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serious question — i'm a service worker with no official programming experience, but program a lot when doing process improvement. i end up spelunking in obsolete languages and abandoned code, and improve what i can, but have no illusions about being qualified to pull figgies. i make $25k a year right now, and adding like $10k a year in a job where customers don't scream in my face would be life-changing. if i just want a job, and dgaf about my career being "tainted" by mumps or something, is there a subfield that might see me as hireable? what could i focus on to become hireable? school would be nice and all but i don't think i can add it on top of getting by. my sorta resumé: last job, entry-level manufacturing
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May 23, 2021 03:32
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handle posted:serious question — i'm a service worker with no official programming experience, but program a lot when doing process improvement. i end up spelunking in obsolete languages and abandoned code, and improve what i can, but have no illusions about being qualified to pull figgies. i make $25k a year right now, and adding like $10k a year in a job where customers don't scream in my face would be life-changing. where are you located? education status? but yes you should get paper; in the us a helpdesk or msp would pay better than that but that’s not a long term thing (customers still suck) but good for getting your foot in the door in an it job
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May 23, 2021 03:36
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you are qualified for computer touching, the trick at this point is luck/opportunity.
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May 23, 2021 03:46
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i'm in the denver area and have a ged. oof, typing that out, you're not kidding i need to get papers. thanks for transitional recommendations. does "msp" stand for managed service provider? i'm not familiar with the players in my area i guess.
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May 23, 2021 03:50
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that is solid junior experience imo. if you can afford it, just take a job with a low salary to get your foot in the door then start trading up as soon as you feel confident. another thing you could do to get some runs on the board is take some projects on upwork or something like that unfortunately with a career change unless you have good contacts or some luck you might have to do some kinda lovely work at first but make sure you don’t get stuck in it or let people take advantage of you
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May 23, 2021 03:54
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you could walk into a 80k/year junior dev job lol
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May 23, 2021 03:54
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handle posted:i'm in the denver area and have a ged. oof, typing that out, you're not kidding i need to get papers. msp covers a lot of things but think "outsourced desktop support" it beats the gently caress out of bussing tables.
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May 23, 2021 03:57
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bob dobbs is dead posted:you could walk into a 80k/year junior dev job lol if they knew someone, sure. if they got very lucky and got in to an interview/assessment stage where they could talk about the things they have done and the person sees potential/is sympathetic.
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May 23, 2021 03:59
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yeah the annoying thing will be getting to a screen
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May 23, 2021 04:01
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bob dobbs is dead posted:yeah the annoying thing will be getting to a screen people who are working bussing jobs and entry level manufacturing generally don't have the kind of that kind of personal network. so you're going to have to make your own network/luck, i'm afraid.
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May 23, 2021 04:03
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handle posted:i'm in the denver area and have a ged. oof, typing that out, you're not kidding i need to get papers. Long term, yeah, the degree matters. But you can get a job now and study while you work. Get paid.
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May 23, 2021 04:04
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hey denver goons send some entry level jobs to handle ged isn’t the end of the world once you’re on the ladder. certs help. particpating in local meetups etc networking helps. msp is a place businesses pay when they don’t want to pay for in-house it so you can potentially get experience a lot of areas quickly your skills are great
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May 23, 2021 04:05
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thank all you folks so much. trying to internalize the next steps. it's been a very sad night so far and i appreciate y'all being straightforward but compassionate.
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May 23, 2021 04:05
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depending on your current employer you might think about it as a two part move - move sideways at your current company by asking to move in to a junior analyst job then after a few years move somewhere else for more money. see if you can get someone with industry knowledge to review your CV and rewrite it as an analyst CV.
