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I remember Dawn of the Dead being pretty good
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Feb 16, 2021 09:27
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quote:In the past 20 years, as we all know, the movie business has changed on all fronts. But the most ominous change has happened stealthily and under cover of night: the gradual but steady elimination of risk. Many films today are perfect products manufactured for immediate consumption. Many of them are well made by teams of talented individuals. All the same, they lack something essential to cinema: the unifying vision of an individual artist. Because, of course, the individual artist is the riskiest factor of all. Although the targets of his criticism very much tried to pretend otherwise, Scorsese has a point to make beyond "superhero movie bad".
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Feb 16, 2021 09:30
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Moore's criticism is more directly on-target, but then the question is: whose fault is it that the ephemera of the previous generation is culturally squatting on centre stage? Whose childhood love of superhero comics has come to dominate pop culture, given that for the entirety of my lifetime at least, the popularity of the comics themselves has been in freefall? And ofc the story of the Justice League movie itself is that it was actively conformed to the kind of DW Griffiths parable Moore is talking about, restructured to downplay non-white roles and any social commentary - Man of Steel makes Superman's 'people' a planet of eugenicist Nazis - removed. We probably shouldn't, in any circumstances, be looking for liberation to come from blockbuster cinema, but if the problem is with the mainstream then go argue with the mainstream.
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Feb 16, 2021 09:40
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Barreft posted:I've just never seen such slavish loyalty to one person. The Snyder poo poo just reminds me of Trump/Elon/Roberts idol worship. Like I'm sure there's many out there defending Joss Whedon as well, which is just as weird. Julia Roberts?
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Feb 16, 2021 10:49
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Feel like a big theme with Superman is his actions are redeeming. He redeems Kryptonians through being selfless and aiding humanity, he redeems Batman by talking him down from murder and giving him a symbolic do-over of Crime Alley, he redeems humanity by showing an individual can be powerful and good.
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Feb 16, 2021 10:51
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BiggestBatman posted:Julia Roberts? Chris Roberts. Which kind of gives away how stupid the comparison is, because the Snyder Cut actually exists. 
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Feb 16, 2021 10:52
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:Chris Roberts. Which kind of gives away how stupid the comparison is, because the Snyder Cut actually exists. I'm gonna go on believing that guy has a big beef with fans of Notting Hill
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Feb 16, 2021 10:57
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josh04 posted:No-one else made the straightforward objection here, that those are all people actively engaged in scams, corruption, fascism, and Star Citizen where Zack Snyder is just a guy who directs movies. You forgot sexual abuse, misogyny, and just abhorrently toxic behavior in general. That Snyder just made some movies a person doesn't like shouldn't immediately have them draw comparisons to some of the worst loving people to exist. Something is broken if that happens imo, and is worth pursuing self-reflection if whoever finds themselves having that sort of immediate reaction because gently caress dude, lol. [Edit] I know people want to justify their opinions, but drat, don't do it by immediately associating people who disagree with actual really, really lovely individuals who should be fired into the sun. Be better. teagone fucked around with this message at 11:56 on Feb 16, 2021 |
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Feb 16, 2021 11:28
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Barreft posted:I've just never seen such slavish loyalty to one person. The Snyder poo poo just reminds me of Trump/Elon/Roberts idol worship. Like I'm sure there's many out there defending Joss Whedon as well, which is just as weird. i can't believe i missed this comparison. snyder, trump, musk, roberts - one of these is not like the others, one of these does not belong.
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Feb 16, 2021 11:51
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For one, pretty consistently everyone who's worked with Snyder has basically said they'd take a bullet for the guy.
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Feb 16, 2021 12:06
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DanteDevils posted:Marvel sucks too. The ubiquitousness of toxic comic-book and superhero fandom (media originally for children and adolescents) among presumably grown adults exemplifies a deeply alienated society and culture in which we live. The particular fanaticism of Zack Snyder’s personality cult is only one — albeit disturbing — iteration of this. Snyder’s love of Ayn Rand novels deserves the ridicule it receives as well. quote:We have always created icons in our own image. What we've done is we project ourselves on to him. The fact is, maybe he's not some sort of Devil or Jesus character. Maybe he’s just a guy trying to quote:Well what are we talking about here then?
