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verbal enema
May 23, 2009

onlymarfans.com
What determines secrects?

I was a Norse king well known for his faith and somehow a vassal released my secret that i was a non believer? I didn't have cynical i constantly did pious acts (murdering Catholics and raiding their churches) so what? I didn't even know i was a non believer!!

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Technowolf
Nov 4, 2009




verbal enema posted:

What determines secrects?

I was a Norse king well known for his faith and somehow a vassal released my secret that i was a non believer? I didn't have cynical i constantly did pious acts (murdering Catholics and raiding their churches) so what? I didn't even know i was a non believer!!

Maybe your heart wasn't really in it

E: there's also a way to generate fake secrets

verbal enema
May 23, 2009

onlymarfans.com

Technowolf posted:

Maybe your heart wasn't really in it

E: there's also a way to generate fake secrets

That bastard!!! I'll have him killed!

M_Gargantua
Oct 16, 2006

STOMP'N ON INTO THE POWERLINES

Exciting Lemon
I keep having my rulers decide that they're secretly witches (Secret from me the player as well!) and constantly inviting more of the house into witchcraft.

Its great when they do this and I am also the head of faith, and get a pop up saying that i've been discovering teaching one of my kids witchcraft. Makes no sense at all.

Punkinhead
Apr 2, 2015

M_Gargantua posted:

I keep having my rulers decide that they're secretly witches (Secret from me the player as well!) and constantly inviting more of the house into witchcraft.

Its great when they do this and I am also the head of faith, and get a pop up saying that i've been discovering teaching one of my kids witchcraft. Makes no sense at all.

Similarly I hate when my character dies and I switch to my heir and he's apparently spent his life loving everything up by cheating on his wife with his daughter and plotting to murder his liege while practicing witchcraft or whatever.

dead gay comedy forums
Oct 21, 2011


so I started playing it and man what an improvement from ck2 holy poo poo

some tips and instructions I was checking out were fairly old at this point, lol. anyway, some questions:

-- any very cool count level starts? I like working out from tiny territories

-- armored footmen are really that amazing?

-- is intrigue op as gently caress as it was a year ago? in fact, what are some great intrigue strategies? I am the spymaster of scotland and I am trying to come up with something interesting to do about that

-- and how do I make money? CK's economy is the only one from paradox that I consistently have trouble with for some reason, I can't hack a good early strategy about it

edit: thanks in advance :)

The Cheshire Cat
Jun 10, 2008

Fun Shoe

dead gay comedy forums posted:

so I started playing it and man what an improvement from ck2 holy poo poo

some tips and instructions I was checking out were fairly old at this point, lol. anyway, some questions:

-- any very cool count level starts? I like working out from tiny territories

-- armored footmen are really that amazing?

-- is intrigue op as gently caress as it was a year ago? in fact, what are some great intrigue strategies? I am the spymaster of scotland and I am trying to come up with something interesting to do about that

-- and how do I make money? CK's economy is the only one from paradox that I consistently have trouble with for some reason, I can't hack a good early strategy about it

edit: thanks in advance :)

For making money, the trick is to try to keep as many of your vassals directly under you as possible - the cut for vassals of vassals is so small as to effectively not exist. So you should only consolidate vassals if you are rubbing up against the limit. Otherwise, for quick cash infusions, prisoner ransoms are still the main way to do it. If you get prompts to imprison a vassal and doing so would not plunge you into a huge civil war, you pretty much always want to arrest and then immediately ransom them for a bunch of free cash (assuming they can afford it).

Punkinhead
Apr 2, 2015

dead gay comedy forums posted:

-- any very cool count level starts? I like working out from tiny territories

Daurama in the 867 start is pretty intense. You're the wife of a man from Iraq who seeks to end your cultures matriarchal system of government and you can either let him or the much cooler option of not letting him do that.

zoux
Apr 28, 2006

Haraldr Tanglehair in Vestfold 867 is great, he even has a special mission to become the first king of Norway, with a special nickname and everything!

