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CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK
Sep 11, 2001



Rhyno posted:

The entire goal of the show was getting back to earth. It's revitalized so they are willing to rough it for a while.

Oh no the BSG ending... :ohdear:

"Let's give up all of our tech because reasons."

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werdnam
Feb 16, 2011
The scientist does not study nature because it is useful to do so. He studies it because he takes pleasure in it, and he takes pleasure in it because it is beautiful. If nature were not beautiful it would not be worth knowing, and life would not be worth living. -- Henri Poincare

CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK posted:

Oh no the BSG ending... :ohdear:

"Let's give up all of our tech because reasons."

At least in this case there are no future generations to help with the tech. As long as the last humans are comfortable until they die, that's all they need.

latinotwink1997
Jan 2, 2008

Taste my Ball of Hope, foul dragon!


Rhyno posted:

The entire goal of the show was getting back to earth. It's revitalized so they are willing to rough it for a while.

This is what still annoys me. Monty waited nearly 50 years and there were no signs of life on Earth so they headed to Sanctum. After 75 years of travel though, they end up back on Earth to find trees that are at least 50 years old and presumably animal life for them to live off of.

Shrimpy posted:

It'd also be weird to be on Sanctum and/or Bardo just surrounded by glowing crystalline structures that used to be members of your species. Like, surprise, the Earth was just faking you out so you’d leave.



The returned crew can go back and visit their glow bodies now.

“So that’s what I looked like when I ascended”

Rhyno
Mar 22, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!

latinotwink1997 posted:

This is what still annoys me. Monty waited nearly 50 years and there were no signs of life on Earth so they headed to Sanctum. After 75 years of travel though, they end up back on Earth to find trees that are at least 50 years old and presumably animal life for them to live off of.



Monty never looked at the other side of the planet.

Apprentice Dick
Dec 1, 2009

latinotwink1997 posted:

This is what still annoys me. Monty waited nearly 50 years and there were no signs of life on Earth so they headed to Sanctum. After 75 years of travel though, they end up back on Earth to find trees that are at least 50 years old and presumably animal life for them to live off of.

Monty lied hoping that going to a new world with other humans would give them a fresh start and that things would be different.

Gaj
Apr 30, 2006
Im finally watching this on Netflix and goddamn Clarke is literally responsible for trying to scrub out the last % of humanity in the galaxy because Earth wasnt enough.

Question, ep 14 or 15 they get sent back to earth and the second dawn bunker. But I thought Earth was a lost cause and the last fertile valley was torched. But when they get there its the standard lush canadian rain forest. Why couldnt they just re-colonize that valley?

CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK
Sep 11, 2001



Gaj posted:

Im finally watching this on Netflix and goddamn Clarke is literally responsible for trying to scrub out the last % of humanity in the galaxy because Earth wasnt enough.

Question, ep 14 or 15 they get sent back to earth and the second dawn bunker. But I thought Earth was a lost cause and the last fertile valley was torched. But when they get there its the standard lush canadian rain forest. Why couldnt they just re-colonize that valley?

Earth was completely desolate when they left and that new patch of fertile land was a new development.

Gaj
Apr 30, 2006
Oh god Im dumb I forgot they slow boated it to the new world. But now that just makes me ask why the Second Dawn group didnt re-colonize Earth since it seems it would be easier to expand on a planet that uh, isnt covered in Biological weapons.

Shrimpy
May 18, 2004

Sir, I'm going to need to see your ticket.

Gaj posted:

Oh god Im dumb I forgot they slow boated it to the new world. But now that just makes me ask why the Second Dawn group didnt re-colonize Earth since it seems it would be easier to expand on a planet that uh, isnt covered in Biological weapons.

If the backdoor pilot was any indication, it's because they portal-ed off of Earth shortly after they got in the bunker.

oh jay
Oct 15, 2012

Gaj posted:

Oh god Im dumb I forgot they slow boated it to the new world. But now that just makes me ask why the Second Dawn group didnt re-colonize Earth since it seems it would be easier to expand on a planet that uh, isnt covered in Biological weapons.

It probably boils down to Cadagon being a dick. He didn't want to give people Night Blood because he wanted them in the bunker with him. Then he kept the code to go back to Earth secret, because as soon as he found what was basically a bunker on Bardo, he felt right at home.

