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Zamujasa posted:and that's before you consider the fact that bitcoin is a gigantic waste of energy. storing your poo poo in gold takes basically zero energy, processing your transaction for a single coffee on the blockchain takes basically the entire energy usage of a small country lol this reminded me of the batshit argument of cryptocurrency "energy storage" anyone still kicking that horse? that one was crazy
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Jan 11, 2021 21:00
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also if the poo poo we integrate with is a surveillance machine then we have nothing to worry about from the surveillance state because it is goddamn awful at that and the customer has to hold its hand at every turn and provide information whenever possible for it to half-way function pro tip for not being surveilled at the store: don't use the loyalty card, don't install the store app, and don't give them your information when they flat out ask and there's pretty much nothing at all else they can do about it
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Jan 11, 2021 21:03
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xtal posted:That might be why you think this way. Using bitcoin instead of credit cards is a form of consumer protection. Most scams work based off ignorance and gaining confidence. Why are you placing all this confidence in something that you have to rely on other people to explain to you? Who are you choosing to place your trust in, and why?
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Jan 11, 2021 21:04
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don't forget to add in hoa, seraph. but this is a great time to be buying in nyc, so good for you if the money actually comes through
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Jan 11, 2021 21:04
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Shame Boy posted:also if the poo poo we integrate with is a surveillance machine then we have nothing to worry about from the surveillance state because it is goddamn awful at that and the customer has to hold its hand at every turn and provide information whenever possible for it to half-way function but what about the cameras that watch your every movement???
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Jan 11, 2021 21:04
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xtal posted:That might be why you think this way. Using bitcoin instead of credit cards is a form of consumer protection. Thank God it's impossible to track literally every bitcoin transaction with some sort of a ledger that is accessible to literally any person.
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Jan 11, 2021 21:05
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xtal posted:That might be why you think this way. Using bitcoin instead of credit cards is a form of consumer protection.
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Jan 11, 2021 21:06
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the customer protection of "fygm" when your chinese research chemicals either kill you or is just corn starch cut with some powdered sugar
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Jan 11, 2021 21:06
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y'know, the thing with no chargebacks. consumer protection.
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Jan 11, 2021 21:07
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look i just assumed that's what the bitcoin people were talking about when they said bitcoin was great for cp
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Jan 11, 2021 21:09
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at least xtal has added bad arguments into the mix of personal attacks and name calling for "debate" techniques, so baby steps
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Jan 11, 2021 21:10
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If you want a hedge against hyperinflation - buy some physical gold or silver, guns, land or other physical assets that have intrinsic value. If you want out of the existing financial system or to overthrow the existing social order, join a commune and barter for everything you can. Don't blindly buy into a technologist delusion about the internet and cryptography placing you beyond the reach of nation states. The internet is fracturing and the idiocy that just happened in the US is going to accelerate it as governments move to protect their populations from disinformation campaigns.
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Jan 11, 2021 21:12
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man when i start work every morning i just love thinking about all the new ways i can gently caress up consumers, gently caress yeah, take that you little shits
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Jan 11, 2021 21:14
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no one will care if you just leave and go live in the woods
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Jan 11, 2021 21:14
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kw0134 posted:at least xtal has added bad arguments into the mix of personal attacks and name calling for "debate" techniques, so baby steps Huh?
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Jan 11, 2021 21:15
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xtal posted:That might be why you think this way. Using bitcoin instead of credit cards is a form of consumer protection. please protect me from being able to perform charge backs if my card gets stolen, i am so very scared
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Jan 11, 2021 21:16
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Boxturret posted:no one will care if you just leave and go live in the woods Many people don't know that you can literally do this in the US. A backwoods recreation permit for national forests is $7 a year. In a medicaid expansion state with a maximum SNAP benefit you can literally go live in the woods for the rest of your life.
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Jan 11, 2021 21:17
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definitely never stayed at work until 1 AM hunting down and emergency fixing a problem that was causing people to occasionally not get refunds quickly or anything, nope. i spend all my time finding new ways to gently caress over you, the purchasing public, just for the pleasure i get from appeasing my capitalist overlords
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Jan 11, 2021 21:21
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Shame Boy posted:definitely never stayed at work until 1 AM hunting down and emergency fixing a problem that was causing people to occasionally not get refunds quickly or anything, nope. i spend all my time finding new ways to gently caress over you, the purchasing public, just for the pleasure i get from appeasing my capitalist overlords You must not work for NCS.
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Jan 11, 2021 21:21
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Shame Boy posted:definitely never stayed at work until 1 AM hunting down and emergency fixing a problem that was causing people to occasionally not get refunds quickly or anything, nope. i spend all my time finding new ways to gently caress over you, the purchasing public, just for the pleasure i get from appeasing my capitalist overlords bless you, i hope soros pays you well
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Jan 11, 2021 21:22
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SYSV Fanfic posted:
This is literally the definition of a Ponzi scheme. Except for the electricity part, that makes it even stupider.
