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Ocean of Milk
Jun 25, 2018

oh yeah

BlankSystemDaemon posted:

there's still legal compliance which can and does affect whether or not any copyleft software can be used?

What specififcally do you mean by that? Examples?

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matti
Mar 31, 2019

Kazinsal posted:

alternatively, write your own unix under whatever license you want

👀

BlankSystemDaemon
Mar 13, 2009



SYSV Fanfic posted:

I obviously read every word. Personally I think it's really lovely of apple they can't even toss $5 or $10k to the freebsd foundation annually. Microsoft still does.
Apple is listed under corporate donors and has been for many years.

BobHoward posted:

fyi the process model is mach tasks, not bsd

they hide a lot of it underneath more abstract libraries, including ones which provide traditional unix interfaces, but mach IPC primitives and the mach process (task) model are the base layer for a lot of stuff in macOS
Huh, interesting - but there is some of the BSD process model, because top(1) on macOS has a column for BSD syscalls (even if there are never any processes that use any; I've tested the entire base system).

Ocean of Milk posted:

What specififcally do you mean by that? Examples?
From trading war stories over drinks with people who've worked in banks, I know that copyleft software is ill thought of in the banking industry, and that at least one major bank has a mail sorting system where FreeBSD is used in some capacity.
Other industries with legal compliance are telecommunications, the medicinal industry and the industry around delivering software to the armed forces - all of which I don't know specifics, but I know that people who work on the BSDs have been hired by subcontractors of those, because they worked on the BSDs.
One thing they all have in common is that they're required by law or contract to keep things secret.

Needless to say, none of it is verifiable, but that's the nature of these things.

mawarannahr
May 21, 2019

BlankSystemDaemon posted:

… at least one major bank has a mail sorting system where FreeBSD is used in some capacity.
Other industries with legal compliance are telecommunications, the medicinal industry and the industry around delivering software to the armed forces - all of which I don't know specifics, but I know that people who work on the BSDs have been hired by subcontractors of those, because they worked on the BSDs.

so you’re saying there’s work in BSD if I sell my soul? ngl it sounds like a bargain worth considering.

AnimeIsTrash
Jun 30, 2018

mycophobia posted:

happy thanksgiving folks. im thankful for linux, and especially for the folks at the debian project for making the best linux

hifi
Jul 25, 2012

BlankSystemDaemon posted:

I'm insomniac and bored out of my mind, so have a lot of :words:

I think there's a fundamental bit of philosophy that a lot of copyleft proponents miss (intentional or not, though I think it's mostly the latter), which is that to a lot of people working on copyfree licenses (not just BSD or MIT, but all of them), the important part isn't that someone else contributes back, that they get kick-backs, or any of a number of other reasons that copyleft proponents often talk about.

Instead, it's that there should be at least one good implementation of something that should be available for everyone to use

well that hasn't happened. not reading the rest

Progressive JPEG
Feb 19, 2003

mycophobia posted:

happy thanksgiving folks. im thankful for linux, and especially for the folks at the debian project for making the best linux

SYSV Fanfic
Sep 9, 2003

by Pragmatica

hifi posted:

well that hasn't happened. not reading the rest

gcc lol.

BlankSystemDaemon posted:

Apple is listed under corporate donors and has been for many years.

https://forms.matchinggifts.com/AppleGuide.pdf

ppl probably submitted their coding time, and the guy doing it must have had a kid b/c it's down to 250 this year.

Nomnom Cookie
Aug 30, 2009



mycophobia posted:

happy thanksgiving folks. im thankful for linux, and especially for the folks at the debian project for making the best linux

KozmoNaut
Apr 23, 2008

Happiness is a warm
Turbo Plasma Rifle


mycophobia posted:

happy thanksgiving folks. im thankful for linux, and especially for the folks at openSUSE for making the best linux

mycophobia
May 7, 2008

ahahaa that's not what i said at all! you beautiful bastard!!!!!

mycophobia
May 7, 2008
was waiting for someone to do that tbh. peace

Zam Wesell
Mar 22, 2009

[Zam is suddenly shot in the neck by a toxic dart; Anakin and Obi-Wan see a "rocket-man" take off and fly away, and Zam dies]
happy thanksgiving folks. im thankful for linus, and especially for making the best tech tips

carry on then
Jul 10, 2010

by VideoGames

(and can't post for 10 years!)

