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Nessus posted:The closest thing to a parallel I can perceive now are the rise of various podcasts and none of them seem to have become institutions the way Rush Limbaugh apparently did. The medium is also intrinsically different and harder to access completely casually. On the other hand, you get that parasocial fandom stuff. Who knows what it will be like in ten years. a dozen father coughlins with a hundred thousand zoomers at their command each
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Nov 16, 2020 23:52
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goethe.cx posted:Cum Town will do for the left what Rush Limbaugh did for the right I don't know what "cum town" is, but that sounds like a very bad thing.
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Nov 16, 2020 23:53
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How are u posted:I don't know what "cum town" is, but that sounds like a very bad thing. lol
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Nov 16, 2020 23:56
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How are u posted:I don't know what "cum town" is, but that sounds like a very bad thing. It's a podcast that is basically a living, breathing embodiment of the "problematic leftists" stereotype that the center loves to propagate on twitter. It's also frequently extremely funny.
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Nov 17, 2020 00:00
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https://twitter.com/Claire_FOX5/status/1328462537311055875 Yeesh. Although they netted Trump +800 votes, I'm sure that the right wing media machine will approach this issue with reason and judiciousness. https://mobile.twitter.com/igorbobic/status/1328476484307210240 Which of course explains the endless mainstream media investigations into voter fraud in Graham's Senate race zoux fucked around with this message at 00:20 on Nov 17, 2020 |
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Nov 17, 2020 00:17
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https://www.cnn.com/election/2020/exit-polls/president/national-results Exit polls that break down age and race. As expected, Trump lost all age brackets up to 49, though that varies significantly by state, and these are national polls so that is what you'd expect for the 5-point curbstomping that the popular vote was. According to this exit poll, Biden lost the 18-29 white vote. Democrats have managed to win the white youth vote a few times (Clinton 1992 and Obama 2008) when they land a decisive victory. Young white voters are still clearly less conservative than their parents even when Republicans win them narrowly, so the political difference is not purely a matter of young voters being a larger percent minorities as some think. https://www.vox.com/2020/11/7/21552248/youth-vote-2020-georgia-biden-covid-19-racism-climate-change This exit poll disagrees and has Biden winning the 18-29 white vote so idk. Note: I do not think either of these are particularly good exit polls. Probably about as useful as polls in general so... yeah. Acknowledge their limitations and use them as a ballpark only.
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Nov 17, 2020 00:19
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Majorian posted:It's a podcast that is basically a living, breathing embodiment of the "problematic leftists" stereotype that the center loves to propagate on twitter. TLDR: it’s a bunch of leftists who say “fag” and “retard” unironically
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Nov 17, 2020 00:31
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Ok Comboomer posted:TLDR: it’s a bunch of
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Nov 17, 2020 00:34
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Rigel posted:Where is this blazing hot take of "actually, millennials can be pretty conservative too/young voters wont save us" nonsense coming from? They voted for Biden 2:1... at around 43% turnout in a good year, which puts current confirmed confirmed liberal supporters at only about 29% of the electorate,with confirmed conservatives being about 15% of it. What the demographic is actually going to look like when they get older and more of those voters are activated is an open question. Older generations regularly see turnout of 60-70% - that's about 25% of the demographic whose political views are not obvious or potentially quite malleable.
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Nov 17, 2020 00:37
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Ok Comboomer posted:TLDR: it’s a bunch of leftists who say “fag” and “retard” unironically
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Nov 17, 2020 00:37
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zoux posted:https://twitter.com/Claire_FOX5/status/1328462537311055875 Floyd county is a democrat or Republican one? I'm sure the GOP won't care
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Nov 17, 2020 00:42
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GlyphGryph posted:They voted for Biden 2:1... at around 43% turnout in a good year, which puts current confirmed confirmed liberal supporters at only about 29% of the electorate,with confirmed conservatives being about 15% of it. Given that they didn't come of age during the Cold War, and have, on average, not had as positive experiences with capitalism as their parents and grandparents, I'm optimistic that they will at least not become fervent defenders of the system like the Boomers did.
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Nov 17, 2020 00:44
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If we're relying on exit polling data to measure much of anything surrounding in 2020, aren't those numbers going to be really wonky given how many people voted by mail and the huge disparity between GOP vs. DEM turnout on election day versus in person voting? I'm not sure how you can account for this disparity given these really unusual circumstances and the unique context of this year's election. It'd be like trying to measure baseball statistics where half of the teams only sent 1/3 of their players on game days or something.
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Nov 17, 2020 00:50
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TulliusCicero posted:Floyd county is a democrat or Republican one? I'm sure the GOP won't care Trump won 70% of the votes in the county so...