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Jan 11, 2021 22:06
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The Atomic Man-Boy posted:even stupider. but enough about xtal's posts
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Jan 11, 2021 22:13
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SYSV Fanfic posted:In the US the AM radio stations all sell gold as an "investment" or a "hedge against collapse of currency". They say it will protect you against the "federal reserve stealing your money through inflation". They never provide concrete reasons these things are true other than your own imagination. it's worse than that. they don't sell gold (which is heavily regulated), they sell ~*collectible gold coins*~ (which aren't) that they keep in storage for you, for a fee of course
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Jan 11, 2021 22:27
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Gobbeldygook posted:frisbee on a roof isn't a problem because nobody uses bitcoin and those that do mostly do transactions off-chain on exchanges. the few people using it would not really notice or care if 90% of hash power suddenly disappeared and now every block took an average of 100 minutes. the users most affected would be the tiny, tiny number of people using it for face to face/retail transactions. And we know this because precisely this thing happened in September 2017 during the bcAsh wars. BTC block times went over an hour. Nobody cared because all the action was on exchanges.
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Jan 11, 2021 22:39
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xtal posted:Using bitcoin instead of credit cards is a form of consumer protection. if you buy things one of the things you buy might accidentally harm you, since businesses don't take bitcoin but do take credit cards, if you use bitcoin you can't buy anything and thus are protected, logic is sound
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Jan 11, 2021 22:59
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xtal posted:That might be why you think this way. Using bitcoin instead of credit cards is a form of consumer protection. Using bitcoins which are irreversible and god help you if you get the wallet ID wrong is a form of consumer protection? my sides are in orbit
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Jan 11, 2021 23:08
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there is no possible consumption under anarcoinism
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Jan 11, 2021 23:19
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orange juche posted:Using bitcoins which are irreversible and god help you if you get the wallet ID wrong is a form of consumer protection? my sides are in orbit just like bitcoins. to the moon
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Jan 11, 2021 23:21
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Shumagorath posted:there is no possible consumption under anarcoinism You cannot consume a bit coin, it is electrons!
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Jan 11, 2021 23:23
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divabot posted:And we know this because precisely this thing happened in September 2017 during the bcAsh wars. BTC block times went over an hour. Nobody cared because all the action was on exchanges. I think you remember it wrong, or confuse BTC with BCH - I don't see anything apart from a few short spikes at https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-confirmationtime.html#log where the average confirmation time was like 18 minutes instead of 10. In contrast, BCH had some periods where the average block time was wayy above one hour. You might also conflate it with the dec 2017/jan 2018 mempool flood, where you had to pay like dozens of dollars to get your transaction into a block in a reasonable timeframe, and people started using BCH to move money across exchanges instead. But even then, blocks were generated at a statistically steady rate
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Jan 11, 2021 23:32
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ymgve posted:I think you remember it wrong, or confuse BTC with BCH - I don't see anything apart from a few short spikes at https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-confirmationtime.html#log where the average confirmation time was like 18 minutes instead of 10. In contrast, BCH had some periods where the average block time was wayy above one hour. That's showing the average for each day. If ~12 blocks took an hour and the rest took ~10 minutes that'd be an 18 minute average block time for that day.
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Jan 12, 2021 00:00
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there was definitely a time where a block or two took over an hour to confirm
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Jan 12, 2021 00:12
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trust dracula he would never lead you wrong
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Jan 12, 2021 00:17
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Boxturret posted:there was definitely a time where a block or two took over an hour to confirm yes, that happens semi-regularly as it’s all a random distribution. so you might risk standing around for an hour now and then to pay for the bitcoin tacos
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Jan 12, 2021 00:24
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i just wanted to lol about how low the delta between these charts is still 
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Jan 12, 2021 00:32
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sustainable growth.tiff
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Jan 12, 2021 00:34
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When I say Frisbee on the Roof I'm talking about a theoretical scenario where a huge percentage of hashing power evaporates. My understanding is that it could take up to 2016 blocks to re-adjust difficulty. China severing itself from the internet, turning up the great firewall, etc. Or mass unprofitability from an energy shock. It could take *substantially* longer than the normal interval to solve a block. Transactions would stack up substantially as throughput dropped. Bringing more hash power online elsewhere could help mitigate, but if it's unprofitable you'd be depending on the kindness of strangers to pull through the next few difficulty adjustments. Bitcoin core devs *could* just push a patch, but so much for decentralized uncontrollable libertarian fun bux. Am I wrong about this? Other people have pointed out that no one actually uses the blockchain. Just the exchanges. Which if you're still reading this xtal means centralization, which means it can be controlled by governments. A lot of people become unbanked (unbanking the banked) due to bitcoin and trying to avoid admitting they were engaging in back alley financial deals.
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Jan 12, 2021 00:38
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you would have to take out a lot of the current mining poo poo for that. even if you drop 50% of the wasted power overnight you're just looking at doubling the average wait and as was said, most of the shitcoin stuff happens off the actual chain in exchanges
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Jan 12, 2021 00:41
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Zamujasa posted:you would have to take out a lot of the current mining poo poo for that. even if you drop 50% of the wasted power overnight you're just looking at doubling the average wait IIRC at some point 70% of hash power was in the PRC. The great firewall and link latency (along with manipulation - cutting hashing power) were cited as the reason for higher than average fees. Has the mining pool become more globally distributed since then?
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Jan 12, 2021 00:46
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finding where the actual miners are located is difficult, but this site has some info on mining power, at least for blocks mined.
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Jan 12, 2021 00:50
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