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Tarnop
Nov 25, 2013

Pull me out

Splicer posted:

It's a weighting system, so from my understanding it doesn't go "I'm low on amenities, better build holo theatres" so much as "time to build a thing, my low amenities has increased holo theatres weighting, I will build holo theatres" So to have low amenities trigger building a city you'd need to have a condition in cities for "if low on amenities AND out of building slots THEN increase city district weight". I'm guessing the city district weighting is just checking free housing or carrying capacity with maybe an "if low on jobs AND out of building slots THEN increase city district weight"

It could be generalised to "if highest priority is building AND no free building slots THEN increase city district weight". But then I don't know what knock on effects that would have. Either way, the end result is that city-heavy AI planets tend to have a glut of amenities while the rest tend towards unrest. These are usually things like generator worlds, so when the AI gets into energy deficit it tries to create energy jobs on planets with a significant output malus, digging a deeper hole for itself.

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QuarkJets
Sep 8, 2008

Shumagorath posted:

This anemic pop growth is really harsh. I have three relic worlds and two Gaia worlds that I can barely get off the ground, much less max out my capitol. Gene clinics and robot plants on every one, yet no luck.

Have you checked whether you can boost your capacity on those worlds? Eventually you get to the point of everywhere is growing slowly no matter what, but I've seen numerous reddit posts where people were running into growth problems due to planetary capacity rather than empire population; worth checking to make sure that those planets are in the sweet spot for pop growth

QuarkJets
Sep 8, 2008

Phosphine posted:

I honestly didn't even consider a housing building, no idea which works out the best/most sciency. Apart from resort worlds I never build housing buildings, it just...feels inefficient somehow, with a district for it right there! Depends on how many you'd have to build, but you can burn down quite a few research labs before it's comparable to one research segment, so that's probably better actually.

Speaking of resort worlds, has anyone checked to see if those got broken by this patch? Or did they get reworked?

HelloSailorSign
Jan 27, 2011

QuarkJets posted:

Speaking of resort worlds, has anyone checked to see if those got broken by this patch? Or did they get reworked?

Mine's building fine, when you convert it you get loads of building slots opened so you can do whatever with it. However, what's weird is that cloning vats are not allowed, but robot building is.

I guess they're those kind of robots.

My other planets appear to be getting the bonuses as intended from the Resort world.

Serephina
Nov 8, 2005

恐竜戦隊
ジュウレンジャー

Tarnop posted:

It could be generalised to "if highest priority is building AND no free building slots THEN increase city district weight". But then I don't know what knock on effects that would have. Either way, the end result is that city-heavy AI planets tend to have a glut of amenities while the rest tend towards unrest. These are usually things like generator worlds, so when the AI gets into energy deficit it tries to create energy jobs on planets with a significant output malus, digging a deeper hole for itself.

Yea careful, that's what the AI used to do; you could set up a sector and watch the govoner constantly replace its own buildings ad nauseam.

----------------

There was some good advice on build orders before, but I'd really stress the whole "avoid bad jobs" things. After the first year or two of the game, I'd rather have a pop be unemployed than be a clerk; that way at least I get a notification about it and can fix the problem. Clerks are a terrible job on your homeworld, and elsewhere there's good chances that their trade doesn't make it back to the capital, so they're literally doing nothing. Having each planet run with a 6-10 population deficit is crippling!

Cease to Hope
Dec 12, 2011
How do you make up the difference on stability without clerks?

Also what was the strategy people were talking about with using underpopulated outlying worlds to feed the core? Can you go into more detail on that?

Jabarto
Apr 7, 2007

I could do with your...assistance.

Cease to Hope posted:

How do you make up the difference on stability without clerks?

Also what was the strategy people were talking about with using underpopulated outlying worlds to feed the core? Can you go into more detail on that?

Once a planet has ~30 pops and ~60 capacity (I don't know the exact numbers, it might be 2-3 in either direction), its pop growth bonus will max out at +3.00. If the planet has no jobs at that point, all new pops will be unemployed and try to migrate to a planet that does. So you can leave your basic resource planets there and use the resulting emigration to populate larger and/or more urbanized worlds

Jabarto fucked around with this message at 00:40 on Apr 23, 2021

Tarnop
Nov 25, 2013

Pull me out

Cease to Hope posted:

Also what was the strategy people were talking about with using underpopulated outlying worlds to feed the core? Can you go into more detail on that?