Rhyno
Mar 22, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!
Also somebody got into the bunker, dug a hole in concrete, pushed the sphere down into it, seamlessly covered the hole with new concrete and left an Azgadia symbol over it.

Sammus
Nov 30, 2005

latinotwink1997 posted:

This is what still annoys me. Monty waited nearly 50 years and there were no signs of life on Earth so they headed to Sanctum. After 75 years of travel though, they end up back on Earth to find trees that are at least 50 years old and presumably animal life for them to live off of.


50 years old? Those trees looked hundreds of years to me.

The show briefly touched on the whole time dilation due to a black hole thing, but they never really took the time to hash out how it worked other than ‘Sanctum is slower than Skyring and Skyring is slower than Bardo.’ It’s my theory that Sanctum is also a shitload slower than Earth, and hundreds of years passed while our heroes hosed around killing each other.

I’m pretty sure this show completely hosed the physics of time dilation and black holes.

Rhyno
Mar 22, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!
I like the "Monty lied" theory.

latinotwink1997
Jan 2, 2008

Taste my Ball of Hope, foul dragon!


Rhyno posted:

I like the "Monty lied" theory.

Monty lied, more people died.


I was also thinking, we never got a reason why the maelstrom was, well, a maelstrom, did we? It’s the portal the spheres create but instead it was miles wide and permanently open. Why?

latinotwink1997 fucked around with this message at 16:05 on Oct 18, 2020

werdnam
Feb 16, 2011
The scientist does not study nature because it is useful to do so. He studies it because he takes pleasure in it, and he takes pleasure in it because it is beautiful. If nature were not beautiful it would not be worth knowing, and life would not be worth living. -- Henri Poincare

latinotwink1997 posted:

I was also thinking, we never got a reason why the maelstrom was, well, a maelstrom, did we? It’s the portal the spheres create but instead it was miles wide and permanently open. Why?

I've come to the conclusion after reading many shows' threads that people on the internet regularly think more about the details of most shows' plots than the writers do, for better or for worse.

Edit: spelling is important

SLICK GOKU BABY
Jun 12, 2001

Hey Hey Let's Go! 喧嘩する
大切な物を protect my balls


Finally finished the last season since it got on Netflix. Pretty good series and also interesting since it started out pretty weird and ended pretty weird.

And also no matter what they do, they manage to kill just about everyone they meet...

latinotwink1997
Jan 2, 2008

Taste my Ball of Hope, foul dragon!


werdnam posted:

I've come to the conclusion after reading many shows' threads that people on the internet regularly think more about the details of most shows' plots than the writers do, for better or for worse.

Edit: spelling is important

I suspend my disbelief until after the show is over.

pile of brown
Dec 31, 2004

latinotwink1997 posted:

Monty lied, more people died.


I was also thinking, we never got a reason why the maelstrom was, well, a maelstrom, did we? It’s the portal the spheres create but instead it was miles wide and permanently open. Why?

They do mention that there are nearly infinite combinations on the sphere, maybe "make a giant permanent portal" is one of the functions they hadn't unlocked for themselves yet

Danzel Glovington
Mar 16, 2006

I'm too old to bury my son!

Becca I believe says the combos are infinite. I remember thinking to myself the implication of that, and I thought well yeah if there's no limit to how many symbols need to be used then it is indeed infinite (one code could be tap this one symbol a million times, then another could be tap it a million and one times).

With an explanation like that sure basically any outcome could make sense within the show and they could take it as far as they need, which in this case seemed to be a variant of, this code takes you to a breathable, uninhabited by humans, future and recovered earth. At least they didn't have the code fully bring people back to life or de-age them. Although it seems transcendence healed any and all injuries so, sweet deal for the terminal characters who chose to return to earth to be with Clark.

I love this show, and a big part of my appreciation comes from the relative freedom the show has from logical constraints. I guess that sounds weird, and could be re-worded as, the show doesn't take itself so seriously, although I don't exactly know what the crew thinks of the show. Either way if the dialogue gets cheesy or the plots fall apart for whatever reason, or the sci-fi elements are incongruent with previously established rules... it doesn't bother me, and in fact I applaud the show when it subverts my expectations either in an unfair shocking way, or in a nuanced and logical way.

