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JustJeff88 posted:I'm mostly sure that the reason that the Mind Flayer did 82 damage to that one female characters (one more hit point than her maximum) is to simulate what flayers do in pen & paper, which is to paralyse with their cone of mind blast and then eat the brain of their helpless victim. This latter attack is, naturally, quite fatal. ed: New update on previous page!
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Aug 29, 2021 00:00
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I hate the mind flayers in the EOB series. RANGED,INVISIBLE, SILENT PARALYSIS. 8 YO me had a lot of trouble at this point
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Aug 29, 2021 00:13
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dervinosdoom posted:I hate the mind flayers in the EOB series. RANGED,INVISIBLE, SILENT PARALYSIS. I don't remember how old I was, but I had problems too, even with a full party of 6. One issues is that there is not way to proactively prevent paralysis, only cure it, so if the cleric is paralysed then there is no way to get rid of it.
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Aug 29, 2021 00:17
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JustJeff88 posted:I don't remember how old I was, but I had problems too, even with a full party of 6. One issues is that there is not way to proactively prevent paralysis, only cure it, so if the cleric is paralysed then there is no way to get rid of it. Eh, terminating the flayer with extreme prejudice before he can act counts as "proactive prevention" in my book.
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Aug 29, 2021 00:21
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The damage in that shot wouldn't quite be fatal even if she didn't have an Aid spell on her. Characters become unconscious at 0 HP and die at -10. The screenshot was the reault of reloading experimentation to see the highest numbers. On Anya, they ranged from the 40s to 70s before that one. When Beohram was hit, it was usually from the 30s to 50s. That's what made me think it might be percentage based.
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Aug 29, 2021 00:28
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Alpha3KV posted:
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Aug 29, 2021 05:54
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tyrra has always seemed to be a bit prickly. I like how it's reflected in her charisma statl
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Aug 29, 2021 06:58
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 I do vaguely recall the happy fun stun blasts but i did not have any memory of taking those kinds of damage in here. loving illithids 
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Aug 29, 2021 13:21
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achtungnight posted:I once had a character who challenged every Thri-Kreen he met to a kung fu duel. Not sure he ever met one who knew what he was talking about. Let me guess, Mantis Style?
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Aug 29, 2021 19:22
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EOTB 10: End of the Beholder We return to the dwarves on level 5 and give them the potion. Voiced version here.   Here's what we're given:  Wand of Slivias? Excuse me, it was supposed to be the Wand of Silvias. Bunch of scam artists here. As with any other wand, only a mage can use it. We can also take care of that right now by reviving Kirath.  Here are his stats and initial spell list:  Two standouts among his spells. Burning Hands causes damage to enemies in front of you, which increases with the caster's level. It is notable mainly because it has no scrolls, so recruiting Kirath is the only way to cast it in this game. Stoneskin is an incredible buff. It nullifies a certain number of physical attacks, dependent on the caster's level (1d4+3 at level 7). Better yet, it is not time-limited. It will stay on after rest, so you can easily cast it on the whole party. Since only a few enemies are capable of anything other than physical attacks, this essentially means nigh-invulnerability. It does not protect against spells, however. A scroll for it is also behind one of the rock doors in level 9.  I also have him scribe some of the scrolls we've collected. I cancelled out after the first screen since it was listing spells he already knew. The most useful among these is Haste, which lowers the whole party's attack cooldown. Unlike some other games, it has absolutely no drawbacks in this series. Time to make use of some of these spells.  I'm getting revenge on the dwarves for their misspelled wand bullshit. This is two of them lined up in a row near the door. That latter part is important because it gives me an escape to avoid being surrounded. Nothing other than the party can open doors, not even the humanoids who built these places.  Kirath is not a high enough level to cast Cone of Cold, but I have four Wands of Frost. Here's a nice property of the spell: It can be cast through partially open doors. Any other spell would just hit the door, and the party if that spell was Fireball or Ice Storm. With this you can use it to kill enemies before they have a chance to reach you.  I use Hold Person on these stragglers and show what Burning Hands looks like.  The way into level 12 is a portal behind a locked door in the southwest room of level 11. There are two xorns in the room and a mind flayer behind the door, so you can encounter both enemies in the same place.  Level 12 starts in a closed square room with no visible door. These things found around the level are fireball launchers, though this one seems to be inactive.  The way out of the starting room is clicking this lamp to remove the wall behind it.  When you do, you see this message on a wall. In the next room, accessed by a normal door, is another sign saying "You were warned."  That room has a door to the west and this pixel-hunt button that removes the wall to the north.  