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WhiteHowler posted:I've played six games of Slipways now, and I have never, ever even come close to running out of money. Which means I'm almost certainly doing something wrong. I finished my third regular game with three stars, and beat the first Campaign scenario.
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Jun 8, 2021 15:54
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WhiteHowler posted:I've played six games of Slipways now, and I have never, ever even come close to running out of money. Which means I'm almost certainly doing something wrong. I finished my third regular game with three stars, and beat the first Campaign scenario. I'm doing the campaign, and the scenario where you connect 4 ancient labs is so goddamn tight with money it's unreal. Almost cleared it today after like 10 tries, but missed it by one point because my happiness slipped below 100% lol
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Jun 8, 2021 16:16
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giogadi posted:I’ve seen a few mentions of Stephen’s Sausage Roll and I gotta vent. I was loving that game for the first few hours or so. Tricky but fair puzzles where I felt I was learning gradually. Then the game locks everything (as far as I know) behind The Great Tower, which has to be the absolute most vertical jump in difficulty I’ve ever seen in a game. I spent hours on it and never felt I was making any progress. Just way too many options and too many mechanics introduced all at once. It honestly made me feel like an idiot because I thought: no way they would put a level this intentionally difficult so early in the game, so I guess my brain is just broken. I bounced off the tower the first time i played, but i was able to beat it on my own the second time i tried the game. It's intimidating particularly because you haven't seen anything in the game like it before, but the win condition is fairly obvious once you take a careful look at it, and the steps needed to get there aren't excessively complex. the difficulty of that puzzle lies more in convincing yourself that it'll be possible than anything else. i'll give a mostly spoiler free hint for anybody who wants to give it a shot: ignore the tower when you start the level, and look at the perimeter. think about what the raised path around the perimeter implies, and what that means about how the sausages need to be arranged. don't worry about figuring out exactly how to perfectly grill each sausage, just focus on how you would get a sausage to every grill mark, and the rest of the pieces should fall into place soon after. Venuz Patrol fucked around with this message at 17:27 on Jun 8, 2021 |
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Jun 8, 2021 17:22
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grate deceiver posted:oh poo poo, I just realised that in Slipways asteroids do not give you passive income, you consume them for a one time payout Yeah and the more settled planets you have nearby the more you'll get from them so it makes sense to wait until you're fully settled around them. Maybe I need to give Slipways another chance. I never even finished a game because it just seemed repetitive. I also didn't understand how tech works at all.
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Jun 8, 2021 17:27
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Play posted:Yeah and the more settled planets you have nearby the more you'll get from them so it makes sense to wait until you're fully settled around them. I've been playing Slipways obsessively for the past few days. I'm still not great at it, but here are some tips that have worked for me: 1. Use the right-click option to plan out your planets before you start colonizing. You'll probably need to change the plan several times to get something that works. 2. Always know where each planet's needs are coming from. If you're going to colonize a planet that can never have its needs met, it should be fulfilling at least TWO needs for nearby planets that have no other way to get their needs met. There are probably some exceptions to this that I haven't figured out yet. 3. Two-way trade routes are amazing. They provide more cash per slipway, meet needs on both ends, and make it much easier to plan out a cluster of planets. There's a council perk that makes them worth even more money. Always two-way when possible. I'm sure I'm still missing a ton of strategy, but my last run everything started to click. I got to tier 4 research (right at the end) and finished with a happiness of 101%. Still only three stars, but I juuuuust under the four star cutoff, and I already see a bunch of things I could have done better. I'm loving the game so far.
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Jun 8, 2021 17:48
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WhiteHowler posted:I've been playing Slipways obsessively for the past few days. I'm still not great at it, but here are some tips that have worked for me: Can you explain how you get to tier 4 research? Or how you research anything at all?