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Feb 16, 2021 12:07
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Come to think of it, Superman can be a more self-aware Goku at times- raised ignorance of his cultural heritage, and what he does see of it doesn't really appeal to him at all, and he's humble about the incredible physical advantages it brings him. That one audio play of 'Dragon Ball DC' was a bit nerd cringe (basically, what if Krypton and Vegeta/Sadala switched places) but still fun. Especially with the themes of Dragon Ball Super: Broly.
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Feb 16, 2021 12:13
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The very best thing about people who glowingly refer to Alan Moore or whomever is that they refuse to acknowledge that what they like about creators like him is that they can work in this idiom for nearly 4 decades (!) and still get to say it's worthless, the fans are stupid, etc.
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Feb 16, 2021 13:36
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Barreft posted:I've just never seen such slavish loyalty to one person. The Snyder poo poo just reminds me of Trump/Elon/Roberts idol worship. Like I'm sure there's many out there defending Joss Whedon as well, which is just as weird. Serious questions: what exactly is all of the scary loyalty exhibited for Snyder? And why did you choose those comparisons in particular instead of like Hideo Kojima or something? DanteDevils posted:Marvel sucks too. The ubiquitousness of toxic comic-book and superhero fandom (media originally for children and adolescents) among presumably grown adults exemplifies a deeply alienated society and culture in which we live. The particular fanaticism of Zack Snyder’s personality cult is only one — albeit disturbing — iteration of this. Snyder’s love of Ayn Rand novels deserves the ridicule it receives as well. Moore is definitely great, but reciting his interviews like they're the Word of God is a bit uninspired. Like what are examples of Snyder's superhero work that reflect a desperate reversion to childhood, the reassurance of the 20th century, or white supremacy? Or are you saying all super hero fiction is irredeemable? Does the Terminator fall under this rubric? It's not that I entirely disagree, as a couple pages back, I wrote a wall of text about how 'alienated' and subsequently bad most superhero fiction is, but that it isn't unique to the superhero genre or genre fiction in general. Why not apply a similar critique to the zombie genre? You should watch Sucker Punch, it's not only his best film (Yes, I will die on this hill  ) but the one that most embodies his overall artistic project, both aesthetically & politically.
KVeezy3 fucked around with this message at 17:01 on Feb 16, 2021 |
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Feb 16, 2021 13:54
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Let's just take a moment to remember the unforgettable opening scene of Joss Whedon's Justice League in all this ridiculous copycat "looks like a graphics card lol" exact-same-gag poo poo going on at the moment. Batman stalks a criminal carrying a bag of money on a "rooftop" set that looks like something out of the loving CW. He then hangs the crook off the edge of the building because "They smell fear." (???) Then a parademon shows up! I guess there's only one of them? And that the guy Batman was loving with was the only scared person in Gotham, a city of millions? Well, sure! Then something happens and the bug explodes! And when it explodes, it leaves the image of three mother boxes burnt into the wall which allows Batman to uh puzzle out I guess what is going on? Then Batman and the criminal have a tender moment over the death of Superman. I just typed that out and I still can't believe this poo poo happened. Imagine the meeting about this scene: "So the bug blows up and gives Batman the evil plot. Do all of them do this when they die?" "No, we see about 30,000 of them die later on and none of them do anything at all like this first one." "Well, why does the first one do it?" "Listen... we have to get the plot going somehow. So we'll just let the audience in on the fact that Darkseid sent one and only one parademon to Gotham that hones in on people scared by the Batman and when it gets there it will essentially tell Batman the bad guys' plan and Batman will immediately deduce everything about it from seeing three squares on the wall. I mean, why wouldn't world-conquering genius villain Darkseid send a single minion to Earth with some sort of special death message in order to let the heroes of Earth know how to stop his plans?" "... sounds great, let's shoot it."
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Feb 16, 2021 16:00
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Don't forgot that it was originally supposed to be a comedic scene but WB told Whedon to re-edit it to be serious.
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Feb 16, 2021 16:09
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It's hilarious that the execs were sure they had a super hit on their hands after the Whedon changes and we're shocked when it blew up in their faces.
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Feb 16, 2021 16:13
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McCloud posted:It's hilarious that the execs were sure they had a super hit on their hands after the Whedon changes and we're shocked when it blew up in their faces. Whedon did Avengers. Ergo proxy victor tango foxtrot same success. They also thought they were meeting all the complaints people had. You have to think like a business person.