Taking that path disables a fireball launcher and allows us to get the drop on this level's main enemy type, the stone golem. These are weaker versions made by shortcuts, and they can be hit by non-magical weapons. Spells don't seem to work against them, though. There are four in this room, one of which drops a skull key.  To the north we find where they are made. Two other pedestals are labeled "Stone for substance." and "Potion for strength." Anything besides the Dwarven Healing Potion will work, including Potions of Poison. When each pedestal has the appropriate item, pressing the button on the right will create a hostile stone golem. The only reason to do this is getting some additional experience.  In the south there's another room with three pedestals. The middle one has another skull key. The outer two have Potions of Extra Healing and useless jewelry, but will steal small items from you if you take them. It's best just to ignore them.  This locked door is unique because it will close and re-lock itself when you come back out.  It leads here, with three golems in a corridor at the end. However, they don't come for you until you cross between the two pedestals, unless the whole party is invisible. You can also just pelt them with projectiles from here and never face retaliation. The shelves contain Potions of Invisibility and Vitality, which bring a character's hunger meter to full.  Level 12 is split into three isolated sections: west (where we started), central, and east. Each one has a room arranged like this. Two of the buttons will warp you to one of the other rooms, and the third will push you into the east wall, where you can go forward into another room or back where you came from.  The east section has a different room with three buttons. The outer ones create shelves with items: an Orb of Power to the south, a Potion of Speed to the north. The middle one launches two fireballs that turn onto its location.  North from there you can find a Wand of Magic Missiles between two locked doors.  The northwestern room of this section has a pedestal with three Orbs of Power. They can be used in the central section.  There we find this room at the end of a long hallway. Put an Orb of Power on each outer pedestal to remove the large eyeball. Put another orb there to remove all three pedestals. The orbs will return to the pedestal they came from. The room behind this has two doors that only open from the inside, connecting to that room with the orb pedestal and the golem factory. With the three sections connected, it's time to go back east and finally confront the titular beholder, Xanathar.   Beholders are extremely terrifying monsters that can very literally kill you just by looking at you and are immune to magic. Taking him on in a fight could be a very deadly mistake, so I do the sensible thing and surrender.  Your characters drop everything in their hands if you do that.  drat, who could have guessed the villain was untrustworthy? Xanathar has two "insta-kill" abilities, the death spell and disintegration, that do exactly 100 damage. As you can see here, death doesn't happen at 0 HP, but -10. From 0 to -9, a character is unconscious: not able to do anything, but can still be healed back into action. Anya would survive this. In this case, Ileria is not a high enough level to cast Raise Dead, and I forgot to take any of its scrolls along. Oops. Luckily, the Wand of Inconsistent Spelling is still in Kirath's inventory. What it does is push Xanathar back. This is important because he stupidly put a deathtrap that he is vulnerable to right in his own quarters.  You have to get him through a corridor first, which reveals another mistake I made: neglecting invisibility. The beam launches a fireball from the north, but is not broken if the whole party is invisible. Granted, invisibility is no help against Xanathar himself, who follows this up with his own more powerful fireball that kills Kirath. I'll have to go back for my weapons and do this the old-fashioned way.  This is going pretty badly. Discretion is the better part of valor, so Ileria flees the battle and drags the barely-alive Tod Uphill with her. Obviously, when your last party member gets killed, that's a game over. But if you drop the last survivor, that last kill never happens. That means you can keep playing even with your entire party dead. In this state, while unable to attack or cast spells, you can still pick up items and throw them to damage enemies. I could kill Xanathar that way, but I'm not letting a perfectly good deathtrap go to waste.  That conspicuous bloodstain marks its location. The shelf behind it contains one of each stone portal key. Since I'm no longer able to push him back, I make him follow me instead. Protip: that's a better way of doing it even if you're keeping your characters alive and not using ridiculous exploits. To actually get him in there, I'll have to use the A.I. of the Beholder to my advantage. When an enemy is at your front-left position, it will move ahead to flank you. But if you move forward at the same time, the monster will keep going in the same direction. This also works with groups of four staying in formation.  It took a few tries to do this since he often turns around at the last tile. It seems to work most reliably when you follow him closely but don't bump into him.  When this happens, the special quest sound will play. I'm not entirely sure if specifically for getting him into his own trap, or just killing him by any means. In any case, we have achieved (pyrrhic) victory!  In the DOS version, the ending sequence is an anticlimactic text dump.  Completing all special quests gets you this as well before abruptly kicking you back to DOS. I have no idea where the password is used. Videos My absurd strategy in motion. The Amiga ending, in which the Lords of Waterdeep act like pricks. Sega CD endings with unused voice lines added. Alpha3KV fucked around with this message at 19:10 on Mar 8, 2022 |
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Sep 5, 2021 22:46
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No, you can't kill me, you have to kill one more party member and my whole party is dead neener-neener. That's a pretty big exploit. Is it carried through to the latter games in the series?
