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b_d posted:nice, i didn't think to look there. Dark heart's arcana was a funding incentive that wasn't met so there won't be one.
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May 3, 2021 07:40
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permanently disfiguring your CCS with a "you didn't give us enough money" mark is so obviously stupid and meanspirited that I refuse to believe that's true & they're just going to work on it and release it anyway (in 5 years)
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May 3, 2021 07:49
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Mr. Locke posted:I mean, '97 is the climax of the first major story arc so it's cool from that angle, but as someone who played '97 and '98 both when they were live in arcades, I'll take '98 any day of the week because endless Blue Mary/Iori/Clark teams get real old real fast in '97, and while '98 has their own ever-present problems (hello Goro) it's nowhere near as egregious as those three were in '97 back in the day. Like, '97 Mary might just be the stupidest, most unfun character to fight against in a KoF game outside 2k1 Heidern and is only remotely reasonable because she has to deal with Peak Iori in the same game. What majes 97 Mary so good, out of curiosity
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May 3, 2021 08:00
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Wrist Watch posted:This is fair. I'm just extremely annoyed at seeing people sweep her stuff under the rug because ltg is magnitudes worse in every possible way. Like yeah, gently caress that dude but none of that excuses the response she gave: idk i just dont think its permaban worthy. like she said some stupid poo poo to try and cover her rear end and she shouldnt have said it in the first place but she never came across as a virulent racist to me. she wasnt saying black people are inferior or making fried chicken jokes or anything, i dont think any of the use of it people dug up was like, derogatory in nature. like lowtiergod is what a racist is, she just seems like shes never once really thought about how that sort of casual use comes across in public versus when you're in a very close circle of friends who are permitting it. the only thing that comes across extremely bad to me is the clip, and idk, i can forgive a person for misspeaking very badly when they've been harassed day and night for weeks and people dug up something from years ago and you're scrambling to try and explain it. people say stupid poo poo. i dont think what she said is like, something completely unforgivable or unable to be recovered from. id feel the same way if someone said 'tranny' a few times on twitter and came up with some stupid excuse about how theyre friends with trans people who speak very brusquely so actually its okay for them to say it, or whatever. stupid, yes, but 'year ban' territory, not 'forever ban' territory. and you can disagree with that! but at the very least you have to agree that its at least like, a question of whether or not she should be allowed to come back, versus lowtiergod who absolutely isnt in question. thats all i mean. that said if they were gonna unban her they should have just said it was a year ban from the start. Endorph fucked around with this message at 08:14 on May 3, 2021 |
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May 3, 2021 08:02
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and like idk theres this insanely common thing in fgc and ESPORTS in general of trans people getting someone banned for inciting mass harassment of them and then people dig up some much less bad thing they did years ago and everyone goes 'ah, so they should get the exact same punishment, thats fair' and then they get the exact same punishment and a bunch of people wokely agree that this isnt hosed up whatsoever. if you think ceroblast in specific deserves to be permabanned thats fair but that trend in specific is way, way worse than anything ceroblast said or did.
