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McCloud
Oct 27, 2005

MCU specializes in cinematic comfort food, and that's fine. Kurzon is right that the consistancy of quality is admirable, you know exactly what you're getting

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Kurzon
May 10, 2013

by Hand Knit
Oh so you think Marvel Studios films are all McDonald's? Where are the fine Michelin star meals I've been missing?

josh04
Oct 19, 2008


"THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"

This title contains sponsored content.

Kurzon posted:

Oh so you think Marvel Studios films are all McDonald's? Where are the fine Michelin star meals I've been missing?

Kurzon
May 10, 2013

by Hand Knit
Oh I get it, Marvel Studios is too mainstream now. That's the real issue, isn't ?

Assepoester
Jul 18, 2004
Probation
Can't post for 11 years!
Melman v2

Bisse posted:

W-wait, people here like Batman v Superman? Like, for real?
I'm just glad post-Gone Girl Ben Affleck got a chance to redeem himself for his turn as Daredevil

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m7GWGLkPepU

Necrothatcher
Mar 26, 2005




Kurzon posted:

Oh I get it, Marvel Studios is too mainstream now. That's the real issue, isn't ?

... well yeah kinda

McCloud
Oct 27, 2005

Necrothatcher posted:

... well yeah kinda

Right, the reason it is mainstream is exactly because it's inoffensive entertainment. It's the soap opera or wrestling of cinema.

No Dignity
Oct 15, 2007

Kurzon posted:

Oh so you think Marvel Studios films are all McDonald's? Where are the fine Michelin star meals I've been missing?

You're the one who described their filmmaking as an industrial process. They're a factory that shoots out edible Content, pretty much your own words

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.
This is like the people complaining that Transformers and My Little Pony sold out

Neurolimal
Nov 3, 2012
There's also plenty of artistic skill and merit in being cheap fun, just like soap operas and wrestling.

Outside of Iron Man 2 (which I still think is the worst Marvel movie barring pinkwashed Raytheon advertisement Captain Marvel), I do think you can get plenty of meaning out of these films beyond being cheap fun, as well. Stark for example gets a lot of flack for being a neoliberal/libertarian wet dream (and rightly so, IM2), but the majority of the films he's in involve him being admonished and/or failing, and Iron Man ultimately needs to clean up Stark's mess [via generic action sequence with limited director input]. This culminates in Endgame, where Tony Stark declares himself Iron Man and dies. It could easily be retooled as a Batman story chronicling the character's shift from 'mentally ill billionaire deviant who abuses gotham's underclass" to "superfriend who punches galactic space dictators".

FalcoWinter, most recently, apparently has done some interesting beats on its own, with the government constructed Captain America replacement weaponizing BLM (via his dead sidekick) in an argument on an institutional problem. There's plenty to enjoy within capeshit, and I'm really just tired of the back-and-forth between the two camps. Marvel movies have ugly flat color grading, DC movies are desaturated and very christian, okay, please move on.

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

A Buttery Pastry posted:

Batman & Robin is better than every MCU movie.

It's pretty cool, I like the visuals where Gotham City is like a cyberpunk megalopolis

Neurolimal
Nov 3, 2012

A Buttery Pastry posted:

Batman & Robin is better than every MCU movie.

I yearn for a Schumacher Batman retrospective that hits the nerd zeitgeist as hard as the RLM prequel videos did. Gay Batman rules, the idea of a billionaire being so tied to his wealth that his secret alter ego needs a credit card in case he needs to Spend on patrol rules, taking the molded abs armor to its natural conclusion & making straight people uncomfortable rules.

josh04
Oct 19, 2008


"THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"

This title contains sponsored content.

I've enjoyed pretty much every MCU film I've watched, just over time my enthusiasm for watching them has tapered off.

KVeezy3
Aug 18, 2005

Airport Music for Black Folk

Kurzon posted:

Oh so you think Marvel Studios films are all McDonald's? Where are the fine Michelin star meals I've been missing?

