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resistentialism posted:but now that it's in my head: someone should make a puzzle roguelike game where you have to control two roguelike characters in entirely different game worlds using the same, simultaneous inputs Easy mode: it's just two copies of Rogue Hard mode: it's one copy of SLASH'EM and one of ZAngband
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Oct 6, 2021 02:19
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Easy, just pilot the SLASH'EM character into a CAPTCHA trap and park it there until you finish your ZAngband run. e: this would be a cool idea for a 7DRL if that's still a thing people do! The rogue one, not the crazy ZAngband one. GetDunked fucked around with this message at 02:27 on Oct 6, 2021 |
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Oct 6, 2021 02:24
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Me: I did it! I'm on the final day of my Armoured Commander 2 campaign and I haven't even lost a single crew member! I'm going to make it! The Game:      
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Oct 6, 2021 07:06
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Angry Diplomat posted:Makeup-based control scheme. Playing a wizard is really difficult, you have to like, contour and poo poo
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Oct 6, 2021 10:01
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in Desktop Dungeons what dictates when an enemy will deal damage in a round where I kill them (e: with an attack, not a spell)? the mechanics aren't making themselves obvious to me
Ciaphas fucked around with this message at 15:46 on Oct 6, 2021 |
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Oct 6, 2021 15:19
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Insert name here posted:Me: I did it! I'm on the final day of my Armoured Commander 2 campaign and I haven't even lost a single crew member! I'm going to make it! Lol so you survived an 88 to the face because they didn't want to waste AP on you? And then you got nailed by a piddly little 37mm? This a feeling of hilarious and tragic best summarized with the word roguelike.
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Oct 6, 2021 15:54
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Ciaphas posted:in Desktop Dungeons what dictates when an enemy will deal damage in a round where I kill them (e: with an attack, not a spell)? the mechanics aren't making themselves obvious to me If you're higher level than your opponent, you'll strike first. Any combatant with First Strike will strike first regardless of level; similarly, you'll always strike last if you have Slow Strike. In case of ties, the monster always goes first.
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Oct 6, 2021 15:57
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Arzaac posted:If you're higher level than your opponent, you'll strike first. Any combatant with First Strike will strike first regardless of level; similarly, you'll always strike last if you have Slow Strike. Aha! The level difference was the bit I missed - not sure if that was in the tutorial and I just forgot or not. Thanks! Neat game. Roguelike dungeon crawl except single screen and with regen mechanics that turn the dungeon into a puzzle? I'm down, at least until I get frustrated 
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Oct 6, 2021 16:45
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New question: How do I read the Regeneration and XP charts? Especially what the black "wasted" strips are.
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Oct 6, 2021 18:03
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Ciaphas posted:New question: Whenever you explore a tile, you heal some hp/mp, the black indicates how often that happened while you were already full. e: the red/blue indicating what wasn't wasted
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Oct 6, 2021 18:30
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I love the "For Administrative Use Only" section so much. I need to steal that idea for one of my games some day.
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Oct 6, 2021 18:46
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Pladdicus posted:Whenever you explore a tile, you heal some hp/mp, the black indicates how often that happened while you were already full. Yeah optimizing this is a pretty critical part of surviving the higher levels of the game. Even if you're clearing levels, if you see big chunks of wasted regen it's worth thinking about how you could have done it more efficiently.
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Oct 6, 2021 20:53
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So I got Arcanium and played 13 hours of it, so figure I should give a trip report on it. It's alright. It removes a lot of the decision space of typical deckbuilders like StS wherein each new card doesn't come with the consideration of deck dilution. Instead, each character's deck consists of 9-12 cards, with a default draw of 3, which increases to 4 when you hit 12 cards, meaning that your deck never gets too big to be its own disaster, and things like deck thinning is never a consideration. Whenever you get a new card, you can just slot it in, as if it were a constructed deck. It makes the game much more "user friendly" at the expense of lowering the skill ceiling. You also don't completely refresh your hand every round, i.e., you only draw up to 3 or 4 cards without discarding your hand first, so you can keep that niche/conditional card in your hand with the only downside being that you draw fewer cards. So the character that has cards dependent on their character resource can just hold their big bomb until they have said resource, which again removes that risk/reward consideration of a StS build. The "open world" thing that they tout on the Steam page is also a big nothing. Instead of branching paths you just get to pick what tile you want to go to next, capped by a "corruption" meter that acts as a game timer and increases the difficulty over time. It's fine, but it's not like, a big bullet point feature. Each run does take about 60-90 minutes though, which I feel is about 30-45 minutes too long. The character balance is kinda poo poo, and some of the designs are pretty unfun, especially for any of the "tank" type characters. The characters each ostensibly have a couple of build paths, although some of them are more synergistic than others and some don't seem as viable. Tanks, and really any defensive type ability like Thorns, take a hit since enemies seem like they really don't like attacking your party, at least not with direct damage. I haven't crunched the math or anything, but I feel like a lot of enemy actions are either buffing themselves, doing a non-damaging debuff, summoning a minion, or doing a direct damage attack, some of which can't be shielded against. There were a lot of turns where my tanks had a hand full of taunts and shields but couldn't do poo poo because none of the enemies were doing a direct attack. The metaprogression is okay. More cards/artifacts. The annoying metaprogression is that each character starts and has an "heirloom" item slot. These are usually some nice bonus that complements one of their builds pretty well. For example, the summoner crocodile general has an heirloom that makes his summons slightly (SLIGHTLY) better. The problem is that it takes 1.xx games to actually get the cool and meaningful heirloom items, and until then you're stuck with an HP + 8 (barely an attack). It's still in EA so they have some time to turn things around, and maybe playing around at higher difficulties makes some of the class nuances more evident. But as of now, unless you're really jonesing for another team-based roguelike (like I apparently was?), you can give this a pass for now.
