|
Tank Abbot tried to throw a guy out of the ring once. Lifted a grown man that didn't want to be lifted up over his head and tried to toss them over a 7 foot fence. They stopped him because they weren't sure if that would mean he won or not. Tank Abbot is a treasure.
|
#
?
Nov 3, 2020 22:51
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 16, 2024 02:47 |
|
|
Isn't tank Abbott also the guy who won by ko then mocked his opponent by mimicking the seizure he was having on the ground?
|
|
#
?
Nov 3, 2020 23:02
|
|
|
Tank is a good example of how being from the dojo of Big and Mean can be effective
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2020 00:05
|
|
|
ilmucche posted:Isn't tank Abbott also the guy who won by ko then mocked his opponent by mimicking the seizure he was having on the ground? You'd like to think being humble has something to do with being good at kicking the poo poo outta people but its usually the opposite.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2020 12:22
|
|
|
ilmucche posted:Isn't tank Abbott also the guy who won by ko then mocked his opponent by mimicking the seizure he was having on the ground? Haha, yeah. He's the best!
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2020 14:15
|
|
|
isaboo posted:Tank is a good example of how being from the dojo of Big and Mean can be effective See also Goodridge comma Gary.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2020 17:29
|
|
|
Dawgstar posted:See also Goodridge comma Gary. Counterpoint: Bob sapp
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2020 22:40
|
|
|
ilmucche posted:Counterpoint: Bob sapp There's exceptions to every rule. And thinking about it even Big Daddy ran into somebody almost as big, definitely meaner and actually knew how to fight in Don Frye.
|
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2020 00:49
|
|
|
Tank Abbott is a loving rear end in a top hat
|
|
#
?
Nov 8, 2020 19:02
|
|
|
Bob Sapp was never mean though. He knew he was there to lose and he had no interest in taking more damage than he had to. As soon as he was in anything even resembling trouble, he tapped, collected his paycheck, and signed up for the next fight. He made a decent amount of money and kept his brain mostly intact. UFC 1 is just so glorious. You had the one glove boxer as previously mentioned who tapped because the fight went to the ground and he knew in that instant that this was not for him. Then you had the sumo guy vs the savate fighter. The savate dude kicked the sumo guy in the mouth basically straightaway and knocked several of the guy's teeth out (this was pre mouth guards in MMA for some loving reason). Savate dude went backstage and had to make a tough choice: remove the teeth embedded in his foot and risk an infection or leave them in and keep fighting. He left them in. He ended up in 2nd place and lost to Gracie because basically no one but Shamrock knew anything about grappling, but he was tapped out in the semis.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2020 08:44
|
|
|
I just started watching this and I have a very important question: does this show ever stop being about Danny's terribly-written daughter and general high school drama because I desperately want to skip every scene with that poo poo to get back to the middle aged men and their karate.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 16:58
|
|
|
Lurdiak posted:I just started watching this and I have a very important question: does this show ever stop being about Danny's terribly-written daughter and general high school drama because I desperately want to skip every scene with that poo poo to get back to the middle aged men and their karate. Not really, in season 2 it morphs into high school karate turf wars if that's any help.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 17:04
|
|
|
No, after they get the story rolling with Johnny opening the dojo, it's always about half and half with the high schoolers and the old people. The show's about how the old men and their karate influence the high schoolers and vice versa, so you kinda need both halves.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 17:10
|
|
|
One half is significantly more obnoxious than the other.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 17:12
|
|
|
Lurdiak posted:I just started watching this and I have a very important question: does this show ever stop being about Danny's terribly-written daughter and general high school drama because I desperately want to skip every scene with that poo poo to get back to the middle aged men and their karate. Not really, no. But that's odd because I saw it more as Johnny's redemptive arc and square peg 80's guy on the comeback trail than I did the kids so much. To me, he was the central character and basically becomes a hero to a large extent. The daughter comes in to her own a bit more in later episodes but if you're expecting the HS stuff to just go away you might want to bail on it. The show is sort of about how toxic masculinity, bullying and bad parenting directly effect the teenage kids so high school is rather central. If you're just starting out, general consensus is that S2 isn't as good as S1 so if you're early in on it and don't like it so far you might want to check out. You do you but I was seriously addicted to this thing once I dove in and couldn't stop watching it. "what time is it? 11:00? I can do one more episode." I didn't have any problems with the daughter character or any of the HS poo poo.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 17:14