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Jun 8, 2021 17:52
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exquisite tea posted:Riven is still one of my all time favorite games. Nearly 25 years ago it brilliantly demonstrated how puzzles could be used to tell a story, rather than them just being an obstacle for the player to overcome. Sadly the source code was lost so it’s unlikely to ever see an HD remaster unless somebody uses a deep learning AI to upres all 30,000 screens or however many there are. There's a fan project to completely rebuild the game from the ground up in real time 3D, with Cyan providing what they can to help. Unsurprisingly, it's been in development for a long time already and will continue to be for longer still.  Re: Myst-likes, I also want to mention The Eyes of Ara. It's not quite as slick as The Room games or Quern, but it's still pretty solid.
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Jun 8, 2021 17:59
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Play posted:Can you explain how you get to tier 4 research? Or how you research anything at all? Build labs using the "structure" button (wrenches at the bottom of the screen). The input to labs is one person and one of (almost) any resource. The more resources you put into the same lab, the more research it will generate. Research points amass each year. So if I have one lab cranking out three research, after three years I'll have nine research. You can then spend the points with the middle flask button at the bottom of the screen. As you research more techs, it unlocks higher tiers (and locks lower tiers, so be careful!). In this particular game I somehow had an excess of people and a few areas with tons of the same resource. By the end I was making 13 research per year, and could have had a few more if I'd prioritized it.
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Jun 8, 2021 18:00
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WhiteHowler posted:Build labs using the "structure" button (wrenches at the bottom of the screen). The input to labs is one person and one of (almost) any resource. The more resources you put into the same lab, the more research it will generate. Thanks. When would you say is a good time to build the first lab, after how many settled planets?
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Jun 8, 2021 18:01
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John Murdoch posted:Re: Myst-likes, I also want to mention The Eyes of Ara. It's not quite as slick as The Room games or Quern, but it's still pretty solid. I liked The Eyes of Ara until I got to an area with a planetarium and then I got so stuck I ended up looking for a guide. When I looked up the solution to the puzzle, I was still not sure how one was supposed to figure it out, even knowing the solution. That seemed like one of the cardinal sins of puzzle games to me, and impossible to overlook.
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Jun 8, 2021 18:02
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Play posted:Thanks. When would you say is a good time to build the first lab, after how many settled planets? I'm still trying to figure that out. I try to get my first lab pretty early, as soon as I have a populated planet with an extra person with nowhere to go. Getting an early tier 0 tech can be game-changing, depending on what's available. Later on I get much more discerning and try to find areas with a ton of the same surplus resource that I can link into the same lab.
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Jun 8, 2021 18:05
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Alice and You in the planet of numbers https://store.steampowered.com/app/1076070/Alice_and_You_in_the_planet_of_numbers/ is a fun little puzzle game that slipped under far too many radars. a simple concept, very well executed. your character stands on a grid of numbers. moving in any direction sends you that way a number of spaces equal to the number on the space where you stepped, and every block you touch falls away from the board. the goal is to clear the blocks from the board, but there's also high score chasing to activate the need for greed and get you into a lot of trouble. one of my hidden gems of 2021, to date.
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Jun 8, 2021 18:18
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Oh, hey, if you’re into classic puzzle games: Cliff Johnson has available all of his games - including The Fool’s Errand and 3 in Three, two of the best puzzle games of the 1980s - on his website for free, along with a Mac Emulator to let you play them on modern machines. https://www.fools-errand.com/ If you want to see what old fogeys like me were doing in high school computer lab, and want to see what puzzle games were like before Myst made things like “theme” and “synergy with story” a thing, check it out. They have great puzzles and fun stories.
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Jun 8, 2021 18:43
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Play posted:Thanks. When would you say is a good time to build the first lab, after how many settled planets? One. Seriously, plop down a lab as soon as possible. Stuff like solar panels is super useful.
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Jun 8, 2021 18:57
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I would say plop a lab down the moment you can actually supply it, so it starts actually making research. Like, if I see two mineral planets fairly close together, that's getting a lab every time.
