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Not entirely true, you also need power poles to branch connections. I like both games, they scratch different itches.
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Aug 22, 2020 15:30
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I think a Satisfactory killed K8.0's parents
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Aug 22, 2020 15:52
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Vasudus posted:I too am just getting back into this. November 2016 for me. I spent a few minutes angrily trying to connect a building to a power pole with copper wire before I realized that this isn’t Satisfactory and I’m going to have to learn this from scratch. If you really want to do this, you just have to put down the power pole, then Ctrl+click it so the connecting wires go away, and then you can string the copper wire along it in any order you want!  (But by default, the copper wire will automatically attach to any other poles within range when you put them down.)
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Aug 22, 2020 15:53
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Playing with cabling in factorio is only necessary (and fun!) when you want to set up isolated power grids with latches and power switches. Because who doesn't want entire factory blocks to spool up from idle on demand?
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Aug 22, 2020 16:24
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M_Gargantua posted:Playing with cabling in factorio is only necessary (and fun!) when you want to set up isolated power grids with latches and power switches. Because who doesn't want entire factory blocks to spool up from idle on demand? That and trying to make all your power poles line up nicely so your power grid looks all clean on the map!
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Aug 22, 2020 16:31
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I'm having issues playing multiplayer. Your choices are: 1) Guy who has never played before / has played for an hour. You ask him to set up green science, and come back with 10 science assemblers fed by 10 inserter assemblers and 10 belt assemblers with 1 gear assembler. This guy builds power armor and fucks off to kill bugs for the entire game so you never see him and are now playing singleplayer 2) Guy who has 500 blueprints and who has completed the game as soon as it launches (I'm this guy). None of his blueprints work with any of yours. I have to actively not use my own blueprint book or else every game just looks the same. If I play with #1 I have to tear it up to fix it and I feel back wrecking something someone worked on, with #2 it's a battle of competing standards
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Aug 22, 2020 16:50
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Freaksaus posted:That and trying to make all your power poles line up nicely so your power grid looks all clean on the map! If you're playing with mods I highly recommend power comb! Drag a box around power poles and it fixes them up for you.
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Aug 22, 2020 16:51
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Evilreaver posted:I'm having issues playing multiplayer. Your choices are: The only real way to play multiplayer is a modpack that no-one in the group has played before, so it's all "hmm, what's the best way to build this?" rather than "hmm, time to bring up my pre-planned blueprint for this". Some people will play the modpack in advance because they think it makes them look cool to show up with a bunch of blueprints and telling everyone the best way to do things. Do not hesitate to boot them from the group.
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Aug 22, 2020 16:55
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Any good scenarios for single or multiplayer? I saw somebody play one where you had to expand into a biter death zone to find and launch a rocket. Wonder if there are any clever scenarios out there.
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Aug 22, 2020 19:05
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Starting to run into problems with big bases of bugs as I'm expanding out looking for uranium and more oil. Huge waves of nasties, they can take lots of hits, and even with a tank it's tricky to get close, they overrun you big time. I don't have access to purple science yet, just yellow, so no spider or artillery for me yet.
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Aug 22, 2020 19:20
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Do you have the damage/ROF upgrades? Are you using explosive shells? Combat robots (Even just the basic defenders are insanely strong with upgrades)? Poison capsules (they stack and are really good at killing clusters of worms and don't hurt you when you're in a tank)? Also you can chuck grenades (and thus cluster grenades) from in a tank and do it while you're shooting too, which gives some pretty crazy DPS. Also with reasonably equipped power armor and upgrades for the rocket launcher you can also fight very effectively on foot. The rocket launcher outranges the tank and as long as you put any effort into dodging you can avoid all damage from even the longest range worms, while personal lasers, turrets, and/or combat robots kill most of the biters/spitters for you. Also Military 4 does not require purple science, so you could totally get artillery, Power Armor Mk2, Uranium Ammo, and Destroyer Capsules (which along with Distractors benefit from Energy upgrades if that's what you've been focusing on more.)