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Feb 16, 2021 16:23
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Gatts posted:Whedon did Avengers. Ergo proxy victor tango foxtrot same success. They also thought they were meeting all the complaints people had. You have to think like a business person. These are probably the same people who thought selling WB's share in Joker was a good bet then it went on to make over a billion dollars. Bunch of geniuses at WB!
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Feb 16, 2021 16:26
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CelticPredator posted:Bill Mahr sucks rear end and shouldn’t be listened too even if he has a point. This is the guy that made a whole film of "  heh, religion?  " Who the gently caress is he telling to grow up when he acts like a 15 year old who just discovered athiesm.quote="Jimbot" post="512553106"] These are probably the same people who thought selling WB's share in Joker was a good bet then it went on to make over a billion dollars. Bunch of geniuses at WB! [/quote] I wish I could get paid thousands to just make bad decisions all day. "Say, does Batman NEED to wear black? What if he had. Uh, like a camouflage Bat-Cape that blends into things! And a super-bright flashlight built into his chest symbol. And a smart-talking AI car!" FilthyImp fucked around with this message at 16:36 on Feb 16, 2021 |
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Feb 16, 2021 16:34
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McCloud posted:It's hilarious that the execs were sure they had a super hit on their hands after the Whedon changes and we're shocked when it blew up in their faces. Imagine watching that execrable piece of poo poo and thinking, "This is gonna make a billion dollars!"
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Feb 16, 2021 16:39
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My favorite WB schadenfreude is that they thought Joker was gonna bomb so through a business-y way basically sold the profit rights or something to investors and when the movie came out and ended up being the most successful DC film yet WB didn't get most of the profits.
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Feb 16, 2021 16:39
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The shot in the trailer with the flash rescuing a woman in slow motion and they're surrounded by flying hot dogs is very good
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Feb 16, 2021 16:44
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FilthyImp posted:"Say, does Batman NEED to wear black? What if he had. Uh, like a camouflage Bat-Cape that blends into things! And a super-bright flashlight built into his chest symbol. And a smart-talking AI car!" EDIT: Jon Peters not Joel Silver, my bad Roman fucked around with this message at 18:03 on Feb 16, 2021 |
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Feb 16, 2021 16:44
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JonathonSpectre posted:Let's just take a moment to remember the unforgettable opening scene of Joss Whedon's Justice League in all this ridiculous copycat "looks like a graphics card lol" exact-same-gag poo poo going on at the moment. Its a pretty good gag tbf 
Neurolimal fucked around with this message at 16:58 on Feb 16, 2021 |
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Feb 16, 2021 16:46
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Roman posted:Sounds like script for the Tim Burton Superman movie. Which you can't even blame Kevin Smith for writing because Joel Silver came up with and insisted on all the stupid ideas. Like you could never see Superman flying, he HAD to fight polar bears for some reason, etc. etc. "So, he can lift 10 quadrillion tons and a loving straight-up AGM to the face just knocks him woozy for like 10 seconds. He can punch something so hard it disintegrates into its constituent atoms and shoot lasers from his eyes that burn through approximately anything. He can move so fast you can't see him and he can loving fly." "Well, what do you think he's gonna do against some polar bears huh? They got claws and teeth!"
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Feb 16, 2021 16:47
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Neurolimal posted:Its a pretty good gag tbf This one got me.
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Feb 16, 2021 16:57
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Someone post the Darkseid one pls.
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Feb 16, 2021 16:58
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I think the executives were looking for a way to wash their hands of the movie and collect a bonus from whatever revenue it generated, but if they were enthusiastic over... all that, then yeah they're delusional. On the other hand, they had years' worth of the internet making GBS threads on their previous DCEU offerings, so maybe they felt desperate to appease self-appointed tastemakers and trusted Avengers Guy to right the ship.
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Feb 16, 2021 16:58
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Neurolimal posted:Its a pretty good gag tbf
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Feb 16, 2021 17:01
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Can't believe they put Leto's Joker on one too
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Feb 16, 2021 17:02
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I think a Whedon Justice League would have been perfectly servicable had it been his movie from the start; it wouldn't have been pretty, the plot would be incredibly throwaway, but it'd have enough cute character moments to make it entirely watchable. What you'd expect from a TV writer/director basically. Instead we got a weird mutant child between two directors with extremely discordant styles & focus. Good job WB.
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Feb 16, 2021 17:04
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Bill Maher recently had one of the founders of the Lincoln Project on his show the exact day they were accused of soliciting underage boys, lmao. Kind of can’t believe anyone is still posting his videos anywhere.