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Jun 8, 2021 19:08
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One thing that took a while to click in Slipways is that you always want to look for places to exports to go, even places that no longer need it. If your food production planet is max level and only needs one biomass to function, but you’ve got planets with extra biomass laying around with no where else to go then you can send all that extra biomass to the food planet. It won’t generate any extra food but it will generate more revenue and, perhaps more importantly, more easily satisfy Successful/Prosperous route requirements.
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Jun 8, 2021 20:22
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Venuz Patrol posted:I bounced off the tower the first time i played, but i was able to beat it on my own the second time i tried the game. It's intimidating particularly because you haven't seen anything in the game like it before, but the win condition is fairly obvious once you take a careful look at it, and the steps needed to get there aren't excessively complex. the difficulty of that puzzle lies more in convincing yourself that it'll be possible than anything else. 100% agree. The great tower level in Steven's Sausage Roll is, to use an overused analogy, like the first boss of a dark souls game, more bark than bite. You've figured out the controls and the basic concepts. Now it's time to apply them. The actual solution isn't all that long or tricky, it just needs a bit of forethought. Get over the intimidation factor and it's fairly simple and forgiving.
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Jun 8, 2021 21:51
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Just FYI for anybody interested in buying Slipways - the current $10 coupon sale that is going on on the Epic Games Store applies to it so you can get the game for $5 there (it's not a Steam key).
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Jun 8, 2021 23:06
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I didn't even get to a tower in Steven's Sausage Roll, I got stuck at a level that was only like 4x8 or something and realized I was not enjoying the experience. If you like Steven's Sausage Roll you might like Pipe Push Paradise, which has similar mechanics and is less ugly, IMO. (I did not like it nearly as much as I did not like Steven's Sausage Roll, because apparently I just do not enjoy Sokoban with an extra half-dimension.)
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Jun 9, 2021 01:21
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roomforthetuna posted:I didn't even get to a tower in Steven's Sausage Roll, I got stuck at a level that was only like 4x8 or something and realized I was not enjoying the experience. Pipe Push Paradise and A Monster's Exhibition both have much better designed and communicated learning curves than SSR, in my opinion; I'd recommend either of them over it if you're looking for "sokoban with a twist".
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Jun 9, 2021 02:03
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NRVNQSR posted:Pipe Push Paradise and A Monster's Exhibition both have much better designed and communicated learning curves than SSR, in my opinion; I'd recommend either of them over it if you're looking for "sokoban with a twist". When I got stuck with Steven's Sausage Roll it felt more like the puzzle was just poo poo, and if I got past it the next puzzle would also be poo poo. Which isn't to say they *are* bad puzzles, clearly some people enjoyed it. It's more "if you tried Steven's Sausage Roll and you're not enjoying it, don't keep trying, it doesn't get better, try something else."
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Jun 9, 2021 03:01
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roomforthetuna posted:The big difference for me was that with Pipe Push Paradise when I got stuck I felt like it was my fault for not being able to see the way forward, and that if I had felt like persevering I would probably have got past it and enjoyed a few more levels. ??? You didn't get up to the tower, how do you know it doesn't get better? I mean it doesn't get better in the sense that there's no point where it stops getting harder but the puzzles are always well designed and reveal new surprises as you get more accomplished, confident, and develop better schemas to approach them with. Steven's Sausage Roll is a game that absolutely rewards you for spending your time with it and persevering. Monster's Expedition is in a bunch of ways Steven's Sausage Roll lite and I rank it as one of the best puzzle games of the decade.
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Jun 9, 2021 03:27
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stephens sausage roll has a design philosophy of always challenging the player with new concepts every puzzle, which i think is loving great but can be completely exhausting compared to games that aggressively tutorialize new mechanics another game that doesn't ever hold back is Snakebird, which has a cutesy mobile game aesthetic that does not at all prepare you for how brutally difficult it is.
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Jun 9, 2021 03:41
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Venuz Patrol posted:another game that doesn't ever hold back is Snakebird, which has a cutesy mobile game aesthetic that does not at all prepare you for how brutally difficult it is.
