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The latest Coolguy stream archive uploaded to youtube has made me interested in getting this game, though going to wait for a steam sale. Interested in a list of what would be considered the important DLCs/game parts to get when one does drop. Also sad that I don't really watch streams because it means I didn't get to see the conclusion of Grimgor and Imrich, BFFs. Real interesting way to be introduced to the game at least.
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Apr 5, 2021 03:06
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Ashsaber posted:The latest Coolguy stream archive uploaded to youtube has made me interested in getting this game, though going to wait for a steam sale. Interested in a list of what would be considered the important DLCs/game parts to get when one does drop. Warhammer 1 is the best DLC for Warhammer 2 by far. Basically mandatory. The rest is pretty much just preference. Some of the oldest Warhammer 1 DLCs feel a bit lackluster nowadays (Chaos, Beastmen, Grim and the Grave) but generally just go for whatever you think looks cool. Love Skaven? Take your pick of any of their lord packs. Think Vampire Pirates sound neat? Grab Vampire Coast. You're some kind of shameful leaf-lover? Wood Elves are for you. Hard to go wrong. Honestly with WH1 and WH2 combined you have so much content that you could probably just wait for the next steam sale to grab anything else, and have a much better idea of what you want when that time comes around. Vargs fucked around with this message at 03:21 on Apr 5, 2021 |
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Apr 5, 2021 03:17
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Ashsaber posted:Also sad that I don't really watch streams because it means I didn't get to see the conclusion of Grimgor and Imrich, BFFs. Real interesting way to be introduced to the game at least. It kinda ended a bit weird because we sallied out with Grimgor and Imrik to slap Archaon, except Archaon fled from us and Karl Franz stole our kill. So we burned down Altdorf.
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Apr 5, 2021 03:24
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jokes posted:I quite like the building system except that once I find a combination That Just Plain Works, I just do that over and over except for specific research things and military buildings. this would be great as a "difficulty" mode, like how some games have a "narrarive mode." instead of just normal/hard/legendary, you could have "General mode" that works like this vs. "Emperor mode" with the building trees.
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Apr 5, 2021 03:59
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Ashsaber posted:The latest Coolguy stream archive uploaded to youtube has made me interested in getting this game, though going to wait for a steam sale. Interested in a list of what would be considered the important DLCs/game parts to get when one does drop. After playing as elves and orcs, which combined have the full swath of ranged, elite melee units, cavalry and monsters, you'll probably have an idea of what kind of gameplay style you like the most. Buy DLC accordingly.
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Apr 5, 2021 04:21
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JT Jag posted:Yeah, keeping the slots and just having the building automatically upgrade without cost would save a lot of campaign map micro. They'd have to rebalance econ a bit to make that not broken, though. At the very least with no rebalancing build queues would be nice. I don't want to have to go back to a settlement four times to replace a t3 growth building with a t3 economic building. Instead I just want to click the T3 building and have it built up to there as long as I just drop the money in. Likewise and especially I never build T2 minor settlement defences unless the plan is for T3 - walls or nothing. But I still have to faff for them
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Apr 5, 2021 15:26
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For those interested, some timelapse videos of what the AI does on the campaign map if left to their own devices. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYvtKSN65IE Tyrion losing the Highelf civil war ending with Empire smushed between Greenskins and Darkelves with a rogue army controlling lustria. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USgTWrUp4qE Highelf and Dwarven alliance wiping out the vampire infestation. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BnUDXkAbdzY Alith Anar has HAD IT with Darkelves existing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBnAIE0RWl0 For Sigmar.
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Apr 5, 2021 17:13
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God drat fighting Skaven is always a huge pain in the rear end and the complete opposite of anything resembling fun. How is getting plagued and having it spread to your entire frontier and wiping out your armies and garrisons there supposed to be fun? poo poo lasts like 6-8 turns, loving ridiculous. It's even more hosed up with the growth changes that make rebuilding lost settlements insanely time consuming after all the wasted growth due to being sacked or razed.