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Sep 5, 2021 23:02
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I love that exploit, it owns. Are there enough tossable items to theoretically clear the whole game in this state?
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Sep 5, 2021 23:09
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I had no idea you could do that, but also i am not surprised that you can. Video games!! I take it that's the party for the start of EotB2 then? Bit surprised it's three fighters and no cleric in that case but am i misremembering in thinking you can pick up a cleric/mage pretty early there? "A.I. of the Beholder" is pretty good  I never figured out the wand myself so i just did the "run circles around and smash +5 implements against" strategy with Xanathar and it was honestly probably easier than the "intended" method. Less room for death spells that way. Also my dude should probably wait until he's at least in the double-digit levels and more than 5 minutes out of being dead before making claims like that...
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Sep 5, 2021 23:41
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PurpleXVI posted:I love that exploit, it owns. Are there enough tossable items to theoretically clear the whole game in this state? Any item can be thrown, which will do at least a little damage if it hits a monster. So yes. Doing this requires more than four party members, so you could potentially do this from level 4 onwards. OneWingedDevil posted:That's a pretty big exploit. Is it carried through to the latter games in the series? As far as I'm aware, it was fixed in the sequels. I'll test it when I start the next game. vilkacis posted:I take it that's the party for the start of EotB2 then? Not necessarily. There's no autosave after killing Xanathar, so the import will use the one from right before. I'll make a poll to go with the EOB2 intro post to decide which four move on, though I'll probably make the spellcasters required.
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Sep 6, 2021 00:01
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Alpha3KV posted:I'll have to use the A.I. of the Beholder  Clever, but still. vilkacis posted:spoiler
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Sep 6, 2021 00:29
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Congratulations. One game down, two remaining. The next is probably the one I played the most back when I had these games.
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Sep 6, 2021 00:57
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Alpha3KV posted:Not necessarily. There's no autosave after killing Xanathar, so the import will use the one from right before. I'll make a poll to go with the EOB2 intro post to decide which four move on, though I'll probably make the spellcasters required. I was thinking you might want to go for narrative continuity, but i'm definitely going to vote to keep our strong, dumb girl Anya around in that case 
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Sep 6, 2021 01:09
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Alpha3KV posted:drat, who could have guessed the villain was untrustworthy? Xanathar has two "insta-kill" abilities that do exactly 100 damage. As you can see here, death doesn't happen at 0 HP, but -10. From 0 to -9, a character is unconscious: not able to do anything, but can still be healed back into action. As someone whose first AD&D games (and CRPGs in general I suppose) were Goldbox games, this irritated me a lot the first time I played Baldur's Gate. I was used to games with fragile characters and less than fair encounter designs, but the whole "gotta reload or drag your character to a temple (after leaving or awkwardly packratting their inventory) if somebody loses all HP" always seemed extra harsh even in the context of early edition D&D.