The Cheshire Cat posted:

For making money, the trick is to try to keep as many of your vassals directly under you as possible - the cut for vassals of vassals is so small as to effectively not exist. So you should only consolidate vassals if you are rubbing up against the limit. Otherwise, for quick cash infusions, prisoner ransoms are still the main way to do it. If you get prompts to imprison a vassal and doing so would not plunge you into a huge civil war, you pretty much always want to arrest and then immediately ransom them for a bunch of free cash (assuming they can afford it).

Also, to get started, Golden Obligations, the first perk in the left stewardship tree, lets you basically sell hooks back to the people you got them from, so combining that with Find Secrets can lead to a lot of money. A lot of virtuous traits will penalize stress for blackmail or demanding payment, however, so keep an eye on that.

zoux fucked around with this message at 23:33 on Aug 17, 2021

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

:geno: Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

dead gay comedy forums posted:

so I started playing it and man what an improvement from ck2 holy poo poo

some tips and instructions I was checking out were fairly old at this point, lol. anyway, some questions:

-- any very cool count level starts? I like working out from tiny territories

-- armored footmen are really that amazing?

-- is intrigue op as gently caress as it was a year ago? in fact, what are some great intrigue strategies? I am the spymaster of scotland and I am trying to come up with something interesting to do about that

-- and how do I make money? CK's economy is the only one from paradox that I consistently have trouble with for some reason, I can't hack a good early strategy about it

edit: thanks in advance :)

For count starts, I quite like either of the Angevin brothers (in Anjou and Touraine, 1066); Geoffrey is safer, Foulques is the better character and historical progenitor of the English Angevins. The last Karling is kicking around in Northwestern France as well. There's also Frederick Hohenstaufen (who I think has two counties) in SE Swabia. I also had a very fun game with one of the lesser Seljuks; started with one county out in Afghanistan or something, and then migrated my way into Anatolia to do Rum things.

Armored Footmen aren't amazing as much as they are just generally good, and they lack serious weaknesses. Your amazing MaA are Armored Horsemen and Horse Archers.

Can't offer much of an opinion on intrigue, I rarely use it.

As for money, capturing people in battle and ransoming them is great (allies' wars are great for this). Raid if you're tribal. Use your Spymaster to discover secrets in the Roman Empire and blackmail those people, then get them to pay it off with the Golden Obligations perk. Long term you want to invest in the income buildings in your holdings, and if you're Theocratic, make sure you there's lots of temples in your realm, ideally with all-income buildings. Find reasons to imprison your Suffragen Bishops and then banish them (which gives you the fat stacks of cash they accumulate).

dead gay comedy forums
Oct 21, 2011


thanks for the tips everyone :)

also, I remembered one: count of Vermandois, last Carling standing?

scaterry
Sep 12, 2012
No one brought up today's dev diary, eh? https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/developer-diary/dev-diary-69-nice-throne-room-artifacts.1487491/

3D artifacts are very cool and swell, but I want that duck coa banner in my game asap

verbal enema
May 23, 2009

onlymarfans.com

scaterry posted:

No one brought up today's dev diary, eh? https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/developer-diary/dev-diary-69-nice-throne-room-artifacts.1487491/

3D artifacts are very cool and swell, but I want that duck coa banner in my game asap

dude gently caress yes

M_Gargantua
Oct 16, 2006

STOMP'N ON INTO THE POWERLINES

Exciting Lemon
I think I won? Hadn't ever tried this before: Game rules were random religions and unlimited diplomatic range, so it was essentially a free for all chaos start. Might work well in a multiplayer game where you want everything to remain chaotic into the 1200's. As it was the religious infighting meant that there were an excessive amount of independent counts and dukes to gobble up. Declared my own militant religion early with Communion as a tenant, which gives me something like an additional ~500 gold a month to fuel the war machine marching ever westward. The recent uptick in gold income was switching many of my royal vassals to Scutage/High/Low for their contracts as my MaA are enough to handle everything except opposing kings and I don't need many levies. Pretty much every kid has gotten a dutchy though the years. A few got kingdoms. The insane renown income and the fact that everybody is related means I can mash "End Dynasty Wars" to make sure everything remains stable and paying taxes.