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Aug 22, 2020 19:38
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If you have enough open ground you can do decently with just a car, up until large biters start appearing. Spitters and worms can't hit a fast-moving car and the machine gun cuts through them just fine, especially with a handful of combat robots too. Just make sure not to run into anything that'll make you stop moving.
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Aug 22, 2020 20:00
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In my little cadre of Factorio friends I'm the guy who's responsible for power--I build the steam engines and boilers early-game, and then get Nuclear online when it is unlocked. If the factory runs out of power, it's because I'm not doing my job. We've got our trains guy, whose job is to get the train network established and tell us what number of locomotives and cargo wagons we're using (we try something new every time). We've also got our stone/wall/pavement expert whose job it is to fortify our borders and make sure that things are defended adequately. It's a pretty rad balance between the three of us! Occasionally we get a fourth or fifth who primarily shot aleins (ty master chef) but for the most part it's just us three.
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Aug 22, 2020 22:25
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We have one person who likes to build very big and often cooks up blueprint ideas offline, one person who likes to make things efficient/smart and also usually develops rail blueprints, one who generally just goes around killing biters and making turret walls, and me who makes terrible spaghetti all over the place and eyeballs all ratios and also uses all our construction bots to place concrete which annoys the efficiency person. It works surprisingly well
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Aug 22, 2020 23:52
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If the variety is barren, maybe it's time to turn to modpack multiplayer instead?
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Aug 23, 2020 01:03
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I feel like I hosed up. I have all of the sciences except for space ones being slowly produced. My red circuits production is pretty wimpy and it seems like a bunch of the core stuff I'm trying to build relies on them, including the two last sciences I unlocked. The problem is that when I built the base at first, I built poo poo as tightly as humanly possible, and red circuits are right in the middle of a ton of other jam packed stuff. Ideally I'd space the entire base out to leave room for expansion within each section producing its own item, but... What are my option? Really don't want to refactor the whole base, that's going to be a nightmare. I could potentially build a red circuits cluster somewhere off to the side and just drone things in, but I can't imagine they will will be able to keep up with the volume.
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Aug 23, 2020 04:08
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One of the bigger drains on red circuits is blue circuits. Build a dedicated module somewhere else that builds red circuits and immediately turns them into blue circuits, and drone in the blue circuits. If you take that load off your existing red circuit factory then hopefully it will be able to keep up with the rest. Your other option is to build speed modules and put them in your red circuit assemblers, to get more production in the same amount of space.
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Aug 23, 2020 04:48
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Build a new array with plenty of space and leave your old setup intact. Use drones to supply it, and ideally build it so that you can bring resources in by train eventually and expand it. Then when it outpaces your original setup you can tear that down and reclaim the space. Adding new production and refactoring the base is one of the core loops of the game
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Aug 23, 2020 04:49
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I installed seablock because of the buzz in this thread, but I'm now about to be done with it for one simple reason. I spent for loving ever working on fluid burning boilers, and then discover for no loving reason hydrogen can't be burned. I wouldn't care if they made it almost worthless to burn next to the cost of electrolyzing it. I wouldn't care if it had much better uses than just burning. But for a stupid mod that emphasizes at every point, realistic chemistry and doing every goddamn step of the process, to say "nah, you can't burn hydrogen" is just so annoying.
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Aug 23, 2020 04:59
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Hydrogen is a gas in seablock, unless I'm mistaken.
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Aug 23, 2020 05:04
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Taffer posted:Build a new array with plenty of space and leave your old setup intact. Use drones to supply it, and ideally build it so that you can bring resources in by train eventually and expand it. Then when it outpaces your original setup you can tear that down and reclaim the space. Adding new production and refactoring the base is one of the core loops of the game Got it. I haven't used drones for supplying anything except for myself yet. Do I basically just have to make sure that the new zone is covered within the orange range of the drone port and that the port is within the same network as the area that I want to be supplied from?
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Aug 23, 2020 05:19
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On an unrelated note, I'm starting to build enough trains that they're about to cross each other's paths. My tracks are bidirectional, which is not amazing. Have most people just avoided crossing tracks and instead figured out a way to make a giant loop that brings all the goodies back to main base in one big swoop? I looked up a video of a guy building a two-way railroad intersection and it's kind of a giant PITA, but I suppose I only have to do it once and blueprint it.
