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Edgar Allen Ho posted:Personally I like games that function instead losing a many-hour campaign because Bengal exists
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Jun 1, 2021 12:44
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Vicky 2 will haunt your computer and destroy your soul, but someone will have survived to grab a save to rehost from.
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Jun 1, 2021 12:48
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A Buttery Pastry posted:I don’t think I’ve ever noticed anything gamebreaking happen in V2. If you play multiplayer, you can't destroy the world economy if four or five human players try to produce a large amount of infantry units right at the start. Also, the crisis overlay can big if humans click it too hard and the crisis never occurs, great power status gets stuck forever and alliances are stuck as well for the rest of the game.
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Jun 1, 2021 15:07
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Vicky 1/Ricky is the better game anyways.
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Jun 1, 2021 15:42
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oscarthewilde posted:you're probably confused with the GalCiv games, whose lead developer, Brad Wardell, is a noteworthy rear end in a top hat and idiot. In GalCiv 2 and 3 he based the economic model around the (trickledown, completely discredited and entirely nonsensical) Laffer Curve. It made no sense at all and made for very bad gameplay, but libertarian's gotta libertarian Hate to well, actually, but taken literally that's a spicy take on the Laffer curve. Literally everyone with any credibility in economics believes that the Laffer curve is a real thing. Like, even the Marxists. The controversial right-wing position is about the maximum on that curve. The curve cannot be directly measured, so you have to estimate it, giving you quite a bit of leeway of embedding your preconceptions into your results. Most mainstream economists believe that the maximum is at ~70% tax rate, with the leftist position being that tax evasion might push it even higher, if you are just measuring by the nominal rate. The weirdo supply-side guys took the "at some point, raising taxes reduces revenue", and out of no evidence whatsoever deduced that the point is actually really low, because that then justifies the policy they actually wanted all along, lower tax rates.
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Jun 1, 2021 16:00
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its like those yudkowsky cultists who learn about bayes theorem and decide 'as a prior' that christian god and the devil exist
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Jun 1, 2021 16:44
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The only game where you can acquire 75% of the Russian Empire by bamboozling the AI with province trades and the optimal way to run a factroy is to have a single craftsman overseen by a million capitalists. I love Vic1 and Vic2 both but it's a hard contest on which of them is the more broken game. Wiz fucked around with this message at 17:06 on Jun 1, 2021 |
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Jun 1, 2021 17:03
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bob dobbs is dead posted:its like those yudkowsky cultists who learn about bayes theorem and decide 'as a prior' that christian god and the devil exist That's...certainly not a mainstream rationalist position. Like, I've seen a lot of stuff in that space, and anyone who is a serious "Yudkowsky cultist" probably isn't asserting the existence of God/the Devil. Atheism, for better or worse, is overwhelmingly the norm.
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Jun 1, 2021 17:08
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all that basilisk poo poo is eschatology dressed up with pullin poo poo out of their rear end
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Jun 1, 2021 17:11
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Wiz posted:optimal way to run a factroy is to have a single craftsman overseen by a million capitalists. But doing it this way ruins the extreme fun times of manually splitting every craftsman and clerk pop in China ten million times per game
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Jun 1, 2021 17:12
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_NBtwY9y6s
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Jun 1, 2021 17:13
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Wiz posted:The only game where you can acquire 75% of the Russian Empire by bamboozling the AI with province trades and the optimal way to run a factroy is to have a single craftsman overseen by a million capitalists. The edit was because you mispelled factroy was it not?
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Jun 1, 2021 17:13
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bob dobbs is dead posted:all that basilisk poo poo is eschatology dressed up with pullin poo poo out of their rear end
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Jun 1, 2021 17:22
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Confirmed that you can destroy the British Empire by stealing all their tea. Game owns.
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Jun 1, 2021 17:40
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Zeron posted:Confirmed that you can destroy the British Empire by stealing all their tea. Game owns. Kinda sounds like V3 will make an excellent base for a Cold War mod.
