|
So I decided to continue on with the effort post(s) I started in GBS and move it into it's own thread here. Figured here was as good of a place as any. Original post in the OSHA thread is found below. I will try and update when I can up to and through run off of a part. Hope you all enjoy the ride... So my work bought a little machine. It's been a long time coming...  That is one of six crates that have been on their way from Italy for about 2-1/2 years now. Well it now looks like this in our side lot.  According to the driver that one alone weighs 76,000(+). Purdy Tractor  There are like 5 more like it, although slightly smaller.     Here is where you locate 16 tow motors to lift it off of the bed  So I somehow got talked into working for a bit and missed them moving the largest crate... so so sorry. Rest assured I will not be doing anything except poo poo posting the rest of the day. Please forgive me. But I did manage to get them squeezing it in the back overhead. Soooo close to not making it.    fwiw, there is a tow motor of equal size on the other side of the crate moving in reverse. Here is the main machining unit laid out on a nice shiny piece of floor.  10' ladder for reference...It supposedly weighed 76,000 in the crate Another view  wait, something doesn't look quite right.... OOPS  I'm sure that will buff right out... And for reference this is what it does. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QjL9ToCpMko Ours is much larger/newer model(G397 whatever the gently caress that means) of that same machine. It was custom built and took over two years from purchase to delivery to get. Covid may have slowed that down a bit. Long story short it's a 5-axis rotary transfer machine that will load, fully machine, deburr, wash, unload, and pack Brass CGA valves in ~ 6 seconds. All of that for the low low starting cost of 3.5million dollars. https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?noseen=0&threadid=3904642&pagenumber=893&perpage=40#post515379163
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2021 12:07
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 19, 2024 03:04 |
|
|
Day two assembly moving right along... Parts hopper. Thing has to be 20' tall.  Coolant tank  Drivers and power supply's and such cabinet  General footprint: 
schmug fucked around with this message at 12:46 on Jun 11, 2021 |
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2021 12:07
|
|
|
Some random questions from the previous thread:LifeSunDeath posted:Yes schmug posted:LAUGHMYFUCKINGASSOFF I just found out at least three of the spindles on the top of the machine are cocked/crooked/bent/dented/not good from hitting something sometime by someone somewhere Arsenic Lupin posted:Do you guys manufacture only brass valves, or is that used for other stuff, too? TjyvTompa posted:There's not many things in this world that makes me jealous but getting to drive one of those trucks is one of them. schmug fucked around with this message at 13:03 on Jun 11, 2021 |
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2021 12:08
|
|
|
Very interesting. I was wondering how the hell you program something like this. Is each station running its own program or are there just a ton of work offsets? Cam or programmed at the machine? I started doing 5 axis stuff recently, but in a normal type of CNC machine and that feels plenty busy so far, I don't know where I'd start for something like that.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2021 14:07
|
|
|
honda whisperer posted:Very interesting. I was wondering how the hell you program something like this. Is each station running its own program or are there just a ton of work offsets? Cam or programmed at the machine? I started doing 5 axis stuff recently, but in a normal type of CNC machine and that feels plenty busy so far, I don't know where I'd start for something like that. Each station has it its own program. There are 11 machining stations, plus a load and unload station. Each machining station has 3 CNC controlled spindles for it. Each jaw set(station) rotates across an axis'. Believe it or not we are still working out the programming of it. It's coming turnkey with two jobs programmed for it, but I'm on the hook after that. I'm really hoping it has some kind of software included because I guarantee Mastercam doesn't support something like that. Maybe NX or something, but that poo poo is out of our price range. It does have Siemens controls though, so who knows... schmug fucked around with this message at 14:55 on Jun 11, 2021 |
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2021 14:53
|
|
|
That's a sweet machine. I saw a baby brother to one of these making pump bodies a few years ago. Super cool to watch it work. The enormous explosion of coolant was amazing. I work at a tier 3 plunge grinding "something" that goes into valves like that, I have no idea who the final customer is though, could be you. How does the raw brass get into the machine? Bar feeder? Robot? Vibe bowl?