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Nov 17, 2020 00:51
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Yikes https://twitter.com/redistrict/status/1328459932237230087?s=21
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Nov 17, 2020 00:52
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Ok Comboomer posted:TLDR: it’s a bunch of leftists who say “fag” and “retard” unironically I wouldn't expect people who talk like that could possibly be considered Leftists 
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Nov 17, 2020 00:58
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Running on "Trump bad" instead of on issues like they did in the midterms did poorly, you say
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Nov 17, 2020 00:59
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But Robby Mook looked so good on paper.  (Ron Howard: he didn't) Seriously, though, a lot of (metaphorical) heads deserve to roll, because this has been a bad election downballot. Lemming posted:Running on "Trump bad" instead of on issues like they did in the midterms did poorly, you say Yeah, who'da thunk not tying Trump to the rest of the elected members of his party would do so poorly as a strategy?
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Nov 17, 2020 01:01
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Shammypants posted:This election was something. Areas hit hardest by covid leaned Trump. Areas devastated economically leaned Trump. Hispanic and Asians often convinced Trump was helpful economically. Somehow, through the virus and downturn and failure to provide more stimulus and effectively distribute loans, Trump seemed to benefit electorally. Trump was a weird loving figure, and speculating about what will happen with Hispanics now that he's gone, or Asians or young people is really anyone's guess.
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Nov 17, 2020 01:03
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How many of these were '18 flips? Also they might win one https://twitter.com/Redistrict/status/1328487760802443266
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Nov 17, 2020 01:05
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So I found a hot take regarding our electoral future from some admin from another debate forum:quote:Are you actually arguing that Democrats should rely on sky-high black voter turnout as their main political strategy? That may have worked for the first black President and for someone as epically racist as Trump but what's your evidence it would work in the future? Do you goons think we're headed towards latin american style politics?
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Nov 17, 2020 01:09
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Are the dems going to have a two seat majority when this is all done?
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Nov 17, 2020 01:10
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So, what do we think Dems can do to claw back some of the non-college vote? Obviously this is mostly white people but not exclusively at this point. What issues can the Dems run on that would help? What should they try to minimize? I wonder if the Dems missed a big opportunity to hit Trump on his corruption. Obama/Romney was clearly a class election, Clinton/Trump was a race election, and Biden/Trump was like a personality or competency one. Then again, not all non college voters are lower class. A lot of Trump voters are actually fairly well off. Potential popular issues: Legal weed $15 minimum wage (Biden ran on this!) Federal Jobs Guarantee ??? UBI? M4A? I'd have to dive into the Trump voter preferences to see what you'd need to avoid. Immigration, guns? You probably can't win back any evangelicals so abortion is probably fine. Part of the problem is that (I'm cribbing from somewhere else) Dems aren't gonna go full anti-trade, anti-immigration. I think those were vital parts of that message. What are some executive orders Biden could do that would positively affect people? The big talk is about student debt, and that might help some of these people's children, but what else is there?
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Nov 17, 2020 01:10
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Lemming posted:Running on "Trump bad" instead of on issues like they did in the midterms did poorly, you say Majorian posted:Yeah, who'da thunk not tying Trump to the rest of the elected members of his party would do so poorly as a strategy? Yeah [idea that validates my bias] would definitely have won, over [my characterization of why dems lost]. I don't think there's enough data yet to make sweeping statements about downballot.
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Nov 17, 2020 01:12
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Grouchio posted:So I found a hot take regarding our electoral future from some admin from another debate forum: I don't think we're going to have the intelligence agency from the super power to the north of us assassinate our leaders or organize coups in our land. So no.
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Nov 17, 2020 01:12
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Trumpism doesn't lose "despite events happening"; political movements don't exist independent of events.
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Nov 17, 2020 01:12
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Grouchio posted:Do you goons think we're headed towards latin american style politics? I think that there are a whole lot of Democrats and left-wing individuals in general who are determined to spin anything less than total, absolute victory into a defeat.
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Nov 17, 2020 01:13
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Lemming posted:Running on "Trump bad" instead of on issues like they did in the midterms did poorly, you say Did they not run on issues? I'd like to see the numbers on who ran ahead vs who ran behind Biden. I know some of the moderates who lost ran ahead of Biden, but it wasn't enough. Trump being on the ballot got a lot of people voting R, and also once people were convinced Biden would win, a lot of people split their ticket.
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Nov 17, 2020 01:13
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What's the process for admitting DC and Puerto Rico as states? Presumably it's something that needs to go through both houses of congress?
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Nov 17, 2020 01:14
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Jaxyon posted:Yeah [idea that validates my bias] would definitely won over [my characterization of why dems lost]. Did Democrats not run with a specific focus on healthcare in 2018, which was massively successful, and not repeat that specific focus in 2020?