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May 3, 2021 08:15
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You said most of what I was thinking but didn't know how to phrase right, there's a lot of dishonest "LOOK LOOK THE WOMAN/QUEER PERSON (That we've been harassing nonstop) DID A THING TOO" tattetale poo poo that ALWAYS happens, so 
Yardbomb fucked around with this message at 08:32 on May 3, 2021 |
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May 3, 2021 08:28
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Spuckuk posted:What majes 97 Mary so good, out of curiosity Starting from real basic stuff and moving on to pure dumb nonsense: - Mary has one of the best walkspeeds in the game, combined with three of the absolute best buttons in '97- Stand B, Close C, and command f+A. Close C in particular hit twice, caused huge amounts of hitstop, and could be cancelled from either hit, meaning it was a braindead confirm button. Also, while this would become fairly common later, having a command normal you could both combo into and out of was very rare in '97, and Mary happened to have one that was both great on it's own and combo'd off a very strong button in Close C. - The scaling on grabs mid-combo in '97 is lighter then other kinds of non-DM moves, meaning characters who could combo into command grabs tended to do huge damage in '97. Other characters benefitted from this too (see: '97 Clark) but as we'll cover as this list goes on, Mary is the queen of abusing this. For starters, the extensions of both Straight Slice and Vertical Arrow are both grabs, and both can combo off of Close C -> f+A. -Blue Mary had a very very easy 100% putting these pieces together- MAX Mode jump D -> Close C -> f+A xx Mary Splash Rose -> otg Vertical Arrow xx Mary Snatcher. -Wait, otg? As in Off The Ground? Yep. Vertical Arrow was apparently a VERY glitchy move in '97, and could OTG opponents if executed after a ground bounce. Like after Mary's command throw. Or just about any solid anti air hit. Any time a knockdown resulted in a heavy bounce, you could tack on Vertical Arrow xx Mary Snatcher. Y'know, the Mary Snatcher that barely scales because it's a grab. -Oh, hey, speaking of grabs, let's talk about Mary Typhoon real quick. Mostly, the really disgusting forward suction on the attack. This thing could hoover Mary forward from nearly a third of the screen away instantly and latch onto her opponent to tack on a DM/SDM Command Grab. Why yes, the scaling on a DM/SDM Command Grab is practically non-existent, why do you ask? Oh, and yes, that isn't pulling the opponent, that's pulling Mary forward, which is important because... -So, later on people would figure out this universal technique called a few things, but I think Ghost Movement is the term that stuck later. It's a weird bit of tech where any character without super stocks can input the command of a super that moves the character forward while blocking or landing from a jumping attack, they will at first opportunity take the forward motion from that super while maintaining neutral state. Where it was found and abused first and best, however, would be following a block or a whiffed Vertical Arrow or jump CD with the command for Mary Typhoon, instantly catapulting Mary forward ready to instantly go into close C or Command Grab depending on how pants-down she caught you with it. -Finally, Mary has a really stupid trick where if she whiffs Vertical Arrow on a downed opponent, she can grab characters during wakeup frames with her command throw or Mary Typhoon by inputting the commands during recovery. Did I mention that Vertical Arrow was a VERY glitchy move in KoF '97? Not only is this a braindead way to land a raw Typhoon, you can catch an opponent by intentionally whiffing an intended OTG Vertical Arrow and performing Command Grab -> OTG Vertical Arrow xx Mary Snatcher for extra damage, although the timing on that one is kinda fight, IIRC. And if you can do the execution for it, even whiff multiple Arrows into command grabs in the corner. There's more to it, but that's the dumbest bullshit Mary does in '97. e: My bad, I was remembering it as Mary's Forward Throw when I first wrote this post... but it's actually a Command Grab. That means it was causing true (barely-scaling) combos, and can't be escaped. Oh, that's much worse. Mr. Locke fucked around with this message at 09:53 on May 3, 2021 |
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May 3, 2021 09:14
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darealkooky posted:permanently disfiguring your CCS with a "you didn't give us enough money" mark is so obviously stupid and meanspirited that I refuse to believe that's true & they're just going to work on it and release it anyway (in 5 years) according to the wiki, selecting “simple” mode for dark heart can auto-pick the locked arcana and crash the game. lol.
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May 3, 2021 09:21
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Mr. Locke posted:Starting from real basic stuff and moving on to pure dumb nonsense: I choose to believe that all of this was intentional, so when playtesting against Orochi they had a character who could do just as much stupid bullshit as the CPU could.
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May 3, 2021 10:02
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J.A.B.C. posted:I choose to believe that all of this was intentional, so when playtesting against Orochi they had a character who could do just as much stupid bullshit as the CPU could. The worst part is, as stupid as '97 Mary is, there is actual debate whether she or Iori is the best character in the game. When I said Peak Iori, I meant it. There is some really disgusting nonsense in KoF97.