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May 23, 2021 04:19
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handle posted:serious question — i'm a service worker with no official programming experience, but program a lot when doing process improvement. i end up spelunking in obsolete languages and abandoned code, and improve what i can, but have no illusions about being qualified to pull figgies. i make $25k a year right now, and adding like $10k a year in a job where customers don't scream in my face would be life-changing. you have better qualifications than most entry level programmers. if i were you i'd grind leetcode easy and medium problems in python or javascript. don't be ashamed to start out by copying other people's solutions. that's how we all learned getting interviews will be hard but doable if you just mass apply for anything you see but you'll need to prove you can code probably to get a shot and leetcode is the best prep there is for that. don't limit yourself to programming jobs. there's lots of basically programming jobs where you can flex your skills and get moved into a "real" programming role pretty easily. sales engineering, qa tester, customer support (at a startup or saas company, not like phone support), business analyst, data analyst... the talent deficit fucked around with this message at 04:34 on May 23, 2021 |
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May 23, 2021 04:32
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handle posted:serious question — i'm a service worker with no official programming experience, but program a lot when doing process improvement. i end up spelunking in obsolete languages and abandoned code, and improve what i can, but have no illusions about being qualified to pull figgies. i make $25k a year right now, stopped reading here. this alone will get you to six figures if you stick to it. your first job won’t pay you this because they know they can get away with it. if you keep at it though you can be there with a few job hops and maybe six years if you’re lucky
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May 23, 2021 08:45
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ultravoices posted:you are qualified for computer touching, the trick at this point is luck/opportunity. what talent deficit says about moving sideways is right too, I was a hobby coder and managed to get into development by getting a job as a QA and one day pestering the friendliest looking dev to let me fix a bug I found.
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May 23, 2021 11:23
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handle you need to post your actual resume in here or the BFC resume thread and find a couple job reqs you’d want to apply for. I think some of the advice might be kinda optimistic but can’t tell because I don’t know what your stats are or who you’d be competing with application wise that said you can def count what you described as relevant for the purposes of an entry level programmer job
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May 23, 2021 12:25
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CarForumPoster posted:anyone ever lol at making >$150k without going to med school and maybe without going to extra school at all Meanwhile I used to write software for cancer research and treatment and was paid all of $75K for it I make over 2x that now to make a cell phone game you play on the toilet
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May 23, 2021 16:06
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kitten smoothie posted:Meanwhile I used to write software for cancer research and treatment and was paid all of $75K for it that sounds sweet I am doing too much toilet posting r n and anyway if the treatment worked I’m American so I couldn’t afford it might as well crush candy
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May 23, 2021 16:13
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CarForumPoster posted:and anyway if the treatment worked I’m American so I couldn’t afford it while I'd agree with that normally this is the YOSPOS interviewing thread
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May 23, 2021 16:15
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yeah, all the 150k/year jobs also come with "pay up to 3k and then stop paying for absolutely anything, yeah we will cover that 500k dealio" insurance post ur drat resume handle
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May 23, 2021 16:41
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nth-ing that handle should be earning life changing amounts of money e.g. like at least $60k+ for the stuff they’re already doing
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May 23, 2021 17:30
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In my previous job I wrote the software for MSP's to use and I would say it is a good path into development. With your experience you could easily get a T2 Deck position which basically means not dealing with customers at all, just learn some ITIL terminology and you're good. With T2 you're doing in depth investigations on bugs which is a good runway into actually becoming a dev and you can always apply for dev positions when you're there anyway.
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May 23, 2021 18:54
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handle may not have a degree, but when placed into environments where programming is not expected, seeing processes that can be improved, they can't help themselves but to program. that's absolutely a developer at heart. how many junior devs have we all hired who have the resume pedigree, but not the drive? and when placed into an environment where programming IS expected of them, they do everything they can to avoid it? you just need to find a hiring manager who thinks this way. at non-FAANGs there are lots of them. the trick will be getting past the bullshit HR screen
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May 23, 2021 19:01
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DELETE CASCADE posted:how many junior devs have we all hired who have the resume pedigree, but not the drive? one and it was a hard lesson learned that said, the number of driven junior devs I’ve hired who don’t have the resume to do the job is 0 which is probably an obstacle for handle today that can be fixed within 6 weeks if driven
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May 23, 2021 21:44
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wanna say thanks again, y'all. i super appreciate mentions of all the positions i've never heard of, and which offer decent chances of making lateral moves in the same org. i'll pull on the few connections i have and try to get resume/application/interviewing feedback from industry folks.CarForumPoster posted:handle you need to post your actual resume in here or the BFC resume thread and find a couple job reqs you’d want to apply for. I think some of the advice might be kinda optimistic but can’t tell because I don’t know what your stats are or who you’d be competing with application wise DELETE CASCADE posted:[...] that's absolutely a developer at heart.  i think about the daily wtf's story on meaninglessness pretty often. and quick shoutout to programmers without the programming fervor... you keep me honest so i don't reimplement templating (poorly.)