Zam Wesell posted:

happy thanksgiving folks. im thankful for linus, and especially for making the best tech tips

im thankful he made the Linux community go apeshit

ynohtna
Feb 16, 2007

backwoods compatible
Illegal Hen

carry on then posted:

im thankful he made the Linux community go apeshit

a short journey for many

shoeberto
Jun 13, 2020

which way to the MACHINES?

Zam Wesell posted:

happy thanksgiving folks. im thankful for linus, and especially for making the best tech tips

Whoa he's the linux guy??

shoeberto
Jun 13, 2020

which way to the MACHINES?
Ok, now that is epic.

akadajet
Sep 14, 2003

Zam Wesell posted:

happy thanksgiving folks. im thankful for linus, and especially for making the best tech tips

I saw he had a new video where he tries linux. i skipped around and he was having issues getting sound to work. classic

akadajet
Sep 14, 2003

he was also trying to use linux with some rack mounted weird rear end computer he doesn’t understand because he’s dumb as hell

Kamrat
Nov 27, 2012

Thanks for playing Alone in the dark 2.

Now please fuck off
He also claimed that running apt-get on Manjaro starts a download for some dependency that quietly fails, I've never heard of this and when I tried it myself I just get a "command not found" like expected so I have no idea what he's talking about.

His github problems was funny as well, him downloading a html file and then being confused about that had me laughing. I can certainly understand github being confusing for some people but you can just look up how to download stuff from there. As someone with a youtube-channel dedicated to computers I would expect him to know stuff like this but... whatever

infernal machines
Oct 11, 2012

we monitor many frequencies. we listen always. came a voice, out of the babel of tongues, speaking to us. it played us a mighty dub.
the whole thing about linus is he just does poo poo without knowing what he's doing and frequently makes a mess because of it.

someone said he's tim "the toolman" taylor, and that's 100% spot on

AnimeIsTrash
Jun 30, 2018

Kamrat posted:

He also claimed that running apt-get on Manjaro starts a download for some dependency that quietly fails, I've never heard of this and when I tried it myself I just get a "command not found" like expected so I have no idea what he's talking about.

Lol Manjaro is arch based, apt would never be on there unless you install it.

spiritual bypass
Feb 19, 2008

Grimey Drawer
freebsd

AnimeIsTrash
Jun 30, 2018

No thank you, I prefer him being banned.

Kamrat
Nov 27, 2012

Thanks for playing Alone in the dark 2.

Now please fuck off

AnimeIsTrash posted:

Lol Manjaro is arch based, apt would never be on there unless you install it.

Exactly, but what confused me was him saying it tried to install a dependency so I had to try it myself.

carry on then
Jul 10, 2010

by VideoGames

(and can't post for 10 years!)

i wonder if he triggered some sort of "search the repos for a package that provides the command you issued" feature?

Last Chance
Dec 31, 2004

Linus is an idiot but that makes him a good test case for Linux. if a complete dipshit can’t run your OS without something basic like sound working then it’s busted rear end garbage

mawarannahr
May 21, 2019

Last Chance posted:

Linus is an idiot but that makes him a good test case for Linux. if a complete dipshit can’t run your OS without something basic like sound working then it’s busted rear end garbage

a 13 year old maybe a tiny bit brighter than average can figure out Linux and FreeBSD with sound and accelerated 3D graphics within weeks. in the days of red hat 6 and freebsd 5. sound Just Worked on a thinkpad and a 200mhz mmx desktop with hedwig, iirc.

doom 3 on BSD’s Linux compatibility mode with ATI drivers on release in 2004 a little later at 16 was easier than the poo poo you need to do to set up a modern web dev environment

mawarannahr fucked around with this message at 05:34 on Nov 28, 2021

infernal machines
Oct 11, 2012

we monitor many frequencies. we listen always. came a voice, out of the babel of tongues, speaking to us. it played us a mighty dub.
sound in linux worked before the ac97 chipset when everything was soundblaster/ess compatible, and then a while after after the ac97 chipset, when it was supported.