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Jun 9, 2021 03:55
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I absolutely wanted to love Shenzhen I/O but it felt like the first 4 or so programming jobs were incredibly fun and did get progressively harder, but then the next one out of the blue was "gently caress this poo poo!" hard. I want, so bad, about 40 more jobs that are like the early levels before it got impossibly hard. I don't care if they were super easy, it was just really zen to do those easier early ones and I enjoyed them SO much.
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Jun 9, 2021 05:42
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I can't blame anyone for finding Shenzhen I/O difficult (it's considered one of the harder Zachtronics games even), but also I don't think the early-mid part of the game is impenetrable unless you're having trouble with one of the core mechanics (how xbus works trips up a lot of people). Unrelated puzzle game stuff: I am playing Filament and it is extremely difficult.
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Jun 9, 2021 05:53
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Well this just happened I seemingly locked myself out of the second platinum star as I kind of messed up my final year by being a bit too cavalier in the first half and scouting like an idiot (do not do this on the final year! You want full undo capabilities to look for optimizations), but hoo boy. Matter Transposition, which lets you switch the position of uncolonized planets, is pretty drat strong. Combine that with Starbirth however, and it becomes completely busted. Starbirth lets you turn any mineral or barren planet into a supply of two energy for a mere 1mo/20c, and being able to place them in the most convenient spots with Transposition made the late game a laughable affair. Establishing tech often and early is key in this case of course. Of course I managed to fund all this galactic marble shifting with two good money perks (8c for deliviering minerals, 8c for connecting two-way trades), double money from asteroids, and Xenotourism. Tourism in general is excellent since it gives you somewhere to sink population, generates money, and is pretty easy to get to Prosperous, especially in conjunction with Starbirth. Looking at my map in hindsight this game could have gone waaay past 20k, so I encourage people to try out this seed and council combination themselves. I was a tad skeptical starting out cause getting a handle on the mechanics and dealing with the sometimes harsh RNG can be dispiriting but I'm glad I stuck with it. This game owns and is a hell of a lot of fun and I anticipate spending 70% of my time on successful runs trying my hardest to optimize and squeeze out every little bit of score I can. I may end up moving to Tough soon to see how much that changes things.
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Jun 9, 2021 06:37
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fez_machine posted:??? You didn't get up to the tower, how do you know it doesn't get better? With sausage roll I learned "the annoying rolling mechanic where you can't easily see the total state of things" and a bunch of things you literally *can't* do but would like to, in like the second puzzle, then ten puzzles later I hadn't learned anything else, it was just "keep doing the same poo poo pretty much by trial and error". Do I remember right that there's also no 'undo'? So if you make a mistake you have to remember everything you did so far to get back to the same point? That's my least favorite antifeature of a puzzle game. vvvv Fair enough, maybe I just didn't find the button for it, or am misremembering. I remember being annoyed by having to start again after a sausage burns. roomforthetuna fucked around with this message at 15:39 on Jun 9, 2021 |
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Jun 9, 2021 13:23
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SSR definitely has undo
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Jun 9, 2021 15:09
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Super Jay Mann posted:Well this just happened I still can't get above 3* 
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Jun 9, 2021 15:24
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Ciaphas posted:I still can't get above 3* Anyone want to make a Slipways thread?  I've gotten 5* my last few games, still playing on the default difficulty. I break each run into three "phases": 1. Get a basic, stable loop set up with 1-2 populated planets and the supporting infrastructure. Build my first lab as early as possible, having it produce at least three bulbs (1 person + 2 of the same resource). This should be done by year 5 at the latest. 2. Build out infrastructure. Focus on adding more labs whenever possible. Concentrate on building a strong core with Successful planets and two-way trades, which will make money a non-factor by the midgame. Also prioritize council tasks; they're a ton of points at the end of the game. This is most of the run, until year 20 or so. 3. Stop most expansion, look for ways to increase happiness and meet needs that were previously unmeetable. Try to connect up any idle Population, or send them for Enlightment / Ascension, depending on which techs you have. Finish up council tasks, and decline taking any more unless you're 100% sure you can meet them. My last few games have all ended at around 125% happiness, with a Colossal empire size. I haven't gotten a platinum score yet, but the last game came very close.