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Oct 6, 2021 23:19
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It wasn't until the tile-regen talk that I realized that it's a screenshot of Desktop Dungeons. I only played the free version, same as Spelunky. Great games, but I felt that I got as much as I could out of them before the paid versions existed.
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Oct 6, 2021 23:39
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Serephina posted:It wasn't until the tile-regen talk that I realized that it's a screenshot of Desktop Dungeons. I only played the free version, same as Spelunky. Great games, but I felt that I got as much as I could out of them before the paid versions existed. The paid version of Desktop Dungeons added a ton of stuff, although if you burnt out on the basic gameplay then fair enough.
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Oct 7, 2021 04:32
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GrandpaPants posted:
It does, believe me. They also jacked up the difficulty a fair way in the most recent major revision; I'd been playing on max Apex and finding it easy, but I've had to drop down to the midrange since. To keep it short: the characters are imbalanced by design, because they're each meant to contribute something to the group. Angorn is an insanely powerful healer, but he has very little damage output and you need a blaster to go with him or you'll be outscaled by the midgame. On the other extreme, Aurora is capable of colossal damage output but she isn't just a glass cannon - she actively damages herself and her allies to maximise it. In between, you have the characters who don't do quite as much but provide vital support. Ragnarok is the master of allies, which serve as useful meat shields against anything except piercing attacks. Milady is the ultimate mobility hero and a solid offtank, which makes her very good at getting your blaster out of the way of a big attack when you can't taunt it. The drawback the game has right now is that the initial roster isn't complete. In particular it suffers from Lazaar being the last character to join. That leaves Angorn as the only true healer, so at high Apex you can feel forced into playing him.
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Oct 7, 2021 10:20
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Vault of the Void continuing their gambit of Think/Approach Different in fine form with a new class (Tempest) update + other misc Betterings: https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/1135810/view/3004455555333513626 Next few months seem primed for this to really go places not unlike Arcanium and Chrono Ark. Also apparently Gordian Quest has a substantial Act III + Whole Lots More quietly unto Beta of late before going fully live and wrought by the end of the month: https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/981430/view/2874975796789674730
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Oct 9, 2021 01:41
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This was a great little snippet from Jim Shepard (Dungeonmans). I've said it once and I'll say it again. Dungeonmans has a lot more design in it than the consumer expects. Jim Shepard Talks about an Interview with Valve. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4SmGnhWHAgA The video is part of a larger video, History and Development of Dungeonmans with Jim Shepard (Developer Interview). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXv8hQguGCI
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Oct 10, 2021 05:31
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Shattered Pixel Dungeon continues to be my roguelike of choice, which is partially due to the fact that I’m able to play it on my phone. There are lots of fun things to learn, and no good central source to learn them. I’ve ascended with every class but the mage and I think I’m on a good run to complete that soon. I hadn’t played for a couple of years because there wasn’t an iPhone port but once it came out I jumped back in. So much has been added since 2018 or so.
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Oct 10, 2021 19:12
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Chinook posted:Shattered Pixel Dungeon continues to be my roguelike of choice, which is partially due to the fact that I’m able to play it on my phone. That's another one I tried to like but I never quite 'got' it. Like, weapons and armor require higher stats, but leveling doesn't seem to increase stats? Just seemed a bit obtuse. Or I'm an idiot. That's always an option.