If you skip back through the last few pages there's a reddit link to a thread about optimal pop to carrying capacity ratio for maximum planetary growth speed. The idea is that you give a non-core planet the rural designation for a boost to raw resource production and make food, energy and mining jobs (plus jobs to keep the planet stable and boost growth) until you hit that sweet spot. Then make no further jobs, set up a transit hub in the system, and you have a resource positive world that's growing pops as fast as it can, who find themselves unemployed and move to your forge and research planets.

Deuce
Jun 18, 2004
Mile High Club
BUBBLES NOOOOO

Juvenile amoeba pal joined up and I set it to move to my homeworld to sit, being at that stage of the game where one more cruiser-sized craft makes no difference in a fight. A group of drone miners spawned in its path while I was distracted by war and the poor thing got killed.

QuarkJets
Sep 8, 2008

Cease to Hope posted:

How do you make up the difference on stability without clerks?

Also what was the strategy people were talking about with using underpopulated outlying worlds to feed the core? Can you go into more detail on that?

Thanks to carrying capacity, you can get up to a +3 bonus to base growth rate, which is multiplicative against growth bonuses instead of additive. So you can easily be generating 10-20 growth points per month by just optimizing your carrying capacity and population growth bonuses, even before migration or pop assembly. This bonus is calculated per-planet (and can become a malus; a fully-developed and highly-populated planet basically doesn't grow anymore), and remember that the normal base growth rate is 3 so this is a 2x bonus to growth on that world.

Capacity comes from housing and open districts, plus a few other things, so you want blockers cleared and some development but leaving districts open can be fine. The max growth bonus can be unlocked at around 25 pops if you have a buttload of capacity, but things are easier around 30-40 pops, and 40-50 is also a good target since you can upgrade your capital building at 40. So you can set up planets with enough jobs for 40ish pops and plenty of capacity, then you put Transit Hubs in orbit over them + any worlds where you want the pops to auto-migrate to, where maybe your capacity is low but you've stacked efficient production bonuses and things like that. This funnels all of that pop growth into the worlds with the most efficient jobs in a mostly automated way

ilkhan
Oct 7, 2004

I LOVE Musk and his pro-first-amendment ways. X is the future.
The hive mind empire that was on my border decided to declare war on my terravores. They now own no space and are soon to own no planets. Oops.

But I did discover something awesome during this war. Reinforcement fleets no longer get lost and confused when the fleet they are reinforcing goes into battle. They'll even reinforce a fleet while it's fighting.
Jesus Christ that's a nice change.

Tarnop
Nov 25, 2013

Pull me out

What if, instead of growth requirements going up as empires got bigger, job upkeep costs went up instead? There's a thematic reason for it (logistical cost of maintaining a massive empire, corruption in local government far from the capital) and it leaves it in the hands of the player to cap off their own growth at the point where further expansion becomes unviable and to use existing systems like megastructures to push through the costs. It also deals with the pop stealing > pop growing issue.

I'm still reacquainting myself with the game after a break of several years, so please tell me why this idea is terrible.

Serephina
Nov 8, 2005

恐竜戦隊
ジュウレンジャー

Cease to Hope posted:

How do you make up the difference on stability without clerks?

Also what was the strategy people were talking about with using underpopulated outlying worlds to feed the core? Can you go into more detail on that?

Entertainer jobs? They give five times as much amenities and 2 unity to boot, at a reasonable upkeep. Yes, it's a building slot, which has its costs. But you can take five clerks, the entirety of an unupgraded clerk building, and replace them with ~1.2 jobs, freeing up the rest do to poo poo. Excessive amenities aren't a big deal as they give happiness/stability/+output. I build the first holotheatre when a colony's loose change of amenities from colonists/etc don't cut it, then deprioritize all clerk jobs from there on out.

------

When do people make an effort to get under Admin Cap (What a lovely mechanic btw)? I eat the penalties as research centres are clearly better, and just stockpile unity after the first ~1.5 tradition trees until I get it back under control. I generally won't bother in the slightest until I get the teir2 bureaucrat building (and I always rush rare resources now) as I find they'll take too many slots at teir1.

Tarnop
Nov 25, 2013

Pull me out

Oh, you reminded me about admin cap / empire sprawl which is the mechanic already in the game that's supposed to make it harder to go wide forever. Why isn't this the lever they're pulling to keep total pop counts in check?

Deuce
Jun 18, 2004
Mile High Club
Pff, my neighbor has a "guarantee independence" from this empire who couldn't possibly reach me. I'll knock him over no problem!


