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2house2fly posted:Sure, but Arrakis isn't just any planet: it's Spice World. The Emperor can act like a Saturday night diva about how the Harkonnens making the Atreides move over is too much, but he can't outright make them stop now that they're there- if he did do it, the interruption in production would mean denying the rest of the galaxy the chance to spice up their life, and since the noble houses- and the spacing guild, for that matter- want to never give up on the good times, they'd all have it out for him. That's how an outsider in the setting would see it anyway, so they could see how it would make sense for the emperor to seemingly just shrug and tell the Harkonnens "viva forever" Lmao
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Nov 25, 2021 06:03
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sebmojo posted:Very same it would be rad having all my questions answered like that Blu-ray extra of Irulan reading the Doon appendices. No explanation is given
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Nov 25, 2021 06:08
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2house2fly posted:Sure, but Arrakis isn't just any planet: it's Spice World. The Emperor can act like a Saturday night diva about how the Harkonnens making the Atreides move over is too much, but he can't outright make them stop now that they're there- if he did do it, the interruption in production would mean denying the rest of the galaxy the chance to spice up their life, and since the noble houses- and the spacing guild, for that matter- want to never give up on the good times, they'd all have it out for him. That's how an outsider in the setting would see it anyway, so they could see how it would make sense for the emperor to seemingly just shrug and tell the Harkonnens "viva forever"
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Nov 25, 2021 06:35
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They did not want to get with the emperor's friends
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Nov 25, 2021 06:52
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In the book, didn’t the Baron have plans that Feyd might become emperor?
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Nov 25, 2021 14:35
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david_a posted:In the book, didn’t the Baron have plans that Feyd might become emperor? If not Feyd, Feyd’s son. He was very much playing Space Crusader Kings.
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Nov 25, 2021 18:13
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MrYenko posted:If not Feyd, Feyd’s son. He was very much playing Space Crusader Kings. Which, if Jessica had given birth to a daughter instead of Paul, would have potentially happened, since the offspring of Feyd and the daughter would have been a potential KH.
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Nov 25, 2021 18:28
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Dune Stellaris mod when? Just kidding Stellaris would need an entire strategy layer that currently doesn't exist. I was so excited for their pitch of a 4X that morphs into grand strategy once the map is filled in. But there never was real diplomacy much less internal political dynamics. I don't blame them, that was just too ambitious in a genre that's already notoriously hard to make. Stellaris really needed a complete overhaul rather than DLCs adding little mechanics around the edges. But as always the hard part would be creating an AI that could intelligently play half a dozen alien empires with all those systems without dragging your computer to its knees.
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Nov 25, 2021 18:58
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Arglebargle III posted:Dune Stellaris mod when? Pretty sure there is one for CK2.
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Nov 25, 2021 20:52
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Arglebargle III posted:Dune Stellaris mod when? stellaris 2 is gonna be lit though
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Nov 25, 2021 21:04
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I'm reading the book for the first time and like the great Heighliner ships are so big that they can simultaneously carry all the frigates of your house but all the frigates around of the house that wants to kill you... at the same time without you knowing? I don't think any game could capture that level of bizarre non-linear warfare.
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Nov 25, 2021 21:44
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CK generally comes close because much of Dune is based around the idea that there are specific things limiting your actions in war, some of which are technological (you can’t quickly move all your forces to where they need to be) and some are political (there will always be someone who limits your ability to act- the Guild, the Pope, etc.) Even as the book ends with the Emperor’s overthrow and a massive universe-wide crusade, some semblances of the old order remain in the sequels. It’s never “there are no rules”.
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Nov 25, 2021 23:29
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So, against whom was Maud Dib's jihad waged? The other houses? Why? And the Guild just shuttled them around to kill everyone?
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Nov 26, 2021 00:32
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It was a religious war against people who didn't want to convert to paul worship. The guild was forced to comply due to paul's threat to the spice but not very happily, hence why dune messiah happened
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Nov 26, 2021 00:36
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No Mods No Masters posted:It was a religious war against people who didn't want to convert to paul worship. The guild was forced to comply due to paul's threat to the spice but not very happily, hence why dune messiah happened
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Nov 26, 2021 00:52
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Simplex posted:If the movie was depicting Feudalism rather than a Roman/Byzantine political system then maybe. In this system the nobility would expect some warfare and murder between houses, but the Harkonnens retaking Arrakis is a direct challenge to the authority of the Emperor. It only happens with the blessing of the Emperor, or if the Emperor is weak. 
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Nov 26, 2021 01:11
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i genuinely dont get why he doesnt put on some weight. he lost it after interstellar and seems dedicate to looking 15-19 years old
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Nov 26, 2021 03:26
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Ammanas posted:i genuinely dont get why he doesnt put on some weight. he lost it after interstellar and seems dedicate to looking 15-19 years old Hordes of women and presumably a decent amount of dudes think he is the pinnacle of beauty and sexiness. His image is being the skinny dude, a muscular version of him would be weird. I don't see him taking a role in a Marvel movie and getting swole anytime soon, although that would be pretty funny.
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Nov 26, 2021 03:45
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To paraphrase John Scalzi: they may have put him in a pigeonhole, but it's a hole filled with money so 
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Nov 26, 2021 04:18
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Guild just shuttling jihad fighters from massacre to massacre.
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Nov 26, 2021 16:28
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Nov 26, 2021 16:33
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I would ask what that's about, but I'm pretty sure the answer would cause me physical pain at the sheer stupidity of the explanation.