M_Gargantua fucked around with this message at 03:48 on Aug 18, 2021

M_Gargantua
Oct 16, 2006

STOMP'N ON INTO THE POWERLINES

Exciting Lemon
One other oddity I noticed in this game: By abusing the religious income I can easily pay for barony buildings. But I've found that by filling all my vassal holdings with income buildings rather than military building's its substantially reduced any risk of revolt, and makes any revolts that do happen easy to put down. You only need to put down the first level of the building to lock the slot, which is cheap even in a regular game.

So everybody winds up on a High Tax Scutage contract with the majority of their holdings with Farm/Pasture/Guilt/Port/etc with all their excellent tax income going to me and almost no military power.

KingKapalone
Dec 20, 2005
1/16 Native American + 1/2 Hungarian = Totally Badass
I'm in my second game and I've been playing this one much more than the first, but I still don't know what to do about succession. It just throws the whole plan out the window. I did the start where you are in Novogrod and I became king of that plus the kingdom to the east of it. I died so the kingdoms were split. I killed my brother so I got that kingdom back, but the next time I died there were too many heirs in the way so I left it.

Then I got the kingdom to the north, but died. I tried to kill the no-heir child brother to get it but failed. I guess it's ok to split them up, but how will I ever get to make the Empire of Russia? Also since things keep splitting, I only have two counties so my income is just poo poo. None of my vassals like me either. I'm always just scraping by on the various resources.

Wafflecopper
Nov 27, 2004

I am a mouth, and I must scream

KingKapalone posted:

I guess it's ok to split them up, but how will I ever get to make the Empire of Russia?

You get claims on the other titles after succession, if you can beat them in a war you can get them back.

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

:geno: Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

KingKapalone posted:

I'm in my second game and I've been playing this one much more than the first, but I still don't know what to do about succession. It just throws the whole plan out the window. I did the start where you are in Novogrod and I became king of that plus the kingdom to the east of it. I died so the kingdoms were split. I killed my brother so I got that kingdom back, but the next time I died there were too many heirs in the way so I left it.

Then I got the kingdom to the north, but died. I tried to kill the no-heir child brother to get it but failed. I guess it's ok to split them up, but how will I ever get to make the Empire of Russia? Also since things keep splitting, I only have two counties so my income is just poo poo. None of my vassals like me either. I'm always just scraping by on the various resources.

You get claims on top level titles that get separated from your inheritance, so you can just go conquer them back. Your kids inherit that claim too; they'll be weak claims, but you can press them in war, and as long as you don't get forced into a surrender, they'll become pressed and inheritable again. Murdering people to inherit their poo poo is overrated IMO. You can also gain claims (for your children) to things by marrying the children of the current holder; so let's say you marry the daughter of the King of Vladimir - any child born of that union will eventually inherit a claim to the Kingdom of Vladimir, and once you are playing as one of those kids, you can go conquer it.

Don't be afraid to migrate around creating the constituent Kingdoms and jamming Rurikids onto them; once the kingdoms exist it'll be way easier to assemble the Empire title. Your true goal should be Kiev anyway, it's by far the best county around to keep as your capital.

As for your counties, if you don't have enough, revoke some of your vassal's counties and take theirs! And as a Tribal it's not so much your income that matters, cash is really only useful to you for hiring mercs; what you want is Prestige. Luckily you can gain both cash and prestige by Raiding! You should be doing it whenever possible.

KingKapalone
Dec 20, 2005
1/16 Native American + 1/2 Hungarian = Totally Badass
Won't revoking their titles make me a tyrant and maybe make them rise up against me? They already all hate me.