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Apr 5, 2021 19:17
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strategically abandon cities, retreat with your armies, expand more slowly, target the skaven first disease was a thing armies and cities had to deal with and it rarely went well. And skaven diseases are like that on steroids. I think there should be a tech that gives certain factions (like empire) resistance (but not immunity) to disease spread if you build certain buildings or choice trees that hurt a lot now but in the long run are better for you. It is a massive malus which means you should make big sacrifices to avoid it.
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Apr 5, 2021 21:43
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Cranappleberry posted:strategically abandon cities, retreat with your armies, expand more slowly, target the skaven first Don’t Skaven get awesome bonuses for colonizing ruins?
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Apr 5, 2021 21:59
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they can just use food to skip past early growth stages downside is that you have to use food every time, you can't just settle and get the place at one lower level which hinders you from gaining from the ais growth bonuses. but food is trivial nowadays. the ai skaven don't use food at all.
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Apr 5, 2021 22:23
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Gyrotica posted:Don’t Skaven get awesome bonuses for colonizing ruins? Not really a bonus, they can just take it at whatever level they want as long as they spend the food. I'm not sure if the AI takes stuff at a higher level.
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Apr 5, 2021 22:24
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Floppychop posted:Not really a bonus, they can just take it at whatever level they want as long as they spend the food. I'm not sure if the AI takes stuff at a higher level. I’m pretty sure AI Skaven uses normal conquering. The AI doesn’t even have the Food mechanic.
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Apr 5, 2021 22:28
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I was able to save scum my way to not losing any valuable money making settlements (Ghrond's and Hag Graef's gold mines) despite the plague decimating them. Moved some armies around and it made the AI hesitant to commit to besieging any one settlement despite having armies full of plagueclaw catapults and weapons teams. Managed to do this long enough to survive the plague and replenish my armies enough to lightning strike my way out of this mess.
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Apr 5, 2021 22:30
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Plagues are fun in theory, but they just feel really unfun once you realize that, like attrition, the AI can mostly just ignore it.
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Apr 5, 2021 22:34
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they can do a number but they are another thing where the ai essentially get one less turn of impact because of how turn order processing works. i... think? it seems like it.
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Apr 5, 2021 22:42
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Cranappleberry posted:strategically abandon cities, retreat with your armies, expand more slowly, target the skaven first Sure armies dealt with plagues all the time but they also dealt with major supply line issues that also aren't a thing at all in WH2 so crying "realism" isn't much of an answer. Mostly, I find plagues not fun because short of killing the plague priest there isn't much you can do against them, and killing the priest doesn't stop them from being spread by armies. It is incredibly punishing in terms of attrition to all your garrisons and armies and you mostly just have to wait it out, and abandoning settlements is really painful now that growth is as slow as it is. I suppose you could constantly combine and recruit new units to keep up a stack defensively for the very long duration (which also would just pin the army in place) but it's really punishing without much to do about it.
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Apr 5, 2021 22:58
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Tiler Kiwi posted:they can do a number but they are another thing where the ai essentially get one less turn of impact because of how turn order processing works. i... think? it seems like it. I've been wondering about this, when do game rules "tick", is it at the start of your next turn?
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Apr 5, 2021 23:16
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Zaphod42 posted:I've been wondering about this, when do game rules "tick", is it at the start of your next turn? a lot of things would tick at the end of the entire turn cycle, and the player is always the first to go at the start of the cycle. techs, replinishment and attrition, random events and such, income / revolts, recruitment, the works. it results in a lot of annoying oddities. for instance, you move into enemy territory, they reply by recruiting a stack and then by the time you reach their city their recruitment is complete. however, if they come into your territory, the cycle change happens before you can recruit so they siege before your new troops appear. i know in 3k they've moved some of this stuff to happen at the end/start of each factions turn, but only when its particularly egregious; an enemy would lay siege to a settlement and your garrison would take attrition damage before you responded, but the ai armies never did. its an architectural holdover at this point; there is really no gameplay reason to not have that poo poo happen on individual faction turns other than it was maybe easier to implement at the time and now there is too much technical debt to justify the wages paid to people who would change it.