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Sep 9, 2021 11:13
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Bonus Update: Extras of the Beholder Before moving on to the second game, I'll be showing a few more things from the first. I played through the Sega CD version to record videos, so I'll detail a few of its other unique features.  One of the first things is a different portrait selection. Many of them are very anime, and show up in other Capcom-developed versions of the game. This version supports multiple save files and has background music. It also has a default party, with characters creatively named Fighter, Thief, Mage, and Cleric.  This is also the only version with in-game maps. These aren't automaps, but items which look like scrolls on the ground. Trying to pick them up immediately puts them into a special map slot, where they don't take up space and can be accessed from any character's inventory screen. Green squares indicate doors, and blue ones represent movable or illusory walls. Squares that are red or yellow (which can be hard to see on this background) indicate stairs/ladders, but have no consistency about which direction they go. The white square, which flashes, is the party's current location. Any map can be seen from any level. If you look at a level you have no map for, the only feature (aside from the party marker if you're there) will be a flashing red square showing its location.  Maps are also one of the things tracked on the screen after the credits. "Quest" got changed into "search" by the translation into and back from Japanese. For some reason arrows are the other thing reported here. This playthrough set out to get all the voice lines. I obviously skipped a lot of other things but didn't really rush it. How quickly can this game be beaten? The current world record on the DOS version is just under six minutes. It takes teleporters to skip large portions of levels 2 and 3, dives into a pit as a shortcut to level 5, and from there uses stone portals to immediately get to level 9.  Speaking of the DOS version, let's go back to that for a while. There's no autosave after killing Xanathar, so my last save is just before meeting him. Back to level 11.  And from there to the hub in level 7.  Using ASE's teleport feature, I show the unique graphic of the short sword I passed on for the Ring of Wizardry. I then take the portal to level 9.  In the previous update, I mentioned that Cone of Cold will go through partially-open doors. Turns out that was underselling it. A partially-open door is for all intents and purposes still closed. Here are two displacer beasts dying to a Cone of Cold from behind a locked door. Notice that other red circle in the middle of the walls. I use ASE to go there too.  It's a rust monster. Stoneskin doesn't just prevent damage from physical attacks, it also stops any other effect of the hit landing. That means poison, paralysis, or in this case, the rust monster eating items. That's good here since wands count as metal. Kirath has Vampiric Touch active.  Hitting with it brings his HP up significantly above max. Nobody has Aid cast on them here. I finish it off with the other mage melee spell, Shocking Grasp. However going into the walls wasn't necessary to do this. Closed doors are functionally the same thing as solid walls. Cone of Cold can can go through those too, as shown here:  Near the northwest corner of level 5, there's an isolated room with two spiders in it. There's normally no way in there. The pits in level 4 go to the corridor east of it. The only real indication of it is the spiders' very annoying walk sound when you're in an adjacent room. Unless you chose no sound on startup. Speaking of those options:   There's a CGA mode for those who can't get enough of magenta and cyan. The drow levels are the ones that come out looking best in this mode. This portal has no key item. The stone gem doesn't even seem to exist in the game data. The Cutting Room Floor has more details on unused things. There is an unofficial version 1.9 of this game that adds it and makes it go to an unfinished part of level 2. Since I'm not using that, I go to level 5 instead.  Levels 10 and 11 look kind of similar to the dwarf levels. Our final party is unable to translate anything, though still have a decent idea of what "pantry" is.  Other dwarf text will just give this.  Orc runes are also no longer translatable, though it still gives a good idea of what they mean. It's a gnome that specifically identifies them as such. You may have noticed that despite these runes, there are no orcs in this game. There aren't any in the sequels either. On the way here, I encountered a zombie that respawned. Ileria's turn undead instantly destroyed it.  That's enough of that. Back to the grind:  The kenku in level 6 don't just have abnormally high experience values, they also have one of the fastest spawn rates of the game's monsters. Just walking around the level can make a lot of them. There's apparently a limit, and spawning one can't be done without killing another at that point. You can get experience from them without directly engaging them or even just blasting them with Cone of Cold from behind a wall. I get everyone above 200K experience like this (they were fairly close to start) and then add 1 million with ASE. That brings everybody up one level each time XP is gained. Hit Dice are still rolled in this game after levels where that should have stopped by AD&D rules. Which ultimately leads to this:  Anya started with 45 HP at 4th level and gained 12 for each level up to the max of 11. 12x7=84+45=129, but character HP is a signed byte in this game so it wraps around to the negatives. She gets the faded unconscious portrait but is otherwise treated as dead. She gains no experience but also takes no further damage in this state, even from things like fireballs. Perhaps our strongest warrior has ascended to Valhalla. With that, now seems like a good time to move on. Alpha3KV fucked around with this message at 03:54 on May 21, 2022 |
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Sep 11, 2021 20:42
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Odd that Cone of Cold ignores closed doors. Does anything else in the game behave that way?
