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Seasons 4 and 5 are the best as far as I'm concerned, and they start using music I've actually heard before
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Feb 25, 2021 05:17
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It's stabbing me in the loving heart.
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Feb 25, 2021 05:31
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The Klowner posted:All of them are the best one This is correct Gaius Marius posted:Seasons 4 and 5 are the best But this is, somehow, slightly more correct. Probably just because those are the seasons where I watched each episode at least twice the week they debuted so they really stuck with me. Yoshi Wins posted:It's stabbing me in the loving heart. Why are you swearing? (Another thing I caught this time, the show revels in its ability to say "poo poo" and "Goddamn" and other TV-14 words that wouldn't fly on broadcast, but when we get the first muted swear of the series since Pete's whispered broadside at Don in the pilot, it's a big drat moment. For as much as these people drink and screw and everything else, an unguarded Effer leaves them all aghast.)
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Feb 25, 2021 06:27
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VinylonUnderground posted:Whoa whoa whoa! Make sure you put how WWI ends in spoiler brackets. Thanks for letting me know there's no reason to seriously engage with you.
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Feb 25, 2021 10:36
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VinylonUnderground posted:Why should we care about Don's cowardice? As I mentioned in the post that kicked this all off, it's very W's America. Look at Max Cleland and John Kerry then compare them to Saxby Chambliss and W. In that sense, humanizing Don with his self-indulgent "emptiness" is loving evil. We even see Don have the chance to start everything over again where he will succeed again. So what if Don runs away from NYC with a new woman to where ever? He's going to be able to make himself again and again and again. He the ultimate self-made man because he's constantly remaking himself. If the show is “loving evil” you probably shouldn’t watch it. I don’t club homeless people on the weekend and then post about how naughty I am.
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Feb 25, 2021 17:27
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can we stop responding to the bad posts that don't understand TV and instead share our favorite mad men era dance?
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Feb 25, 2021 19:15
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Beamed posted:can we stop responding to the bad posts that don't understand TV and instead share our favorite mad men era dance? the one coming up, and Ken’s tap dance when Cutler gives everyone drugs in one of the last few seasons
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Feb 25, 2021 19:40
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Xealot posted:Just emphasizing this part. If Matt Weiner wanted to make a show about a cool, hyper-masculine badass who clowns on libs and feminists or whatever, he could've done that and set it in 2007. He could've cast Gerard Butler in some kind of Suits-esque business dramedy and made...whatever that show would be. He made a show set in the 60's because he wanted to say something about the dominant culture of that time, especially with respect to gendered power and the capacity for "successful" men to behave like Don unchallenged. I think you and others are missing my point. Weiner absolutely wants to make a show condemning those things. I just think he fails at it, because he actually likes those things despite his comments to the contrary. The Romanovs makes his adoration of wealth quite explicit and his personal scandals make it clear that he quite likes being a grimy little pimp and adores the fruits (if not the tree) of the patriarchy. I don't think Weiner wants to make a show about a hyper-masculine badass who clowns the libs. I think Weiner did make a show about a hyper-masculine badass who owns the libs (but is sad sometimes). Here are two jokes that I think exemplify Weiner's thought process: Joke 1 posted:Back in the old country, a husband and wife were walking along a dirt road. A Cossack road by and stopped. He points at the wife and says, "I am a proud Cossack, I will have my way with your wife!" What could they do? He was a Cossack and if they didn't let him have his way the situation could get much worse. The Cossack dismounts from his horse and points at the husband and says, "I am a proud Cossack and this road is made of dirt. You will hold my balls to make sure they don't touch the ground and get dirty." The Cossack does what Cossacks do and as he road off the husband was laughing and smiling. His wife was, understandably, very cross. How could her husband be happy at a time like this? The husband happily explained: I scooped dirt into my hands before I held his balls. The idiot, his balls are filthy! I won!" Weiner "owns" conservatives the way the husband "owned" the Cossack. Don's emptiness is the Cossack's dirty balls. It's trivial compared to everything else. Joke 2 posted:Author: I am writing a tragedy about a man who suffers. He works from morning until night and cannot spent time with his family and at his home. Friend: Is the man very poor? Author: No, the man is very rich. A poor man working from morning until night is normal. A rich man who works so much that he cannot use his yacht -- now that is real tragedy. Weiner is writing that tragedy. Prince Myshkin posted:Thanks for letting me know there's no reason to seriously engage with you. Hey man, you are the person who suggested that Paths of Glory should have had an alt history ending. ANOTHER SCORCHER posted:If the show is “loving evil” you probably shouldn’t watch it. I don’t club homeless people on the weekend and then post about how naughty I am. Sorry for talking about a show in a thread about the show. I'll let you guys get back to just mentioning what is happening on screen and what happens in future seasons. TV chat as train chat: the Northwestern leaves at 10AM heading North . . . VinylonUnderground fucked around with this message at 19:58 on Feb 25, 2021 |
