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Cinema Discusso Animation+: Debating the philosophy of Oogie Boogie
Fartington Butts fucked around with this message at 05:25 on Jan 14, 2021 |
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Jan 13, 2021 23:49
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| # ? Apr 25, 2024 22:34 |
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He's santa's fear of his own impending demise, hence bugs, bodybag, life or death gambling, etc. He's also in esence a mirror of santa, being fat and jolly, beloved by childen/imps, and the inverse of santa's colors. Santa's Id?
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Jan 14, 2021 02:06
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Fartington Butts posted:Cinema Discusso Animation+: Debating the philosophy of Oogie Boogie I always assumed he was more older primal fears compared to Jacks more playful brand of controlled fear. They are two sides of a coin. Jack's the stuff you enjoy being scared of, Oogie is the poo poo you SHOULD be scared of. It reminded me of why I was disappointed to learn Pitch's backstory in the Rise of the Guardians franchise after watching the movie - he grew up in the dark ages, so I assumed that fear was his centre, like fear of the black death that was ravaging the world, fear of the zealotry of that era's religion, fear of how screwed you would be if anything at all went wrong. Nope, turns out he was just a knight who got possessed by demons, compared to Jack Frost's backstory that's not nearly as interesting.
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Jan 14, 2021 07:07
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Apparently Oogie Boogie is meant to be a figure from some long-forgotten yearly event that's no longer celebrated.BioEnchanted posted:I always assumed he was more older primal fears compared to Jacks more playful brand of controlled fear. They are two sides of a coin. Jack's the stuff you enjoy being scared of, Oogie is the poo poo you SHOULD be scared of. It reminded me of why I was disappointed to learn Pitch's backstory in the Rise of the Guardians franchise after watching the movie - he grew up in the dark ages, so I assumed that fear was his centre, like fear of the black death that was ravaging the world, fear of the zealotry of that era's religion, fear of how screwed you would be if anything at all went wrong. Nope, turns out he was just a knight who got possessed by demons, compared to Jack Frost's backstory that's not nearly as interesting. A lot of these holiday-based movies are really bad at making villains, at least the non-redeemable kind.
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Jan 14, 2021 10:17
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With one important exception: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3e1SQmt9WtQ Seriously though, I wonder why that is?
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Jan 14, 2021 13:21
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Now you remind me of how The Santa Clause's villain was a jackass who would actually be right in a world where Santa Claus is NOT a real and provable phenomenon, and an insane naysayer in that world. I feel like holiday movie makers are afraid of making villains *too* mean because it'd 'ruin the mood'.
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Jan 14, 2021 17:47
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Dunno if anyone here particularly cares about it any more, but apparently the 3rd part of Disenchantment just dropped on Netflix.
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Jan 16, 2021 06:32
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Regalingualius posted:Dunno if anyone here particularly cares about it any more, but apparently the 3rd part of Disenchantment just dropped on Netflix. I watched some of it. If you liked the previous bits you'll like the continuing bits. Its same strengths and weaknesses apply.
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Jan 16, 2021 06:37
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I only ever watched the first half season, did the sound get fixed? It always just seemed so quiet, like no background noise at all Iirc of course, didn't really care for it to commit to memory
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Jan 16, 2021 06:59
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Regalingualius posted:Dunno if anyone here particularly cares about it any more, but apparently the 3rd part of Disenchantment just dropped on Netflix. I care, I like it Luci continues to be the best
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Jan 16, 2021 07:09
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Regalingualius posted:Dunno if anyone here particularly cares about it any more, but apparently the 3rd part of Disenchantment just dropped on Netflix. I was surprised it just dropped like that. Pretty sure this series is on death watch. I care enough that I’m going to give season3 a try.
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Jan 16, 2021 11:37
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It's kinda nice, I hope it ages well. I think futurama aged well in ways I used to think it was slow or too quiet. The backgrounds are great, it actualoly uses computers to look nicer instead of worse.
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Jan 16, 2021 18:58
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My big thing is that the first two seasons never really felt like they were going anywhere when taken together. The first ended on a decent cliffhanger that seemingly irreversibly changed the status quo, only for the second to roll most of that back within a few episodes... and then it ended on a pretty similar setup, so I’m wary of getting burned again.
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Jan 16, 2021 19:12
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I really didn't remember how bad Sword in the Stone is. It's not as bad as Melody Time, but it's pretty drat bad.
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Jan 16, 2021 19:25
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Sword in Stone is an example of a movie where the sum of its parts is better than the whole. Doesn't help it basically condensed huge parts of the first half of 'The Once and Future King' into a relative short run time.
