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Jewmanji posted:Yeah the attack on Starkiller is one of the most inert pieces of filmmaking I can remember. There’s a stunning lack of craft in it. It doesn’t improve or enhance on the 1977 scene in any way. It’s like an extremely faithful cover song that is nonetheless performed by very mediocre musicians. Which makes sense, when you realize it was a last minute addition to give Poe something to do after they'd made the last minute decision to keep him alive. It's more and more obvious that Poe's inexplicable survival was the point where the series first started to fall apart.
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Oct 20, 2020 04:16
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i'd never argue for less oscar isaac but goddamn if 'poe survives' isn't the decision that basically began to unravel the whole ST.
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Oct 20, 2020 04:19
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poe surviving makes more sense in a universe where tlj is an even more obvious retread of esb and he's on the boat with finn and they kiss
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Oct 20, 2020 04:26
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They started beefing up Poe's role mid-way through filming (after the Abu Dhabi, before / during the UK stuff) when Ford got injuredThe shot list article posted:it’s clear The Last Jedi was not made to follow JJ Abrams decisions in The Force Awakens. Rather JJ was forced to change The Force Awakens so Finn could be sidelined in The Last Jedi. I'm not arguing that TFA was changed and that Finn's role was reduced but nothing they posted justified that particular claim. Doctor Spaceman fucked around with this message at 04:42 on Oct 20, 2020 |
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Oct 20, 2020 04:34
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Angry Salami posted:Which makes sense, when you realize it was a last minute addition to give Poe something to do after they'd made the last minute decision to keep him alive. It's more and more obvious that Poe's inexplicable survival was the point where the series first started to fall apart. What was the original plan with Starkiller base? I know that Poe was famously supposed to die in the crash, but what was going to happen in the third act originally?
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Oct 20, 2020 04:35
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Jewmanji posted:What was the original plan with Starkiller base? I know that Poe was famously supposed to die in the crash, but what was going to happen in the third act originally? probably something pretty similar, but without the half assed ticking clock of the bad space battle.
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Oct 20, 2020 04:40
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Jewmanji posted:What was the original plan with Starkiller base? I know that Poe was famously supposed to die in the crash, but what was going to happen in the third act originally? the resistance was going to deploy their own superweapon to bring down starkiller's shield
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Oct 20, 2020 05:13
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Halloween Jack posted:Maz is objectively worse than those other characters because she only exists to deliver exposition. (Hux was in the same boat in TFA, but later went on to do literally anything besides that, making him better than Maz.) That's just an extremely basic mistake, like if there was a whole scene of Peter Cushing walking around in women's slippers and it made it into the theatrical cut. Yeah that coupled with Disneys own history with "union disputes"
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Oct 20, 2020 07:57
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Robot Style posted:Almost literally. I'm the Yoda purging the heretics in the name of the Emperor with my bolter gun.
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Oct 20, 2020 10:01
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Alchenar posted:I'm the Yoda purging the heretics in the name of the Emperor with my bolter gun. 
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Oct 20, 2020 10:33
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Jewmanji posted:What was the original plan with Starkiller base? I know that Poe was famously supposed to die in the crash, but what was going to happen in the third act originally? It’s roughly the same, but with some big differences: Leia sends a big smashy weapon to crush the enemy defences and unleash a bunch of X-Wings. There’s a swarmy air battle, but it’s evidently just a distraction while Han blows up the base on his own. (It’s unclear if the attack is intentionally a distraction, or if the X-Wings just lose and Han needs to save the day.) Meanwhile, FN is not helping the Resistance, and has snuck into the battle because he’s just trying to save Rey from getting killed. This explains a couple other weird choices in the theatrical cut: The “Phasma turns off the shields and gets sent to the trash compactor” scene was effectively a reshoot. That’s why it’s oddly truncated and takes place on a tiny set. Phasma’s just there so they could re-use the costume, and FN’s acting weird because they’d fully switched the character over to “funny coward” schtick. It’s also why the X-Wings teleport to the planet instantly, which I recall a lot of folks complained about. Overall, the point seemed to have been that the Resistance is both morally-ambiguous and ineffectual. Han sacrifices himself to save Leia, but the real conflict is all separate from what the Resistance is doing. SuperMechagodzilla fucked around with this message at 13:10 on Oct 20, 2020 |
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Oct 20, 2020 13:06
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That Finn rewrite stuff is fascinating. All in all I think it was probably a good choice not to have literally all of your new characters suddenly be Jedi, but boy did they fall to do anything interesting with him after the Force Awakens. Especially after John Boyega had such a memorable and enigmatic performance in that film. Seeing headlines about him swearing off Star Wars, complaining about the last Jedi and his general anger at Disney for perceived racism, at first I thought that was just partly actor ego, thinking they deserved a bigger part, but I then read about how he would receive death threats from fans, be edited out of Chinese posters, and generally be used / treated specifically for the demographics and I'm all too sadly reminded that people loving suck. No wonder everyone involved in the sequel trilogies are bitter.
