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marshmallow creep posted:The first of the two sequels had some parts that I thought were genuinely more exciting than the original. But the third was so bloated and full of itself that I just wanted it be over more than an hour from the finish line. I wasn't really blown away by the first one when I watched it. Then the sequel went full steam ahead into dumbass blockbuster versions of seaman's yarn and I vibed with that a lot better. The two-parter has escalation on a scale of Lord of the Rings, which is just hilarious because the only thing the first Pirates movie has in common with LotR is that everybody has swords.
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Nov 27, 2020 18:55
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The second movie's plot takes so long to get going. It's like forty minutes of Sparrow shenanigans before we're even introduced to Davy Jones.
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Nov 27, 2020 19:09
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I bet the second two Pirates movies have some interesting streamlined fan edits out there. They're like Jackson's King Kong, a lot of good in them but just so ridiculously self-indulgent and stuffed to excess.
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Nov 27, 2020 19:15
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feedmyleg posted:I bet the second two Pirates movies have some interesting streamlined fan edits out there. They're like Jackson's King Kong, a lot of good in them but just so ridiculously self-indulgent and stuffed to excess. The fact that 2 and 3 are 151 and 168 minutes is loving insane. Spoilering just because I want everyone to guess how long they were because you'll STILL underestimate it.
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Nov 27, 2020 19:18
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in my mind the pirate lord poo poo is like an entire movie unto itself
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Nov 27, 2020 19:22
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I made a joke to someone earlier this year about how Margot Robbie can do anything and she'll probably be playing Queen Elizabeth I in a blockbuster trilogy of movies soon only to be reminded that she already played her and it was awesome.
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Nov 27, 2020 19:23
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unfortunateley for her and Samara Weaving they are always bound to cannibalize each other's roles
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Nov 27, 2020 19:26
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2 and 3 also occasionally dip into unexpectedly dark or weird territory. The second opens with a guy getting his eye pecked out, and the third with a kid getting hanged in imagery that specifically recalls the holocaust. That kind of made them interesting despite their unweildy narrative, which is more than I can say for 4 and 5.
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Nov 27, 2020 20:12
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Wait there was a fifth? The last I remember was Stranger Tides
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Nov 27, 2020 20:15
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Dead man tell no tales with Javier bardem as the villain. Better than 4 but still boring and pointless. Oddly enough it’s super similar to The rise of sky walker lol in terms of character reveals.
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Nov 27, 2020 20:28
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Looking forward to Dread Pirate Robbie.
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Nov 27, 2020 20:42
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The main problem with Pirates 2 & 3 is that they were being written in a big hurry and it was one of those situations where they had to start shooting without a finished script and while this is increasingly common with big blockbusters, here they weren't really able to bring it all together in the end. The second's kind of entertaining in the manner of old serials, where the plot just keeps throwing everyone hither and yon and there's not enough time to really think about anything, but then in the third they have to actually wrap everything up. Oddly enough, though, I think the third movie is where they finally got the swordplay to start working. In the first two movies it feels kind of weightless, just people hitting their swords against each other, but ISTR it working better in the third one. Too bad about everything else.
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Nov 27, 2020 20:50
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I preferred the 3rd Pirates compared to the second but I enjoy 3+ hour epics into fantasy like this. There's some great sets, costuming, scenery, etc. and it's allowed to be lived in and breathing and vibrant. I liked Peter's King Kong, LOTR, Hobbit, and like the Pirates, MoS, BvS, etc. movies. Though didn't bother with Pirates 4 and 5 except catching parts of it on the movie channels. Someone somewhere made a comment the heist to start the 5th movie is a take on FF5 and I loled because it kind of is. But I do agree Karloff's comment on Sparrow and Depp's performance and them somewhat missing the point of what made it magic in the moment. EDIT: I also like Ben Hur and Lawrence of Arabia so maybe I have some stamina for the longer movies. Gatts fucked around with this message at 20:59 on Nov 27, 2020 |
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Nov 27, 2020 20:55
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It's not just length, it's the amount of time you want to soak in that world. If someone is engaging and compelling I won't want it to stop. But if you give me something like Pirates that is a fun genre mashup but not a terribly interesting or compelling world to spend a ton of time in, I'm going to feel it drag and would prefer a more svelte version.
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Nov 27, 2020 21:23
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I watched the first three just last month after beginning the Aubrey Maturin books; from that perspective I greatly preferred the first film for being more grounded. Compared to its two direct sequels the first film is an an intimate slow burn grounded firmly in reality. I also strongly agree that it's difficult to remember just how good Sparrow is in the first movie, and how obviously aware of it they are starting with 2.
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Nov 27, 2020 21:40
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The third movie had so much politics, backstabbing and doublecrosses that one reviewer called it "Syriana with tricorner hats".