I feel like I bonded with the show around season 5 after just enjoying it more casually before that, similar to my feelings on the show House. As it got more and more absurd I loved it even more, for reasons so different from why I love other shows. And, like House, The 100 ending makes me very sad I won't get to wait for more new ridiculous episodes, although I hope the spinoff can be more enjoyable than something like The Good Doctor (US). I'm also excited for a re-watch of The 100.

oh jay
Oct 15, 2012

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFgSNhuJmHw

Sheidheda got into some interesting fights back when he was in his prime.

cheeseboy58
Dec 14, 2020
Shoutouts to this series was not expecting ANY of this deciding to watch the first episode on a whim. My wife and i marathoned the whole thing in about a month. Dont ever watch tv but i was hooked, gonna miss the show, characters, plot etc.

INH5
Dec 17, 2012
Error: file not found.
The other day my mind wondered back to this show, I looked on the internet for retrospectives and the like, and I stumbled upon this hilarious reaction video of a guy watching the first episode and then the last episode of the series, having only watched the first 2 seasons years ago.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEo23TNTLvs

(Paraphrasing.) "They must have jumped like 12 sharks."

I, personally, would have phrased it a bit differently, but yeah, pretty much.

I also see that the prequel didn't get picked up. Not very surprising considering how low the ratings were during the final Season.

oh jay
Oct 15, 2012

The backdoor pilot was confounding.

"Let's make a prequel of a moderately successful show, but not even tie it into any of the popular stories/characters. It's about the daughter of the leader of this new faction. It might reveal a little about some unanswered questions, but mostly it's about this sister and brother you don't care about."

It was never going to be picked up.

Open Source Idiom
Jan 4, 2013
It seems to be the CW's process on getting spinoffs to happen. Just sort of shove some new hot people in a random episode and maybe commission a pilot off the back of that, since it worked for The Flash. Except The Flash was a whole different kettle of fish, given that he was already established IP, etc.

In my mind, more successful spin-offs would focus on a character that's already had some breakout success. Send Octavia through a wormhole to the past at the end of season five and you'd have an instantly successful spin-off with a built-in audience.

Re: The 100, looking back, the best episodes of the show were -- to my mind -- the ones that did sfnal versions of horror monsters. So two, and three (science vampires and techno demons), and if you squint the sixth season (they're a mix of invasion of the body snatchers and divinity, but I thought it was all very compelling). These were also the seasons that felt like they had the biggest shifts in the status quo and seemed the least afraid to murder characters, which was a good vibe for the series all up.

I mean, I totally get why they backed away after the third season became this huge flashpoint for them, but gently caress it, I think their narrative choices were ultimately more good than bad.

I don't think I ever finished the final season, unfortunately. Maybe because I didn't find it super compelling and there were a loooot of breaks. Might get back to it, one day.

Shrimpy
May 18, 2004

Sir, I'm going to need to see your ticket.

Open Source Idiom posted:

It seems to be the CW's process on getting spinoffs to happen. Just sort of shove some new hot people in a random episode and maybe commission a pilot off the back of that, since it worked for The Flash. Except The Flash was a whole different kettle of fish, given that he was already established IP, etc.

In my mind, more successful spin-offs would focus on a character that's already had some breakout success. Send Octavia through a wormhole to the past at the end of season five and you'd have an instantly successful spin-off with a built-in audience.

The Vampire Diaries to The Originals was basically the latter. The Originals to Legacies as well. Definitely the way The 100 should've done it, especially since they had a ton chances to do so.

INH5
Dec 17, 2012
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Another issue with a prequel based on the Grounders is that until the very last Season the show didn't commit to whether the Grounders were either random survivors on the ground who had "gone native", for lack of a better phrase (the clear intention during Season 1, where you had IE Anya and Tristan talking to each other in English when no Sky People are present) or the descendants of some special group that had survived through special circumstances and as a result developed a special culture, which is pretty much what they ended up going with in 7x08 after multiple hints in that direction over the course of the series.

Even in Season 4, which introduced Cadogan and Second Dawn and there were BTS photos had the Grounder Clan symbols in the Second Dawn bunker, you also had that shot at the end of 4x01 of Grounders in Egypt getting fried by the Death Wave.

IIRC the creator of Trigedasleng has said that if he had known from the start that the Grounder Language had originated as something just made up by a pre-war teenager, he would have designed the language totally differently.