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Feb 25, 2021 19:52
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dp
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Feb 25, 2021 19:57
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Why are you like this
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Feb 25, 2021 19:59
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Escobarbarian posted:Why are you like this Shbobdh can't tell the difference between examining the flaws of a character/society and condoning their expression of the same. Imagine thinking that anything with moral complexity is the 24 of its setting. Beamed posted:can we stop responding to the bad posts that don't understand TV and instead share our favorite mad men era dance? Pete and Trudy doing the Charleston and Ken's hopped-up tap dance, is there any contest? McSpanky fucked around with this message at 20:09 on Feb 25, 2021 |
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Feb 25, 2021 20:07
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McSpanky posted:Shbobdh can't tell the difference between examining the flaws of a character/society and condoning their expression of the same. I don't think Weiner actually believes they are flaws. He knows he isn't supposed to like them and that tension drives the show. I think he likes wealth and likes the patriarchy very much. That's the point of what I'm saying. I think that is interesting. The idea that "Don has everything but is hollow" is self-indulgent bullshit. Weiner talking out of both ends of his rear end is way more interesting. Like isn't it oddly prescient that Don the alpha male literally "grabs them by the pussy" as a power move in a episode where we are explicitly told that "Don is garbage". Post 2016, that isn't the "own" that Weiner thought it was. It wasn't at the time either. Just dusty Cossack balls. VinylonUnderground fucked around with this message at 21:11 on Feb 25, 2021 |
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Feb 25, 2021 20:17
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I disagree
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Feb 25, 2021 20:23
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Cool. So what?
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Feb 25, 2021 21:10
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Imagine stealing jokes from Zizek in 2021. *sad trombone noise*
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Feb 25, 2021 21:32
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ANOTHER SCORCHER posted:Imagine stealing jokes from Zizek in 2021. *sad trombone noise* Which joke did I steal? I'm not big into Zizek but I have friends who I. I probably got it through a game of telephone. Good to know a joke's provenance.
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Feb 25, 2021 21:42
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The two responses to best dance in the show are correct and I was a fool to ask  a FOOL
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Feb 25, 2021 22:01
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Nah, the best one is Bert Cooper's "The Best Things in Life Are Free" from Waterloo.
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Feb 25, 2021 22:18
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VinylonUnderground posted:Hey man, you are the person who suggested that Paths of Glory should have had an alt history ending. No I didn't. gently caress you.
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Feb 26, 2021 04:57
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Prince Myshkin posted:No I didn't. gently caress you. I'm just talking about Mad Men, I'm sorry if that made you upset. You are the one who started introducing counterfactuals (including a counterfactual regarding the end of WWI). I didn't take you for a David Lewis fan, so I'm sorry. If you think all counterfactuals that can be constructed are equally valid then sure. Maybe Kubrick would have done things differently if he had been actively trying to communicate the message he actually conveyed in Paths of Glory. I'm not complicated like that. I'm a "death of the author" guy so on the one hand you have the message the author is trying to convey and on the other you have the message the author is actually conveying. You seem to be vibrating at a higher frequency where those two things are aligned so any deviation between them can be solved through structural equations. That's beyond my ken. I'm just talking about 1) What we see in Mad Men 2) What Weiner has publicly stated he was communicating and 3) The historical circumstances of 1&2. No crazy counterfactuals. Just what is, what is and what is. I'm sorry this is making you upset.