Oh wait wormholes

Cease to Hope
Dec 12, 2011

Tarnop posted:

If you skip back through the last few pages there's a reddit link to a thread about optimal pop to carrying capacity ratio for maximum planetary growth speed. The idea is that you give a non-core planet the rural designation for a boost to raw resource production and make food, energy and mining jobs (plus jobs to keep the planet stable and boost growth) until you hit that sweet spot. Then make no further jobs, set up a transit hub in the system, and you have a resource positive world that's growing pops as fast as it can, who find themselves unemployed and move to your forge and research planets.

Wait, planet designations give bonuses? And you can change them? Holy poo poo, that's new since I last played, lol

Tarnop
Nov 25, 2013

Pull me out

Cease to Hope posted:

Wait, planet designations give bonuses? And you can change them? Holy poo poo, that's new since I last played, lol

I've been clicking on every button I can find in every UI screen, with full tutorial on, and I still made it through a full game without realising you can switch off individual jobs. There's a lot of hard to find stuff.

scaterry
Sep 12, 2012
Do you want to know what's a crazy thought? I think it might be meta to build housing buildings. Because rural districts decrease your planet capacity by two, and you don't use the building slots on rural planets anyway, housing buildings are a way to keep planet capacity in the >70 range for max growth. It's especially good for hive minds, who have a lot of building slots, amenity issues and want to maximize organic growth.

FileNotFound
Jul 17, 2005


Tarnop posted:

There's a lot of hard to find stuff.

The UI for a lot of stuff is super confusing because so much of it got sort of shoehorned in later.

My favorite is how frequently people forget about Minor Artifacts that are a fantastic source of money in the early game... but they are hidden away under a Society Management tab that nobody looks at until they actually have a full Relic...by which point selling minors for 500 energy isn't worth it

Admiral Joeslop
Jul 8, 2010




Is there a decent guide to how planets and jobs work after they removed grids? I didn't play much then and I'm having a hard time catching up on the changes combined with 3.0. Do I leave building slots empty until I need something or should I fill them as soon as one opens? I don't even know what a clerk is or why it's a bad job.

Electro-Boogie Jack
Nov 22, 2006
bagger mcguirk sent me.

Yami Fenrir posted:

I'm having the time of my life not resettling poo poo or building housing or yet another alloy factory every 2 minutes no matter what I play tbh

yeah the weird empire-wide pop thing needs to get reworked or removed, but the mid to late game is already way better with the new system. no more endlessly scrolling through your list of planets trying to keep up with the 'build new alloy factory' button.

wilderthanmild
Jun 21, 2010

Posting shit



Grimey Drawer
My current game is hell. First I started next to a very aggressive neighbor, who at this point is long forgotten. His fleet power was "overwhelming" even with my max naval power. I eventually managed to win with a stronger economy and convincing his fleets to keep suiciding themselves into my chokepoint and then sending in my fleet once he'd attack the station. One I conquered him, I noticed I'd either fallen behind in tech or just never caught up to the advanced start AIs, so I had to be really aggressive and maintain a large navy to offset their advantages. I started picking them off. Then my neighbors started banding together so that every war is against the whole galaxy. Then once I get about half the galaxy under my control or as subjects and move to strip off one more, the Unbidden show up. Once they show up, I pull back from that area and start to plan a way to deal with them, then the big anti-me alliance declares war. I destroy their most powerful empire, claiming their home world and megastructures and the vassalizing the rest of their territory(I took the crisis perk), other than 1 planet since it was a "status quo" so I could go back to dealing with the Unbidden. Then the moment I do that, before my fleets can even get home, the FE's decide they need to invade me and 300k power fleets start pouring into my two vassals that share borders with them.

Electro-Boogie Jack posted:

yeah the weird empire-wide pop thing needs to get reworked or removed, but the mid to late game is already way better with the new system. no more endlessly scrolling through your list of planets trying to keep up with the 'build new alloy factory' button.

Yea. I really like the mid game now. I feel like the planets are just the right level of management. I do hope they find a way to rework the empire-wide pop thing though. I felt like mine was still growing, since if I didn't check every so often, I'd still find new unemployed on every planet, but I don't think I play optimally enough to be bumping up against the empire wide growth curve from what I can tell?

wilderthanmild fucked around with this message at 03:12 on Apr 23, 2021

QuarkJets
Sep 8, 2008

scaterry posted:

Do you want to know what's a crazy thought? I think it might be meta to build housing buildings. Because rural districts decrease your planet capacity by two, and you don't use the building slots on rural planets anyway, housing buildings are a way to keep planet capacity in the >70 range for max growth. It's especially good for hive minds, who have a lot of building slots, amenity issues and want to maximize organic growth.