|
|
BiggerBoat posted:Not really, no. I understand what they're going for thematically, but the character writing and the plot beats involving the teens are so "I've seen this before". The thing with the daughter's former friend getting a viral video made of her at the school dance feels like it could've been in degrassi in 2008. Plus her friends are such obvious shitheads that I'm siding with the dad as he tries to control her life, which I'm pretty sure is not what the show wants me to feel. I'm probably supposed to side with the bizarrely permissive mom instead who seems to think anything short of immolating a hobo is just normal teen behavior.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 17:18
|
|
|
Well, that's kinda the charm. It feels like an old 80s-90s TV show, only updated to the present day.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 17:26
|
|
|
Lurdiak posted:I understand what they're going for thematically, but the character writing and the plot beats involving the teens are so "I've seen this before". The thing with the daughter's former friend getting a viral video made of her at the school dance feels like it could've been in degrassi in 2008. Plus her friends are such obvious shitheads that I'm siding with the dad as he tries to control her life, which I'm pretty sure is not what the show wants me to feel. I'm probably supposed to side with the bizarrely permissive mom instead who seems to think anything short of immolating a hobo is just normal teen behavior. Not necessarily. With a few exceptions, I found the lines are a little blurred about who's a good guy or a bad guy and most of the characters are flawed yet relatable and for various easily understandable reasons. I've read plenty of opinions that diss both the permissive mom as well as Daniel. There's only one or two just flat out unambiguous motherfuckers and several characters are shown changing throughout, for better and for worse, over the course of the show. I guess you could say some of them are one dimensional but I didn't really see it that way for the most part.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 17:31
|
|
|
I guess I wasn't expecting all this soap opera energy in a continuation to a series with very clearly defined good guys and bad guys.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 17:50
|
|
|
Phenotype posted:Well, that's kinda the charm. It feels like an old 80s-90s TV show, only updated to the present day. Also with the 80's action movie trope of all problems both caused and solved by karate!
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 18:00
|
|
|
Lurdiak posted:I understand what they're going for thematically, but the character writing and the plot beats involving the teens are so "I've seen this before". The thing with the daughter's former friend getting a viral video made of her at the school dance feels like it could've been in degrassi in 2008. Plus her friends are such obvious shitheads that I'm siding with the dad as he tries to control her life, which I'm pretty sure is not what the show wants me to feel. I'm probably supposed to side with the bizarrely permissive mom instead who seems to think anything short of immolating a hobo is just normal teen behavior. That's the whole point. It's an 80s teen drama, juxtaposed with modern sensibilities, as well as a deconstruction of 'what would people who actually were in 80s teen dramas turn out like?'
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 18:24
|
|
|
Lurdiak posted:I guess I wasn't expecting all this soap opera energy in a continuation to a series with very clearly defined good guys and bad guys. Yes, Daniel always was the bad guy; hitting on Johnny's girl, suckerpunching Johnny, trying to get him in trouble, spraying him with water for no good reason, then winning a tournament with an illegal kick to the face. I don't think he did anything terribly egregious in KK2. KK3 though, he stole, he lied, he turned to violence to solve his problems.....
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 18:26
|
|
TheCenturion posted:Yes, Daniel always was the bad guy; hitting on Johnny's girl, suckerpunching Johnny, trying to get him in trouble, spraying him with water for no good reason, then winning a tournament with an illegal kick to the face. Ugh it's like I'm reading a cracked article from 2005.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 18:53
|
|
|
What I want in season 3 is for Sam to have a bit of bloodlust awakened following the experience with Tory, and maybe even seek a bit of revenge against the wishes of her father. When Amanda finds out she'll naturally flip on Daniel as she tends to, but it'd be an interesting reversal if Sam takes his side - contrasting the first season's distance between the two. With how dismissive Amanda was about the karate thing right up until the fight I could see that putting a real strain on the marriage. I mean, what did you expect shacking up with a former teen karate champ - that he'd just be happy selling cars the rest of his life and not punching people (in controlled settings admittedly, not kicking a drink out of Tom Cole's hands).