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Apr 6, 2021 00:29
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Ravenfood posted:Sure armies dealt with plagues all the time but they also dealt with major supply line issues that also aren't a thing at all in WH2 so crying "realism" isn't much of an answer. Mostly, I find plagues not fun because short of killing the plague priest there isn't much you can do against them, and killing the priest doesn't stop them from being spread by armies. It is incredibly punishing in terms of attrition to all your garrisons and armies and you mostly just have to wait it out, and abandoning settlements is really painful now that growth is as slow as it is. I don't want to get bogged down in a realism debate because obviously the game isn't realistic and I don't want it to be. But its an interesting and flavorful mechanic to use. Again, I think there should be something mitigate it for the player. Also I personally think supply line and resource management would be super cool but that's me. I will argue that the AI needs advantages over the player and stacking melee attack and defense buffs are not enough. If they can't slow the player down because you'd crush them immediately and that is no fun. You can still divide and conquer pretty easily. There are limits to people dealing with the slog, though.
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Apr 6, 2021 00:52
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Cranappleberry posted:I don't want to get bogged down in a realism debate because obviously the game isn't realistic and I don't want it to be. But its an interesting and flavorful mechanic to use. Again, I think there should be something mitigate it for the player. Also I personally think supply line and resource management would be super cool but that's me. Oh I like the plague mechanic as an idea, I just think it isn't handled well mechanically because once there's a plague nearby, nothing you can do will keep you from getting plagued. Maybe if it stopped all replenishment, gave minor attrition, and gave combat debuffs like having an constant poison effect? You'd still be able to use it to give yourself an advantage but it wouldn't just mean that your frontier cities and armies just wither away after 3 turns. Also I'd unironically like supply lines and think early game 3k where you actually have to worry about army supply is a good one. E: some way to institute quarantine or...something. Make attrition damage only happen while on the move or while garrisoned so your armies are trapped outside the city walls but can still generally not just wither away immediately. Ravenfood fucked around with this message at 01:03 on Apr 6, 2021 |
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Apr 6, 2021 00:59
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If you don't garrison in the city with a plague then your army won't get plagued.
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Apr 6, 2021 01:07
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Idea: delete the plagues and let pestilens, the best and perhaps only good clan, have cool mechanics like the others got
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Apr 6, 2021 01:10
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Plague sucks for the same reason public order and attrition in general suck. The AI is incapable of dealing with the mechanics so they are basically switched off for the AI by default. It's probably been my biggest complaint with this game going back to the first one. There are a lot of mechanics and hero bonuses and things that are effectively useless against the AI. This frustratingly eliminates the entire strategy level of terrain type (mountain passes, arctic/desert, magic forests, etc) and corruption based factions for everyone but the player. It's lame and would be on the short list of things I'd want them to fix in TW3 if I believed it was possible.
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Apr 6, 2021 01:15
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Plagued armies should have stink lines coming off of their units on the battlefield
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Apr 6, 2021 01:18
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DeadFatDuckFat posted:Plagued armies should have stink lines coming off of their units on the battlefield The blood DLC for TW Attila made plagued armies have all their guys vomiting and so on in-battle. It was kind of over the top.
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Apr 6, 2021 01:46
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John Charity Spring posted:The blood DLC for TW Attila made plagued armies have all their guys vomiting and so on in-battle. It was kind of over the top. I remember that and I approve of over the top things in warhammer
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Apr 6, 2021 02:00
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the composition and implementation of this beast wizard doom stack is pretty funny, imo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5ws36MAbpc the op is in the comments. 
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Apr 6, 2021 02:01
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:Idea: delete the plagues and let pestilens, the best and perhaps only good clan, have cool mechanics like the others got take a bath, heretic.