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Oct 10, 2021 19:36
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Shattered Pixel Dungeon just kicks my rear end sideways. i never feel like i can get traction during a run. i've made it past the first 3 bosses but never much farther. some runs seem WAY luckier than others
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Oct 10, 2021 19:55
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Whoo, these upcoming Cogmind changes seem to be adding a higher hill for new players - I always though EM weapons required a shitload of power generation that it wasn't easy to acquire, and flight was very useful but had crippling weight limitations given that your parts seem to get blown off in every encounter, but now EM weapons need twice as much energy and flight/hover parts carry less weight! I'm sure this is all closer to balanced if you're an experienced player and know how to optimize your play and where/how to find parts and whatnot, but I've got like twenty or thirty runs and I'm nowhere near that level.
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Oct 10, 2021 19:57
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John Lee posted:I'm sure this is all closer to balanced if you're an experienced player and know how to optimize your play and where/how to find parts and whatnot, but I've got like twenty or thirty runs and I'm nowhere near that level. cogmind.txt I feel like at some point the game was finished and it's been in continuous dev since for the dev and its most devoted fans which is extremely cool... if you're really really good at it (there are difficulty levels though, the "normal" roguelike difficulty is brutally hard, especially if you try to shoot things with cool guns, you fool, you absolute moron, shooting cool guns in the cool guns robot game)
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Oct 10, 2021 20:04
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Also a small Cogmind complaint: Moving lowers your accuracy, which is in the manual but isn't noted in, like, the combat log or anything, and was a significant detriment for most of my runs. Base accuracy is 60%, but if you were walking and shoot? 40%, you gotta wait two turns to get back up to that sweet 60%. Wouldn't be a big issue, but it took a long time for me to find out just from checking the logs. It's like how DoomRL had a significant dodge bonus for moving perpendicular to the line of enemy fire, but no marker for it anywhere in the UI or how to tell what 'perpendicular' was. Annoying. (Cogmind is really great and cool, though!)
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Oct 10, 2021 20:31
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It wasn't long ago that EM weapons didn't have the double-energy thing, they where comically optimal for shooting random mooks. I still personally keep an EM launcher handy as they're my get-out-of-this-mess card, but I'm usually an exclusive kinetics guy so the changes seem fine. Especially as it's only loot that it effects, no biggie. The buffs to kinetic cannons are long overdue, there where basically unusable as a primary weapon due to the -salvage loot spiral. Meanwhile flight has always been the 'best' propulsion choice, and so while the nerf seems harsh I'm gonna hold judgement until I actually use it; as most of your weight in was holding cargo, which has now been buffed. John Lee, if you want to get a flight build off the ground: Play normal (eg legs/shooting) during the early game, and transform at -7 factory. So don't go all aggro, visit Exiles to drop alert and maybe get a cool part that's lightweight, and try to start collecting Schematics to fabricate on the first level of factory. The only thing I keep while flying is a Mni Grenade Launcher for wall busting and a small/med inventory, everything else goes on the ground. So try to hunt for some teir4 flight schematics, lgt power sources, bot/terrain scanning stuff1, and ECM/cloak/triangualtor stuff1. No weapon slots added, 4+ propulsions, go fab some stuff, acheive liftoff, gtfo off stage. Flying isn't meant to be able to fight (well), so don't. But yea Kzyrati really does focus too much on high level play, it's the curse of EA titles with crazy fanatic player bases. The Exiles was a very good newbie addition, but honestly early game could use a bit of tweaking to be a bit more hand-holdy I feel. Or just hit player over the head more with a newspaper regarding alert spirals, or something. 1Assuming you want to stealth, which is the easiest way to get your first win. Hacking stuff can be mixed in as needed but I personally have trouble making hack-centric builds work.
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Oct 10, 2021 21:05
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Serephina posted:But yea Kzyrati really does focus too much on high level play, it's the curse of EA titles with crazy fanatic player bases. that's not a curse, that's a blessing games shouldn't get worse as you get better at them
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Oct 10, 2021 21:15
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John Lee posted:Also a small Cogmind complaint: Moving lowers your accuracy, which is in the manual but isn't noted in, like, the combat log or anything, and was a significant detriment for most of my runs. Base accuracy is 60%, but if you were walking and shoot? 40%, you gotta wait two turns to get back up to that sweet 60%. Wouldn't be a big issue, but it took a long time for me to find out just from checking the logs. It's like how DoomRL had a significant dodge bonus for moving perpendicular to the line of enemy fire, but no marker for it anywhere in the UI or how to tell what 'perpendicular' was. Annoying. Do you have "advanced" UI turned on? If you don't then you shouldn't because it actually shows you all the numbers that you practically would want to know. At least I'm 90% sure that it would solve your problem.
