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Zaphod42 posted:MM is one of the core characters of the League, they had to introduce him at some point. Clearly he was intended to be in JL2. I couldn't agree less. You shouldn't be including people just to check off boxes on the list. If Martian Manhunter is so important than he should be a part of the movie and not a glorified cameo, and if he isn't then you can probably wait. It isn't like there's a defined Justice League. The Snyder cast isn't the original JL cast, it isn't the cartoon cast, it isn't anything where they have to declare (x) is a Must Have. I love Martian Manhunter but the dude could have waited. Edit: And on a similar note I think 'getting the Justice League together' isn't something that is a stopping process. Having a set unaltering cast of League members seems to miss the point of the league from a writing perspective. Zaphod42 posted:I felt like he was just loving around with Batman / saying how they've had a "relationship" of criminal and crime fighter (Joker is definitely a big part of Batman's character) Unfortunately there is a long history of doing exactly that with The Joker. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 05:03 on Mar 19, 2021 |
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Mar 19, 2021 04:59
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to me, and another example of queer coding a villain, which in cases like this feels less like character development and more like building them on homophobia. Like Moriarty in Sherlock.
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ImpAtom posted:I couldn't agree less. You shouldn't be including people just to check off boxes on the list. If Martian Manhunter is so important than he should be a part of the movie and not a glorified cameo, and if he isn't then you can probably wait. It isn't like there's a defined Justice League. The Snyder cast isn't the original JL cast, it isn't the cartoon cast, it isn't anything where they have to declare (x) is a Must Have. I love Martian Manhunter but the dude could have waited. It plays out like basically a cameo, and could have been cut from the cinematic Snyder film without changing the plot and then added back in the blu-ray release or whatever.  It does feel unnecessary to JL's story and the movie is already bloated. ImpAtom posted:Unfortunately there is a long history of doing exactly that with The Joker. For sure.
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Mar 19, 2021 05:11
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https://twitter.com/BravelySolo/status/1372607636739387410?s=20
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Mar 19, 2021 05:15
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Miss Lonelyhearts posted:why does Cyborg murder his family inside of them to accept himself? are you seriously asking what the symbolism is behind a sinister voice offering to "fix" the hero's life and showing them an illusion of a happier time before they lost the people close to them, and then the hero responding by tearing apart the illusion and saying "I'm not broken" is that too subtle
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Mar 19, 2021 05:15
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The first time Martian Manhunter shows is one of the film's few fumbles, in my opinion. But the second time, just treat it like you would a mid-credit stinger in a Marvel film, but has the courtesy of just being in the epilogue.
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Mar 19, 2021 05:21
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If I was going to do some fan edit thing I would probably end up removing the Knightmare stuff from BvS and ZSJL, and the MM stuff. While Knightmare is cool and all we're never gonna see it realized anyway. The MM epilogue thing was fine but MMMartha didn't work for me.
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Mar 19, 2021 05:30
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loving loved that movie. Man what a good time. For the people who didn’t like it or think it’s too grim dark, good news!! There’s a whole other cut suited just for you as well! goddamn just, amazing OST, really well paced. Just made you care about what was happening. So sick
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Mar 19, 2021 05:31
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Jimbot posted:The first time Martian Manhunter shows is one of the film's few fumbles, in my opinion. But the second time, just treat it like you would a mid-credit stinger in a Marvel film, but has the courtesy of just being in the epilogue. I am admittedly of the opinion that Marvel stinger scenes suck rear end which probably colors that.
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Mar 19, 2021 05:31
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ok i get why people complained about the random russian family b-plot in the whedon cut, but at least it gives the flash something to do besides literally run in a circle until he's needed, and the visual of superman carrying an entire apartment to safety ruled the whedon cut is a worse movie, i don't have any problems saying that. i just wonder if maybe, the hypothetical 3-ish hour snyder theatrical cut would have married better pacing and structure like whedon's movie had to the grander story ambitions of snyder's
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Mar 19, 2021 05:33
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One thing I really loved was how visually creative they got with showing how fast Flash is. They didn’t just settle for doing the quicksilver slowmo thing but they also had these really great and flashy shots of him zipping and bouncing around with the camera struggling to keep up with him. I respect the fact that Snyder’s movies have CGI schlock that has some real expressiveness and impact to it rather than just kinda blurring together like most other CGI schlock does.Jimbot posted:The first time Martian Manhunter shows is one of the film's few fumbles, in my opinion. But the second time, just treat it like you would a mid-credit stinger in a Marvel film, but has the courtesy of just being in the epilogue. The worst part of any half-decent superhero movie is always the sequel-bait breadcrumbs they toss into the middle of the movies that have nothing to do with the rest of the plot. Doubly so when it’s a sequel that probably won’t ever happen. Or at least I don’t think it will? Who the gently caress knows how WB will treat this film in regards to “canon”
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Mar 19, 2021 05:33
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Augus posted:One thing I really loved was how visually creative they got with showing how fast Flash is. They didn’t just settle for doing the quicksilver slowmo thing but they also had these really great and flashy shots of him zipping and bouncing around with the camera struggling to keep up with him. I respect the fact that Snyder’s movies have CGI schlock that has some real expressiveness and impact to it rather than just kinda blurring together like most other CGI schlock does. If nothing else it's difficult to imagine them not saying that Cyborg died on the way back to his home planet or was suddenly played by Will Smith all along.