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2021 16:48
|
|
|
Yooper posted:That's a sweet machine. I saw a baby brother to one of these making pump bodies a few years ago. Super cool to watch it work. The enormous explosion of coolant was amazing. Bar is cast-slugged-forged and shipped to us. We used to do all our own casting and forging as well, but monies got involved or something. After we receive the forgings they then get dumped into a giant hopper(pictured above) then on to a conveyor then to a to robot to load/unload.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2021 17:46
|
|
|
I used to broker flatbed shipments and also CNC machines are way cool so now I have a "very large" boner.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2021 18:24
|
|
|
Voted one-thread does not feature any big asses, and the machine does not make big asses either! Very cool machine OP. Italians make very good machines IME. I wonder how many manual humans machinists making valves it is equivalent to.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2021 18:43
|
|
|
Did you build a big castle with the big box afterwards?
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2021 20:09
|
|
|
tangy yet delightful posted:I used to broker flatbed shipments and also CNC machines are way cool so now I have a "very large" boner. I get it. Just watching the riggers do their thing is pretty amazing in itself. Kaiser Schnitzel posted:Voted one-thread does not feature any big asses, and the machine does not make big asses either! Side story on these Italian machines. This type and size of machine has two main competitors that make basically the same machine with different names and they are all located in some "little valley" over there. Apparently the owners are all related to each other. We had quotes from all three. It kind of makes you think.... We have versions from all three in our shop. schmug fucked around with this message at 13:47 on Jun 12, 2021 |
|
#
?
Jun 12, 2021 13:38
|
|
|
That's incredible. We used to make parts similar to (but less complex than) that where I work but we did it on a single spindle machine and it took like 8 setups. I don't envy you trying to learn how to program that thing. It amuses me that your company would buy a machine like that but balks at the software cost. Typical.
|
|
#
?
Jun 12, 2021 14:56
|
|
|
Disgruntled Bovine posted:That's incredible. We used to make parts similar to (but less complex than) that where I work but we did it on a single spindle machine and it took like 8 setups. amusing, and very typical, yes. I've been asking about software for this thing for well over a year.
|
|
#
?
Jun 12, 2021 16:35
|
|
|
schmug posted:I get it. Just watching the riggers do their thing is pretty amazing in itself. These people make insanely huge bandsaws for cutting slabs of aluminum: https://instagram.com/bandsawfacts?utm_medium=copy_link
|
|
#
?
Jun 12, 2021 19:07
|
|
|
Thanks, those are some impressive photographs. I recently bought some brass valves for water and never really considered how they had been milled. I guess this makes more sense that you'd have a gigantic machine doing it automatically. Now, talk to me. What are the tolerances here on the machining? (Not that I'd understand but I'll just nod politely.)
|
|
#
?
Jun 16, 2021 10:34
|
|
|
kimihia posted:Thanks, those are some impressive photographs. We mostly specialize in compressed gas valves, but the machining processes are the same for the most part. As far as tolerances go it's a pretty standard +/.005" for most, but we get down to +/-.0005" in some critical applications. RA, or surface finishes, are more of an issue most of time since compressed gasses really need to be sealed at certain areas on the valve(s) or bad stuff can happen. Will be posting some new stuff soon, but this build is taking quite some time and most of it is pretty mundane,
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2021 00:47
|
|
|
On a side note I was speaking with one of the builders and he said they just built a machine whose coolant tank/system was bigger than our main machining area. Took them three months to bring the whole thing into operation. So fwiw Big rear end Machine is a very relative term.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2021 00:53
|
|
|
schmug posted:.... So fwiw Big rear end Machine is a very relative term. Indeed. For a fun time look up the lathes they used to make the guns for battleships.
|
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2021 02:47
|
|
|
I live semi-near this monstrosity. If you look close you can see a couple guys standing in front of it. It's one of two 50,000 ton presses in the US used for forging major aircraft components. Here's an interesting article on them. https://boingboing.net/2012/02/13/machines.html Our contracted internal auditor has been there and saw it in person, I'm very jealous of him. Also the Mesta catalog linked near the end of the article (here: http://archive.org/details/plantproductofme00mest/page/n5/mode/2up?view=theater) is a definite pro-click. Disgruntled Bovine fucked around with this message at 04:26 on Jun 18, 2021 |
|
#
?