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Aug 23, 2020 05:21
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But my verisimilitude is a very silly reason to drop something. Also you could see immediately that it doesn't have a fuel value like other flammables do.
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Aug 23, 2020 05:22
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DreadCthulhu posted:just drone things in, but I can't imagine they will will be able to keep up with the volume. Enough drones can support any volume or throughput. There's some theoretical limit on the number of logistics drones you can keep charged, but I've never run into it in practice.
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Aug 23, 2020 05:25
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Upgraded drones are faster than blue belts Trains are even faster once there is distance. DreadCthulhu posted:On an unrelated note, I'm starting to build enough trains that they're about to cross each other's paths. My tracks are bidirectional, which is not amazing. Have most people just avoided crossing tracks and instead figured out a way to make a giant loop that brings all the goodies back to main base in one big swoop? I looked up a video of a guy building a two-way railroad intersection and it's kind of a giant PITA, but I suppose I only have to do it once and blueprint it. Depends, you can easily move a lot with bidirectional trains, and if you know how to signal you can have multiple trains (on a single lane bidirectional track with sidings) without blockages. But train signaling is intuitive only after you've learned it, unless you've spent a lot of time playing Transport Tycoon in your youth. We have an infographic somewhere. At some point you just have to decide that single direction rails are cheap enough to warrent laying them everywhere rather than trying to min/max with bidirectional. If its just single train per single track then you just need the most basic of signals at intersections and there won't be any problems. Here is the premiere way to do two crossing bidirectional single rails 
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Aug 23, 2020 05:46
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Chakan posted:Hydrogen is a gas in seablock, unless I'm mistaken. Gases are a fluid. Fluid is not the same as liquid. Googling what was going on led me to a post where the maintainer of bobs literally renamed it from "oil burning boiler" to "fluid burning boiler" to allow for hydrogen burning. Some smarmy rear end in the seablock dependency chain disabled it. And I'm annoyed.
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Aug 23, 2020 06:00
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Figure 1) NS train to the south, EW train traveling west: The westbound chain and regular signals are yellow indicating that the blocks are reserved by an incoming train, the eastbound signals are red because there is already a train in the east block. The southbound signals are red because there is a train to the south, and the northbound chain signal is red because the EW train is about to enter the central block, while the northbound regular signal at the top is green because the north block is available. Figure 2) NS train still to the south, EW train just passing intersection:  Now the eastbound signal and northbound signal are green, because those blocks are free, but everything is red because there are trains in the west and south block and the EW train is still in the core block. Figure 3) EW train clears intersection, NS train enters intersection northbound  Similar to figure 1, the northbound chain and regular signals are yellow to indicate that the block is reserved by the incoming train. Eastern block has the green signal because its free Figure 4) Process repeats in reverse for the EW train, now eastbound  Figure 5) southbound NS train waits for EW train to clear  Figure 6) EW train is clear, southbound NS train now has block reservations to continue south 
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Aug 23, 2020 06:02
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DreadCthulhu posted:On an unrelated note, I'm starting to build enough trains that they're about to cross each other's paths. My tracks are bidirectional, which is not amazing. Have most people just avoided crossing tracks and instead figured out a way to make a giant loop that brings all the goodies back to main base in one big swoop? I looked up a video of a guy building a two-way railroad intersection and it's kind of a giant PITA, but I suppose I only have to do it once and blueprint it. Trains are an endless well of complexity - this is not really a problem you ever "solve" but one you continually find new approaches to. That's been my experience, anyway. There are about a billion and one different approaches, but generally for me what has worked is finding a spacing for two-way tracks (I use the width of two railroad tracks as the "gap" between mine, some people go wider), figure out direction (right hand drive is pretty standard, like the roads in most countries) and never, ever deviate from it. Then create a series of blueprints for basic rail setups. Straight lines, 3-way, and 4-way intersections. Plonk those down all over the place and you'll have a system that can scale very far. Create a few more for things like loading/unloading stations, stackers (you probably don't need to worry about this yet, but it will come up eventually), etc. Your first attempts will suck bigtime, but that's okay! Everyone's does at the start (mine still do, as someone I play with constantly reminds me), the fun is learning what approaches work and how to improve them in the future.