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May 23, 2021 21:59
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hey handle: 1. get yourself a trade name. i used "[my last name] engineering" for mine. i think it was like $35 or something (in california). link to colorado secretary of state. you just want the sole proprietorship - that just means that all money you'd get is normal income, no tax breaks or anything, but also no tax complications 2. do a programming-related task for someone for money 3. put "freelance [whatever you do] - doing business as [handle engineering]" on your resume it's ok if the gigs pay terribly (as long as they aren't free, this is the part that makes it not a lie). i bet you have friends/family/people in this very thread that would throw you twenty bucks or whatever to automate some mp3 renaming or some kinda text processing in bash via sed etc for them (especially if you took them out to dinner afterwards to celebrate your business getting a new client) do make sure that's not gonna get you in any kind of non-compete hot water, but it's an easy way to suddenly become a professional computer-toucher. if won't help you with the "three years" part of "three years of experience required," and it won't help you pass an interview, but it might help you softshoe around a dumbass HR filter.
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May 23, 2021 23:11
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handle posted:i'm glad my affection for machines can pay off for other people if you cherish this affection, keep in mind that selling it for money will tarnish it. it might not be a fun hobby once it's your day job. surely thats fine if you get enough money for it, but worth keeping in mind if you really do it for fun now that story is nice, but probably most of your actual job is not going to be that rewarding idk tho, im not a programmer Achmed Jones posted:hey handle: lol are you saying he needs a new handle?
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May 23, 2021 23:22
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Achmed Jones posted:hey handle: good advice, also I did exactly this last fall also, my state waived the registration fees for a sole proprietorship during COVID which was nice
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May 23, 2021 23:27
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Achmed Jones posted:hey handle: This is very good advice. If you wanna seem like you actually totally did consulting for real though form an LLC. Its also cheap and easy. This is nice to have too because if you get fired you can always truthfully say you worked for DaShitpostBoss, LLC Putting a github together now and starting to commit and star poo poo and fork poo poo is a good way to build a paper trail of your computer touching experience as well. CarForumPoster fucked around with this message at 02:17 on May 24, 2021 |
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May 24, 2021 02:14
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Back in the senior level computer nerd saddle again after a year off, id rather hire a guy with a GED and drive over some master of cs thats confident. E: context, I started with a GED TehRedWheelbarrow fucked around with this message at 18:44 on May 24, 2021 |
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May 24, 2021 18:41
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sneakyfrog posted:Back in the senior level computer nerd saddle again after a year off, id rather hire a guy with a GED and drive over some master of cs thats confident. peeps default towards bein biased towards similar educational backgrounds. if handle wants to whack at cold callin / dming random peeps on linkedin (which works for getting to a screen like single digit %s of the time but that just means you do a few hundreds of them) they prolly wanna whack at the ged-havers in places, is what that means bob dobbs is dead fucked around with this message at 19:23 on May 24, 2021 |
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May 24, 2021 18:57
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sneakyfrog posted:Back in the senior level computer nerd saddle again after a year off, id rather hire a guy with a GED and drive over some master of cs thats confident. what is the master of cs who's not just confident but also incredibly insufferable?
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May 24, 2021 19:19
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bob dobbs is dead posted:peeps default towards bein biased towards similar educational backgrounds. if handle wants to whack at cold callin / dming random peeps on linkedin (which works for getting to a screen like single digit %s of the time but that just means you do a few hundreds of them) they prolly wanna whack at the ged-havers in places, is what that means handle has drive and aptitude which is absolutely priceless, but unfortunately hard to communicate in a CV
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May 24, 2021 19:31
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yeah, its just an orgy of peeps throwin out resumes of peeps who didnt do roughly the same educational dealio they did, whether it's clawing their way through w a ged or goin to plutocrat school
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May 24, 2021 19:33
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I got super held back in my early career because I was "self taught" and didn't have a design degree, lately the only person who was like "why don't you have a masters yet" was from google
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May 24, 2021 19:36
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qirex posted:I got super held back in my early career because I was "self taught" and didn't have a design degree, lately the only person who was like "why don't you have a masters yet" was from google did he add the "from stanford" or is it just implied
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May 24, 2021 19:38
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hobbesmaster posted:did he add the "from stanford" or is it just implied someone else on that call asked me about my undergrad classes I'm over 40
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May 24, 2021 19:41
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toiletbrush posted:drive and aptitude is hard to communicate in a CV strongly disagree you show it by accomplishing things that are relatively easy to verify - increasing responsibilities with the same employer - publishing web apps and code to GitHub - having a consultancy that has a real legal entity and people to vouch for it - ???your idea here??? CarForumPoster fucked around with this message at 00:50 on May 25, 2021 |
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May 25, 2021 00:28
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