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Jan 16, 2021 20:21
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Regalingualius posted:Dunno if anyone here particularly cares about it any more, but apparently the 3rd part of Disenchantment just dropped on Netflix. I’ve been on a Groening kick recently, watching all of golden age Simpsons and now up to season 6 of Futurama. So I’ll probably watch Disenchantment next.
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Jan 16, 2021 20:40
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Robindaybird posted:Sword in Stone is an example of a movie where the sum of its parts is better than the whole. Like Make Mine Music is something that really doesn't hang together, but has some really fun highs. Sword in the Stone feels like the same premise repeated over and over again until you have the magic fight. But especially after watching it with Sleeping Beauty and 101 Dalmatians, it's a bummer. Quick question though, I was sort of wondering if Mary Poppins was sort of taking away from animation resources to explain why they went for something so unambitious?
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Jan 16, 2021 21:12
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The Sword in the Stone had some sad bit about a squirrell bookended by 70 minutes of some other stuff.
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Jan 16, 2021 21:54
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I remember when they chopped out the squirrel bit into a Valentines special for one of those Disney Sunday Movie segments hosted by Eisner or something, and it was so depressing to 8 year old me I never wanted to see the real thing
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Jan 16, 2021 23:00
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I liked Higgitus Figgitus in Sword in the Stone because I like when magic feels difficult and unpredictable and Merlin's magic really sells that. I prefer it to Bibbedi Boddedi Boo because the Godmother's magic is too easy, less interesting. Merlin's magic is a tool and the fairy godmother's is a plot device. As a result Merlin feels like he has to earn control over his spells, he has to keep micromanaging everything as the song progresses and it becomes more and more frantic and stops being a song entirely because all rhythm has been lost as the whole room falls to chaos trying to shove itself into his bag. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tb75RjpvBIk
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Jan 16, 2021 23:00
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Yes, but counterpoint: Bibbedi Boddedi Boo is actually a good song.
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Jan 17, 2021 01:02
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Didn’t they have to replace the kid playing Arthur like three or so times during production due to puberty related issues? Also, why was said character called “Wart” in that movie?
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Jan 17, 2021 04:08
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They did, and Wart was basically a nickname given by Ector and Kay that stuck - you can see how it progress from The Ward Arthur - Ward Art - Wart. In fact, in the book he was only called Arthur near the end, much like the movie after he became king, and he wasn't just "wart" he was The Wart. Robindaybird fucked around with this message at 04:44 on Jan 17, 2021 |
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Jan 17, 2021 04:42
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I've been thinking more about Oogie Boogie. So first, the kids who pay tribute to him love masks, they're always wearing masks of their own face and masks around the house and such. perhaps it is that they see themselves as frightening. In any case, they feed the bugs to an iron mask in the wall. Now, the other, commonly held cultural understanding of the boogie man is that he is explicitly not real (like santa) or at the least poses no threat. Could it be, then, that the kids are imagining him, like a rag doll?
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Jan 17, 2021 06:37
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Oogie Boogie is a bunch of insects who came together to form a band and they kidnapped Santa to be the audience to their first single. Edit: I rewatched Howl's Moving Castle for the first time since 2004 and it turns out that I really like Howl's Moving Castle and I just... forgot or something. It has the misfortune of coming directly after Princess Mononoke and Spirited Away, literally my favourite movies, but it's still really pretty and I adore the characters. I think I'm going to give the book a shot next. YggiDee fucked around with this message at 06:52 on Jan 17, 2021 |
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Jan 17, 2021 06:45
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YggiDee posted:Oogie Boogie is a bunch of insects who came together to form a band and they kidnapped Santa to be the audience to their first single. Book is honestly better because it has a real ending rather than “movies over this guy’s the prince everything’s happy roll credits” abruptness. But I do love that first act in the film. It’s awesome.
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Jan 17, 2021 19:31
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Well it's clear that Jack can be frightening if pushed to it. His little face-trick with Oogie's Kids comes out of nowhere and puts them in their place. But he has a personality that mixes all the jobs of Halloween together: the frights, the atmosphere, the fun, the sense of transition. Oogie's just the dark scary slimy slithering stuff. It's more chaotic and carefree.