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Oct 20, 2020 13:36
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ungulateman posted:poe surviving makes more sense in a universe where tlj is an even more obvious retread of esb and he's on the boat with finn and they kiss Halloween Jack posted:STAR WARS
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Oct 20, 2020 15:20
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Jedi Finn probably would have made Rey joining Kylo in 8 more viable
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Oct 20, 2020 17:26
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Leia Poppins gets even funnier when she flies to the door, which everyone is running to open to get her inside ...forgetting it opens into the vacuum of space
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Oct 20, 2020 17:27
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Isometric Bacon posted:That Finn rewrite stuff is fascinating. All in all I think it was probably a good choice not to have literally all of your new characters suddenly be Jedi, but boy did they fall to do anything interesting with him after the Force Awakens. Especially after John Boyega had such a memorable and enigmatic performance in that film.
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Oct 20, 2020 18:27
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Simplex posted:That's the problem. You take away that arc and there is basically nothing for him to do. He's the love interest from any 80s action film, but he doesn't even get laid. He's not even that; as said before, he turns into the black comic relief from any 80s action film, at best. Between him and Cyborg in Justice League, it's been a bad time to be a black man in a franchise movie cast in what's supposed to be a leading role; as soon as the studio gets cold feet on anything they cut you down to comic relief to make room for more white people to do nothing.
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Oct 20, 2020 18:33
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Ghost Leviathan posted:He's not even that; as said before, he turns into the black comic relief from any 80s action film, at best. I was legit stunned when I heard how the hosed over Ray Fisher with that. I mean I knew a lot of his scenes got cut just like how a ton of other stuff got cut from it but I hadn't known until more recently that originally he was to be a major part in uniting everyone together over what's up with the mother boxes/etc. instead of just another person Batman/WW recruit. That recent Avengers game too, the main character of the game's story is Kamala Khan, I literally had no idea til like a week after the game came out.
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Oct 20, 2020 18:53
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Thinking back on it, I guess Last Jedi did try do something with him, giving him and Kellie Marie Tran a almost 'love' story, exploring his initial reluctance to die for the resistance, growing into a want to sacrifice himself for the cause, before being literally pushed back into reality at how a silly idea that is. I really liked all that. It was the b-plot casino planet slog in-between that really dragged it down. The resolution with Phasma was also pretty unsatisfying after the build up in Force Awakens. I've almost successfully entirely blocked Rise of the Skywalker from my memory, and barely remember what he did in that film at all. I wanted to say that they should have done more with the fact he was an ex stormtrooper, but then I remembered ROTS had ex stormtroopers on horses for some reason.
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Oct 20, 2020 20:51
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Jannah has to be some kind of all time record for how late you can introduce a character that's on the poster. She may have been introduced after the two hour mark
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Oct 20, 2020 21:26
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Isometric Bacon posted:Thinking back on it, I guess Last Jedi did try do something with him, giving him and Kellie Marie Tran a almost 'love' story, exploring his initial reluctance to die for the resistance, growing into a want to sacrifice himself for the cause, before being literally pushed back into reality at how a silly idea that is. The annoying part is that there's almost something there. They even filmed part of it for TLJ. There's a silly deleted scene with Tom Hardy playing a Stormtrooper who recognizes Finn in an elevator, that's also actually pretty funny, but plays up that Finn's story could start actually being told as a Stormtrooper who started becoming something bigger. Sure, he thought Finn was promoted instead of being a traitor, but add it to the also deleted alternate scene of Phasma being outed by Finn in front of the other Stormtroopers as being the one who lowered the shields on Starkiller base, and you start to have something. Then, you could have used that to build on when introducing the Stormtroopers who defected in The Rise of Skywalker. Like, maybe they heard Finn's story and were inspired to move against the First Order, too. Stand on their own like he did. Then Finn is leading a Stormtrooper rebellion. As it is, you...kind of get that? But it appearance only, without any of the actual story to back it up. It's weird that they just cut it out, but kept the bones in there anyway. It really wouldn't have been hard to make the connections, and it would have given the sequel trilogy something unique, at least, and given Finn's character some purpose. thrawn527 fucked around with this message at 21:39 on Oct 20, 2020 |
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Oct 20, 2020 21:36
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thrawn527 posted:The annoying part is that there's almost something there. They even filmed part of it for TLJ. There's a silly deleted scene with Tom Hardy playing a Stormtrooper who recognizes Finn in an elevator, that's also actually pretty funny, but plays up that Finn's story could start actually being told as a Stormtrooper who started becoming something bigger. Sure, he thought Finn was promoted instead of being a traitor, but add it to the also deleted alternate scene of Phasma being outed by Finn in front of the other Stormtroopers as being the one who lowered the shields on Starkiller base, and you start to have something. Disney wanted to avoid any potential negative portrayal of black people as revolutionaries so in the ST they limited them to partying and fathering numerous bastard children across the galaxy.