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Oct 10, 2021 21:16
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:that's not a curse, that's a blessing loving this. I've played so many games that seemed to be good at first glance but then as you start putting any effort into getting better at them they start to fall apart and at that point it just feels like you wasted your effort.
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Oct 10, 2021 21:18
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Jack Trades posted:loving this. This was Haque for me. I beat it on my first try. Heard it was a rogue like. Expected difficulty. Started out almost challenging and got progressively easier as the game went on. Story was alright though. Fwiw I think dungeonmans does a great job of scaling difficulty into endgame. Obviously you could just grind characters for proofs of stremf, but I've never been one for excess unnecessary grinding.
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Oct 10, 2021 22:29
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Duderclese posted:Fwiw I think dungeonmans does a great job of scaling difficulty into endgame. Obviously you could just grind characters for proofs of stremf, but I've never been one for excess unnecessary grinding. you're reminding me of when the dmans discord got rolling and I got to see the people who had maps COVERED in dungeons and just trillions of stermfs and map powers they were playing a very different, much more Diablo 3/Poe endgame game than I was
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Oct 10, 2021 22:36
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:that's not a curse, that's a blessing assuming of course that the early play is fine and needs no work. i think a lot of people bounce off cogmind who would otherwise love it for this reason. that said, it's very cool that the dev has continued to extend the life of the game by making it rewarding even to get extremely good at it, that's not super common in single player games. it's very roguelike. but I think it's also fair to say that more work done to bridge the gap between new/expert would be a good thing for the game overall. as a second counter: I like games that reflect how I've gotten better by getting easier, I don't typically fall in to playing games for more than 20-40 hours so it's nice for me to get a cue to move on from them once that happens.
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Oct 10, 2021 22:59
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Duderclese posted:That's another one I tried to like but I never quite 'got' it. Like, weapons and armor require higher stats, but leveling doesn't seem to increase stats? Just seemed a bit obtuse. Neither. Maybe not the most obvious mechanic to stumble across, but the mechanic is also in Brogue, Unexplored, probably a few others I can’t recall right after waking up from a nap. But super simple in practice if you ran into one of those before. Pretty much the essence of ‘you adapt to the dungeon RNG’ instead of dominating it with a build. Edit: eh, I guess Cogmind goes even further along that route, but it’s a robot. LordSloth fucked around with this message at 23:30 on Oct 10, 2021 |
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Oct 10, 2021 23:25
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Cogmind's the only game I ever regretted picking up on thread advice. Clearly something's there or it wouldn't have so many fans, but to me it felt like 700 unlabeled buttons and it was never clear when exactly you'd made the fatal mistake of touching the wrong one.
Dachshundofdoom fucked around with this message at 00:21 on Oct 11, 2021 |
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Oct 10, 2021 23:42
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that's easy, it's when you chose to fire a weapon in anger really it's a meditation on pacifism
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Oct 11, 2021 00:18
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LordSloth posted:Pretty much the essence of ‘you adapt to the dungeon RNG’ instead of dominating it with a build. I wish the game told me that instead of me splatting by floor 4 every time to a dang stone statue in a locked room victrix posted:you're reminding me of when the dmans discord got rolling and I got to see the people who had maps COVERED in dungeons and just trillions of stermfs and map powers Hard agree. I died to the last boss on a mans and considered that close enough to winning. Game good.
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Oct 11, 2021 00:24
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"it's like a roguelike, you've got to build up your power over several games until you're strong enough to beat it"
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Oct 11, 2021 07:34
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victrix posted:"it's like a roguelike, you've got to build up your power over several games until you're strong enough to beat it" Thanks, I hate it.
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Oct 11, 2021 07:40
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Duderclese posted:I wish the game told me that instead of me splatting by floor 4 every time to a dang stone statue in a locked room No worries, all roguelikes RNGs hate you deep down inside. It's just a matter of how much the dev also hates themself that limits the spite. P.S. There are several variants of Pixel Dungeon. The one I played I also was pretty happy to max out at floor four. Maybe I could get good, but the number of hours it took me to beat DCSS reliably speak poorly of my ability. LordSloth fucked around with this message at 08:35 on Oct 11, 2021 |
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Oct 11, 2021 08:32
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i picked up my old DS copy of Shiren and man that game rips. it's so cool to return to after playing bunch of modern RLs. it really holds up. the in-game hints and guides are great and a lot of them could apply to any roguelike. i'll have to finally pick up Shiren 5 for Switch
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Oct 11, 2021 08:53
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-wrong thread-
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Oct 11, 2021 09:03
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