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Monaghan posted:I read the comic years ago and liked most of it. I watched the show and I don't know if this is the appropriate place to post this as I don't see any other threads on it but: Fans have accepted bigger turns. Look at Vegeta from Dragonball.
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May 4, 2021 20:32
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Good Citizen posted:The difference between the comic and the show in that scene was all in how explicitly depicted Omin-man's murder spree was. He absolutely killed just as many people and had just as much disregard for human life in the comic. Here are the relevant pages (not spoilering since it already happened in the show): It was more than that, I feel like in the comic, Nolan was mostly mad at Mark for not accepting his Viltrumite heritage, whereas in the show it's much more about showing him the difference between viltrumites and humans and how little humans matter - which is also why I think that the ultraviolence was justified in that case, not only for Mark but for the audience. We're pretty desensitized to violence these days so you gotta go insane to get people's attention. In the comic you can infer that a lot of people died, but inferring and seeing Mark holding the arm of the woman he was futilely trying to save is a much stronger scene. Going back and rewatching some of the show with that end fight in mind really colors the interactions in which Mark saves people throughout the series. Like when he saves that little girl and her mom from the building collapse and he's all "no rush", that's essentially the same circumstance in the final fight with him trying to hold back the collapsing building and failing to save that mother and child. Also that's just my read, it's a lot clearer what's going on in character motivations and attitudes in a work that's performed by actors than one in which the actor is the voice in your head. JK Simmons definitely made Nolan seem more sympathetic than he came across in the fight in the comic. zoux fucked around with this message at 20:41 on May 4, 2021 |
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May 4, 2021 20:39
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golden bubble posted:Fans have accepted bigger turns. Look at Vegeta from Dragonball. This is why season 2 is gonna be Mark and Eve's search for the Savage Dragonballs in order to bring back everyone Nolan killed
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May 4, 2021 20:42
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Good Citizen posted:Savage Dragonballs I died
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May 4, 2021 20:49
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Good Citizen posted:The difference between the comic and the show in that scene was all in how explicitly depicted Omin-man's murder spree was. He absolutely killed just as many people and had just as much disregard for human life in the comic. Here are the relevant pages (not spoilering since it already happened in the show): I do think theres' an i difference from being indifferent to human life and deliberately murdering them. But Vegeta is a good counter argument.
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May 4, 2021 20:51
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Omni-man straight up asked Mark to take over the world with him. Like kill everyone who had a problem with it, and rule the planet until the Viltrumites could come and conquer it. This was happening. There wasn't a chance that the discussion was going to be tabled until Mark came to his senses after he saw his Dad murder The Immortal. Mark said no, they fought - Omni-man killed a bunch of people in the process to demonstrate just how little they mean to him. Mark was hosed up bad. Omni-man was perfectly capable of killing Mark and going forward with his plan alone. That is what a Viltrumite would do. That is the reason he came to Earth to begin with. bigperm fucked around with this message at 21:55 on May 4, 2021 |
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May 4, 2021 21:46
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Good Citizen posted:The difference between the comic and the show in that scene was all in how explicitly depicted Omin-man's murder spree was. He absolutely killed just as many people and had just as much disregard for human life in the comic. Here are the relevant pages (not spoilering since it already happened in the show): Yeah its more implied killing here though. And the extent of gore here is Dragonball-level blood splatter. The show really went next level, implementing how grisly some of Ottley's art got later on.
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May 4, 2021 22:16
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Ccs posted:Yeah its more implied killing here though. And the extent of gore here is Dragonball-level blood splatter. The show really went next level, implementing how grisly some of Ottley's art got later on. i never read the comic but i was doing some wiki deep diving after watching the show and spoiled myself on some stuff and holy poo poo, that is nasty.
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May 4, 2021 22:21
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People complaint about how MoS or Avengers avoid showing what happens to the civilians. Invincible goes the other way, making what happens to the civilians the centerpiece. I haven't seen much complaining about it, but I have seen so much complaining about the gore in the comics, which is about on a par with the subway scene. I guess I just don't care? Or maybe because I'm so squeamish I hate actual gory horror movies but animated doesn't bother me as much so that's how I consume that kind of media? I just don't think ultraviolence is inherently bad, I guess. It can be, but the violence in the finale is extremely organic to scene and characters and serves a definite purpose. People everywhere are talking about the episode and I don't think you get that kind of reaction if they do the lighter, implied violence from the comics fight.
