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Worth noting is that 5th Edition isn't balanced around PVP at all, which means when PVP breaks out it's frequently unbalanced, unfair, and over very quickly because PC damage output outpaces PC HP pools. Monks spamming Stunning Strikes is top tier regressive bullshit with no counterplay
Froghammer fucked around with this message at 04:59 on Jun 20, 2021 |
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Jun 20, 2021 04:09
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I don't think any version of D&D really works for PVP. You definitely need to approach it as a big dumb spectacle. Which it was
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Jun 20, 2021 16:08
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I hadn't realized the extent to which monks could be an angel of death in PVP. Between their mobility and flurry of blows, it really is "revive your downed party member before the monk's next turn or ready revivify". They hinted at doing one with the other halves in the future and I'd love a cooperative gauntlet with boons at stake for Campaign 3 and an Uk'otoaUk'otoaesque shrinking board to drive urgency and tamp down some of the high level slog. Yasha, Grog, Caduceus, Vex, Veth, Caleb, and Keyleth... in addition to whatever NPC from either campaign Matt wants to play against high level foes and creatures from another DM (Aabria? Deborah? Mark? Someone new?). For every major foe defeated/surviving character, the cast (fans?) can pick from a list of boons, contextless, for the next campaign. A mage ally? Luck granting items to appear in the first arc? An extra vestige hidden somewhere? An appearance by a mystery NPC from a past campaign? One free revivify? The name of a member of the Tal Dorei council?
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Jun 20, 2021 16:53
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For those who missed it yesterday, the vod is up on youtube now: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpBIQhWAhuM Obviously: contains spoilers for Campaigns 1 & 2 of critical role.
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Jun 20, 2021 18:11
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Paracaidas posted:I hadn't realized the extent to which monks could be an angel of death in PVP. Between their mobility and flurry of blows, it really is "revive your downed party member before the monk's next turn or ready revivify". NADDPOD did an episode called Can They Kill It? that was like this. They’re a lot sillier than CR but I think it would still be fun.
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Jun 20, 2021 18:53
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Campaign 3: Everyone plays a monk and Matt spends 4 straight hours crying every Thursday
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Jun 20, 2021 19:29
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Joey McChrist posted:Campaign 3: Everyone plays a monk and Matt spends 4 straight hours crying every Thursday That could actually be interesting. A monastic order leaving their retreat to save the world but no one believes them or has heard of them. A skilled warrior monk. A scholastic mage monk. A devout priest monk. A stealthy ninja monk. An angry barbarian monk constantly struggling with their rage. A one with nature druidic monk. A Zen archer type monk.
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Jun 20, 2021 19:44
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VM also got totally screwed by having to deal with Molly that one turn while having absolutely no idea what he could do. It was basically what stopped Scanlan from getting to safety, and also prevented some big attacks on Beau from Vax. They also don't know that you can still sue Bonus Actions while stunned, which actually would've been pretty big for the spellcasters.
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Jun 20, 2021 20:13
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Antifa Spacemarine posted:VM also got totally screwed by having to deal with Molly that one turn while having absolutely no idea what he could do. It was basically what stopped Scanlan from getting to safety, and also prevented some big attacks on Beau from Vax. They also don't know that you can still sue Bonus Actions while stunned, which actually would've been pretty big for the spellcasters.
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Jun 20, 2021 20:22
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bagrada posted:That could actually be interesting. A monastic order leaving their retreat to save the world but no one believes them or has heard of them. A skilled warrior monk. A scholastic mage monk. A devout priest monk. A stealthy ninja monk. An angry barbarian monk constantly struggling with their rage. A one with nature druidic monk. A Zen archer type monk. And every single one of them is an elf with a 4 hour long rest.
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Jun 20, 2021 20:35
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Senjuro posted:"Anything that deprives you of your ability to take actions also prevents you from taking a bonus action" (PHB, 189). Wow, never knew about that.
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Jun 20, 2021 20:49
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Pocky In My Pocket posted:I don't think any version of D&D really works for PVP. You definitely need to approach it as a big dumb spectacle. Which it was
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Jun 20, 2021 21:44
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bagrada posted:That could actually be interesting. A monastic order leaving their retreat to save the world but no one believes them or has heard of them. A skilled warrior monk. A scholastic mage monk. A devout priest monk. A stealthy ninja monk. An angry barbarian monk constantly struggling with their rage. A one with nature druidic monk. A Zen archer type monk. That's actually been a campaign idea I had back in the day....an all Monks and Mystics game with a full on martial arts Wu Xia style.