The result of this was that only that one episode in the last Season, viewed by less than 700k people during its initial broadcast according to the available data, and presumably on Netflix viewed mostly only by the people who stuck to it through 7 seasons, was able to commit enough to actually set up plot hooks instead of just raising vague questions.

I haven't watched The Vampire Diaries, but I'm guessing that the backstory of the spinoff characters was more consistently presented? Glancing at the Fan Wiki, it seems like the concept of "The Originals" was first presented in Season Two, so fairly early on?

Strange Matter
Oct 6, 2009

Ask me about Genocide
I finished this show like two years ago and sometimes I still get randomly mad at how Bellamy had an authentic spiritual encounter, found inner peace, got killed pointlessly and for idiotic reasons, turned out to be right about everything, missed out on the afterlife he believed in, and then nobody felt bad about it afterwards.

Also the best episode is the Season 3 episode where Jasper dies. I was legit stunned by how surprisingly elegiac the entire episode was.

Boris Galerkin
Dec 17, 2011

I don't understand why I can't harass people online. Seriously, somebody please explain why I shouldn't be allowed to stalk others on social media!
I miss this ducking show.

Boris Galerkin
Dec 17, 2011

I don't understand why I can't harass people online. Seriously, somebody please explain why I shouldn't be allowed to stalk others on social media!
YOU ARE WANKRU OR YOU ARE THE ENEMY OF WANKRU

CHOOSE

Boris Galerkin fucked around with this message at 15:09 on May 24, 2023

INH5
Dec 17, 2012
Error: file not found.

Strange Matter posted:

Also the best episode is the Season 3 episode where Jasper dies. I was legit stunned by how surprisingly elegiac the entire episode was.

I assume that you mean the Season 4 episode?

He was supposed to commit suicide at the last episode of Season 3, and the scene was actually filmed, but it was edited out before broadcast. That's still one of the weirdest aspects of this show's production, IMO, why it happened that way? My own theory is that the controversy over Lexa's death was loud enough that higher-ups at the CW noticed and passed instructions down the chain to "do something," and apart from dubbing in some lines between Clarke and Lexa while they were in The Matrix, all that they could think to do was remove another potentially controversial character death, and since the whole Season had already been filmed by that point the only death that was feasible to edit out was Jasper's.

I don't suppose that any new information about this has come to since the show's ending that I missed?

That aside, yeah, I agree that that episode was pretty well done. In hindsight, one good thing to come out of the controversies over Lexa and Lincoln's deaths in Season 3 was that they put more care into major character deaths going forward. I honestly can't think of a single one from the start of Season 4 onward that I thought was done particularly poorly, and it's not like they were in particularly short supply.

Bucky Fullminster
Apr 13, 2007

The original apocalypse and its immediate aftermath and the origin of the grounders makes perfect sense for a prequel

oh jay
Oct 15, 2012

Yes, but Becca should have been the star.

Bucky Fullminster
Apr 13, 2007

Yeah that makes sense, but didn’t we already get most of that?

Could always do more I guess,

Strange Matter
Oct 6, 2009

Ask me about Genocide

INH5 posted:

I assume that you mean the Season 4 episode?

He was supposed to commit suicide at the last episode of Season 3, and the scene was actually filmed, but it was edited out before broadcast. That's still one of the weirdest aspects of this show's production, IMO, why it happened that way? My own theory is that the controversy over Lexa's death was loud enough that higher-ups at the CW noticed and passed instructions down the chain to "do something," and apart from dubbing in some lines between Clarke and Lexa while they were in The Matrix, all that they could think to do was remove another potentially controversial character death, and since the whole Season had already been filmed by that point the only death that was feasible to edit out was Jasper's.

I don't suppose that any new information about this has come to since the show's ending that I missed?

That aside, yeah, I agree that that episode was pretty well done. In hindsight, one good thing to come out of the controversies over Lexa and Lincoln's deaths in Season 3 was that they put more care into major character deaths going forward. I honestly can't think of a single one from the start of Season 4 onward that I thought was done particularly poorly, and it's not like they were in particularly short supply.
Yeah I meant Season 4. His final scene with Monte against the window as the entire Earth's ecosystem is falling apart was genuinely haunting to me.

Overall there's probably one season's worth of the finest young adult science fiction ever to make it on TV with this show, but it's spread out over seven seasons that feature some of the most infuriating storytelling and character development I've ever had the misfortune of viewing.