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Feb 26, 2021 05:44
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Lol shut the gently caress up dude
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Feb 26, 2021 05:47
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16 years on this forum, and I've never ignored a poster until this very moment.
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Feb 26, 2021 05:50
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Devorum posted:16 years on this forum, and I've never ignored a poster until this very moment. Why? I state my opinion and then explain my position. Why is this bad? I'm just talking about Mad Men. I don't get the hate.
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Feb 26, 2021 05:53
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Devorum posted:16 years on this forum, and I've never ignored a poster until this very moment. Shocking the guy who burned 2 other accounts with racism/homophobia slurs would be the one that finally pushes someone to use the ignore function.
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Feb 26, 2021 06:09
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pentyne posted:Shocking the guy who burned 2 other accounts with racism/homophobia slurs would be the one that finally pushes someone to use the ignore function. That's a myth.
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Feb 26, 2021 06:11
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Yoshi Wins posted:One of those posts provided examples and performed a close reading and one did not. Hey the guy mentioned how silly the show and fanbase is. Sounds like a good critical take to me.
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Feb 26, 2021 06:23
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Can we all ignore him now? This is a small enough group that we might get universal agreement to ignore all of his posts.
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Feb 26, 2021 06:26
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Yes please.
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Feb 26, 2021 06:31
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Yoshi Wins posted:Can we all ignore him now? This is a small enough group that we might get universal agreement to ignore all of his posts. But why? I'm just talking about the show. I don't get why people are so upset.
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Feb 26, 2021 06:43
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Yoshi Wins posted:Can we all ignore him now? This is a small enough group that we might get universal agreement to ignore all of his posts. That goes against my poster code. Plus its interesting. Look at this. VinylonUnderground posted:I think you and others are missing my point. Weiner absolutely wants to make a show condemning those things. I just think he fails at it, because he actually likes those things despite his comments to the contrary. The Romanovs makes his adoration of wealth quite explicit and his personal scandals make it clear that he quite likes being a grimy little pimp and adores the fruits (if not the tree) of the patriarchy. I don't think Weiner wants to make a show about a hyper-masculine badass who clowns the libs. I think Weiner did make a show about a hyper-masculine badass who owns the libs (but is sad sometimes). Cutting out the fat, its things alot of people can agree on, with a last sentence ("making a show about owning libs") that comes out of nowhere so quickly and without any buildup it gives a person whiplash just looking at it. Its not an argument. Its casus belli, and follows a meter familiar to anyone more interested in causing a ruckus then join a conversation. Lol, it can be done better.