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Sep 11, 2021 21:03
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PurpleXVI posted:Odd that Cone of Cold ignores closed doors. Does anything else in the game behave that way? My guess here is that what it's doing is unlike most spells, rather than shooting a projectile it just has some sort of instant effect applied in the tiles ahead of you, and they likely just forgot to have it check for obstacles when doing so. I would guess that burning hands probably uses the same logic, but it only affects the tile immediately ahead of you so you wouldn't be able to hit anything beyond a door/wall with it anyway. The Cheshire Cat fucked around with this message at 21:45 on Sep 11, 2021 |
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Sep 11, 2021 21:35
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Alpha3KV posted:
I have a strong suspicion that quite a few of the eye-cancer CGA versions were meant to be displayed on a black and white monitor. Yes, I checked, EOB still looks like poo poo on b/w CGA. Better than color, but still nowhere near bearable.
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Sep 11, 2021 21:53
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Pierzak posted:I have a strong suspicion that quite a few of the eye-cancer CGA versions were meant to be displayed on a black and white monitor. The 8-Bit Guy did a video talking about CGA graphics, and depending on when the game was made, there's a decent chance it would have looked... well, not necessarily good, but certainly better. It had to do with later EGA and VGA cards dropping the video port that caused color artifacting that CGA graphics were designed to exploit. https://youtu.be/niKblgZupOc if you want to see the video in question.
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Sep 11, 2021 22:57
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The Cheshire Cat posted:My guess here is that what it's doing is unlike most spells, rather than shooting a projectile it just has some sort of instant effect applied in the tiles ahead of you, and they likely just forgot to have it check for obstacles when doing so. I would guess that burning hands probably uses the same logic, but it only affects the tile immediately ahead of you so you wouldn't be able to hit anything beyond a door/wall with it anyway. I was just about to post this very thing. Lightning Bolt, Fireball, and Magic Missile very clearly shoot a projectile that can travel quite a distance, but Cone of Cold clearly just manifests some swirly white particles in front of the party.
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Sep 12, 2021 01:16
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Alpha3KV posted:Hit Dice are still rolled in this game after levels where that should have stopped by AD&D rules. That's kind of shocking! I'd have expected them to stick as closely to the rules as possible. Does this still happen in the sequels? Or would it be ~optimal~ to grind out levels in 1 and bring your illegal HP levels into them through exports...?
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Sep 12, 2021 05:34
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vilkacis posted:That's kind of shocking! I'd have expected them to stick as closely to the rules as possible. The sequels stop rolling hit dice at the proper levels, though they both have cases of not doing the HP gain afterwards correctly. In EOB 2, multiclass characters still get the full HP gain for each class (e.g. a multiclass fighter still gets 3 HP for every fighter level after 9). EOB 3 fixes that, but in its character creation (only there, not in the game proper) constitution bonuses are applied to the HP after max hit dice.
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Sep 12, 2021 07:03
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I finally got around to rendering and uploading the higher quality version of my "battle" with Xanathar, now edited into that post: https://www.polsy.org.uk/play/yt/?vurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3D5OlPb9e-1UA
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Sep 14, 2021 17:58
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What's with that glass shutter that comes down?
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Sep 14, 2021 23:44
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Alpha3KV posted:I finally got around to rendering and uploading the higher quality version of my "battle" with Xanathar, now edited into that post: Not horribly eye-scarring cga graphics, voted 1  TapamN posted:What's with that glass shutter that comes down? It's like the inverse of this: 
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Sep 15, 2021 00:24
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I love this, where's this from?
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Sep 15, 2021 02:11
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dervinosdoom posted:I love this, where's this from? I wish i could tell you but it's really old (saved in 2012 according to file info!) and i have no idea where i got it.