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May 4, 2021 23:01
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BSS really hated the gore, I remember when the comic was out, but I found that the strength of the story and the characters made the violence more of a "meh" thing. It was also when walking dead was like at it's zenith so people were getting a little tired of kirkman, especially how unrelenting bleak the walking dead largely is. The over the top violence of invincible made him seem like a pure shock value author, which wasn't a fair assessment. There is one bit of violence that I won't go into that I think is super, super dumb and pointless, but that's really about it. Monaghan fucked around with this message at 23:06 on May 4, 2021 |
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May 4, 2021 23:04
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zoux posted:Or maybe because I'm so squeamish I hate actual gory horror movies but animated doesn't bother me as much so that's how I consume that kind of media? Same here. Hate even fake looking zombie movie gore but animated stuff doesn't give me the same reaction.
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May 5, 2021 00:08
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I'm not a huge fan of excessive gore. I would definitely enjoy it if they toned it down a bit but overall it doesn't ruin my enjoyment. On the other hand I don't recommend the show to people for that very reason.
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May 5, 2021 00:30
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Its not excessive though, its to the point of the story. If Omni-man still killed people but it was very clean and clinical and we mostly just heard about it from off-screen, it wouldn't work the same. If Omni-man didn't kill innocents, it would be a completely different story. But if you don't want to see violent superheroes then the show isn't for you, that's like half the point of the story. A superhero story that looks at other aspects of that setting, like the cost to humans and weird relationships the supes have. It just seems weird to me to be like "I wish this story about superman slaughtering innocent children had less blood in it"
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May 5, 2021 00:39
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The sanitized violence demanded of the BSS crowd is puerile in the extreme, a case of child-brained adults clinging to a manufactured ideology.
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May 5, 2021 00:55
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If Omni-man wasn't killing innocents (and in a brutal way) there wouldn't be that sense of tension whenever he shows up. Like in episode 7 or 8 when he's asking Invincible's friend where he's gone, you know that at any moment, if he's not pleased with his answers, he could just crush him. YOU the viewer know his life is in mortal peril, but the character has no idea.
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May 5, 2021 00:58
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Just binged through this show over the last few days... I went in totally blind too, didn't know it was a comic series or the premise or anything. I just about broke my jaw on the floor at the end of the first episode. Almost wish I recorded my reaction lol but I had no idea it was coming! Loved this show though! Episode 7 had me so stressed out that I actually cried a little. It was awesome.
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May 5, 2021 01:04
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The only change that's bothered me is seeing Mark get bodied by his dad loses some impact when we've seen him get hosed up over and over in these 8 episodes. I don't remember Mark taking any serious damage in the comic until he took on his dad, which made the whole ordeal even more hosed up.
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May 5, 2021 01:06
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It got deleted, what was it?
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May 5, 2021 01:10
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JT Smiley posted:The only change that's bothered me is seeing Mark get bodied by his dad loses some impact when we've seen him get hosed up over and over in these 8 episodes. I don't remember Mark taking any serious damage in the comic until he took on his dad, which made the whole ordeal even more hosed up. Yeah i think that panel I posted on the last page where Mark gets a nosebleed from Nolan's punch is the first time we ever see him even slightly damaged.
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May 5, 2021 01:13
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JT Smiley posted:The only change that's bothered me is seeing Mark get bodied by his dad loses some impact when we've seen him get hosed up over and over in these 8 episodes. I don't remember Mark taking any serious damage in the comic until he took on his dad, which made the whole ordeal even more hosed up. Well Battle Beast was always out of his league.
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May 5, 2021 01:18
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By moving the Machine head arc up they made a good episode that changed the context around omni man a bit but also gave Mark a huge injury that he recovered from no problem. So when Nolan does the same but to less of an extent we’re not worried about Mark’s physical injuries at all, we know he can bounce back. In light of that they almost needed to add the other gratuitous violence so it really makes the impact of how much mental scarring Mark will carry from this encounter.