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Apr 6, 2021 02:01
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drat Dirty Ape posted:Plague sucks for the same reason public order and attrition in general suck. The AI is incapable of dealing with the mechanics so they are basically switched off for the AI by default. It's probably been my biggest complaint with this game going back to the first one. There are a lot of mechanics and hero bonuses and things that are effectively useless against the AI. This frustratingly eliminates the entire strategy level of terrain type (mountain passes, arctic/desert, magic forests, etc) and corruption based factions for everyone but the player. It's lame and would be on the short list of things I'd want them to fix in TW3 if I believed it was possible. Make it where they can't deal with it anyway and the ai just falls apart. Setting fires in ai castles in stronghold crusader was and is great. This might make the chaos invasion more interesting if there's chaos nonsense happening everywhere to give the ai hordes more of a chance of getting into kislev
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Apr 6, 2021 02:13
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Tiler Kiwi posted:take a bath, heretic. Skaven need plagues to have a chance against getting Grailed Ps Graildivers dlc when
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Apr 6, 2021 02:45
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pnutz posted:Make it where they can't deal with it anyway and the ai just falls apart. Setting fires in ai castles in stronghold crusader was and is great. This might make the chaos invasion more interesting if there's chaos nonsense happening everywhere to give the ai hordes more of a chance of getting into kislev I used to do this with mods but unfortunately since the AI doesn't know how to handle it they end up drastically nerfed so much that it's not really fun. I remember things like pre-revamp greenskin armies garrisoned in cities just infighting themselves to death (full armies with 1 health in each unit).
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Apr 6, 2021 02:56
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look we all know launching smelly, ignorant peasants blessed by The Lady and doused in holy water is good and right and exactly what The Lady wills. The question is do we use holy oil and light them on fire before launch? Perhaps make them carry a torch and ignite in cleansing fire mid-air?
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Apr 6, 2021 02:57
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What's the arbitrary lore reason you can't build walls in chaos wastes? It's ridiculous Rakarth on the vortex map can't build walls in a province separated by water. The beginning of this campaign is nothing but following force marched/full sail armies as they zoom around the map to get at your ports without walls. Think I'm just going to let the AI do whatever they want to them, not worth the hassle of keeping them protected. Total War has never been good at naval stuff and I hope WH3 has little to no ocean to deal with.
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Apr 6, 2021 07:44
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Thank you! 
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Apr 6, 2021 07:48
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Mustang posted:What's the arbitrary lore reason you can't build walls in chaos wastes? It's ridiculous Rakarth on the vortex map can't build walls in a province separated by water. The beginning of this campaign is nothing but following force marched/full sail armies as they zoom around the map to get at your ports without walls. Think I'm just going to let the AI do whatever they want to them, not worth the hassle of keeping them protected. The AIs huge boner for unwalled settlements is one of the most annoying things in the campaign. You can use it to your advantage of course but it just tends to make everything tedious. I hate having to sacrifice a building slot for walls, it just delays development and drags on campaigns which are already way too long. If you don't then 3 factions come charging across their foes territory just to get that 100 income settlement. I used to have a mod to deal with it but can't remember what the name was.
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Apr 6, 2021 14:41
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The campaign layer makes walls mandatory everywhere, but it actively makes the battle layer of the game worse because of sieges.
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Apr 6, 2021 15:19
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Before I only walled up capitals because minor settlements could be rebuilt relatively quickly. But when CA hosed up growth walling became a must because of how much longer it takes to develop them.
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Apr 6, 2021 16:16
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Ra Ra Rasputin posted:The campaign layer makes walls mandatory everywhere, but it actively makes the battle layer of the game worse because of sieges. I wouldn’t put walls up if the AI wouldn’t try its hardest to avoid all walled settlements and only attack unwalled settlements no matter how far away they are.
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Apr 6, 2021 16:26
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Sasgrillo posted:Before I only walled up capitals because minor settlements could be rebuilt relatively quickly. But when CA hosed up growth walling became a must because of how much longer it takes to develop them. Yeah I really hate wasting 20 turns on some piece of crap settlement, only to have a Skaven or Greenskins stack materialize out of nowhere after passing over 2 other enemies. Speaking of growth, did they fix Tomb Kings growth or is still really slow? I should really do a Tomb Kings vortex campaign soon, they have a really chill campaign that strikes a balance between Vortex and Mortal Empires. ME campaigns just take too damned long for almost every race.
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Apr 6, 2021 17:10
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