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Nov 27, 2020 23:22
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Gatts posted:I preferred the 3rd Pirates compared to the second but I enjoy 3+ hour epics into fantasy like this. There's some great sets, costuming, scenery, etc. and it's allowed to be lived in and breathing and vibrant. I liked Peter's King Kong, LOTR, Hobbit, and like the Pirates, MoS, BvS, etc. movies. Though didn't bother with Pirates 4 and 5 except catching parts of it on the movie channels. Someone somewhere made a comment the heist to start the 5th movie is a take on FF5 and I loled because it kind of is. Third has the best sword battle (jack and Davy on top of the ship as it’s going around a cyclone while will and Liz are getting married) because it’s so stupid and the Zimmer music is blasting and it’s dumb but fun.
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Nov 28, 2020 00:48
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My friend fell asleep during Pirates 3 twice.
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Nov 28, 2020 01:16
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I mean if you're going to watch people on a ship do stuff the best one is Master and Commander. That's legit.
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Nov 28, 2020 02:51
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The Boss Baby crawling across the ceiling towards the camera is a Trainspotting reference and no one can convince me otherwise
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Nov 28, 2020 03:37
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Grendels Dad posted:I wasn't really blown away by the first one when I watched it. Then the sequel went full steam ahead into dumbass blockbuster versions of seaman's yarn and I vibed with that a lot better. The two-parter has escalation on a scale of Lord of the Rings, which is just hilarious because the only thing the first Pirates movie has in common with LotR is that everybody has swords. Didnt the second on end with a kraken fight cliffhanger and the third one picks up without showing what happened. Is this a fever dream E: also holy lol comparing Ben Hur and Lawrence of Arabia to the Hobbit Even Ben Hur is a fantastic loving epic and to compare it to a 40 min Dwarf meal jesus christ Shageletic fucked around with this message at 03:45 on Nov 28, 2020 |
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Nov 28, 2020 03:42
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Shageletic posted:Didnt the second on end with a kraken fight cliffhanger and the third one picks up without showing what happened. Is this a fever dream The kraken fight ends with Sparrow and the Pearl getting dragged under the sea, then the reveal that Beckett has Jones' heart. And then in the third one, the kraken is just dead on a beach and everyone gets kind of sad about it.
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Nov 28, 2020 03:46
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I remember that I didn't even realize that thing was the kraken until way later. The Barbossa reveal at the end of 2 was great, though.
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Nov 28, 2020 03:49
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marshmallow creep posted:The first of the two sequels had some parts that I thought were genuinely more exciting than the original. But the third was so bloated and full of itself that I just wanted it be over more than an hour from the finish line. It also contains the worst pre battle speech in movie history. Speaking of the final battle, it spends some massive chunk of its running time with the good guys gathering a massive fleet, and the massive fleet just sits there (as does the baddies fleet) while two, possibly three ships duke it out. Alan Smithee posted:unfortunateley for her and Samara Weaving they are always bound to cannibalize each other's roles I genuinely didn't realise they were different people for a good while. It was like Mia Kirshner and Natasha Leggero all over again. Vandar posted:The kraken fight ends with Sparrow and the Pearl getting dragged under the sea, then the reveal that Beckett has Jones' heart. I have a feeling that was because they'd written themselves into a corner with the kraken. The (admittedly fantastic) fight against it towards the end of the second one, makes it nigh unkillable. It's also a narrative cheat. The heroes can't really get around while it's about, so simply remove it from the plot and suddenly it's a lot easier for everyone to get around. There's also the way that 2 and 3's scripts feel completely pasted together. There's a good chance that they started writing 3 without accounting for the kraken and then went 'oh, poo poo, what happened to that massively important thing from the last movie?'
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Nov 28, 2020 05:25
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Edit: wrong thread
Teriyaki Hairpiece fucked around with this message at 14:02 on Nov 28, 2020 |
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Nov 28, 2020 06:06
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Pirates 1 is still the best in the series; 2 is weaker overall but there's stuff in it I still really like, all the poo poo with the kraken is good, the Flying Dutchman is cool and loving creepy. I liked the stuff with Jack Davenport's character, his fall from grace and how him grabbing the heart at the end seems to be setting him up as a major player in the sequel. Then 3 just kinda drops all that or wraps it up in the first 30 minutes or so and then suddenly the Pirate Superfirends have to stop Lord British from carrying out Pirate Holocaust because Pirates are now some kind of ethnic group/subculture/illuminati-esque global organization I guess. Edit: Also I love how we've spent like a whole page shooting the poo poo about the first three movies and the most anyone's said so far about 4 and 5 basically boil down to "wait, did those happen!?" and "yeah that happened, anyways-". MechanicalTomPetty fucked around with this message at 07:42 on Nov 28, 2020 |
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Nov 28, 2020 07:34
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I fell asleep twice when I saw 5 in theaters.