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Jun 20, 2021 21:57
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Yeah, I pretty much predicted Beau was going to run roughshod over that comp. The only one who really stands a chance of both keeping up and warding off the stunning strikes would of been Grog. Scanlan and Pike were always going to eat poo poo the moment she got in contact with them When we get the mirror match and it's Grog Kei Vex and Tary vs Yasha Veth Cad and Caleb it's probably going to be pretty one sided in the other direction. Shifter druids are about as hard to pin down as monks and incredibly hard to kill. On the Nein side, Yasha is going to be an unlikable problem but I think they'll be spending a lot of time reacting to what's coming at them.
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Jun 20, 2021 22:37
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If it's another lvl 15 fight Keyleth will be tough but not the nightmare a level 20 with Beast Spells and Shapechange is
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Jun 20, 2021 22:39
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Beef Jerky Robot posted:If it's another lvl 15 fight Keyleth will be tough but not the nightmare a level 20 with Beast Spells and Shapechange is Even if it was level 20, hopefully they looked up the rules. Druids need to go back to their base form before turning into something else, they can't just go from fire elemental one round to something else the next to a third thing the third round with a full heal each time. They're still very powerful, but at least it gives others a chance to hurt them. You still have to nuke the poo poo out of them that one round, but level 20 PC's can do that kind of thing.
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Jun 20, 2021 23:22
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seaborgium posted:Even if it was level 20, hopefully they looked up the rules. Druids need to go back to their base form before turning into something else, they can't just go from fire elemental one round to something else the next to a third thing the third round with a full heal each time. yes she can. she's a circle of the moon druid and she has no limitations to her wild shape besides how many times she can do it per short rest at levels lower than 20. she doesn't have to shift back before changing form again.
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Jun 20, 2021 23:31
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basically, think of the lvl 20 archdruid as having a constantly regenerating HP shield. they're tough, but not unkillable. if you can get whatever form they're in to just under 100 hp then hit em with a power word: kill they're done unless they've managed to get a bunch of buffs up. or stun their rear end with a monk and go to town
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Jun 20, 2021 23:52
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Joey McChrist posted:basically, think of the lvl 20 archdruid as having a constantly regenerating HP shield. they're tough, but not unkillable. if you can get whatever form they're in to just under 100 hp then hit em with a power word: kill they're done unless they've managed to get a bunch of buffs up. Senjuro fucked around with this message at 00:05 on Jun 21, 2021 |
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Jun 20, 2021 23:59
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seaborgium posted:Even if it was level 20, hopefully they looked up the rules. Druids need to go back to their base form before turning into something else, they can't just go from fire elemental one round to something else the next to a third thing the third round with a full heal each time. They're still very powerful, but at least it gives others a chance to hurt them. You still have to nuke the poo poo out of them that one round, but level 20 PC's can do that kind of thing. Yes but Shapechange allows you to change using your action as long as you maintain concentration
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Jun 21, 2021 00:02
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Beef Jerky Robot posted:If it's another lvl 15 fight Keyleth will be tough but not the nightmare a level 20 with Beast Spells and Shapechange is Without Beast spells she’s choosing between having healing available for others or being in beast form. They do have some other sources of healing in that group, but she’s the only Heal spell and a low hp PC is going to get dropped fast if both Veth and Caleb are in operation. (We might see Yasha with the coup de gras but I don’t expect that unless Ashley opts to finish off Grog after Travis bobbled his coup de gras on Pike.) M9 benefitted from everything these people learned in C1, so I’d expect they’d hold an advantage in these fights even without figuring in the fact that they’re going to be rusty playing the Vox Machina characters. It doesn’t matter what your character can do if you don’t remember you can do it.
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Jun 21, 2021 00:56
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Beef Jerky Robot posted:NADDPOD did an episode called Can They Kill It? that was like this. They’re a lot sillier than CR but I think it would still be fun. That sounds like something I need to listen to. I have to admit the solemn tone of the battle royale was jarring given what I expected. I nearly wept at the phantasmic pegging.
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Jun 21, 2021 03:04
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Paracaidas posted:That sounds like something I need to listen to. I have to admit the solemn tone of the battle royale was jarring given what I expected. I nearly wept at the phantasmic pegging. Well then the Band of Boobs vs the Astral Dad-nought is where it’s at
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Jun 21, 2021 03:07
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Saw something funny in chat during the wrap which was also surprising cause chat is usually awful but anyway. When Matt was describing The Plank King as someone who gets info from all over just so he can repeat and feel smart someone in chat said "So he's Joe Rogan?" Got a laugh outta me
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Jun 21, 2021 07:22
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Paracaidas posted:That sounds like something I need to listen to. I have to admit the solemn tone of the battle royale was jarring given what I expected. I nearly wept at the phantasmic pegging. NADDPOD is the one ran by Brian Murphy and Emily Axeford right? I've been catching up with Dimension 20 stuff and they are both great on that.