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Jun 1, 2021 17:44
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Cease to Hope posted:The world economy has been crashing basically as long as there has been a world economy, and relative stability is a peculiarity of the modern period. The US economy crashed about once a decade in the 19th century, for example, and a fair amount of Marxist economics argues that this boom-crash cycle is inherent to capitalism, in part because it was happening very frequently at the time. I do wonder if Vicky 3 will reflect that lack of stability! I think the main issue w.r.t to V2, at least in multiplayer is that once the crash occurs it persists until the end of the game unless everyone agrees to switch to LF; because everyone building factories at max tilt makes all those factories unprofitable. One thing I hope will exist in V3 is the ability to write stimulus cheques to give all pops money, or at least a cheat code to do is to unfuck liquidity traps.
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Jun 1, 2021 17:58
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CharlestheHammer posted:Nope I hope to god you don’t get that as it sounds like a horribly boring sterile game Having campaign ending bugs that are impossible for paradox to fix makes for funny stories on the internet and that's it.
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Jun 1, 2021 18:15
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Having campaign ending bugs that are impossible for paradox to fix makes for funny stories on the internet and that's it. Perfect game for the posters in this thread who never play the games and just post moaning about them???
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Jun 1, 2021 18:32
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just conquer bengal and/or use console to fix poo poo ez
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Jun 1, 2021 18:33
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Fellblade posted:Perfect game for the posters in this thread who never play the games and just post moaning about them??? I paid for the game, if I choose to play it by not playing it and moaning about it, then that's my right.
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Jun 1, 2021 18:38
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even if the game somehow comes out perfectly balanced and unbreakable, you can still get the good v1/v2 fix by installing whatever inevitable steppe wolf-like mod gets made for it
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Jun 1, 2021 19:08
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A Buttery Pastry posted:It is not the Christian God, but yes, it most definitely is a theistic belief system. Yeah, he's thinking of the Robot Devil they dreamed up. Also, thinking about it, the soundtrack dispute could solve two problems by offering the music of the era as the preorder/early adopter bonus instead of any flags or 3d graphics, or gameplay. I dunno, that sound like a decent compromise to everyone?
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Jun 1, 2021 19:34
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As long as A Day at the Court comes back
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Jun 1, 2021 19:38
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Takanago posted:even if the game somehow comes out perfectly balanced and unbreakable, you can still get the good v1/v2 fix by installing whatever inevitable steppe wolf-like mod gets made for it I wonder if that dude is still developing his mod.
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Jun 1, 2021 20:07
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Tuna-Fish posted:Literally everyone with any credibility in economics believes that the Laffer curve is a real thing. Pretty much. Its main issue is being connected to Laffer, Rumsfeld and Cheney. It's a pretty logical statement of "hey, there is an optimal tax rate (in terms of revenue) to set where any higher will bring losses", all argument regarding it among anyone with knowledge of economics is in regards to the bounds and applicability to different fields. It's most relevant with stuff like tariffs, though income tax wise it's a far thornier area. While it's most commonly used to support decreasing tax burdens on the wealthy and corporations, it can also be used for the opposite reason. The idea of the Laffer Curve specifically doesn't even include the costs incurred in effective taxation, nor the chance or degree of evasion. Taken alone, it's literally just tax rate vs income over a given time period. Just gotta keep in mind that it's nothing more than a concept which may be modelled, and certain models support different viewpoints not necessarily supported by any rigorous study.
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Jun 1, 2021 20:09
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HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:Just gotta keep in mind that it's nothing more than a concept which may be modelled, and certain models support different viewpoints not necessarily supported by any rigorous study.
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Jun 1, 2021 20:47
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A Buttery Pastry posted:Or necessarily not supported by any rigorous study. 
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Jun 1, 2021 20:58
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Eiba posted:e.g. The Laffer Connect-the-dots
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Jun 1, 2021 21:02
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Eiba posted:e.g.  I hope Interest Groups can fool themselves and push for policy that's against their stated interests. Most political sims I play have the parties be too rational to be believable.