Yeah, I think that's a good strategy on planets where you want pop growth to be high. In 2.X I'd just stuff rural planets with rare resource converters, but now for the first time it makes sense to build paradise domes

Tarnop
Nov 25, 2013

Pull me out

wilderthanmild posted:

Yea. I really like the mid game now. I feel like the planets are just the right level of management. I do hope they find a way to rework the empire-wide pop thing though. I felt like mine was still growing, since if I didn't check every so often, I'd still find new unemployed on every planet, but I don't think I play optimally enough to be bumping up against the empire wide growth curve from what I can tell?

It certainly sounds like it's getting toned down in 3.02 or 3.03 and another poster has already reported good results with it modded to 2/5ths of the current malus

QuarkJets
Sep 8, 2008

Admiral Joeslop posted:

Is there a decent guide to how planets and jobs work after they removed grids? I didn't play much then and I'm having a hard time catching up on the changes combined with 3.0. Do I leave building slots empty until I need something or should I fill them as soon as one opens? I don't even know what a clerk is or why it's a bad job.

I wrote out a post kind of describing the changes a few pages back, but basically a fresh planet has a bunch of Districts and Buildings that provide Jobs. Pops work those Jobs, consuming resources to produce other resources. If you hover over a district or a building, it'll tell you about the jobs it provides, any upkeep costs, and the inputs/outputs of the jobs. Buildings and districts cost upkeep (usually energy) each month even if their jobs are not being filled, so you often just want to create jobs as-needed. On the Planet screen you can see how many spare jobs are currently available, or if there's unemployment. You usually want to have just enough jobs to prevent unemployment; having 20 spare jobs just means that you're paying a ton of extra upkeep while those districts/buildings sit empty.

There are 3 stratum of jobs, and pops always want to go to the highest-possible strata. Everyone wants to be a ruler. Basic workers would rather be a specialist than a basic worker toiling in the fields. When you create a specialist or ruler job, pop preferences are checked and they'll float upward into the new job, abandoning their old one. So if you have a world with 5 mining districts and you suddenly build 5 industrial districts, that world suddenly won't have anyone working in those mining districts; the workers went from the basic jobs to the specialist jobs, and now suddenly you have a mineral deficit.

Specialists and Rulers would rather be unemployed for awhile than go into a lower-stratum job. Administrators don't want to do field work, but they will eventually succumb if nothing suitable becomes available.

Sometimes pops can only work certain kinds of jobs. Basic robots can only be basic workers, but eventually can be allowed to work specialist and even ruler jobs. Slaves have their job options limited by the type of enslavement.

All pops have a job, even if that's "Unemployed", or even "Livestock" (yum)

Clerks are low-quality jobs because they don't produce much: a little bit of trade value and some amenities. Clerking isn't bad, it's just not a very valuable job type. If you stack a ton of trade value bonuses on a planet then Clerks actually become pretty good, but usually it's better to just use energy districts for energy, entertainers for amenities, etc.

You don't have to fill building slots as soon as they open. Since building slots most often come from building housing districts, you're usually in control over when a building slot will open up; you decide "I'd like to build something that improves mineral extraction here", so you build a housing district and then the building you wanted.

ilkhan
Oct 7, 2004

I LOVE Musk and his pro-first-amendment ways. X is the future.
The empire that attacked me was another hive mind and I totally didn't realize they would just integrate into my own instead of being purged and now I have to do a ton of moving pops around and buying a bajillion foods as my lithoids didn't eat foods. Pop growth formula is still a PITA.

Fhqwhgads
Jul 18, 2003

I AM THE ONLY ONE IN THIS GAME WHO GETS LAID
I haven't touched this game in a while, but has the update broken the pop/capacity mods? I've got a robot determined exerminator race that now won't grow a single pop, the meter just keeps going over the cap and I get negative months to the next pop. (Like 250/150 for next pop, -50 months to next pop growth). I think it's the Carrying Capacity mod specifically. I don't run many mods, just Glavius, Tiny Fleets, Tiny Outliner, and Auto Pop Migration outside of the Carrying Capacity Mod.

wilderthanmild
Jun 21, 2010

Posting shit



Grimey Drawer

Fhqwhgads posted:

I haven't touched this game in a while, but has the update broken the pop/capacity mods? I've got a robot determined exerminator race that now won't grow a single pop, the meter just keeps going over the cap and I get negative months to the next pop. (Like 250/150 for next pop, -50 months to next pop growth). I think it's the Carrying Capacity mod specifically. I don't run many mods, just Glavius, Tiny Fleets, Tiny Outliner, and Auto Pop Migration outside of the Carrying Capacity Mod.