Dwesa
Jul 19, 2016

scaterry posted:

No one brought up today's dev diary, eh? https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/developer-diary/dev-diary-69-nice-throne-room-artifacts.1487491/

3D artifacts are very cool and swell, but I want that duck coa banner in my game asap
These are seriously beautiful, not some generic 'medieval' crap.

The Cheshire Cat
Jun 10, 2008

Fun Shoe

KingKapalone posted:

Won't revoking their titles make me a tyrant and maybe make them rise up against me? They already all hate me.

The thing about tyranny is to think of it like a currency to be managed rather than something to avoid at all costs (similar to stress). A little bit of tyranny won't really make much of a difference and is worth taking if it means a more stable realm. However, if they do all already hate you, then it is probably best to hold off unless the chance for acceptance is 100%, because if they refuse and declare war on you, all the vassals that hate you will also join in as an ally on their side.

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

:geno: Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

KingKapalone posted:

Won't revoking their titles make me a tyrant and maybe make them rise up against me? They already all hate me.

I mean if they all hate you already then what is a little tyranny going to mean? But yeah be prepared to fight the lot of them.

Elias_Maluco
Aug 23, 2007
I need to sleep
When you can wait, wait until you are old to do all things that give tyranny

By than you will be more loved (even if its just for the long reign bonus) and also the tyranny wont matter much because soon you will be dead

Arcvasti
Jun 12, 2019

Never trust a bird.

Elias_Maluco posted:

By than you will be more loved (even if its just for the long reign bonus) and also the tyranny wont matter much because soon you will be dead

There is some kind of "Child of a Tyrant" opinion modifier for your kid so it isn't entirely free, but yeah it can be nice to start your heir's reign with some key vassals in jail or landless.

Elias_Maluco
Aug 23, 2007
I need to sleep
Never saw that

Im my current game there was an occasion that I arrested my daughter and heir without good reason and than executed her (cause I wanted her daughter to inherit) and still never got that (but even after that, I still had +100 relations with almost all my vassals, so maybe is related )

The Cheshire Cat
Jun 10, 2008

Fun Shoe

Elias_Maluco posted:

Never saw that

Im my current game there was an occasion that I arrested my daughter and heir without good reason and than executed her (cause I wanted her daughter to inherit) and still never got that (but even after that, I still had +100 relations with almost all my vassals, so maybe is related )

I think it's a thing where what you get is a lingering percentage of the opinion bonuses of the previous ruler, so if you still have a net positive opinion with your vassals after doing something tyrannical it won't affect the children, it's only if you incur so much tyranny that it plunges the parent into the negative. It's mostly to discourage people from gaming the system by doing a bunch of stuff just before a character dies and then getting the slate wiped totally clean.

Elias_Maluco
Aug 23, 2007
I need to sleep

The Cheshire Cat posted:

I think it's a thing where what you get is a lingering percentage of the opinion bonuses of the previous ruler, so if you still have a net positive opinion with your vassals after doing something tyrannical it won't affect the children, it's only if you incur so much tyranny that it plunges the parent into the negative. It's mostly to discourage people from gaming the system by doing a bunch of stuff just before a character dies and then getting the slate wiped totally clean.

Ah makes sense. I often do some things like that when Im about to die, but I never go that far

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

:geno: Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

The Cheshire Cat posted:

I think it's a thing where what you get is a lingering percentage of the opinion bonuses of the previous ruler, so if you still have a net positive opinion with your vassals after doing something tyrannical it won't affect the children, it's only if you incur so much tyranny that it plunges the parent into the negative. It's mostly to discourage people from gaming the system by doing a bunch of stuff just before a character dies and then getting the slate wiped totally clean.

It's exactly this, if your vassals hate you upon death it transfers to your heir as a Negative Opinion of Predecessor or something like that. Decays pretty rapidly but all but guarantees a rebellion upon succession.

Elias_Maluco
Aug 23, 2007
I need to sleep

PittTheElder posted:

It's exactly this, if your vassals hate you upon death it transfers to your heir as a Negative Opinion of Predecessor or something like that. Decays pretty rapidly but all but guarantees a rebellion upon succession.