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Mar 19, 2021 05:35
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Part of why Man of Steel is such a good movie is that its 'sequel bait' consists entirely of 'there are two logos on the screen very briefly that aren't important or draw attention to themselves'
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Mar 19, 2021 05:36
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Yeah, I don't disagree with any criticisms of that cameo. I liked the epilogue one well enough because of that mid-credit stinger feel but in the film proper. But I also am giving it a bit of a pass because of how Snyder talks about the actors he works with and how he considers them friends. That stuff is just him throwing everything, including the sink, into the film. Plus Harry Lennix is great and him getting a big thing like that is nice.
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Mar 19, 2021 05:37
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The second time Martian Manhunter shows up it fits the story and themes well, and not just as a tease for a sequel that will never come. It fits Batman's overall arc, from paranoid loner to trusting leader. He goes from only working alone (with Alfred) and distrusting Superman, to forming the Justice League, to immediately accepting Diana's mention of needing room for more members, and finally he has changed so much that he is willing to immediately trust Martian Manhunter when he shows up. Then in the future he is apparently even willing to work with the Joker.
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Mar 19, 2021 05:38
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^^That's my take on it too. I just wish it didn't feel so cheap production wise. Affleck's reactions were very nonspecific. The MM cameo is forgivable knowing that this is most likely his final DC movie. Like Superman, Snyder got a second chance.
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Mar 19, 2021 05:41
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https://twitter.com/CosmonautMarcus/status/1372687740534464514?s=20
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Mar 19, 2021 05:49
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Say bye to your billions of dollars Marcus!
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Mar 19, 2021 05:52
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So, what happened to buff, crossfit Zeus? Was he too busy chilling in the Garden of the Hesperides to come and fight Steppenwolf or something?
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Mar 19, 2021 05:52
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Lord Krangdar posted:The second time Martian Manhunter shows up it fits the story and themes well, and not just as a tease for a sequel that will never come. It fits Batman's overall arc, from paranoid loner to trusting leader. He goes from only working alone (with Alfred) and distrusting Superman, to forming the Justice League, to immediately accepting Diana's mention of needing room for more members, and finally he has changed so much that he is willing to immediately trust Martian Manhunter when he shows up. Then in the future he is apparently even willing to work with the Joker. Yeah I was fine with that moment, it was the earlier one where it undercuts an otherwise touching character moment that was kinda dumb
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Mar 19, 2021 05:52
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Roman posted:If I was going to do some fan edit thing I would probably end up removing the Knightmare stuff from BvS and ZSJL, and the MM stuff. While Knightmare is cool and all we're never gonna see it realized anyway. The MM epilogue thing was fine but MMMartha didn't work for me. I mean Knightmare ties into Flashpoint, which is happening? Although we'll see what dumb WB does from here, since so much of the set-up for the next JL from snydercut was cut. Rabelais D posted:So, what happened to buff, crossfit Zeus? Was he too busy chilling in the Garden of the Hesperides to come and fight Steppenwolf or something? I think the bigger question is what the hell happened to Ares, dude was jacked and REALLY let himself go by the 1940s.
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Mar 19, 2021 05:54
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Who's that? They said they didn't like it until an hour or so in. I feel like anyone who doesn't like the singing aquaman scene isn't a good taste maker.
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Mar 19, 2021 05:54
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On IMDB I rated the first Justice League cut a 3/10. I have rated the Snyder Justice League a 7, but I would have done 7.5 if I could. It did much better with Cyborg obviously but also Supes and the Flash. The major set pieces still take place in overwhelmingly boring gray environments but at least everything else around those pieces was more fun and affecting. But  at Hallejulah in the end credits, c'mone: Didn't know the context of using Hallejulah - feels bad, explained later el oso fucked around with this message at 06:35 on Mar 19, 2021 |
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Mar 19, 2021 05:56
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It's just a Youtuber who runs a channel called the Cosmonaut Variety Hour. I generally enjoy his content but he's a confirmed Snyder Hater so him actually enjoying it gives me perverse pleasure.