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 18:54
|
|
|
Lurdiak posted:Ugh it's like I'm reading a cracked article from 2005. Or, you know, watching Cobra Kai, where Johnny describes it all as this.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 19:18
|
|
|
So the scene at the beginning of Karate Kid 2 where Kreese physically attacks Johnny for losing was filmed for and supposed to be included in part 1. It makes the theme of bullying being a cycle (a theme that Cobra Kai is basically entirely about) way more apparent. It is kind of a bummer that the original went for a more black and white situation where Johnny was just a rich douche with no nuance, but it is very good that Cobra Kai grows out of and explores the idea that bullying is self perpetuating and that defaulting to karate kicking is worse than talking and exploring what you have in common (also I like the light retcon that while Johnny had the appearance of being rich it turns out that he himself had more in common with Daniel, having a single mother who took a path that was more about giving her son a better life).
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 19:51
|
|
|
Lurdiak posted:Ugh it's like I'm reading a cracked article from 2005. Well it's canon. Cobra Kai is literally this turned into a show: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_Gz_iTuRMM
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 20:02
|
|
MiddleOne posted:Well it's canon. Cobra Kai is literally this turned into a show: My dude, I just watched season 1 and even Johnny's flashback shows that he was the bad guy.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 20:34
|
|
|
Saying Daniel is the real bully is stupid, Johnny and like 4 of his friends beat the poo poo out of a kid half their size for pouring some water on them, that's clearly way over the line. Again, the interesting thing is that Johnny was acting out a cycle of abuse and that's what Cobra Kai is exploring not "well ackshooally Daniel was the bad guy and Johnny the good guy  "
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 20:41
|
|
|
Lurdiak posted:My dude, I just watched season 1 and even Johnny's flashback shows that he was the bad guy. Yeah, the show is saying now that roles are now reversed and Daniel isn't coming off the best. The first movie has Johnny acting like an abusive ex about the moment he hits the screen along with three counts of at the least aggravated assault.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 20:43
|
|
|
Johnny was definitely the "bad guy" in the first movie, with the show exploring the cycle of abuse and poor parental relationships. It works really well to show an antagonistic teenage relationship from the perspective of people who are now adults. What I also like about the show is that, while it's clear Daniel is the hero of the film, he was also a dick. Sure, he didn't deserve to get beat near to death for pouring water of Johnny, that's clearly a disproportionate response. He was being an escalating rear end doing it though. He constantly goes out of his way to rub Johnny's face in everything, which doesn't help the situation any. Mind you, it also feels pretty accurate to how some dumb toxic masculinity exposed teens would behave. Edit: I should be clear, Johnny still behaves like an awful person through most of the film. He repeatedly either straight up breaks the law or behaves in a super sketchy/abusive manner. I like that they show provides more background to demonstrate that this behaviour didn't just come out of nowhere. It still doesn't change the fact that he remains responsible for his actions. Lemony fucked around with this message at 20:51 on Nov 26, 2020 |
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 20:48
|
|
Lemony posted:Johnny was definitely the "bad guy" in the first movie, with the show exploring the cycle of abuse and poor parental relationships. It works really well to show an antagonistic teenage relationship from the perspective of people who are now adults. Well if you remember the movie, Daniel is stuck between either just spending his whole life running away and not getting any respect (Ali gets on his case pretty hard when he just bails from the Cobra Kai gang after like the third beatdown) or standing up for himself and getting his rear end beat nonstop. Miyagi shows him a third way, (technically fourth after going to their teacher is a bust) and he grows as a person from it. Like his goal for most of the movie is not getting beat on and humiliated every day at school, which is pretty relatable. Like with the 100 times Miyagi says karate should only be for defense, I don't think you can accuse the movie of reinforcing toxic masculinity that much.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 21:01
|
|
|