The latest update would definitely break the carrying capacity mod, since they essentially took it and made it vanilla, plus their own changes.

Tarnop
Nov 25, 2013

Pull me out

Fhqwhgads posted:

I haven't touched this game in a while, but has the update broken the pop/capacity mods? I've got a robot determined exerminator race that now won't grow a single pop, the meter just keeps going over the cap and I get negative months to the next pop. (Like 250/150 for next pop, -50 months to next pop growth). I think it's the Carrying Capacity mod specifically. I don't run many mods, just Glavius, Tiny Fleets, Tiny Outliner, and Auto Pop Migration outside of the Carrying Capacity Mod.

Carrying capacity is part of the vanilla game now and there's a building in spaceports for auto migration.

binge crotching
Apr 2, 2010

Finished destroying the galaxy, that was actually pretty fun. Star Eaters are so much better than Colossi, it was definitely a good idea to build 6 of them.

The tooltip for the special project event said that every country would declare war on me right then, but none of them did. At some point the Fallen Empires did declare humiliate wars, but since they were only humiliate I could instantly surrender and not worry about it. I was able to just declare war on the regular countries one at a time (or 1 federation at a time for those), and use my beefy boys to generate thousands of dark matter. At some point I didn't care at all about capturing anything, the entire south west of the map was destroyed systems.

I was definitely caught by surprise the first time I used the special Crisis CB, since it wasn't at all clear from the tooltips that every single system you capture automatically destroys the starbase. I thought it would be like the total war CBs where it let you just take them. Had to use a lot of influence to rebuild the starbases after that one. I feel like it's a lot more useful once you have your first Star Killer, since at that point you don't care about capturing systems anyway.

I think Galactic Wonders is a must have perk, because the faster you can build the 5 stages of the megastructure, the fewer psionic spawns and FE wars you have to deal with.

Dirk the Average
Feb 7, 2012

"This may have been a mistake."

Tarnop posted:

Carrying capacity is part of the vanilla game now and there's a building in spaceports for auto migration.

To clarify, auto migration is a thing that happens automatically at a low % chance each month. The starbase building, and other similar modifiers just increase the chance so that the automatic resettling happens faster.

JerikTelorian
Jan 19, 2007



And Tyler Too! posted:

What I usually do is immediately set trade policy to consumer benefits and economy to militarized, send out 4 scientists to survey (sell excess food/consumer goods to get some early energy). When my first ascension tree is active I almost always pick expansion first because spending less influence to take systems and colonies starting with an extra pop makes it an insanely good choice. I'd like to adopt Discovery first and then fill out Expansion but 200 influence for Map the Stars is BULLSHIT. After that I focus on getting a good supply of minerals rolling, since those are your lifeblood early on. Always put up orbital stations as soon as possible, since it's free stuff and really begins to pay for itself with upgrades that increase mining/research station output. The upkeep becomes an afterthought very quickly. After that I focus on building up my energy/mineral income so when I start gunning for alloys+research I won't nosedive my basic resource income. Industrial districts+consumer benefits (remember to scoop up trade value with starbases) covers scientist upkeep. I keep my food income in the positive but I don't need to prioritize it, just have enough to keep the pops from starving and enough for colony ships and then add more food jobs as needed. Once I've got my first 2 colonies up the one with the most generator districts becomes a dedicated generator world, the other one becomes a forge world. After that my economy is stable enough that I can generally do whatever. I personally am very anal about staying under my sprawl cap so I'll find some lovely small planet and if the habitability is good it becomes my bureaucrat world. Once stability drops below 50 I start adding holo-theaters, gotta have amenities. If I see an excess of clerks, it's time to build a useful building/industrial district.

Thanks for this. With this advice I was able to iron out some of the wrinkles in my empire tonight and things are running much more smoothly.

Phosphine
May 30, 2011

WHY, JUDY?! WHY?!
🤰🐰🆚🥪🦊

Fhqwhgads posted:

I haven't touched this game in a while, but has the update broken the pop/capacity mods? I've got a robot determined exerminator race that now won't grow a single pop, the meter just keeps going over the cap and I get negative months to the next pop. (Like 250/150 for next pop, -50 months to next pop growth). I think it's the Carrying Capacity mod specifically. I don't run many mods, just Glavius, Tiny Fleets, Tiny Outliner, and Auto Pop Migration outside of the Carrying Capacity Mod.