Jun 18, 2021 04:24
|
|
|
How many margaritas per minute (mpm) can this sucker crank out?
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2021 16:22
|
|
|
AstroZamboni posted:How many margaritas per minute (mpm) can this sucker crank out? lol that thread
|
|
#
?
Jun 21, 2021 20:46
|
|
|
schmug posted:I get it. Just watching the riggers do their thing is pretty amazing in itself. Theres some Tiawanese machine makers for EDMs that are like this. one started based on old Fanuc engineers that went there to make their own company. Then some of those engineers went down the road to make their own. Literally the two machines are almost identical but with different control systems. Work great and are dependable, along with cheaper then most other machine makers. Parts are cheap to which is a major plus. One of the big claims to fame was that they were some of the first to make bigger machines with 20 inch plus z axis, something unheard of for the traditional manufactures for a long time.
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2021 04:52
|
|
|
Well the machine is coming along... Not your mom's spaghetti:  Some of it in it's new home:  Overall it's about 75% put together. We still have about week of wiring to do do plus a wash line to install, but here are some overall views of it:     And some close ups up the working bits      Wish I could have gotten more pictures of the assembly, some of which were OSHA af, but there we like 8 guys working on it all at the same time and it was just too hectic. Tell you what though, the Italians, or these ones anyways DO NOT gently caress AROUND. It was very impressive to see them put this thing together in about a week. Next up is about two weeks of training fml. I will hopefully have some more updates in the next couple weeks...
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2021 12:24
|
|
|
UCS Hellmaker posted:Theres some Tiawanese machine makers for EDMs that are like this. one started based on old Fanuc engineers that went there to make their own company. Then some of those engineers went down the road to make their own. Literally the two machines are almost identical but with different control systems. Work great and are dependable, along with cheaper then most other machine makers. Parts are cheap to which is a major plus. One of the big claims to fame was that they were some of the first to make bigger machines with 20 inch plus z axis, something unheard of for the traditional manufactures for a long time. Yeah, seems you find this a lot in this industry. Most really. I find the history of it fascinating for some reason though.
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2021 12:28
|
|
|
It wasn't very clear from the video.. does this just process one kind of valve, or is it flexible enough to do multiple types?
|
|
#
?
Jun 25, 2021 23:42
|
|
|
devicenull posted:It wasn't very clear from the video.. does this just process one kind of valve, or is it flexible enough to do multiple types? Only limited to the machining envelope and tooling. We will be running 100's of different types of valves across this machine. They are all very similar though.
|
|
#
?
Jun 26, 2021 12:48
|
|
|
Once you have it programmed, how easy is it to run? Could an idiot select the right program off a menu and just let it run? There's a Men's Shed which just received an old CnC machine. ("Men's Shed" is an organisation that finds warehouses in different areas and sets them up with a charter, machinery, tools, and materials for retired folks to make things.) The guy who donated the machine gave them a quick tutorial but it's all too complex. They're just going to use it as an old fashioned drill press.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2021 02:43
|
|
|
What kind of CNC? When you say drill press I assume it's a knee mill.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2021 03:47
|
|
|
schmug posted:Well the machine is coming along... I'm kinda surprised your company's logo isn't plastered on every available facet.
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2021 06:55
|
|
|
kimihia posted:Once you have it programmed, how easy is it to run? Could an idiot select the right program off a menu and just let it run? babyeatingpsychopath posted:I'm kinda surprised your company's logo isn't plastered on every available facet.
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2021 12:04
|
|
|
When do we get an update on The Machine? I wanna see this baby in action - video!!
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2021 20:04
|
|
|
Please update us on the state of the Machine?
|
|
#
?