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May 3, 2021 10:05
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I'll never get how white people who use the N word don't feel every minority in the room collectively cringing. This one girl I knew would do that, and would even lower her voice to sound more thuggish, and it was like a chill blew through the room every time. The "my black friends are okay with it" are just "my black friends are too nice to say anything and don't wanna get into a shouting match that ruins the mood... also I'm a friend of a friend, not their friend"
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May 3, 2021 10:14
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darealkooky posted:permanently disfiguring your CCS with a "you didn't give us enough money" mark is so obviously stupid and meanspirited that I refuse to believe that's true & they're just going to work on it and release it anyway (in 5 years) I'm not sure if this game's gonna get a bug fix patch unless ArcSys is secretly funding it
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May 3, 2021 10:38
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Hmm https://twitter.com/Shini_Zack/status/1334012335631974401?s=20
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May 3, 2021 11:15
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i can kind of get 'i want to finish the game before worrying about netcode' but 'very deep down my list of agendas' is very funny phrasing
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May 3, 2021 11:16
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If only fighting game devs could see from my 2021 consumer point of view (which shoulda been my 2016 consumer point of view, put up with this poo poo for too long) "yo this game has a great cast, stellar gameplay, a soundtrack you'll remember the rest of your life, jaw dropping visuals, every single frame of it just oozes perfection. There will be dlc support for multiple seasons at fair prices and the game will be so popular you won't need discord to find opponents for years." Me: Does it have rollback? "No" Me: I'll get it when its $3.49 on steam. Or I won't :shrugs:
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May 3, 2021 11:26
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i think right now, they're focusing on porting to arcade, switch and ps4, then after that who knows kind of a weird limbo they're in
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May 3, 2021 11:29
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Blaise330 posted:If only fighting game devs could see from my 2021 consumer point of view (which shoulda been my 2016 consumer point of view, put up with this poo poo for too long) This is purely anecdotal but I've heard that launching without rollback is actually a tactic by some devs - they've internalised the idea that they need some big post-launch update to extend the life of their game and rather than new characters or some other asset-intensive addition, they've determined that a big netcode update can be the thing they use to renew interest in their game. Launching with good netcode and ensuring as many people buy at full price as possible seems like a far less stupid course of action to me, but what do I know, I'm not an impoverished Japanese dude with no grasp on reality.
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May 3, 2021 12:16
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American execs keep showing they're unable to comprehend the idea of their entire customer base not having world-class internet, let alone a bunch of old dudes in Japan who consider the entire non-Japanese market to be peripheral.
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May 3, 2021 12:41
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North American fighting games are pioneering good netcode, though - NRS' stuff, Skullgirls, KI, Power Rangers, Thems Fighting Herds, the better re-releases of old games, etc. The divide could not be more obvious.
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May 3, 2021 12:58
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PaletteSwappedNinja posted:This is purely anecdotal but I've heard that launching without rollback is actually a tactic by some devs - they've internalised the idea that they need some big post-launch update to extend the life of their game and rather than new characters or some other asset-intensive addition, they've determined that a big netcode update can be the thing they use to renew interest in their game. when the kickstarter was first announced, the director of ah3 said that rollback would be impossible with how fast it is and how homing works because a single stutter ruins your whole combo
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May 3, 2021 12:59
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I've got it, we purposefully get our game a bad rep so that we push away a significant player/buyer base!Ghost Leviathan posted:American execs keep showing they're unable to comprehend the idea of their entire customer base not having world-class internet, let alone a bunch of old dudes in Japan who consider the entire non-Japanese market to be peripheral. Huh? Most of the games with good netcode are coming out of NA, which helps way more with not having world-class internet, them actually listening about the netcode I mean. Like good god almighty do I wish every game had the black magic that Iron Galaxy put on Killer Instinct or like, whatever the Thems Fightin Herds people did too. Yardbomb fucked around with this message at 13:17 on May 3, 2021 |
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May 3, 2021 13:10
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Mr. Locke posted:Blue Mary is busted af This has motivated me to pick up 97.
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May 3, 2021 13:23
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Think the last american fighter that had bad netplay for its entire lifespan was like.... Injustice 1. Oh man I shoulda played Doomsday on that game.
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May 3, 2021 13:23
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Good netcode coming out of NA (and that one upcoming Japanese game) is due to the same small circle of people sticking rollback in wherever they get employed, not anything done by their execs. Netherrealm do get a special mention because they did it "spontaneously" (after players kept complaining), not because they had some acquaintance of the Cannon bros on payroll. Chev fucked around with this message at 13:41 on May 3, 2021 |
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May 3, 2021 13:34
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I wonder if most companies just think literally everyone complaining just has bad internet. Like how people think every poor person is just poor because "they buy too much stuff they don't need". I know during that last dev roundtable they kept deflecting the rollback convo to talk about people having wifi. Nevermind that I can't play people in my own state on DBFZ when we both have wired 100mbs+ connections.