Let's get back to the meat of the topic: that the MCU is in the midst of a film world-historical run (on the aggregate).

We know it's monumentally successful financially, but what notable ideas has it contributed to superhero stories through the medium of film? What will its legacy be?

Kurzon
May 10, 2013

by Hand Knit
It's legacy is that producer-driven moviemaking can be better than director-driven moviemaking. WB made the mistake of letting Zack Snyder do what he wanted. What WB should have done was find someone like Kevin Feige.

CelticPredator
Oct 11, 2013
🍀👽🆚🪖🏋

You might want to wear this protective suit, you’re gonna need it...

Grendels Dad
Mar 5, 2011

Popular culture has passed you by.

KVeezy3 posted:

Let's get back to the meat of the topic: that the MCU is in the midst of a film world-historical run (on the aggregate).

We know it's monumentally successful financially, but what notable ideas has it contributed to superhero stories through the medium of film? What will its legacy be?

"Don't try to copy this, it only worked this once and we don't really know how, either."

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

Kurzon posted:

It's legacy is that producer-driven moviemaking can be better than director-driven moviemaking. WB made the mistake of letting Zack Snyder do what he wanted. What WB should have done was find someone like Kevin Feige.

WB actually made exactly the opposite mistake, and continues to make it

Grendels Dad
Mar 5, 2011

Popular culture has passed you by.

CelticPredator posted:

You might want to wear this protective suit, you’re gonna need it...

Very sly to call that straightjacket a protective suit.

Mulva
Sep 13, 2011
It's about time for my once per decade ban for being a consistently terrible poster.

McCloud posted:

Right, the reason it is mainstream is exactly because it's inoffensive entertainment. It's the soap opera or wrestling of cinema.

Both those things are loving awesome.

McCloud
Oct 27, 2005

Grendels Dad posted:

Very sly to call that straightjacket a protective suit.

It's to protect us. He's not locked up here with us, etc etc


Mulva posted:

Both those things are loving awesome.

You're right, they're way more exciting than anything the MCU did
Comparison retracted.


Kurzon posted:

It's legacy is that producer-driven moviemaking can be better than director-driven moviemaking. WB made the mistake of letting Zack Snyder do what he wanted. What WB should have done was find someone like Kevin Feige.

This is hilarious, especially considering Zack turns out to have been a moderating influence on the worst impulses of studio execs.

Kurzon
May 10, 2013

by Hand Knit

McCloud posted:

Right, the reason it is mainstream is exactly because it's inoffensive entertainment. It's the soap opera or wrestling of cinema.
It's inoffensive in the sense that Thor will happily fight space aliens but won't lift a finger for the oppressed Uyghurs in Xinjiang.

White Light
Dec 19, 2012

I feel like I need to make an apology to Mr Snyder. I've really been enjoying this film, its surprised the hell out of me so far.

I thought this was gonna be a guaranteed trash fire for sure. Man of Steel was a flick that got a collective shrug from my end after seeing it. Batman vs Superman was honestly the worst film I'd seen in theaters in the past five years or so, almost walked out before the credits rolled.

But this one is different. I actually care about the plight of some of the characters, the cyborg guy especially. The actor they hired loving nails this 70% robot/30% human personality with how he delivers his lines, don't think I've seen anything like it before in any sci-fi work. Snyder made Wonder Woman ten times more deadly than the entirety of WW84, that scene where she deflects like 8 bullets in the third of a second in real time was pants-on-head bonkers compared to all the overdone speed slow-mo you see in every big budget action movie these days. The art design for the villains oozes style, notably Stepphenwolf and whatever broadcast through that black monolith in the nuclear reactor silo.

Really would not mind seeing a sequel to this. Probably the only series where I sort of hated the build up films but loved the final delivery. I'm not sure where WB ends up going with this but I hope they give it one last Justice League push.

White Light fucked around with this message at 13:39 on Apr 30, 2021

HUNDU THE BEAST GOD
Sep 14, 2007

everything is yours

Kurzon posted:

It's inoffensive in the sense that Thor will happily fight space aliens but won't lift a finger for the oppressed Uyghurs in Xinjiang.