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Jun 9, 2021 15:58
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WhiteHowler posted:Anyone want to make a Slipways thread? I didn't realize it was possible to just decline counsel task. This changes everything.
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Jun 9, 2021 16:05
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I dont know posted:I didn't realize it was possible to just decline counsel task. This changes everything. It's only during the last few years of the game. Maybe the last five? There's also a "postpone" button that's available all the time, but I don't know if this lets you then decline if you keep postponing past year 20. I haven't tried. Edit: As I play more of it, I realize Slipways is more of a management game than a puzzle game. While the core gameplay of linking up resources with needs is straight-up puzzle-y, there are a ton more moving pieces (money, research, techs, tasks, etc.) than most puzzle games have. WhiteHowler fucked around with this message at 16:30 on Jun 9, 2021 |
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Jun 9, 2021 16:20
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Llamadeus posted:I can't blame anyone for finding Shenzhen I/O difficult (it's considered one of the harder Zachtronics games even), but also I don't think the early-mid part of the game is impenetrable unless you're having trouble with one of the core mechanics (how xbus works trips up a lot of people). Yeah I recall getting stuck in like the tenth room in Filament. It is tough. There obviously was some trick I wasn't figuring out but it devolved into repeating the same tactics with the same results over and over again.
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Jun 9, 2021 16:28
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Play posted:Yeah I recall getting stuck in like the tenth room in Filament. It is tough. There obviously was some trick I wasn't figuring out but it devolved into repeating the same tactics with the same results over and over again. I agree. Some of the more complex puzzles are less about figuring out the solution and more about applying the rules in a trial-and-error fashion. The last area of Filament (the Bridge) is absolutely ridiculous about this. I ended up looking up solutions to a lot of the endgame puzzles, because I wasn't having any fun "solving" them. The story is really good, and piecing together what happened to the crew is a fun mystery. It's a shame the gameplay gets in the way, especially when the earlier puzzles seem to have so much potential.
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Jun 9, 2021 16:34
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Slipways chat: since switching to challenging difficulty I don't prioritise labs that much anymore. Main priority is to get some planets to succesfull as soon as possible, because that's the best way to get money. I only start building labs when money is no longer an issue at the end of the year.
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Jun 9, 2021 16:52
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Two indie puzzle games I enjoyed that I haven't seen mentioned yet: Back to Bed - A real-time, "Lemmings"-style puzzler where you have to redirect a sleepwalker around hazards and get him back to bed. Each level loops when you fail, so it's very quick to retry new solutions. She Remembered Caterpillars - An isometric traversal puzzler. Make bridges and open gates based on colors. The game looks easy at first, but the later levels require you to do some complex color shifting and mixing. They're both quite good.
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Jun 9, 2021 16:56
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Walh Hara posted:Slipways chat: since switching to challenging difficulty I don't prioritise labs that much anymore. Main priority is to get some planets to succesfull as soon as possible, because that's the best way to get money. I only start building labs when money is no longer an issue at the end of the year. Labs are a good way to do that because they provide an export outlet for goods that can be difficult to multi-export. That said, I haven't played on Challenging yet. I did get my first double-platinum score earlier. I gotta say, the tech to collapse planets into stars that produce two energy solves almost any problem. 
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Jun 9, 2021 18:54
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Sign me up to ask for a Slipways thread, I have no idea what I"m doing.
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Jun 9, 2021 19:14
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One thing I don't quite understand is whether unused goods can travel THROUGH one or more planets that don't need them and to one that does. It seems like not, but that kinda doesn't make sense. Obviously I haven't played too deep into this game but understanding it better would probably get me to do that.
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Jun 9, 2021 19:26
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