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Oct 20, 2020 21:46
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Don't forget dressing up in animal skins and riding into battle with spears against space aircraft carriers.
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Oct 20, 2020 21:51
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Ingmar terdman posted:Jannah has to be some kind of all time record for how late you can introduce a character that's on the poster. She may have been introduced after the two hour mark It's wild that a character worse than zori bliss appears in a movie already containing zori bliss
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Oct 20, 2020 21:52
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I mean, they introduced Jannah in The Force Awakens when she was part of a squad of stormtroopers that attacked some innocents and she didn't partake in the killing and was named Finn for some reason I guess the mitosis occurred at some point in the year between TLJ and RoS?
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Oct 20, 2020 21:58
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No Mods No Masters posted:It's wild that a character worse than zori bliss appears in a movie already containing zori bliss These action figures will never be gone from the shelves. They are the new constable zuvio Also remember constable zuvio
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Oct 21, 2020 08:56
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CelticPredator posted:These action figures will never be gone from the shelves. They are the new constable zuvio Rise of Zuvio: A Star Wars Story
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Oct 21, 2020 10:29
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No Mods No Masters posted:It's wild that a character worse than zori bliss appears in a movie already containing zori bliss Jannah should have been a power ranger too 
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Oct 21, 2020 11:40
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thrawn527 posted:The annoying part is that there's almost something there. They even filmed part of it for TLJ. There's a silly deleted scene with Tom Hardy playing a Stormtrooper who recognizes Finn in an elevator, that's also actually pretty funny, but plays up that Finn's story could start actually being told as a Stormtrooper who started becoming something bigger. Sure, he thought Finn was promoted instead of being a traitor, but add it to the also deleted alternate scene of Phasma being outed by Finn in front of the other Stormtroopers as being the one who lowered the shields on Starkiller base, and you start to have something. Finn and Rose's entire side story would have been justified if at the end they talked about the legend of Finn instead of the legend of Skywalker and showed some more storm troopers abandoning ship instead a slave kid Finn and Rose failed to free repeating the horrible inertness of the Jedi in Phantom Menace. Hell I think someone mentioned earlier but Jannah (sp?) and the other troopers who jumped ship in Rise of Skywalker probably should have been introduced then instead of appearing like 2+ hours into Rise of Skywalker and then riding horses on top of a Star Destroyer. Like, why would expend extra effort to evoke the Star Trek V poster lmao Neo Rasa fucked around with this message at 14:16 on Oct 21, 2020 |
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Oct 21, 2020 14:12
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THEORY: Jannah was a studio-mandated replacement both FN and Rose, which is why she’s horse-themed.
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Oct 21, 2020 14:21
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My cynical theory is they just wanted a black woman on the poster and on the press tour
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Oct 21, 2020 15:58
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According to Terrio:Chris Terrio posted:Jannah's company came about because we thought, "Well, where does Finn belong?" First of all, he needs to learn that he's not the only one with a conscience. He's not the only one who said, "No." His family is Rey and Poe and the Resistance, but he needs to find another family. So he ends up being the leader of the group that said, "No."
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Oct 21, 2020 19:00
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"Finn has a family but he needs another family." ???
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Oct 21, 2020 19:55
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I can’t stand these movies lol
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Oct 21, 2020 20:02
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Vinylshadow posted:"Finn has a family but he needs another family." 'He should be with his own kind'
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Oct 21, 2020 20:03
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multijoe posted:'He should be with his own kind' God drat lmao
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Oct 21, 2020 20:12
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You hate to see the good name of CD golden boy Chris T. being dragged through the mud. But perhaps even he wasn't immune to JJ's brain worms
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Oct 21, 2020 20:13
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multijoe posted:'He should be with his own kind' He's already with Poe and Rey though. Even more redundancy! Hooray!
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Oct 21, 2020 22:21
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No Mods No Masters posted:You hate to see the good name of CD golden boy Chris T. being dragged through the mud. But perhaps even he wasn't immune to JJ's brain worms It’s important to look at the context behind PR stuff, because (in this case) Disney had already nixed multiple versions of the Stormtrooper Revolt plotline. It seems like ensuring that the revolt takes place entirely offscreen, plus spinning it as “FAMILY”, let em get past the censors. SuperMechagodzilla fucked around with this message at 22:35 on Oct 21, 2020 |
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Oct 21, 2020 22:23
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cargohills posted:Guy Henry apparently played a young version of a Cushing character in something else before (I don't remember what) so had some prior experience with imitating him. Plus he sort of has the cheekbones. I saw him in Harry Potter recently for the first time after seeing Rogue One, and unfortunately the dude just moves his face like a strange zombie which (in my opinion) totally amplified the uncanny valley poo poo. I still think they should have just recast the character.
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Oct 21, 2020 22:26
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