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Nov 17, 2020 01:15
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Also, it's impossible to know what the Democrats would've run on without coronavirus. They were talking about coronavirus because that's what their cohort was worried about. In the absence of a pandemic, they run on something else. What, exactly? I'm not sure that we know. They seem to be comparing the Republicans not having to run on coronavirus to the Democrats still running on coronavirus if coronavirus doesn't exist (??).
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Nov 17, 2020 01:16
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jackofarcades posted:Did they not run on issues? I'd like to see the numbers on who ran ahead vs who ran behind Biden. I know some of the moderates who lost ran ahead of Biden, but it wasn't enough. Trump being on the ballot got a lot of people voting R, and also once people were convinced Biden would win, a lot of people split their ticket. Healthcare was the broad focus of the Democratic party as a whole in 2018, which was emphasized in the different downballot races. Biden did *not* run on that as a specific thing, his campaign focus was "the soul of the nation," this ephemeral idea of having certain values that Trump didn't share. The presidential election takes a lot of oxygen out of the room to discuss any other issues. You could try to make an argument that Biden wasn't completely ignoring the issues (he was), but you could not make the argument that the 2020 election was as issues focused as 2018
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Nov 17, 2020 01:18
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Majorian posted:Given that they didn't come of age during the Cold War, and have, on average, not had as positive experiences with capitalism as their parents and grandparents, I'm optimistic that they will at least not become fervent defenders of the system like the Boomers did. Of any information I've been exposed to (although, this is going to end up explicitly race-centric and isolated from a more representative collection of americans) it decidedly appears that zoomers are even more disabused of neoliberal concepts and even more permanently progressive, and will probably be less conservative overall than even millenials are. Neither generation is sufficiently conservative to float nationally viable representative numbers for conservatives, unless the system ends up even more dramatically packed to favor republican candidates, and both generations are intractably so. The primary difference I see in the two generations is that zoomers don't harbor the same 'lost paradise' dissatisfactions. Millenials were raised with the expectation of being able to achieve the same reasonable economic markers and goals as their parents, and had to undergo the experience of watching that fall away from them. They have a lot of discontent and views that were essentially built from the experience of watching livable adult "milestones" get permanently thrust from their reach, leaving them feeling like they were always in an awkward state of non-conversion into adulthood or 'success.' There's a consistent undertone of grievance. Zoomers/Zennials didn't really get to experience the same experience of watching the ladder get pulled up behind the boomers. They didn't have to be disabused of expectations, they just grew up sort of understanding that, lol, the system was never for them. They didn't have to engage in a conspicuous conversion to disaffected progressivism, it was just ... native. The generations are likely to be close cohort allies in american politics. They share far more values than they differ on. American conservatives do not have an answer to it, demographically. Their only option is illiberalism and ensuring that the system permits transitional forms of antidemocratic minority rule.
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Nov 17, 2020 01:19
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If you don’t count COVID as an issue, then sure you can say this wasn’t an issues election. “But aside from that, how was the play Mrs Lincoln?”
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Nov 17, 2020 01:20
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Just a heads up, this thread is going to be closed within the next few days with a rebooted thread to follow shortly thereafter. If you haven't reached out to either myself or GreyjoyBastard or Majorian with any suggestions you have for the reboot, please feel free to do so. Thanks!
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Nov 17, 2020 01:21
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Blessings to Polliwonks, good thread 🐸
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Nov 17, 2020 01:22
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Lemming posted:Did Democrats not run with a specific focus on healthcare in 2018, which was massively successful, and not repeat that specific focus in 2020? Literally saw the same exact posts leading up to 2018, that dems were leaning too heard on Trump Bad and not enough on real issues, and then when it looked like they weren't doing well election night people said the same thing, and then in retrospect the narrative changed. Now people are using the results of this election as a Rorschach test of their grievances with the dems and there isn't enough data yet.
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Nov 17, 2020 01:22
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whydirt posted:If you don’t count COVID as an issue, then sure you can say this wasn’t an issues election. You could easily sum up the 2018 election as the Democrats making a pitch that if they controlled the House, they would stop the Republicans from dismantling Obamacare and protecting pre-existing conditions, and the electorate found that extremely compelling and elected them in a wave. What would you sum up the Democratic COVID response plan as, in contrast to what Trump has done?
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Nov 17, 2020 01:22
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jackofarcades posted:
Legal weed, $15/hr, COVID relief, and a massive infrastructure bill with a jobs guarantee tied to it. And just give Republicans all the tax cuts they want in exchange. Give them whatever pork they want in their states too. If nothing else, I think Biden believes in the transactional nature of politics vs Obama’s grand vision stuff, so I’m hopeful.
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Nov 17, 2020 01:31
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Jaxyon posted:Yeah [idea that validates my bias] would definitely have won, over [my characterization of why dems lost]. At this point, given how poorly the Dems fared downticket, it's hard to come up with any other conclusion.
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Nov 17, 2020 01:33
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