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Feb 16, 2021 17:05
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Roman posted:Sounds like script for the Tim Burton Superman movie. Which you can't even blame Kevin Smith for writing because Joel Silver came up with and insisted on all the stupid ideas. Like you could never see Superman flying, he HAD to fight polar bears for some reason, etc. etc. Jon Peters. Joel Silver is a guy who tends to go to bat for his creatives, sometimes to the detriment of the movie. Jon Peters is the guy who basically got to the top of Hollywood through dumb luck and nearly destroyed a studio before just loving off and counting the free money he would get from Batman movies being made.
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Feb 16, 2021 17:09
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DanteDevils posted:Alan Moore detailed this alarming phenomenon perfectly: This strikes me as a particularly baffling quote to cite for a criticism of Zack Snyder or his 'personality cult.' "Primarily, mass-market superhero movies seem to be abetting an audience who do not wish to relinquish their grip on (a) their relatively reassuring childhoods, or (b) the relatively reassuring 20th century." One of the main criticisms of Snyder's films as that they fail to provide reassurance. Superman doesn't smile enough, Batman is too comfortable with guns, they don't protect enough people, and yadda yadda yadda. "The superheroes themselves – largely written and drawn by creators who have never stood up for their own rights against the companies that employ them, much less the rights of a Jack Kirby or Jerry Siegel or Joe Schuster – would seem to be largely employed as cowardice compensators, perhaps a bit like the handgun on the nightstand. I would also remark that save for a smattering of non-white characters (and non-white creators) these books and these iconic characters are still very much white supremacist dreams of the master race.” The Snydercut is coming out in large part because Zack Snyder has stood up for his rights as a creator against Warner Bros. Moreover, as Ray Fisher has stated, the film does feature non-white characters in significant roles — which Warner Bros cut out, and which the Snydercut would restore. I don't want to overstate the worth or quality of Snyder's caped punchman films, but trying to wrangle Moore's criticisms of the comic book industry against those films seems like a particularly miss-aimed effort. If anything, Moore's words imply he'd view the whole "release the Snydercut" hubbub as a positive movement for change in a stilted industry. (The interview this was from is available here: https://alanmooreworld.blogspot.com/2019/11/moore-on-jerusalem-eternalism-anarchy.html) Schwarzwald fucked around with this message at 21:36 on Feb 16, 2021 |
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Feb 16, 2021 17:15
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The Snyder films also grapple with the 21st century post-9/11 forever war world, like Superman is being actively monitored by the military and keeps having to smash their drones and tell them to leave him alone; a simple errand to save Lois ends with him interfering in some CIA/lexcorp proxy war in the third world; Batman brutalizes the poor with the explicit approval of the police and his trauma from witnessing the destruction of a bunch of buildings is used to manipulate him into hating immigrants; etc. They're well away from the reassuring 20th century, to the point that America's greatest symbol of heroism is now subject to round-the-clock dissection of his every action by pundits and bloggers, and Lex's goal is basically to cancel Superman
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Feb 16, 2021 17:34
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Schwarzwald posted:The Snydercut is coming out in large part because Zack Snyder has stood up for his rights as a creator against Warner Bros. Moreover, as Ray Fisher has stated, the film does feature non-white characters in significant roles — which Warner Bros cut out, and which the Snydercut would restore. Yeah, Superman, Batman, and kind-of-Wonder Woman (Israeli/Jewish people are seen as white sometimes, and then not in others) are white, but Cyborg, Martian Manhunter, and Aquaman are minorities and The Flash is gay. Compare that to the original Avengers movies where uh....every Avenger is white. Does Nick Fury count as an Avenger? Hell, even Endgame was all white and a raccoon for people that actually did anything for the entire movie until the end wasn't it? I remember all the black people got dusted off the top of my head. Edit: Oh yeah War Machine and one person from Wakanda were alive I guess. I don't recall them actually doing anything.
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Feb 16, 2021 20:17
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War Machine got to sucker punch Chris Pratt, so he has my support.
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Feb 16, 2021 21:25
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Roth posted:War Machine got to sucker punch Chris Pratt, so he has my support. They also broke his back and made him require Stark tech to move his legs. Disney maintaining that balance. teagone fucked around with this message at 21:48 on Feb 16, 2021 |
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Feb 16, 2021 21:32
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Don't say cripple
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Feb 16, 2021 21:37
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