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Jun 21, 2021 13:41
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DeathSandwich posted:NADDPOD is the one ran by Brian Murphy and Emily Axeford right? I've been catching up with Dimension 20 stuff and they are both great on that. Any other recommendations from the thread on actual play podcasts/streams to scratch the itch until C3? I'm aware The Adventure Zone and NADDPOD exist and are well regarded. Who else?
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Jun 21, 2021 13:51
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Paracaidas posted:Any other recommendations from the thread on actual play podcasts/streams to scratch the itch until C3? I'm aware The Adventure Zone and NADDPOD exist and are well regarded. Who else? Depending on your tolerance for comedy, there’s D&D Is For Nerds from Sanspants Radio. It’s closer to the chaos Sam/Laura bits of CR than the serious stuff, but I enjoy it at least. Maybe you will too?
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Jun 21, 2021 14:04
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Paracaidas posted:I think so? I just started their current campaign last night and had to turn it off because I was trying to focus on it instead of fading off to sleep, the highest compliment I can give any podcast. NADDPOD is great, as mentioned. Dimension 20 is fantastic and has some of the same folks - also, there's been some Critical Role crossover with Matt and Marisha having been guests in their various campaigns. Downside, while some of them are on Youtube, the rest is paywalled behind their Dropout service. Dungeons and Daddies is a great goofy show about four dads who get stuck in a fantasy world and have to try to track down their missing sons, and is wildly chaotic in the best ways. Spout Lore is super interesting- it uses the Dungeon World system which is much more like, cooperative storytelling than traditional D&D? A lot more of like, collaborative play where everyone is building the story together, and the players are a lot of fun in terms of building an interesting world. I also listen to Rude Tales of Magic and also Dragon Friends, but those are much more chaotic/zany and are much less like, "game" podcasts. The other ones listed at least try to interact with the game aspects, while these two are much more of like improv/story streams with a light sprinkling of dice rolling. Still fun! But.
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Jun 21, 2021 14:17
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Paracaidas posted:I think so? I just started their current campaign last night and had to turn it off because I was trying to focus on it instead of fading off to sleep, the highest compliment I can give any podcast. Check out Dimension 20s stuff. Everything I've listened to from them has been amazing. Matt Mercer is in their Escape from Bloodkeep miniseries and both Matt and Marisha are in Pirates of Leviathan series from them so it is a good way to ease into Brennan Lee Mulligan's DM style while still having familiar faces present.
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Jun 21, 2021 14:19
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Paracaidas posted:I think so? I just started their current campaign last night and had to turn it off because I was trying to focus on it instead of fading off to sleep, the highest compliment I can give any podcast. Partizan season from Friends at the Table. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IXqCIchzOfg It's not 5e, but Beam Saber(and Kingdom for a mini arc) https://friendsatthetable.net/partizan-00-the-divine-principality is their Session 0, if you want to start just right into it https://friendsatthetable.net/the-seaside-town-of-obelle-pt-1 This is the episode 1 Dexo fucked around with this message at 14:25 on Jun 21, 2021 |
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Jun 21, 2021 14:20
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OmniBeer posted:NADDPOD is great, as mentioned. You can also get all the Dimension 20 stuff by supporting the College Humor YouTube channel for cash if, like myself, you prefer to stick to just YouTube rather than mess around with Dropout.
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Jun 21, 2021 17:53
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bagrada posted:That could actually be interesting. A monastic order leaving their retreat to save the world but no one believes them or has heard of them. A skilled warrior monk. A scholastic mage monk. A devout priest monk. A stealthy ninja monk. An angry barbarian monk constantly struggling with their rage. A one with nature druidic monk. A Zen archer type monk. Speaking of NADDPod, they recently ran a short campaign adjacent to the main campaign after one of the three normal players went on a leave of absence for a short while because his wife had just given birth to their first child. Lou Wilson of Dimension 20 stepped in to take the missing player's place as the third player for those weeks and the cast all played monks of various kinds on a 4 or 5 episode campaign that was taking place in a different part of the Empire, doing stuff that sets up or impacts elements of the main campaign going forward. They each played a different kind of monk, so Lou was a more straight forward damage dealing monk but some ranged capacity through a bow (way of the kensei monk), Jake had a little bit of healing and a bit more utility but was also a straight monk (way of mercy) and Emily played a mixed monk (way of the ascendant dragon)/peace cleric to give some actual healing capability to the team. The cast obviously had a blast playing the small campaign, and it was popular enough they've stated they want to revisit the characters again at some point in the future. Despite all nominally playing monks and having the same base abilities they never felt all that similar either, at least partially because they played them all so differently. Jake played his character as a really laidback bayou guy who gave cryptic advice that was all empty soundbites but sounded profound if you didn't think about it (he modeled him on some Hollywood celebrity or other; can't remember who), Emily played a gullible hippie-ish monk who wanted to leave fighting behind but had anger issues in the past and is kind of being drawn back towards them despite herself and Lou played a guy who just loving loved his job and kicking the poo poo out of people, and his exuberance as a character infected the other players and got them pumped up for poo poo the whole time. It's a lot of fun if you want a short campaign to get a feel for the podcast.