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Nov 26, 2021 17:21
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Randalor posted:I would ask what that's about, but I'm pretty sure the answer would cause me physical pain at the sheer stupidity of the explanation. No that's frank, he just never wrote about it
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Nov 26, 2021 19:43
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRrct4lzowIRandalor posted:I would ask what that's about, but I'm pretty sure the answer would cause me physical pain at the sheer stupidity of the explanation.
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Nov 27, 2021 02:29
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2house2fly posted:Sure, but Arrakis isn't just any planet: it's Spice World. The Emperor can act like a Saturday night diva about how the Harkonnens making the Atreides move over is too much, but he can't outright make them stop now that they're there- if he did do it, the interruption in production would mean denying the rest of the galaxy the chance to spice up their life, and since the noble houses- and the spacing guild, for that matter- want to never give up on the good times, they'd all have it out for him. That's how an outsider in the setting would see it anyway, so they could see how it would make sense for the emperor to seemingly just shrug and tell the Harkonnens "viva forever"
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Nov 27, 2021 04:15
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ALFbrot posted:If you put two and two together, you'll see what the collusion was for. The scary Harkonnens and posh Atreides hated each other, and the two houses were a bit of a pain to the emperor. So he found a way to make 2 become 1, while appearing neutral. The Harkonnens enhance their fearsome reputation and the emperor lets it happen because tell me why another house would wannabe put in charge of Arrakis? The Harkonnens say they'll be there, forever, and the emperor can keep denying his involvement by shrugging and saying "I tried to remove them but they want it too much. At least they keep the spice flowing."
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Nov 27, 2021 04:17
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Ow. I think that link gave me an aneurysm.
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Nov 27, 2021 04:44
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So nobody wants to use lasguns on someone with a shield because that would cause a nuclear explosion. But wouldn't suicidal terrorists love this option? It sounds like a relatively low-cost way of creating massive destruction. I don't think it occurred to Frank Herbert that terrorists would love doing this.
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Nov 27, 2021 09:58
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Duncan does it.
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Nov 27, 2021 10:12
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Spoilers for Dune Part 2 final battle https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvWefB4NGGI
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Nov 27, 2021 10:25
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CelticPredator posted:Spoilers for Dune Part 2 final battle God I love that this is the future for all upcoming movie stars
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Nov 27, 2021 10:41
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Kurzon posted:So nobody wants to use lasguns on someone with a shield because that would cause a nuclear explosion. But wouldn't suicidal terrorists love this option? It sounds like a relatively low-cost way of creating massive destruction. I don't think it occurred to Frank Herbert that terrorists would love doing this.
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Nov 27, 2021 11:23
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I was talking about terrorism. Like, if you want to blow up a city, just rent a hotel room downtown, activate your shield and get your accomplice to shoot you repeatedly until the desired explosion happens.
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Nov 27, 2021 12:03
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Kurzon posted:I was talking about terrorism. Like, if you want to blow up a city, just rent a hotel room downtown, activate your shield and get your accomplice to shoot you repeatedly until the desired explosion happens. Isn't the problem that "your accomplice shoots you, and you both die in an explosion" just that the size of the explosion could be everything from "The walls of the room you're in need a quick scrubbing to get the blood off" to "several city blocks are gone"? You only get one try, amd you have no way to control the size of the explosion. If you were wanting an explosive death, bombs still exist and are far more reliable.
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Nov 27, 2021 13:52
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CelticPredator posted:Spoilers for Dune Part 2 final battle Father! Father. The beats have awoken.
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Nov 27, 2021 14:59
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Kurzon posted:I was talking about terrorism. Like, if you want to blow up a city, just rent a hotel room downtown, activate your shield and get your accomplice to shoot you repeatedly until the desired explosion happens. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fnkLCoVSjnc
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Nov 27, 2021 15:18
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Kurzon posted:I was talking about terrorism. Like, if you want to blow up a city, just rent a hotel room downtown, activate your shield and get your accomplice to shoot you repeatedly until the desired explosion happens. the reaction can be whatever. sometimes only the one with the shield dies, sometimes the shooter dies, sometimes it both...and sometimes it's a nuke, but you can't predict it.
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Nov 27, 2021 15:44
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McKilligan posted:Because they were just as eager to lure House Atreides into a trap. Vladimir Harkonnen was in on it from the beginning. Plus towards the end he seemed confident that they would have time to martial the Fremen to their side, it's not til that last conversation he has with Jessica that he realizes poo poo is going down way too fast for him to do anything against it. I liked how in the movie he seems focused on the sabotage aspect commenting on the lovely nature of the gear he thinks the Harkonnen have left behind and stuff - He sees the expected protracted sabotage and economic warfare right in front of him between cemented in assassin, the carry-all malfunctioning (in the book it just doesn't show up because it was supposedly shot down), etc.. The movie did a good job fixing some of the almost arguably a plot hole level of lack of initiative from Leto and Jessica in some of these situations. Crespolini posted:the reaction can be whatever. sometimes only the one with the shield dies, sometimes the shooter dies, sometimes it both...and sometimes it's a nuke, but you can't predict it. Yeah it's far too random a range of outcomes to be useful.
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Nov 27, 2021 16:19
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If I remember correctly the lasgun / shield interaction specifically caused atomic fusion which always resulted in a big explosion. The reason they're not used for this purpose militarily is because the author thought swords were cooler.
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Nov 27, 2021 16:33
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Mata posted:If I remember correctly the lasgun / shield interaction specifically caused atomic fusion which always resulted in a big explosion. The reason they're not used for this purpose militarily is because the author thought swords were cooler. Dune posted:A lasgun-shield explosion was a dangerous variable, could be more powerful than atomics, could kill only the gunner and his shielded target.
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Nov 27, 2021 16:44
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