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Sep 15, 2021 17:22
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 This game was released within a year of the first, built on the same engine. It doesn't have graphics and sound options at startup. Sounds can still be toggled at the in-game Preferences menu. The intro scene can be watched here. quote:You were settling in for an evening by the fire. Then a note was slipped to you. It was from your friend Khelben Blackstaff, Archmage of the city. The message was urgent. The contents of this letter are shown in the manual.  As indicated it comes with an attachment, which is twice the length of the letter.   That attachment has its own attachment, which is three pages. That's five pages of attachments to a single-page letter.    The party heads to Khelben's place.   Going by what the letter in the manual says, the party should drat well know this considering they've already agreed to his task.   The party climbs some stairs...  ...and finally meets the man himself.   Khelben posted:Ancient evil stirs in the Temple Darkmoon. I fear for the safety of our city.  Khelben posted:Three nights ago I sent forth a scout. She has not yet returned. I fear for her safety. Take this coin.  Khelben posted:I will use it to contact you. You must act quickly. I will teleport you to Darkmoon. May luck be with you my friend.  And so the next adventure begins.   I'm making the spellcasters Kirath and Ileria required. The other two will be decided by a poll.  VOTE HERE
Alpha3KV fucked around with this message at 04:27 on May 21, 2022 |
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Sep 16, 2021 23:33
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Khelben's letter looks like spam. Dear Adventurer, Claim Your Free 500 000 Gold Pieces Now... I feel like someone forgot to make sure the sender wasn't like, kheIben@notatrap.underdark and the entire party got suckered  Gonna be fun to see this one, i didn't play it nearly as much as the og. Might actually not have beaten it more than once.
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Sep 17, 2021 01:00
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Since you already have a cleric and mage, bring Tyrra because plain fighters are boring and Tod because I recall this game having a lot of locks.
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Sep 17, 2021 02:04
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JustJeff88 posted:Since you already have a cleric and mage, bring Tyrra because plain fighters are boring and Tod because I recall this game having a lot of locks. I agree on this, though I did like Anya. You said there were five manual pages accompanying Khelben's letter. I only counted 4 in your post. Did one get cut? The journal entry seemed half complete from what I could read. Either the image font was blurry or my eyes are finally starting to succumb to middle age.  Edit- I ran a search for a transcript of the manual and found what was missed. No trouble reading this, so it must have been your images. Hope you don't mind me posting this, if you do let me know and it will come down. EotB2 Manual posted:* KHELBEN'S LETTER TO THE PARTY * Here's a link to the document I found- https://www.lemonamiga.com/games/docs.php?id=590 achtungnight fucked around with this message at 03:07 on Sep 17, 2021 |
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Sep 17, 2021 02:59
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achtungnight posted:I agree on this, though I did like Anya. I posted 3 screenshots of the rulebook PDF, covering the first six pages after the ToC. They're all fairly large in both dimensions and file size, so maybe one took too long to load. They're all showing up for me. If other people are having problems with those images I'll see about splitting them up, reducing their size or just putting that text transcription in their place.
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Sep 17, 2021 03:54
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I reloaded the page and got the rest, you were right, sorry. I'll leave my transcript up as a bigger font option in case anyone needs it. edit- as I've said before, I played this game a lot back in the day. I have fond memories of it, particularly the villain. It will be interesting to see how it holds up almost 30 years later. Thanks in advance for the chance. achtungnight fucked around with this message at 04:03 on Sep 17, 2021 |
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Sep 17, 2021 03:58
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quote:JOURNAL ENTRY 420
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Sep 17, 2021 04:02
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I've always loved how, as presented within the game, your friend asks you to come see him and then, without giving you any opportunity to object or even ask any questions, teleports you into the forest. Thanks Khelben. You're a great friend.
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Sep 17, 2021 07:31
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Tiggum posted:I've always loved how, as presented within the game, your friend asks you to come see him and then, without giving you any opportunity to object or even ask any questions, teleports you into the forest. Thanks Khelben. You're a great friend. It's because if you do give the players a choice, they'll ruin and then complain that it's your fault. And since players are disposable, you can always get new ones if things go wrong, just like with the scout
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Sep 17, 2021 11:02
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