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Jun 21, 2021 23:49
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Beef Jerky Robot posted:NADDPOD did an episode called Can They Kill It? that was like this. They’re a lot sillier than CR but I think it would still be fun. Antitonic posted:D&D Is For Nerds from Sanspants Radio. DeathSandwich posted:Check out Dimension 20s stuff. OmniBeer posted:NADDPOD is great, as mentioned. Dexo posted:Partizan season from Friends at the Table. Thank you, everyone! Consolidating as a helpful bookmark. As immediately sold on Eldermourne by the cast as I was by Grog's confidence they rely on his intellect and expertise in shapes and colors, so I'll get up live to NADDPOD and then find something new from the above. A silver lining for the commute. Really enjoying the atmospheric sound in (I assume) post. Get why it doesn't work with a livestream but really takes advantage of the pod medium.
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Jun 22, 2021 02:08
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Also check out Rusty Quill Gaming which uses Pathfinder but still fun to listen to. The DM is a monster and a psychopath but We Respect His Craft
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Jun 22, 2021 02:39
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DarklyDreaming posted:Also check out Rusty Quill Gaming which uses Pathfinder but still fun to listen to. The DM is a monster and a psychopath but We Respect His Craft See, that's what I love about Dimension 20. Less so on the combat encounter stuff, but Brennan can do legit horrifying roleplay scenarios. Spoilers for Fantasy High Season 2, but this gives an excellent example of him creating a whole character arc out of a throw-off insecure lie: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUK4wBljqdo
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Jun 22, 2021 03:29
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DeathSandwich posted:See, that's what I love about Dimension 20. Less so on the combat encounter stuff, but Brennan can do legit horrifying roleplay scenarios. I knew that's what that link was heading to before I even clicked it. Imagine being on the ball enough to take one off-hand line by a player and developing it into that. That's some quality DMing. 
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Jun 22, 2021 03:59
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Gustav agreeing with a literal devil to feed it the infirm, elderly and disabled to save his circus is being interpreted by a few fans as Matt Mercer being ableist. I found this out, and now all of you have to suffer more fandom crap, too.
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Jun 22, 2021 07:31
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Yeah I feel like Matt's description of "the audience" in the VM x M9 fight isn't too far off from the truth sometimes
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Jun 22, 2021 07:50
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DeathSandwich posted:Check out Dimension 20s stuff. Everything I've listened to from them has been amazing. Matt Mercer is in their Escape from Bloodkeep miniseries and both Matt and Marisha are in Pirates of Leviathan series from them so it is a good way to ease into Brennan Lee Mulligan's DM style while still having familiar faces present. I started on Dimension 20 last week, Blood Keep is just a rip roaring fun. Had a go at Fantasy High as well - I found it harder to get into but then Bud Cubby happened and I was completely onboard. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnzFfJUteTo EDIT: For context, their party committed multiple felonies in front of a family of Halflings My GM has, on many occasions, roleplayed out arrests because some of our group has trouble understanding that actions have consequences... but each time has been comedy gold to a point where we're almost eager to derail the campaign for more hi-jinks. The above linked video felt like a clever way to get around having the party arrested early on in the story, and introduced a great NPC that showed up to cook bacon later. Rougey fucked around with this message at 12:29 on Jun 22, 2021 |
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Jun 22, 2021 12:18
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I think that fight was largely decided based on relative HP pools. The lowest CON on anyone in the Mighty Nein was 14, which is the same as the the highest CON modifier of anyone in VM. The total difference in HP was +155 for the M9. The M9's most fragile character HP wise was Beau with 127 HP, and the toughest character on VM's side was Scanlan with 129 HP. It was just too much HP for VM to overcome. They whittled Fjord down to 1, but Jester had like 100 HP and Beau still had 78 by the time everyone else in VM was dead. And that's not counting Molly who was also essentially at full. M9 still had a collective 196 HP remaining - not counting Molly's 145. Nemo2342 posted:I'm so glad they've changed the entire campaign world because they wanted to make a robot friend. Making that friend also got them directions to where Lucian was going, and also unlocked the door to the time gem they used for the instant long rest.
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Jun 22, 2021 13:38
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