substantial to replace them beyond gimmicks that wear out their welcome. Out of the “modern” series, it’s easily the best, but can we say it could stand close to, say Super Paper Mario?
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Jul 18, 2020 00:52
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Geostomp posted:I’m curious on the consensus here. I found this game mostly charming, but weighed back by the inane decisions to never allow characters unique designs or names and the aversion to RPG elements with little substantial to replace them beyond gimmicks that wear out their welcome. Color Splash kicked Super Paper Mario's rear end, so if this game winds up being just as good or around it it'll be fine I imagine. Right now, to me, it feels like they tried to put back some of the old DNA into color splash and it's not gelling perfectly- but it's still really enjoyable.
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Jul 18, 2020 00:55
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Okay, I'm enjoying the boss battles way more than Sticker Star or Color Splash's so that's a really drastic improvement on that front.Rock My Socks! posted:One of the early reviews (Polygon) described the combat as “rediculously punishing”. Are ya’ll finding that to be the case? Basically if you mess up horribly, you'll be taking a lot of damage, but the game is fairly forgiving, and different degrees of salving the ring puzzles can mitigate how much damage you take. Amppelix posted:I mean that's not a problem at all, it just means they have less health than it would appear. The problem was that you needed the arbitrarily chosen Things for the fights before. That just made the whole thing feel somewhat meaningless even if there was a "real" fight before you got to use it. Yeah, from what I've played so far, it's honestly more of a super solution you can find to drastically shorten the battle, but you can still fight normally. As opposed to Sticker Star turning the battles into slogs and then insulting you if you didn't realize what the solution was, or Color Splash just instakilling you if you missed the boat on when to use the Thing. It's a much better middle ground that rewards good players but doesn't utterly punish people who try to play normally.
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Jul 18, 2020 01:58
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YourHumbleMessiah posted:One thing I have really enjoyed is the soundtrack, the battle theme in particular! I loved CS’ music and they outside themselves here. You’re right about the main battle and event battle themes—I can’t get that wah-wah guitar they use out my head.
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Jul 18, 2020 03:15
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I played CS for the first time last week and really enjoy it, I think I'm close to halfway through. Started OK today and my first impressions are: - It looks fantastic - The battle system is ok, I find it a chore like I did in colour splash and there's zero incentive not to just avoid every enemy encounter you can - The humour/writing seems to be mostly gone, which is a shame because I loved it in CS
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Jul 18, 2020 04:58
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I think confetti's a good incentive to fight battles. Granted, I might be biased because I do want to plug the holes in the scenery up so things look nice, even if I don't have to actually do so to progress... You can get some from scenery and the like but that feels so slow you might as well engage in some sort of puzzle solving system to make it actually feel like a good use of time. (coins are also nice for boss battles but they're definitely way less necessary if you can plan out where you're going to end up, unlike, say, me)
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Jul 18, 2020 05:11
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I didn't think of that, ive rarely run out from the environment and bags being plentiful. I too want to plug every hole
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Jul 18, 2020 05:35
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I never got to play Color Splash due to not owning a WiiU. I'm very much enjoying OK though. I'm a huge fan of exploration so this game is hitting the right notes with areas being large and involved plus having five million toads all around to find. I'm enjoying the more puzzley battle system too though I will echo the popular sentiment that there's needs to be some actual incentive to getting into fights. If they'd went a step or two further with injecting more RPG elements back into the series it would be baller. Even still I'm not too fussed. Also the Red Streamer boss theme loving slaps.
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Jul 18, 2020 05:50
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Finally got to my first battle that made me say aloud “oh, gently caress me...” I’m hopefully going to be a lot better at spatial reasoning by the time this is all over.
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Jul 18, 2020 05:53
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Well that's a first for paper mario in general  Spoilers for after you solve the boat mystery It was corny as hell with the set up but I didn't expect them to just flat out kill off Bobby and have you try to console Olivia about his death. Saying goodbye to his spirit actually made me sad. I'm such a easy mark.
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Jul 18, 2020 09:01
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Counterpoint: Bobby was a lazy poo poo and chasing him down was a pain in the rear end.
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Jul 18, 2020 09:08
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BurgerQuest posted:Counterpoint: Bobby was a lazy poo poo and chasing him down was a pain in the rear end. I mean, he did a TON of fighting for me so I found him helpful. He was a nice bomb to hang with  .
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Jul 18, 2020 09:09
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Olivia seems a first for a Mario advice partner in that she actually seems to be kind of dumb.
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Jul 18, 2020 09:26
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MonsterEnvy posted:Olivia seems a first for a Mario advice partner in that she actually seems to be kind of dumb. She’s very good at ninja stuff though! I don’t think enough positive things can be said about the soundtrack to this game. The composer clearly had a blast with the variety that this game has, and there are some real nutso moments that might not have played with a lesser score. Ska-wan Lake as a part of the Elastic Entertainer’s Suite was a “wait am I really hearing this!?” moment. You can really hear the energy in the orchestra, switching to live orchestrated scores is easily one of the best decisions Nintendo has ever made and this game might live or die based on how much the music helps you buy into the story, whether it’s goofy or serious or sweet or terrifying or adrenaline-pumping. Also, the whole tower theater thing was a blast, I occasionally have my doubts about how much action they try to have you do in regular walking around mode but that was particularly well done.
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Jul 18, 2020 10:46
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I just finished the red streamer, so far the boss system is really good, I got a little confused at first when I first fought the Vollumental but after practicing it a couple times it at the VR battle practice room it became a lot more understandable, I will say though, I kinda wish they made opening the chests in a boss battle different, because you’re already in mid stride when you open them so it’s impossible to plan to take what’s in the chest afterwards since the rings reset after each turn. So far my opinion of the game is unchanged, I really am enjoying it, now that I understand all the different battle systems and I’m enjoying them I am confident the rest of the game will be great. I laughed out loud at the Cheap tourist trap scam the toads have set up for faithful Koopa troopas that hid the true actual danger dungeon for the vollumental lol I’m glad the game lets you easily stomp weak enemies when you level up, it makes the refreshing enemies a lot less annoying. Al-Saqr fucked around with this message at 12:25 on Jul 18, 2020 |
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Jul 18, 2020 12:23
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God drat i love this game. Played a bit of the blue streamer area and the music and visuals just get better and better. That battle theme man...
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Jul 18, 2020 12:36
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The Water Vellumental was a cool fight. They're really not holding back in demanding you master the ring system in the boss battles.
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Jul 18, 2020 13:09
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 make this image the thread title
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Jul 18, 2020 14:37
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It took me way too long to remember slide technique to get On buttons where I needed them in the water spirit fight.
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Jul 18, 2020 14:49
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