Johnny was always the bad guy, but Daniel wasn't a saint, and he really did go out of his way to antagonize Johnny. Yeah, Johnny had no claim on Ali at the time, yeah, a four-person gang bang was disproportionate to a stupid high school prank. I loved the scene in S1 where Johnny finds Miguel, in KK1 Skeleton costume, utterly shitkicked, exactly the way he and his boys tried to leave Daniel-san. Everybody is hurt, everybody is lashing out, and everybody is ultimately trying to solve communication issues with violence, be that violence physical, financial, or just authoritative; Daniel banning Cobra Kai from the tournament, Daniel getting CK's rent jacked, Daniel not listening to his daughter turfing out all her friends, Daniel kicking a drink out of the other dealership owner's hand, Daniel attacking Johnny for giving Sam a place to crash. And ultimately, I think the show is, at the same time that it examines cycles of violence and patterns of abuse, still tries to put forward the idea that people are ultimately responsible for their own actions. At the same time Johnny is trying to be better, and tries to help Kreese, Daniel is constantly ignoring Miyagi lessons while lamenting that Miyagi isn't around to tell him what to do.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 21:06
|
|
|
I think that's an oversimplification of Daniel's behavior, at least for season 1. He only starts being a dick when Cobra Kai returns because it brings back a lot of bad memories for him, but then there is a definite shift in his attitude when he visits Miyagi's grave and dusts off his karate outfit. While he's obviously still against Cobra Kai ideologically (and he's 100% correct to be) and thus opposes Johnny in that respect, he gets a hold of his worst instincts and stops letting things get to him as much and losing his temper. He becomes blatantly more miyagi-like, especially in his relationship with Robbie, and finds his balance again. Meanwhile Johnny grows as a person but not quite enough, and Cobra Kai's values twist his students in bad directions. Ultimately season 1 ends with Cobra Kai winning the tournament but its philosophy being shown to be the wrong one, and Miyagi-do Karate winning the ideological battle instead. Sure there's still nuance in there, and I'm sure season 2 will unbalance things again to, y'know, have a continuing story, but it's clear the story isn't saying both of these guys are equally bad. They just have some of the same flaws and baggage.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 21:14
|
|
|
Lurdiak posted:Like with the 100 times Miyagi says karate should only be for defense, I don't think you can accuse the movie of reinforcing toxic masculinity that much. Oh, I agree with this. The movie and the show both spend a lot of time illustrating that toxic masculinity is bad. Miyagi's whole thing is that sudden sharp violence is an okay thing to be capable of, so long as you are only ever using it as a last resort to defend yourself or others from harm. Kreese, on the other hand, is teaching that the ability to enact sudden violence on others is the goal in and of itself. I think someone earlier in the thread said something about it reflecting their respective wartime experiences and I'm inclined to agree. Most of Daniel's crappy actions in the film come from prior to Miyagi taking him on as a student, when Daniel is basically trying to fight back by acting almost like a copy of Johnny.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 21:15
|
|
|
Also I watched all 3 karate kid movies to prepare for this show and it is hilarious how unceremoniously each of Daniel's love interests are disposed of off-screen at the start of 2 and 3 so he can have increasingly boring new romantic subplots. Ali was the only interesting one so it's good that she's still a presence in the show. Also at the end of 2 the main rival guy just turns into a crazed suicidal murderer and has a bloody brawl with our lead, which is schlock and totally out of step for this series. There's a reason this show mostly focuses on the first one lol.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 21:19
|
|
|
Show references the hell out of the third movie which is bar none the best.  EDIT: Daniel bringing up the events of the third movie and Johnny being all 'I dont know anything about this lunacy' was such a great scene.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2020 23:38
|
|
|
MiddleOne posted:EDIT: Daniel bringing up the events of the third movie and Johnny being all 'I dont know anything about this lunacy' was such a great scene. What scene was that? The only reference to KK3 that I remember was Daniel fessing up to joining Cobra Kai temporarily.
|
|
#
?
Nov 27, 2020 02:36
|
|
|
Utgardaloki posted:What scene was that? The only reference to KK3 that I remember was Daniel fessing up to joining Cobra Kai temporarily. The meeting to get Cobra Kai allowed into the tournament in season 1.
|
|
#
?
Nov 27, 2020 02:47
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 16, 2024 02:47 |
|
|
All they really do is mention Terry Silver's name alongside Kreese's when reading off the ban decision. Which is a bit weird, since all of Terry's gross evil actions weren't things the committee should know about, but maybe he and Kreese threw a double tantrum in the parking lot after the credits started rolling and karate kicked someone's head off.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 27, 2020 03:42
|
|