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Nov 28, 2020 08:14
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MechanicalTomPetty posted:Pirates 1 is still the best in the series; 2 is weaker overall but there's stuff in it I still really like, all the poo poo with the kraken is good, the Flying Dutchman is cool and loving creepy. I liked the stuff with Jack Davenport's character, his fall from grace and how him grabbing the heart at the end seems to be setting him up as a major player in the sequel. The Pirates sequels actually seem like they were warning us about the Star Wars sequels in retrospect; Disney has no goddamn idea how to stick the landing for a trilogy.
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Nov 28, 2020 09:10
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Snowman_McK posted:
Theres a Fantastic making of doc on pirates 2’s Blu Ray that shows how they wrote 2 and 3 back to back. All while trying to get it done in time. I’m not sure if it answers your question but I’d take a look at it if you’re interested.
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Nov 28, 2020 09:38
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I watched part of Pirates 4 or maybe Pirates 5 and like, I could not tell you which or what it was about because I was so intensely bored of the vacuous sumptuousness of the film that I turned it off instead of finishing it. It was a film with infinite budget hoping to find a reason to exist.
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Nov 28, 2020 14:19
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I love Pirates 2 and 3. The creatures are incredible (kraken, Davy Jones, all the half sea-creature pirates, etc) and there’s just creative setpiece after creative setpiece (2: the cannibal island, the water wheel fight, the kraken fight; 3: the Singapore bath fight, the wave of crabs carrying the ship, tipping the ship upside down to get back from the locker, etc) They’re long and messy but I love them anyway, like I love King Kong ’05. Messy sprawling epics stuffed with ideas. 4 i disliked the first time but I’ve come around on it since. Barbossa is great in it and there are a few creative bits (the palace fight, the tilting ship fight) but it’s just not as creative as the original trilogy, and the Will and Elizabeth replacements are beige as gently caress 5 i can barely remember. I remember enjoying a funny guillotine visual gag. Mainly I was annoyed that they wrote themselves out of the rather dark ending of 3: Will becoming Davy Jones and only being able to see Elizabeth and their child once every 10 years - I remember them giving him an out somehow. They should have stuck with the bold way 3 ended and just not have brought those characters back.
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Nov 28, 2020 15:05
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I do have to wonder if it's a problem with Disney in particular, film division anyway, having no idea how to worldbuild, or maintain stakes and tone over multiple instalments.
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Nov 28, 2020 15:12
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My low key “most disappointed over a 2020 film delay” film was Jungle Cruise getting bumped back a year. That looks like it could be the start of a new period fantasy franchise like Pirates or the Brendan Fraser Mummy movies. Maybe it’ll come to Disney+ sooner than when it’s slated for (June I think) 
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Nov 28, 2020 15:15
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In my mind none of the sequels compare to curse of the black pearl. The first film is unquestionably the best of them, to the point where I consider all the sequels in a separate category.Ghost Leviathan posted:I do have to wonder if it's a problem with Disney in particular, film division anyway, having no idea how to worldbuild, or maintain stakes and tone over multiple instalments. The problem is that the sequels come from a different creative source. The first film came from actual inspiration; someone looked at the theme park ride and imagined how it would look as a movie. The sequels were ordered by the studio. They didn't come from a pure creative vision. The creators of the first film were tasked with following up a singular work with successive entries that, from a creative standpoint, were never meant to exist. So the sequels necessarily ran off the creative fumes of the original film, which had the side effect of turning all the unique elements from the original (depp's performance, barbossa, will's origins) into parodies of themselves. Cael posted:The fact that 2 and 3 are 151 and 168 minutes is loving insane. Spoilering just because I want everyone to guess how long they were because you'll STILL underestimate it. The first is two and a half hours and doesn't feel like it at all. Everything moves along so smoothly and the screenplay is so tight, it feels like no more than an hour forty five. The Klowner fucked around with this message at 16:06 on Nov 28, 2020 |
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Nov 28, 2020 15:55
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Actually didn’t the first film start preproduction as a purely original story and just get branded with the title/ride connection at some point?
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Nov 28, 2020 17:41
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Gatts posted:I mean if you're going to watch people on a ship do stuff the best one is Master and Commander. That's legit. The best ship movie
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Nov 28, 2020 18:13
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Master and Commander is so goddamn good
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Nov 28, 2020 18:30
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Maxwell Lord posted:Actually didn’t the first film start preproduction as a purely original story and just get branded with the title/ride connection at some point? Nah. Disney commissioned a script based on the ride in 2001 which was just a straight forward pirate story (I think Disney wanted Matthew McConaughey as Jack Sparrow) but when they got Jerry Bruckheimer on board he didn't like the script because it was "just a pirate movie", so they had some other guys rewrite it to add the supernatural stuff.
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Nov 28, 2020 18:35
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Continue to give Gore Verbinski all of the money I say.
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Nov 28, 2020 19:00
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I'm still bummed his BioShock never happened.
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Nov 28, 2020 19:18
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