Rufus Ping
Dec 27, 2006





I'm a Friend of Rodney Nano

mawarannahr posted:

a 13 year old maybe a tiny bit brighter than average can figure out Linux and FreeBSD with sound and accelerated 3D graphics within weeks

Next thread title

Progressive JPEG
Feb 19, 2003

mycophobia posted:

happy thanksgiving folks. im thankful for linux, and especially for the folks at the debian project for making the best linux

just saw this at the curb lol

FlapYoJacks
Feb 12, 2009
Real talk: In the several decades I have been using Linux on my desktop, sound has never been an issue. Especially after kernel 2.4 (when OSS was replaced with ALSA and you could play sound from multiple sources AT THE SAME TIME!!!!) :corsair:

Not once have I had to mess with config files, or compile drivers, or deal with third-party garbage. Sound has always just.. worked.

Edit:

I want to be clear that is on the desktop. Laptop sound has sometimes been a nightmare.

FlapYoJacks fucked around with this message at 06:24 on Nov 28, 2021

Truga
May 4, 2014
Lipstick Apathy
yeah. laptops will often have lovely OEM chips packaged that have a single 10 year old windows driver for them and nothing else ever, so if your laptop model isn't popular enough to have been used by some other linux nerd who went through the trouble of fixing it, it won't work. see also: wifi

luckily OEMs can't into their own GPUs, but that doesn't mean they won't try to make your life hard on that front too. i remember sony having custom geforce pci device IDs, and again only having 5 year old drivers for windows available lmao. at least unlike on windows, forcing the nvidia driver to load anyway was trivial i guess

FlapYoJacks
Feb 12, 2009
Indeed, and now that AMD GPUs have mainline kernel drivers, I haven't had any GPU issues in over two years. It's wonderful. :allears:

mawarannahr
May 21, 2019

Rufus Ping posted:

Next thread title

the sound didn’t take 3 weeks, I included learning bash and how basically anything at all worked after coming off windows 98 and nt4, because my Russian friend said real hackers used Linux

Rufus Ping
Dec 27, 2006





I'm a Friend of Rodney Nano
After a decade+ of using desktop (laptop) Linux I've bought a MacBook. Hardware is really nice, software has some unexpectedly rough edges

Kind of hilarious that macs have their own little third-party paid shitware ecosystem like windows used to. People don't see anything wrong with having to buy and install proprietary tools to add missing features to the OS :pwn:

The way you install (non- app store) software by mounting a disk image and then dragging the application onto a shortcut to the /Applications directory is something straight out of the 90s

Really makes me realize how good I had it in many respects with gnome + almost everything you want being in the distro's own first party package manager

Nomnom Cookie
Aug 30, 2009



mawarannahr posted:

my Russian friend said real hackers used Linux

no, this is the new thread title

BobHoward
Feb 13, 2012

The only thing white people deserve is a bullet to their empty skull

Rufus Ping posted:

After a decade+ of using desktop (laptop) Linux I've bought a MacBook. Hardware is really nice, software has some unexpectedly rough edges

Kind of hilarious that macs have their own little third-party paid shitware ecosystem like windows used to. People don't see anything wrong with having to buy and install proprietary tools to add missing features to the OS :pwn:

99% of this kind of software is poo poo which you don't need even though tons of people swear you do

quote:

The way you install (non- app store) software by mounting a disk image and then dragging the application onto a shortcut to the /Applications directory is something straight out of the 90s

Really makes me realize how good I had it in many respects with gnome + almost everything you want being in the distro's own first party package manager

you may not realize it yet but the mac way is vastly superior and users like just being able to drag-install poo poo

linux style package management is unironically the #1 reason why linux can't have good software

spiritual bypass
Feb 19, 2008

Grimey Drawer
i need postmam to do http things lmao

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mawarannahr
May 21, 2019

Nomnom Cookie posted:

no, this is the new thread title

lol

https://web.archive.org/web/20000229124100/http://happyhacker.org/

good times, when computers were amazing

also textfiles and totse

mawarannahr fucked around with this message at 14:13 on Nov 28, 2021

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