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Mar 19, 2021 05:56
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Well I finally got to watch it. That fuckin ruled. Now to catch up and read the offers that guy made today
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Mar 19, 2021 05:58
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  Imagine how much better the ending of WW would be if he looked like Snydercut
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Mar 19, 2021 06:00
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I liked a lot of the movie and have a lot of thoughts on it that I'll be processing for a bit. But one thing I know right now is that that entire Joker scene was beyond embarrassing.
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Mar 19, 2021 06:01
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Apparently Nick McKinless who plays Ares in JL did not get credited, but David Thewlis did (for his voice?), but I don't remember Ares saying anything at all
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Mar 19, 2021 06:06
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normally it takes a year or longer for a Joker scene to be a source of cultural embarrassment, geniuses Ayer/Snyder got it down to near instant.
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Mar 19, 2021 06:06
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is there any kind of making-of doc out there for this thing? i'm really curious, now that i've seen the whedon cut and realized how they reshot the entire loving movie when snyder left, how much they actually had to do for the snyder cut reshoots over the past year or two. i could totally believe they just dropped $70 million on finishing cgi or something, but i assume it's more than that gimmie the 2017 snyder workprint you cowards i need the rest of this story
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Mar 19, 2021 06:06
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Rabelais D posted:Apparently Nick McKinless who plays Ares in JL did not get credited, but David Thewlis did (for his voice?), but I don't remember Ares saying anything at all i'm pretty sure he said HUUAAARGGH at one point
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Mar 19, 2021 06:07
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abraham linksys posted:is there any kind of making-of doc out there for this thing? i'm really curious, now that i've seen the whedon cut and realized how they reshot the entire loving movie when snyder left, how much they actually had to do for the snyder cut reshoots over the past year or two. i could totally believe they just dropped $70 million on finishing cgi or something, but i assume it's more than that The 12-hour Snyder Doc 
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Mar 19, 2021 06:09
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On the opposite side I thought it was one of the best Joker's we've seen on film. A 180 from the SS version and so much more creepier. Totally in Batman's head and he knows it. (literally in this case since it's a nightmare) Instead of the meme:  He easily stands shoulder to shoulder with each interpretation.
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Mar 19, 2021 06:09
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My cousin actually didn't even notice Martha turned out to be Jon Jonzz in that scene -- there are so many long drawn-out dialogue-free cuts that he just got in the habit of looking at another screen between scenes and missed the transition.  Maybe a plot hole, maybe just something I missed: why didn't Darkseid remember that the anti-life equation was on Earth? They had that flashback showing him squaring off with ancient Atlanteans and Amazons hundreds of years ago, and he pounds the ground and the symbol shows up, right? Why did Steppenwolf have to rediscover it? Didn't anyone make a note of the coordinates or whatever?
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Mar 19, 2021 06:12
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I know axes are generally axe-shaped, but I felt like Ares's axe kinda looked particularly like the Bat symbol in the epic old gods fight. Combined with him wearing his animal-skull helmet, I kinda thought it was connecting in a cool way to Batman's trappings. Like, implying Batman's animal theme and symbol were inspired by Ares and lust for war without him even realizing it.
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Mar 19, 2021 06:14
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Honestly I didnt mind the aspect ration one bit. It is a massively improved movie. I ended up liking it. But in the end, my problem with it is that DC does deal with gods more than men, and so it's hard to relate. Barry is pretty much the audience insert in ways, and Victor can as well I suppose. Both their rolls were the biggest improvements, character wise to me. I dunno if I'll watch it again for a long long time, but yeah I'm glad it was done.
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Mar 19, 2021 06:17
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el oso posted:On IMDB I rated the first Justice League cut a 3/10. I have rated the Snyder Justice League a 7, but I would have done 7.5 if I could. It was his dead daughters favorite song and he put it and the dedication in for her.
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Mar 19, 2021 06:20
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It was a bit of a weakness that the climax largely involved slaying a bunch of demon monsters like video game mobs-stuff like that always lets down the Avengers movies. Man Of Steel and BvS were great partly because it all boiled down to big one-on-one fights, and they're cool symbolically like the God of Hope battling the God Of Despair in MoS, or Doomsday's incarnation as an evil version of the Superman statue, Lex spends the whole movie trying to convince the world Superman is evil and at the end he gives this malign fiction a physical form. In this film, the villains are evil bug men. It's a very satisfying movie but I don't think it'll stick with me like its predecessors did. There's a reason everyone likes Empire Strikes Back the best!
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Mar 19, 2021 06:20
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el oso posted:But With context (that the movie isn't going to provide, naturally) it's quite a nice thing to end on for the project. Apparently it was the favorite song of his daughter (who the film is dedicated to), and the version used in the credits is by the person who sang it at her funeral.
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Mar 19, 2021 06:22
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Finished my 3rd viewing. Movie is still incredible.
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Mar 19, 2021 06:25
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Augus posted:The 12-hour Snyder Doc im imagining a blade runner box set kind of situation
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Mar 19, 2021 06:26
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