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Jan 17, 2021 20:11
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Lock, Stock, and Barrel are clearly representative of the “bad” aspects of Halloween - the “trick” part of “trick or treat” - combined with the “bad” aspects of Christmas - naughty children. So you get both ideas for what the bad kids are like in both holidays that have explicit allowances for bad children to exist, and you get the idea for that trio. In direct contrast to all the other denizens of Halloweentown and especially Jack, they’re actively malevolent individuals - everyone else wants to just have fun with the concept of either Halloween or Christmas, whilst LS and B are causing intentional harm to others, knowingly, through their actions. But again, they’re children. They don’t know better, and still have an underdeveloped sense of morality that doesn’t allow them to understand the full weight or impact of their actions. In contrast, Oogie is these children’s collective Id manifested and matured - pure malevolence, pure evil. Hence why he has the gambling gimmick, with six shooters and the actual threat of permanent death, the lust he has for Sally - he’s meant to be the dark counterpoint to Jack, and an illustration of the sort of person Lock, Stock, and Barrel could grow up to be. It doesn’t make sense for him to be non-existent, because then his role in the story as the mirror to the protagonist has no meaning and makes no sense. Jack is “good” Halloween - harmless scares and fun that’s meant to be frightening but in a safe way. Oogie is “bad” Halloween - serial killers, murderers, actual violence, and perverts.
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Jan 18, 2021 05:02
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...perverts? e: oh, wait, the weird thing he did with Sally's leg. Nevermind, got it, carry on.
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Jan 18, 2021 09:22
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Netflix recently readded the Lego Movie 2, so I watched that for the first time last weekend. It was actually better than I expected it to be. I said it following my viewing of the first movie that I didn't expect much from this movie since it just seemed to come and go unlike the first movie which kept the internet busy for quite a while. But it was fun. I think it might be funnier than the first movie, but it doesn't have quite the emotional underpinning and "easily understandable" multiple layers that the first movie had. Like following the first movie my son asked me if the dad was really a bad guy. That's brilliant. He has no such questions about this movie and I don't really expect him to get them. The disconnect between Rex and the older son is just too big. Even if I do recognize what they were going for. While funnier it does lean extremely heavily into shout outs and cameo's to do such. As a result, my wife felt the movie was less good. She's not as well versed in geek/movie culture as me so she just felt the movie was cluttered. The mixing of the different Lego franchises is hilarious in and of itself. (Fabuland and all the Wonderwomen) Still it's an extremely competently made movie with so many tiny details, like the scuffing/scratches on the Princess' blocks, or the different walks depending on the figure. But it also has just enough foreshadowing to make you feel smart if you pay attention without hitting you over the head with it. I guess I can understand why this movie didn't catch fire like the last one, while still being really good. It's unfortunate that it apparently killed the current franchise, I would've liked one more adventure with Emmet. 
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Jan 18, 2021 10:01
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It did underperform, but a number of factors put the franchise on ice. Frankly I’d pin it more on the Ninjago movie, which tanked harder and diminished the interest in more LEGO films. After that and some lackluster marketing decisions, the underperformance (but still more than double what Ninjago made) was enough to convince WB to drop it. I was honestly surprised we got a second and I’ll be satisfied with a good finish. Also the soundtrack of the second is vastly superior, especially with the choice to just toss a ton of tracks on the credits—the dedicated Lonely Island credits song is great. My kids still pop the soundtrack on constantly.
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Jan 18, 2021 13:45
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Both songs the queen sings are awesome
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Jan 18, 2021 14:08
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"Not Evil" is a great jam
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Jan 18, 2021 14:09
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PierreTheMime posted:It did underperform, but a number of factors put the franchise on ice. Frankly I’d pin it more on the Ninjago movie, which tanked harder and diminished the interest in more LEGO films. After that and some lackluster marketing decisions, the underperformance (but still more than double what Ninjago made) was enough to convince WB to drop it. I was honestly surprised we got a second and I’ll be satisfied with a good finish. Soundtrack is hard for me to have an accurate opinion on, because some songs were half translated which doesn't always work as well. The brainworm song however worked perfectly well. Soundtrack from what I heard however was perfectly fine. And I loved how they kept everything is awesome while remixing and playing with it. True, better to stop on a high note.
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Jan 18, 2021 14:23
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This song's gonna get stuck inside your This song's gonna get stuck inside your This song's gonna get stuck inside your HEEEEEAD
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Jan 18, 2021 14:27
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The credits rap is the funniest thing.
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Jan 18, 2021 15:08
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The credits rap is hilarious.
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Jan 18, 2021 18:12
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LEGO Batman movie is still the best thing to come out of the franchise.
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Jan 18, 2021 19:02
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Assume you mean the Batman franchise
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Jan 18, 2021 20:25
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Both the Lego and Batman franchises. It literally is *the* Lego Batman movie.
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Jan 18, 2021 20:41
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