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May 3, 2021 14:16
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Haven't seen what you're talking about so very likely giving more credit than is due, but to be fair there is something that needs doing about wifi in fighting games online, even with stellar netcode it's never gonna be great until they whip up like, Router Fiber or something.
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May 3, 2021 14:46
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Yardbomb posted:Haven't seen what you're talking about so very likely giving more credit than is due, but to be fair there is something that needs doing about wifi in fighting games online, even with stellar netcode it's never gonna be great until they whip up like, Router Fiber or something. when will capcom patch the air to make it better for wifi
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May 3, 2021 14:51
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Smoking Crow posted:when will capcom patch the air to make it better for wifi When fans make a patch and they swipe it, probably.
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May 3, 2021 15:09
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I might have worded that wrong, I was thinking of that Microsoft exec who ended up fired for responding to people complaining about how bad netcode is for places with bad internet with 'Why would I want to live there?' Yeah, the games that actually care about good netcode to compensate for wildly varying internet infrastructure are mostly American, while Japan is much smaller, has a high population density and very well developed infrastructure.Smoking Crow posted:when will capcom patch the air to make it better for wifi Ol' Nikola Tesla tried.
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May 3, 2021 15:33
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How do people deal with having to use items in MK11 towers while using a fight stick?
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May 3, 2021 15:34
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Japan is much smaller, has a high population density and very well developed infrastructure. People like to repeat this mantra in an attempt to excuse JP devs, but in truth delay based netcode is still garbage even in these conditions, and it's something well known in the Japanese community. They just don't give a poo poo to launch with functional netcode.
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May 3, 2021 15:58
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Part of that's also because arcades and actual community centers still exist in japan and have their whole own network, less of an excuse but it's because they can get away with it and still be fine with the local market and all that.
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May 3, 2021 16:11
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dr.acula posted:How do people deal with having to use items in MK11 towers while using a fight stick? I never could. If I wanted to do a tower and be able to use items I'd just connect a controller.
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May 3, 2021 16:49
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So I picked up UMVC 3 and I'm digging it. It feels like somebody kinda went "I like how in late-game Diablo, the whole screen basically turns into a fireworks show / winamp visualizer every time you press a button. Let's make a fighting game that does that." and out came this thing. It's pretty great.
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May 3, 2021 17:39
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dr.acula posted:How do people deal with having to use items in MK11 towers while using a fight stick? I have a mayflash and it hooks up to a regular controller as well as the console so you can kinda hold it in your lap and bump it when needed. It’s really dumb and I don’t recommend it. Otherwise I don’t think you can. It’s frustrating because I can’t use a regular controller but I enjoy the game.
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May 3, 2021 18:16
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Artelier posted:This has motivated me to pick up 97. Right? That's not bullshit thats depth.
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May 3, 2021 18:35
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Smoking Crow posted:i think right now, they're focusing on porting to arcade, switch and ps4, then after that who knows Didn't Examu go down sometime last year, what happened there?
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May 3, 2021 19:31
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Arzachel posted:Didn't Examu go down sometime last year, what happened there? Examu went down but Team Arcana continued. Team Arcana were the only ones even making games over at Examu so it’s in essence a rebrand.
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May 3, 2021 20:00
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I like ah3 a lot but lets not forget that game was a running joke the same way 'The Pony Game' is now for a solid decade+ in english speaking parts of the world. I really don't see a game like this getting a sudden huge upswing in players like +R did even if it did suddenly have rollback netcode because a lot of people still wring their hands over a game with anime schoolgirls that doesn't also have Cool Manly Guys in it (like skullgirls now does). I can understand team arcana focusing more on people who would actually play their game (japanese arcades) then doing a favor for the 10 western arcana heart players when they can't even finish the dlc characters.
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May 3, 2021 20:10
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Yardbomb posted:Haven't seen what you're talking about so very likely giving more credit than is due, but to be fair there is something that needs doing about wifi in fighting games online, even with stellar netcode it's never gonna be great until they whip up like, Router Fiber or something. Wi-fi users suck but honestly for small games I'd rather have them in the community and maybe eventually someone with more patience and tact than I have will educate them on why it's bad. Wi-fi indicators before committing to a match are a good compromise. Even better would be if the filtering process were automatic instead of having to manually dis/confirm.
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May 3, 2021 20:48
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