Oh brother.

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!
To Thor, the oppressed uighurs in xinjiang are space aliens!

HUNDU THE BEAST GOD
Sep 14, 2007

everything is yours
This is almost too on the nose, you start off talking about how the problem with the MCU is that it's too good and where it leads you is saying if there is a flaw, it's that Iron Man can't personally intervene on the US' behalf in Syria. Incredible.

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.
Imagine if Peter Jackson had been forced out halfway through The Two Towers or Return of the King.

McCloud
Oct 27, 2005

Kurzon posted:

It's inoffensive in the sense that Thor will happily fight space aliens but won't lift a finger for the oppressed Uyghurs in Xinjiang.

It's inoffensive in that it not only avoids controversial topics it actively reinforces the status quo. Black Panther will say racism is bad and then give a sloppy toppy to the CIA while it pretends the solution is to provide minorities the means to pull themselves up by their bootstraps. They'll say their intelligence agencies and indeed US foreign policy has been undermined by double nazis, but it's ok because Captain America made a stirring speech and The Good Ones turned on the obviously evil double nazi infiltrators so everything is ok now. It's also funny because their villains have so far been either other rich Tony Stark types that promoted the Wrong Kind of business or distorted parodies of people claiming to seek social justice but are so cartoonishly evil they will slit a nuns throat to get their goals, just so the audience don't find them too sympathetic.

It's peak lib propaganda, really.


That's not to say DC is innocent of this. Aquaman made such bold claims as "polluting is wrong and biracial people should be treated with respect" and Wonder Woman made the revolutionary claim that war was bad, but it's no coincidence that they were incredibly successful at the BO.

Guy A. Person
May 23, 2003

Parrotine posted:

I feel like I need to make an apology to Mr Snyder. I've really been enjoying this film, its surprised the hell out of me so far.

I thought this was gonna be a guaranteed trash fire for sure. Man of Steel was a flick that got a collective shrug from my end after seeing it. Batman vs Superman was honestly the worst film I'd seen in theaters in the past five years or so, almost walked out before the credits rolled.

But this one is different. I actually care about the plight of some of the characters, the cyborg guy especially. The actor they hired loving nails this 70% robot/30% human personality with how he delivers his lines, don't think I've seen anything like it before in any sci-fi work. Snyder made Wonder Woman ten times more deadly than the entirety of WW84, that scene where she deflects like 8 bullets in the third of a second in real time was pants-on-head bonkers compared to all the overdone speed slow-mo you see in every big budget action movie these days. The art design for the villains oozes style, notably Stepphenwolf and whatever broadcast through that black monolith in the nuclear reactor silo.

Really would not mind seeing a sequel to this. Probably the only series where I sort of hated the build up films but loved the final delivery. I'm not sure where WB ends up going with this but I hope they give it one last Justice League push.

Really love seeing takes like this, thanks!

Jimbot
Jul 22, 2008

Parrotine posted:

I feel like I need to make an apology to Mr Snyder. I've really been enjoying this film, its surprised the hell out of me so far.

I thought this was gonna be a guaranteed trash fire for sure. Man of Steel was a flick that got a collective shrug from my end after seeing it. Batman vs Superman was honestly the worst film I'd seen in theaters in the past five years or so, almost walked out before the credits rolled.

But this one is different. I actually care about the plight of some of the characters, the cyborg guy especially. The actor they hired loving nails this 70% robot/30% human personality with how he delivers his lines, don't think I've seen anything like it before in any sci-fi work. Snyder made Wonder Woman ten times more deadly than the entirety of WW84, that scene where she deflects like 8 bullets in the third of a second in real time was pants-on-head bonkers compared to all the overdone speed slow-mo you see in every big budget action movie these days. The art design for the villains oozes style, notably Stepphenwolf and whatever broadcast through that black monolith in the nuclear reactor silo.