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May 5, 2021 01:21
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MonsterEnvy posted:Well Battle Beast was always out of his league. That plotline was post omni-man in the comics. I'll spoil this just for purists, but literally nothing that wasn't in the show already. Comic wise it was just 1. get powers, fight the bank robbers 2. learn about viltrumites 3. the little green men invade 4. I can't recall if this one appeared in the show 5. Allen the Alien 6. First appearance of the robot zombie things, but not the whole scientist plotline 7. rip guardians 8. funeral 9. guardian tryouts + immortal waking up 10. we need to talk 11. they talk 12. mark gets pwnd so yeah, Invincible was pretty invincible until he got mulched by Omni-man so it was a pretty big deal
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May 5, 2021 01:42
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I was reading the last issue of the series (no spoilers, I promise) and Kirkman mentions in the outro that he originally was going to put the Nolan turn in like issue 25, Jim Valentino (head of Image Comics at the time) was like "dude, your book won't make it to issue 25 if you don't have a hook, move it up to issue 12" and he eventually moved it up to issue 7. Before the Nolan hook landed, sales were waning hard and he mentions the book looked like it wasn't even going to make it to issue 12, but then word of mouth started buzzing, sales picked up, and eventually Kirkman would become, well, Kirkman, and Invincible would last for 144 issues. Crazy.
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May 5, 2021 01:49
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I started reading the comic when the first big hardcover collection came out, so by that point it had already survived the early uncertain years, but probably a lot of my ignorance was that comic shop owners had a real grudge against Image after the 90s. My hometown had a local comic shop and it was filled with DC, Marvel, and anime. I don't think I saw a single Image comic until I went to a Barnes and Noble and happened to find that there were American comics publishers who had series that didn't change artists every 6 issues and numbered their books in a normal way instead of naming each after the story arc, which made it impossible to know which Batman GN you should read before or after any other (does Long Halloween come before or after Dark Victory? When should I read Court of Owls?! Oh this Invincible comic is labeled #1, #2...) Much more appealing to readers raised on manga.
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May 5, 2021 02:21
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Ccs posted:I started reading the comic when the first big hardcover collection came out, so by that point it had already survived the early uncertain years, but probably a lot of my ignorance was that comic shop owners had a real grudge against Image after the 90s. My hometown had a local comic shop and it was filled with DC, Marvel, and anime. I don't think I saw a single Image comic until I went to a Barnes and Noble and happened to find that there were American comics publishers who had series that didn't change artists every 6 issues and numbered their books in a normal way instead of naming each after the story arc, which made it impossible to know which Batman GN you should read before or after any other (does Long Halloween come before or after Dark Victory? When should I read Court of Owls?! Oh this Invincible comic is labeled #1, #2...) Much more appealing to readers raised on manga.
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May 5, 2021 02:36
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If the new guardians are the primo supers on the planet, then earth is in dire straights if Omni-Man comes back wanting to take over. Eve and Mark are so far above that group in power level it's comical really.
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May 5, 2021 02:39
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starkebn posted:If the new guardians are the primo supers on the planet, then earth is in dire straights if Omni-Man comes back wanting to take over. Eve and Mark are so far above that group in power level it's comical really. I bet even not-Batman could have kicked the poo poo out of the new guardians all at once. Also the ending montage showed Immortal being put back together again. So does he get a free pass to rejoin? Does he have to join a lesser team like Fight Force and work his way up the ranks again? 
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May 5, 2021 02:45
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starkebn posted:If the new guardians are the primo supers on the planet, then earth is in dire straights if Omni-Man comes back wanting to take over. Eve and Mark are so far above that group in power level it's comical really. yeah, Omni would kill them all in like a minute.