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Aug 23, 2020 06:02
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Thanks for those detailed tips you all. Those screenshots are worth a thousand words! Regarding using trains to gain access to iron and copper, is there any benefit to smelting everything by the ore itself and shipping in the plates instead? Assuming I use electric furnaces that don't require messing around with coal. It doesn't look like I'm saving myself any space this way since it's a 1:1 ratio.
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Aug 23, 2020 06:10
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DreadCthulhu posted:Thanks for those detailed tips you all. Those screenshots are worth a thousand words! Plates are 2x as dense as ore since its 1:1 but it has a stack size of 100 rather than 50. Similarly gears are 4x as dense as ore (two plates per gear, stack size 100), Steel and green circuts are 10x as dense as ore, etc With the already high throughput of trains this doesn't actually gain you much in the way of immediate benefits until you've launched a rocket and are scaling bigger. Its mostly a matter of conveniences throughout the midgame.
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Aug 23, 2020 06:18
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I've never had trouble with trains, but I also just about never make 2-way tracks. Maybe for my very first line until I ramp up production, but otherwise I always run one line for one direction and a second line for the other.
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Aug 23, 2020 07:21
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DreadCthulhu posted:
The only real benefit is at the megabase stage when your trains start getting backlogged due to trying to ship ore to a central smelting facility, but even this is based on your train network. You will be fine until you launch several rockets at which point you may consider refactoring the whole base to transition to a megabase anyway.
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Aug 23, 2020 08:47
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Running point-to-point lines before your system gets laid out is chill, but I almost always automate rails into an unrestricted steel chest and then come back later; conservation of rail segments hasn’t really been a thing for me for fuckin years at this point. So I just run a big huge loop with the outline of the in-and-out accesses of the early railhead, and the intervening route parallel track at the appropriate spacing. It all gets integrated, and seriously what are you even doing if you aren’t riding a smoke-belching brute-force engine from one exploitation focus to the next?!
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Aug 23, 2020 11:22
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Also it's completely fine to decide that you have more fun focusing on the base as a whole or details of other production chains than perfectly turning all your rail stuff and use one of the many blueprint books available online. You'll still probably have to customize them a bit to add power poles or defense nodes or zig them when there's cliffs or zag them when there's water or make your own sidings to suit your preferred train control mod (if any) but it's completely fine to say "I would rather figure out how to scale up red circuit production than mess with signals to prevent that one deadlock that keeps happening because I screwed up an intersection 10 hours ago"
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Aug 23, 2020 14:15
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Zigging and zagging? Fill the water! Blow the cliffs! Pave the world! 😁 I really love using a chunk-aligned set of blueprints for rails - reduces my anxiety over unordered rail systems.
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Aug 23, 2020 16:21
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I'm the opposite. I haven't built a single cliff explosive and I only ever fill in narrow isthmuses with landfill because there are no bridges  Working around the terrain is The Best and spaghetti is The Point. I want a base that looks like the trailer cinematic.
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Aug 23, 2020 16:36
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The other great use for single track trains as you move in the megafactory stage is to continue to ship all the products of your old factory to your new bigger, better organized factory. Also never tear down a working factory, just abandon it in place. If you ever have issues it will still be there packed with resources and infrastructure ready to be tapped.
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Aug 23, 2020 17:45
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KillHour posted:I'm the opposite. I haven't built a single cliff explosive and I only ever fill in narrow isthmuses with landfill because there are no bridges I don't fill in isthmuses (sp?), but that's just because they're my best defensive lines against biters.
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Aug 23, 2020 18:02
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Pretty sure a narrow neck of land with water on two long sides is an isthmus, a narrow neck of water with land on two long sides is a channel. Landfill is for dropping a couple of tiles in order to run undergrounds, and not loving up my perfect robogrid if that’s what I’m doing
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Aug 23, 2020 18:14
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How much water could one possibly need in a regular playthrough? Is it fair to fill in most water you encounter as your base grows with exception for a few squares that you'll need to pump from?
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Aug 23, 2020 18:52
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