Yeah, just like there is a positive Opinion of Predecessor too, which is also a reason to not go too far in tyranny before dying because it helps a lot not getting hosed after you inherit

zoux
Apr 28, 2006

PittTheElder posted:

It's exactly this, if your vassals hate you upon death it transfers to your heir as a Negative Opinion of Predecessor or something like that. Decays pretty rapidly but all but guarantees a rebellion upon succession.

That's when it helps to have a prison full of off-faith inmates to mass execute.

dead gay comedy forums
Oct 21, 2011


so the byzantine empire is a cool place for high intrigue and fantasy supergenetics cool adventures

been trying to figure a neat spot to start that is not too close to pissing off the emperor neither too vulnerable to the seljuks, any tips? tia!

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

:geno: Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

My man I have two words for you: Alexios. Komnenos.

Arbite
Nov 4, 2009





Babby Alexios in Boukellarion.

Try to become emperor before you're 20.

*edit*

PittTheElder posted:

My man I have two words for you: Alexios. Komnenos.

Great minds.

dead gay comedy forums
Oct 21, 2011


PittTheElder posted:

My man I have two words for you: Alexios. Komnenos.

oh poo poo that's it time to do an alexiad

Quorum
Sep 24, 2014

REMIND ME AGAIN HOW THE LITTLE HORSE-SHAPED ONES MOVE?
I only wish Alexios was dynasty head, it sucks to lack those buttons or else form a cadet house and lose the name and cool coat of arms. :(

Arbite
Nov 4, 2009





Quorum posted:

I only wish Alexios was dynasty head, it sucks to lack those buttons or else form a cadet house and lose the name and cool coat of arms. :(

Unless you're doing iron man just console kill 'em. Or if you are, intrigue kill 'em.

pidan
Nov 6, 2012


Playing a wrathful guy for the first time. Can't imprison my rear end in a top hat vassal brother, but can "punish criminal" him, which the tooltip says will imprison him on a win. So I fight him, and afterwards he's dead? And it says I executed him? Now I'm a kinslayer and everyone likes me slightly less. Thanks, tooltip.

Also I wanted to put my relative on the English throne and now he's my vassal. Is it better to make him independent?

PancakeTransmission
May 27, 2007

You gotta improvise, Lisa: cloves, Tom Collins mix, frozen pie crust...


Plaster Town Cop

pidan posted:

Playing a wrathful guy for the first time. Can't imprison my rear end in a top hat vassal brother, but can "punish criminal" him, which the tooltip says will imprison him on a win. So I fight him, and afterwards he's dead? And it says I executed him? Now I'm a kinslayer and everyone likes me slightly less. Thanks, tooltip.

You probs didn't read the fight options, generally there will be one to accept their yield if you win and another to kill em anyway.

pidan
Nov 6, 2012


PancakeTransmission posted:

You probs didn't read the fight options, generally there will be one to accept their yield if you win and another to kill em anyway.

I did read them, and I'm reasonably sure I didn't click any "kill that guy" buttons. But I did choose a bunch of options that "increased risk of injury" to him, so maybe he died from that and it counted? Still not what I expected to happen.

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Tippis
Mar 21, 2008

It's yet another day in the wasteland.

PancakeTransmission posted:

You probs didn't read the fight options, generally there will be one to accept their yield if you win and another to kill em anyway.

I don't remember if it carried over from CK2 or if they made it more controllable, but I seem to remember situations where you'd just be good (or lucky) enough that the other guy simply automatically dies, so as to put some gamble and risk into exactly that kind of situation.

pidan posted:

I did read them, and I'm reasonably sure I didn't click any "kill that guy" buttons. But I did choose a bunch of options that "increased risk of injury" to him, so maybe he died from that and it counted? Still not what I expected to happen.

It could just have been a case of the guy simply running out of health from a combination of weaknesses and wounds. Even if not intentional, the combination was just enough.

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