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Feb 26, 2021 06:48
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LIGHT THE JERU BEACON
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Feb 26, 2021 07:28
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Shageletic posted:That goes against my poster code. I guess I just think we are all on the same side so I don't think it is a "casus belli". I'm not trying to make war on my allies. I think we all agree on what Mad Men *wants* to say. I think we all agree that what Mad Men *wants* to say is good. I think Mad Men does a terrible job actually saying what it wants to say. And that's all I'm saying. Hence me mentioning "no such thing as an anti-war film" using a textbook example and then que people wanting to relitigate that antiwar movies do actually exist. Which is cool but not my point and beyond the scope of discussion I'm trying to have. My initial statement was that S1-2 (all we have in this thread) is firmly in the tail end of the W era and Don is very much a W conservative. After he grabs a woman by the pussy and is told by a comedian that he is a piece of garbage. Like, 2007, a rich white man who loves wealth and power going "Look at this crass piece of poo poo, don't you hate him?!?" makes sense. But that caricature got loving elected in 2016. Hell, Trump's whole appeal is Don's endorsement of loving Nixon. I'm not offering a casus belli. I'm calling people in. The vision of Mad Men is flawed and flawed in ways that we, knowing the future since we are living in it, can clearly see. A rich LA fuckboi critiquing W-era conservatives on bullshit that no one cares about. Who gives a poo poo if Don is sad because his rich life where all of his desires are fulfilled is empty? That's so far down on the list of "things to give a poo poo about". Let me tell you the real ending of Mad Men. You have a man whose whole life is a fabrication. Every single moment of it is a lie. That lie is that he is a successful, sexy alpha male. The actual person is grossly inadequate, petty and stupid but above all they are projecting the worst case of impostor syndrome the world has ever seen. The whole subtext of Mad Men is "look at what a loving loser this guy is!". But we know how it really ends. That dude becomes President. Weiner's idea of a caricature of conservativism he can dunk on is now so mainstream that they get speaking time at the DNC. It's not an accident that Don's comments about Nixon came at the height of Nixon rehabilitation, when people like Colbert were singing Nixon's praises (as compared to W). Just like now we have feckless fucks singing W's praises compared to Trump. Weiner failed to go far enough because he loves the patriarchy and he loves wealth. I'm not saying you can't make an anti-war movie. I'm saying Paths of Glory isn't an anti-war movie. I'm specific, not general. Because I'm talking about the show we are watching. I'm just trying to talk about Mad Men.
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Feb 26, 2021 07:28
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Yeah these posts aren't so bad, but "why are you upset" is overly dickish. Press send before that part.
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Feb 26, 2021 07:29
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BrotherJayne posted:LIGHT THE JERU BEACON Let him work on his own time. It took what eight years for the series to finish, if you must have more read his gta san andreas let's play. It's truly something to behold.
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Feb 26, 2021 07:30
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pokeyman posted:Yeah these posts aren't so bad, but "why are you upset" is overly dickish. Press send before that part. I'm not meaning to upset people here. I'm not trying to be a dick, I legitimately don't understand why people can't have a civil conversation. Like, I'm talking about Mad Men in the Mad Men thread and people are angry.
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Feb 26, 2021 07:32
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Gaius Marius posted:Let him work on his own time. It took what eight years for the series to finish, if you must have more read his gta san andreas let's play. It's truly something to behold. Ooo! How do I list threads started by someone
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Feb 26, 2021 07:36
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"Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas" https://lparchive.org/Grand-Theft-Auto-San-Andreas-(Screenshot)/
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Feb 26, 2021 07:40
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VinylonUnderground posted:I'm not meaning to upset people here. I'm not trying to be a dick, I legitimately don't understand why people can't have a civil conversation. Like, I'm talking about Mad Men in the Mad Men thread and people are angry. You're saying the same thing over and over and it's really dull. Stop, please.
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Feb 26, 2021 07:56
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VinylonUnderground posted:I'm just talking about Mad Men, I'm sorry if that made you upset. You are the one who started introducing counterfactuals (including a counterfactual regarding the end of WWI). I didn't take you for a David Lewis fan, so I'm sorry. If you think all counterfactuals that can be constructed are equally valid then sure. Maybe Kubrick would have done things differently if he had been actively trying to communicate the message he actually conveyed in Paths of Glory. I'm not complicated like that. I'm a "death of the author" guy so on the one hand you have the message the author is trying to convey and on the other you have the message the author is actually conveying. You seem to be vibrating at a higher frequency where those two things are aligned so any deviation between them can be solved through structural equations. That's beyond my ken. Prince Myshkin posted:No I didn't. gently caress you.
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Feb 26, 2021 09:04
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What did you say? sebmojo posted:You're saying the same thing over and over and it's really dull. Stop, please. A dull conversations stops. This conversation keeps going on and on. Largely driven by people who don't understand what they are saying, like the example above. But even when I'm going through a probation people keep talking and talking about me and my posts without me so clearly there is something interesting about what I'm injecting into the conversation. If it were boring, or if I were obviously wrong, it would dry up. VinylonUnderground fucked around with this message at 09:34 on Feb 26, 2021 |
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Feb 26, 2021 09:31
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