Surprisingly, it's actually glavius. https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2293478298
This fixes it.

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

:geno: Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

Holy hell, purging actually purges now.

Splicer
Oct 16, 2006

from hell's heart I cast at thee
🧙🐀🧹🌙🪄🐸

Serephina posted:

There was some good advice on build orders before, but I'd really stress the whole "avoid bad jobs" things. After the first year or two of the game, I'd rather have a pop be unemployed than be a clerk; that way at least I get a notification about it and can fix the problem. Clerks are a terrible job on your homeworld, and elsewhere there's good chances that their trade doesn't make it back to the capital, so they're literally doing nothing. Having each planet run with a 6-10 population deficit is crippling!
Yeah they're really going to have to do something to buff clerks. It was fine before when they were kind of an unemployment buffer but now they're actively detrimental

Gato The Elder
Apr 14, 2006

Pillbug
I tried playing terravores on grand admiral and was doing pretty well until I hit some rude peacocks with 2-3x my fleet strength. They vassalised the guys I had mostly devoured and then proceeded to more-or-less restore all their system to them (minus the eaten populations). If I had ended the first war earlier I probably would have had enough time recover, but I dunno. Grand admiral (and even admiral) are rough in the early game when everyone wants to kill you 😌

Libluini
May 18, 2012

I gravitated towards the Greens, eventually even joining the party itself.

The Linke is a party I grudgingly accept exists, but I've learned enough about DDR-history I can't bring myself to trust a party that was once the SED, a party leading the corrupt state apparatus ...
Grimey Drawer
Ha ha, turns out if you piss off your federation buddy too much, they'll eventually get pissed enough to leave. One of my galaxy-spanning mega federation partners kept wanting to include another authoritarian monarchy from the other side of the galaxy and I was like "dudes, we're already bleeding XP like there's no tomorrow because you wanted to create a federation with just a total jumble of ethics and now you want even more weirdos to join??" and strictly voted no every time.

A couple years and a dozen votes later the they finally have enough and just leave our federation. They're also setting themselves to "suspicious", break off all our treaties and start actively harming our relations to make sure I can't brainwash them back to being nice.

The real fun part? The empire they wanted to join is still associated with our federation.

And then the Khan happened. The marauders now have eaten with equal abandon large parts of the associated empire I didn't want to join and one of our oldest, staunchest allies. And now the marauders have started hitting the southern borders of our traitorous ex-friends and I can just look on and marvel while not doing a thing.

I guess gloating about how our federation controls 75% of space was a bit premature :v:

Admiral Joeslop
Jul 8, 2010





Awesome, thanks. Are any of the buildings, in general, traps or just plain bad? I often see specialized buildings that come from traits/ethics/whatever and I guess I need to really dig into those tooltips.

QuarkJets
Sep 8, 2008

Admiral Joeslop posted:

Awesome, thanks. Are any of the buildings, in general, traps or just plain bad? I often see specialized buildings that come from traits/ethics/whatever and I guess I need to really dig into those tooltips.

The only real trap is in building poo poo that you don't currently need, or that doesn't make sense for the planet. Don't go building a supercomputer on a planet with only 2 research labs.

It can also be a trap to upgrade buildings prematurely when you have open building slots, because upgraded buildings usually require rare resources for upkeep. For example, research labs (+2 researchers) upgrade to research complexes (+4 researchers), which is great, but the upgraded building requires 1 exotic gas per month. That's usually manageable, but if you have an extra building slot sitting there then you may as well just build a second research lab and not pay the rare resource tax. If you decide later that you want that slot to become something else, that's pretty easy/cheap

Hydroponics farms are kind of bad,

Commercial zones are pretty bad unless you really just need to quickly employ a ton of idle pops on the cheap, or unless you have a ton of trade value bonuses on the planet.

A lot of people don't like gene clinics, the logic goes that the pop growth bonus is too small so you may as well just create more alloy jobs. I like gene clinics anyway

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Spanish Matlock
Sep 6, 2004

If you want to play the I-didn't-know-this-was-a-hippo-bar game with me, that's fine.

Admiral Joeslop posted:

Awesome, thanks. Are any of the buildings, in general, traps or just plain bad? I often see specialized buildings that come from traits/ethics/whatever and I guess I need to really dig into those tooltips.

Last I recall gene clinics were traps and probably still are traps. Other than that it's hard to say right now, I imagine. Robot making buildings seem like a first priority build because they give you extra population at a regular rate.

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