Really would not mind seeing a sequel to this. Probably the only series where I sort of hated the build up films but loved the final delivery. I'm not sure where WB ends up going with this but I hope they give it one last Justice League push.

I highly recommend going back and watching the previous two film and see if your opinion changes. Some people came out of those films liking them a whole lot more after Justice League. Sometimes it helps knowing the destination to make the journey better. The Ultimate Cut of BvS is the way to go, though. It was what was originally going to be released until at the 11th hour WB pulled a WB and Snyder was forced to strip 30 minutes from it.

roffels
Jul 27, 2004

Yo Taxi!

Kurzon posted:

It's legacy is that producer-driven moviemaking can be better than director-driven moviemaking. WB made the mistake of letting Zack Snyder do what he wanted. What WB should have done was find someone like Kevin Feige.

I'm not going to argue with anyone on this, I just find it sad because I think many people earnestly believe this to be a good thing.

Halloween Jack
Sep 12, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 47 minutes!
We need a Marvel movie where Thor reads a storybook to the children in American "immigrant decompression centers" and then flies off to save the Uyghurs from Communism.

KVeezy3
Aug 18, 2005

Airport Music for Black Folk

Kurzon posted:

It's legacy is that producer-driven moviemaking can be better than director-driven moviemaking. WB made the mistake of letting Zack Snyder do what he wanted. What WB should have done was find someone like Kevin Feige.

I was not strictly speaking to a 'MCU v DCEU' narrative, but Snyder was actually or effectively the producer of their 'film universe'. And although he did engage in discussions with the other filmmakers in the DECU stable, he thought the best approach was to allow them, if they didn't want to, to not contort themselves as if they were sequels/prequels to his films.

hiddenriverninja
May 10, 2013

life is locomotion
keep moving
trust that you'll find your way

2house2fly posted:

To Thor, the oppressed uighurs in xinjiang are space aliens!

Disney, notable Marvel and princess movie maker, actually filmed part of the live action Mulan in Xinjiang

Chairman Capone
Dec 17, 2008

KVeezy3 posted:

Let's get back to the meat of the topic: that the MCU is in the midst of a film world-historical run (on the aggregate).

We know it's monumentally successful financially, but what notable ideas has it contributed to superhero stories through the medium of film? What will its legacy be?

In all honesty I think one of the biggest ideological contributions of the MCU is helping push ecofascism through the meme that "Thanos was right," something which people immediately started repeating in earnest even before the pandemic.

Ferrinus
Jun 19, 2003

i'm finding this quite easy, i guess in part because i'm a fast type but also because i have a coherent mental model of the world

HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:

This is almost too on the nose, you start off talking about how the problem with the MCU is that it's too good and where it leads you is saying if there is a flaw, it's that Iron Man can't personally intervene on the US' behalf in Syria. Incredible.

All I'm saying is, why can't Tony contribute a little something to our dwindling police budget?

AccountSupervisor
Aug 3, 2004

I am greatful for my loop pedal


(Once again the first 4 DCEU movies were more profitable than the first 4 MCU movies)

A Buttery Pastry
Sep 4, 2011

Delicious and Informative!
:3:

Mulva posted:

Both those things are loving awesome.
Absolutely nailed that the two are the exact same thing targeted at different demographics, but yeah, the MCU doesn’t belong in that category.

RBA Starblade
Apr 28, 2008

Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

AccountSupervisor posted:



(Once again the first 4 DCEU movies were more profitable than the first 4 MCU movies)

lol

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Megaman's Jockstrap
Jul 16, 2000

What a horrible thread to have a post.

Ghost Leviathan posted:

Imagine if Peter Jackson had been forced out halfway through The Two Towers or Return of the King.

Not only would he have been forced out, but first he would have to have cut Fellowship by half an hour (the Extended Version would still be released, so the gap would have been even wider between the DVD and the Theatrical experience). Then, after firing Jackson, the studio would have hired McG would take over and finish the movies. He would demand a moustache be digitally added to Gollum.

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