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May 5, 2021 02:46
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Kulkasha posted:I can only imagine what would have happened if someone like Kirby was able to work in such a company during his time. Kirby did do an Image book! Phantom Force! It’s kinda a mess but was made with the best of intentions and gave Kirby the biggest pay day of his comics career. The cartoonist kayfabe fellas did a video on it that’s really good and informative. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HPoVrCX1ah8 Good Citizen posted:Savage Dragonballs 
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May 5, 2021 03:00
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I know they did some of the show out of order with the comics but can anyone tell me how many issues of the comic were covered one way or another in season 1? (if this it considered too spoilery for the thread, disregard this post)
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May 5, 2021 04:36
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Spacebump posted:I know they did some of the show out of order with the comics but can anyone tell me how many issues of the comic were covered one way or another in season 1? (if this it considered too spoilery for the thread, disregard this post) Here's what I recall from the show: Comic issues 1-12 was pretty much just the main Invincible gets powers -> Omni-man loving off into space plot and the things directly related to it (old guardians/new guardians). None of the other show plots were involved. Mars stuff was issue 18 Titan/Battle Beast stuff was issue 19 College students being turned into robots was issue 20 and 22 Robot getting a new body occurred over a couple pages here/couple pages there across 30-34 while other plotlines happened If there were other show plots I skipped lemme know, I read the whole series between the last two episodes so it's all pretty mixed up in my head
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May 5, 2021 05:02
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Spacebump posted:I know they did some of the show out of order with the comics but can anyone tell me how many issues of the comic were covered one way or another in season 1? (if this it considered too spoilery for the thread, disregard this post) The farthest thing forward so far was issue 37, which was DA Sinclair's Reanimen operation finally being taken down, but there's a ton of stuff in the post-12 and pre-37 story that hasn't been covered yet, including a couple major things that may not even make it into season 2 based on how I would plot it out. If I had to guess I'd say we've covered about 20 issues worth of content so far, and again if I had to guess I'd say there's a total of about 6-8 seasons of content in the full comics run if they did the whole thing. I'm judging more by 'this should be a season finale' moments more than 'they have to cover everything' because they probably shouldn't cover everything.
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May 5, 2021 05:04
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Linking to another thread cause its extra spoilery, but this is what I guessed season 2-3 will land on https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3574760&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=738#post514379361
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May 5, 2021 05:11
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The gore is excessive but I sort of like that. Not just for the sake of gore itself but because the gore makes sense considering what we see on screen. If someone as powerful as Nolan attacks someone/something it's going to be insanely destructive. Especially if he's making a point about how fragile and weak humanity is. It's like if you went ham on an antstack. All those crushed ants probably is a grizzly scene if you were an ant
Collapsing Farts fucked around with this message at 08:23 on May 5, 2021 |
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May 5, 2021 08:17
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as someone who grew up loving animation but knowing that it had a perception as being aimed at small children, i'm happy to see that it seems to be more appreciated and acceptable for older audiences in the present. still, sometimes i find myself conflicted at the idea of 'adult animation'. mature content is nice, but far too many take the lack of restrictions for opportunities to go overboard on graphic material. i've learned long ago that sometimes there are people who NEED to be restrained (looking at you, john k).
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May 5, 2021 10:26
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Shwqa posted:I'm not a huge fan of excessive gore. I would definitely enjoy it if they toned it down a bit but overall it doesn't ruin my enjoyment. On the other hand I don't recommend the show to people for that very reason. My favourite comic is Crossed and it's almost impossible to recommend to people unless I know they will def be into it. Gore can serve a purpose, but it's hard to get right, and even when done right, it can put people off before they give it a chance, which is fair enough really.
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May 5, 2021 10:54
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The show gore is way higher then the comics so far. Someone mentioned that in the comics people died in the subway too so it wasn't just the show, but the comic was just invincible getting punched through the ground, tunnel collapsing on a train, then getting punched back out. The whole bit with omni just deciding to feed everyone into a juicer was entirely the show.
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May 5, 2021 11:23
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It sure do feel like the show is making a more concerted effort to not let you, the viewer, forget that Nolan has done some Bad poo poo.
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May 5, 2021 12:20
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Mr Interweb posted:as someone who grew up loving animation but knowing that it had a perception as being aimed at small children, i'm happy to see that it seems to be more appreciated and acceptable for older audiences in the present. still, sometimes i find myself conflicted at the idea of 'adult animation'. mature content is nice, but far too many take the lack of restrictions for opportunities to go overboard on graphic material. i've learned long ago that sometimes there are people who NEED to be restrained (looking at you, john k). Spawn was like 20+ years ago at this point.
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May 5, 2021 13:56
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Zaphod42 posted:Its not excessive though, its to the point of the story. It is why I will always stick up for the Squid ending of Watchmen. Those images are burned into my head forever, while the movie version is so sterile and undramatic. I don't think the Invincible comic always justifies it, especially later on, but the animated version has done a great job of making the violence matter.
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May 5, 2021 14:02
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