Jul 4, 2022 02:36
|
|
|
ChickenOfTomorrow posted:Please update us on the state of the Machine? Well It's only been a year but here goes the latest! It's been a bitch. Long story shory we(I) have had nothing but problems with this machine and I have had to deal with the brunt of it. That being said here are a couple short clips and pics to show what it's supposed to do non-stop: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ZSK0hSkYPQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6owVGm-Q4B8 A couple pics of inside the machine:   Pics of the part being machined:   That little bitch takes just over 14 seconds to machine. It should take about 8. Good times. schmug fucked around with this message at 02:55 on Mar 11, 2023 |
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2023 02:32
|
|
|
babyeatingpsychopath posted:I'm kinda surprised your company's logo isn't plastered on every available facet. Some companies definitely do this. We have a couple machines with our logo on them. I went to Italy last summer to visit the company that made this machine, They will paint it what ever color, and even brand it! There is a pretty substantial tooling manufacturer in Isreal that has the star of david embossed on their machines. Think they had 10 of them being built when I was there. Looked pretty badass, to be honest.
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2023 03:03
|
|
|
Why doesn’t your $3.5mn machine work flawlessly aside from  (That’s a joke the Italians make wonderful machines, at least in the woodworking world)
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2023 05:13
|
|
|
Kinda wild to me to see that expensive of a machine, and all the complex custom form tools are just running in CAT40 ER collet chucks and sidelock holders. If it works it works, but I'm pretty used to hydraulic and shrinkfit, and it seems like holders would be a drop in the bucket compared to the machine!schmug posted:That little bitch takes just over 14 seconds to machine. It should take about 8. Good times. Is that one of the parts that they provided turnkey programs for? It's never a good sign when the people manufacturing the machine can't meet the rate they promised (and I've been on that side!) Sometimes the proposals group doesn't know what they're talking about... schmug posted:Some companies definitely do this. We have a couple machines with our logo on them. We'd repaint the mills any color the customer wanted. We had one customer give us a lengthy spec sheet with their requirements, including that it had to match their specific shade of white. I think it was a slightly bluer shade, the normal paint was just a little bit closer to eggshell. Sure, we'll add the paint to the quote, no problem. Machines were all done, they came to visit, and their PM looked at their machine, then one of our standard machines right by it. "That looks basically the same. Why the heck did we bother requesting the custom color?" No idea, but thank you for the $5k!
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2023 05:44
|
|
|
I'm kinda surprised that you can get a big stand alone cnc factory like that for $3.5m I'd have thought that sort of thing would be in the $10m price range or maybe only available for lease, It's just wild to me how fast technology moves.
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2023 06:51
|
|
|
Kaiser Schnitzel posted:Why doesn’t your $3.5mn machine work flawlessly aside from I honestly blaim some of it on Covid. It was built right in the height of it. coldpudding posted:I'm kinda surprised that you can get a big stand alone cnc factory like that for $3.5m I'd have thought that sort of thing would be in the $10m price range or maybe only available for lease, It's just wild to me how fast technology moves. Oh, their are much fancier version of this out there. We are looking at one right now with 35 spindles that are all CNC. And another one in a couple years...fingers crossed.
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2023 13:35
|
|
|
Karia posted:Kinda wild to me to see that expensive of a machine, and all the complex custom form tools are just running in CAT40 ER collet chucks and sidelock holders. If it works it works, but I'm pretty used to hydraulic and shrinkfit, and it seems like holders would be a drop in the bucket compared to the machine! On the cost of tooling: CAT 40 has been working for our company for as lonf as they have been around. We already have a serious ammount of money invested in them for all of our other machines, as well as some of the tools are interchangable and work on the other machine with a pull stud swap. Same goes for the shrink fit as well. Nope, that's part of the problem. It was all on "us". They(the powers that be) only had them turnkey two products. Then they nickle and dimed the manufacturer on price until it was a shell of what it should have been. I've already had to figure out how to tool up and prgrom ~10 more with way less capacilities than what I was lead to believe I was getting. I now get "final say" on machine builds....money not-withstanding of couse lol. At least I can give them an "I told you so" when something doesn't do what I wanted it to do because of price!
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2023 13:50
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 19, 2024 03:04 |
|
|
Management nickle & dimeing is always frustrating, but hot drat if that kind of machinery isn't cool as gently caress 😳.
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2023 19:16
|
|