EDIT: Did you really feel like Bellamy's death was well done? Like I said that still makes me angry.

Strange Matter fucked around with this message at 19:21 on May 24, 2023

pressedbunny
May 31, 2007

To A Brand New Galaxy
The specific scene of Bellamy being killed was fine, because Clarke is a reactionary homicidal lunatic who had already proven many times that she'd do literally anything to anyone for Madi, and I like that even Bellamy wasn't an exception to that to that.
However, I don't like how it was handled after. It was out of character that Echo and Octavia didn't hack Clarke to pieces immediately, and then having Bellamy be right all along and not even getting to be part of the 'Finalkru' made his death feel very unbalanced. The second-main character of the story is killed, it's proven killing him was a gigantic and needless mistake, and the only cost is a few tears? Obviously it's been a couple of years so maybe I'm misremembering, but as I recall, Clarke got away with it essentially scot-free.
Shooting Bellamy wasn't even why she got left behind in the end, it was just one of many gently caress-ups she listed. She literally got punished more for shooting Cadogan. I like Clarke and got a kick out of her mass murdering ways, but man, she really needed to get some kind of direct and clear comeuppance. I don't think dying of old age with her friends and dog, knowing her daughter is now an immortal cosmic force, was really the punishment or penance the writers thought it was.

Bellamy being killed off before the final was fine. Clarke shooting Bellamy was fine. Not having her really pay for it in any significant way, especially when he was right, was not fine.

Strange Matter
Oct 6, 2009

Ask me about Genocide

pressedbunny posted:

Bellamy being killed off before the final was fine. Clarke shooting Bellamy was fine. Not having her really pay for it in any significant way, especially when he was right, was not fine.
Yeah alright, that's my feeling too. What's worse is that Echo and Octavia didn't just not murder Clarke instantly, but they're both like "You did the right thing, he wasn't Bellamy anymore", when in fact he experienced an actual, factual transcendent encounter that wound up being 100% accurate. And in the end there's no reflection on this, just moving on, and the final is treated as a happy ending as if there isn't a giant Bellamy shaped hole in the final scene.

You're not misremembering, it's exactly how that all happened.

Boris Galerkin
Dec 17, 2011

I don't understand why I can't harass people online. Seriously, somebody please explain why I shouldn't be allowed to stalk others on social media!
He deserved to die because his name was Bellamy.

oh jay
Oct 15, 2012

Bellarke was the worst ship, if only because of the name.

INH5
Dec 17, 2012
Error: file not found.

Strange Matter posted:

EDIT: Did you really feel like Bellamy's death was well done? Like I said that still makes me angry.

I meant the death scene itself. My feelings are similar to pressedbunny on this:


pressedbunny posted:

The specific scene of Bellamy being killed was fine, because Clarke is a reactionary homicidal lunatic who had already proven many times that she'd do literally anything to anyone for Madi, and I like that even Bellamy wasn't an exception to that to that.
However, I don't like how it was handled after. It was out of character that Echo and Octavia didn't hack Clarke to pieces immediately, and then having Bellamy be right all along and not even getting to be part of the 'Finalkru' made his death feel very unbalanced. The second-main character of the story is killed, it's proven killing him was a gigantic and needless mistake, and the only cost is a few tears? Obviously it's been a couple of years so maybe I'm misremembering, but as I recall, Clarke got away with it essentially scot-free.
Shooting Bellamy wasn't even why she got left behind in the end, it was just one of many gently caress-ups she listed. She literally got punished more for shooting Cadogan. I like Clarke and got a kick out of her mass murdering ways, but man, she really needed to get some kind of direct and clear comeuppance. I don't think dying of old age with her friends and dog, knowing her daughter is now an immortal cosmic force, was really the punishment or penance the writers thought it was.

Bellamy being killed off before the final was fine. Clarke shooting Bellamy was fine. Not having her really pay for it in any significant way, especially when he was right, was not fine.

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Shrimpy
May 18, 2004

Sir, I'm going to need to see your ticket.

INH5 posted:

I haven't watched The Vampire Diaries, but I'm guessing that the backstory of the spinoff characters was more consistently presented? Glancing at the Fan Wiki, it seems like the concept of "The Originals" was first presented in Season Two, so fairly early on?

The main cast of The Originals are recurring characters starting in Season 2 that eventually get their backdoor pilot in Season 4.

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