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Jun 1, 2021 21:21
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Eiba posted:e.g. Didnt know US corporate taxes were that high
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Jun 1, 2021 21:45
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Randarkman posted:Didnt know US corporate taxes were that high They aren't anymore and no corporation actually paid that rate either.
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Jun 1, 2021 21:52
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HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:Pretty much. Its main issue is being connected to Laffer, Rumsfeld and Cheney but that's exactly the point nobody argues against the concept of taxation efficiency, which is what the laffer curve insinuates itself to be about, but because mainstream economics is blind to the rhetoric and discourse itself creates or thinks it does not exist, the critical and most consequential point of the laffer curve is thoroughly missed: that it is an ideological argument veiled through a technicality to cut taxes on the wealthier strata of society, with any of the supposed benefits not happening at all, which is why it is bullshit
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Jun 1, 2021 21:59
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dead gay comedy forums posted:but that's exactly the point Anyone can disingenuously use anything. Every serious source I’ve seen that actually engages with the Laffer Curve identifies that many countries fall short by a considerable degree. This is what they do - take anything that is half right in a very particular narrow window, distort it and unduly widen its application. The Laffer Curve itself is not bullshit.
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Jun 1, 2021 22:04
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popewiles posted:They aren't anymore and no corporation actually paid that rate either. Yeah to put it in Victoria terms, sure the nominal tax rate was high but they had poo poo admin efficiency. It's why you always get those stories about how Amazon paid less in taxes than you did, because the corporate tax code is so full of loopholes that billion dollar corporations can make it look like they made less money than someone working on an hourly wage in one of their warehouses.
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Jun 1, 2021 22:06
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Mans posted:I wonder if that dude is still developing his mod. He's not going to stop until there are an infinite number of Bulgarias
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Jun 1, 2021 22:14
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a pipe smoking dog posted:He's not going to stop until there are an infinite number of Bulgarias Why is that man not leading the development of V3? Without his guidance it's clearly not going to have enough Bulgarias That said, Wiz still hasn't answered my question about how many Bulgarias there will be so who knows 
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Jun 1, 2021 22:21
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The Cheshire Cat posted:Yeah to put it in Victoria terms, sure the nominal tax rate was high but they had poo poo admin efficiency. It's why you always get those stories about how Amazon paid less in taxes than you did, because the corporate tax code is so full of loopholes that billion dollar corporations can make it look like they made less money than someone working on an hourly wage in one of their warehouses. ah so they're keeping pops from fulfilling their needs so that they don't promote into bureaucrats, keeping admin efficiency low. tricky capitalists
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Jun 1, 2021 22:21
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HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:The Laffer Curve itself is not bullshit again, it is, but not in the way you are thinking right now (that's what I meant about the rhetoric in economics btw). art laffer was a reaganite economist whose napkin illustration in a dinner party thoroughly transformed a well-established and highly complex area of interest of economics, namely taxation efficiency, into a single graph to say, "mr president, we should try to find the top spot of this graph, and I fully believe that the government taxes too much". The man didn't invent the idea at all, but by illustrating in the manner and in the context which he did, it became an ideological tool much as any other to benefit the wealthy, and in this respect, again, it is bullshit as the technical shorthand to illustrate taxation efficiency? no, it isn't, but that is why thinkers on the left do not refer to it by that: it became a concept like many others such as the homo economicus to justify monumental dumbassery in the field. Laffer got the presidential medal of freedom from trump in 2019 for his contributions to economics and I think that alone might explain a loving lot
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Jun 1, 2021 22:24
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Raenir Salazar posted:I think the main issue w.r.t to V2, at least in multiplayer is that once the crash occurs it persists until the end of the game unless everyone agrees to switch to LF; because everyone building factories at max tilt makes all those factories unprofitable. I'm not saying that Vic2's economic crash was necessarily a good thing, mind. I just think that a stable, coherent, and easily understood system is ahistorical (and probably not very interesting to play).
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Jun 1, 2021 22:54
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Yeah I agree maybe multiplayer should have its own balance system though. Because what’s fun fo PvP is rarely useful against the AI anyway
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Jun 1, 2021 23:00
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