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nate fisher
Mar 3, 2004

We've Got To Go Back
I would love to see For All Mankind win too, but it will be hard to derail Succession. Yellowjackets would be a second choice, but of course kind of hard to judge with season still going on.

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Big Mean Jerk
Jan 27, 2009

Well, of course I know him.
He's me.
I don’t think I’ll ever anticipate a season of a show more than For All Mankind season 3 because it’ll apparently be set in and around Houston/Seabrook/Clear Lake circa 1995 and that is absolute nostalgia crack for me.

My little backyard slice of Houston is gonna be featured in a tv show and set during my childhood. :allears:

zoux
Apr 28, 2006

What show

Late to the party but I watched Venom last night. Was the contemporary consensus that Tom Hardy was horribly miscast

zoux fucked around with this message at 22:40 on Dec 6, 2021

OldSenileGuy
Mar 13, 2001
Nope the consensus is that he is the only good part of it

Gaius Marius
Oct 9, 2012

Tom Hardy is the best part of any movie he's in. He also always manages to feel the most out of place

LionArcher
Mar 29, 2010


Aardvark! posted:

My vote is For All Mankind but my gut says it'll be Succession.

It will be succession even though it shouldn’t be.

Medullah
Aug 14, 2003

FEAR MY SHARK ROCKET IT REALLY SUCKS AND BLOWS
The original Venom surprised me because I went in expecting it to be total garbage and it wasn't. Let Their Be Carnage was what I expected the original Venom to be.

I love Tom Hardy, the voice he uses for the symbiote is so ridiculous but hilarious. So proper

Hakkesshu
Nov 4, 2009


Venom 2 was hot trash. How do you waste Woody like that

Escobarbarian
Jun 18, 2004


Grimey Drawer

LionArcher posted:

It will be succession even though it shouldn’t be.

Oh your whole thing is just contrarianism? Man this would have saved me so much time earlier in the year

LionArcher
Mar 29, 2010


Escobarbarian posted:

Oh your whole thing is just contrarianism? Man this would have saved me so much time earlier in the year

No. I like a ton of popular things. But my issue is when things are hyped up to a degree by a group of people that have an underlying vibe of "we know best". In this case, with Succession, it's the twitter creative community. Something awful has it's issues, but one of the things I like about this place is that it's geeky as hell and never (or at least not now,) no longer cool.

My issue with Succession is it's take on capitalism, and how it feels very centrist libs adore it.

I vastly prefer Billions which has the writing style of playwrights on cocaine (not saying it's better than the other, but in my mind it's more fun) and more importantly, it's less mean, while doing a better job of criticizing capitalism without coming off like it's idolizing it to a degree.

Succession is a mean show, made to laugh at fake rich people, and maybe find some vague empathy for them? There's a reason a lot of Hollywood folk are loving it. It's because on some level they desperately want to be those people, on some level, because behind the scenes, a lot of them are incurably high functioning narcissists, even if they pretend they're "good ones".

When I see the same critics complaining about the ending of season 2 of Mando for being too much "fan service," praising this, dissing or ignoring Wheel of Time, and being obsessed with every tired Marvel tv show, I get annoyed.

Liking Succession is fine. Like, I'll defend odd poo poo that most people dislike. I think Rise of Skywalker is a better Star Wars movie than Last Jedi, while understanding why the last Jedi is more "beloved" by "critics". I'm not saying ROS is like a great movie, but as a star wars film, it in many ways does it's job much better than Last Jedi did. And I say that as someone who adores Knives Out, and Brick.

zoux
Apr 28, 2006

That's, uh, one hell of a read. You are projecting a lot onto an audience that you are imagining in your head.

It's a shakespearean drama about a hosed up and powerful family. Very common throughout the ages of human letters. And because I know the difference between TV and the real world, the show doesn't make me have bad politics (the most important consideration when deciding if it's ok to enjoy a show) and I can still continue to despise the rich. Though I shan't eat them.

zoux fucked around with this message at 01:16 on Dec 7, 2021

Matt Zerella
Oct 7, 2002

Norris'es are back baby. It's good again. Awoouu (fox Howl)
Anyone who finds any kind of empathy for anyone in Succession is telling on themselves.

Meanwhile people hoot and holler about how cool Axe is.

LionArcher
Mar 29, 2010


zoux posted:

That's, uh, one hell of a read. You are projecting a lot onto an audience that you are imagining in your head.

It's a shakespearean drama about a hosed up and powerful family. Very common throughout the ages of human letters. And because I know the difference between TV and the real world, the show doesn't make me have bad politics (the most important consideration when deciding if it's ok to enjoy a show) and I can still continue to despise the rich. Though I shan't eat them.

Again, I don't think folks in these forums are a problem for enjoying the show. I don't think the show is bad. It's well acted, well directed, well ish written. It's the way it's hyped on twitter by a bunch of "creatives" I have issue with.

LionArcher
Mar 29, 2010


Matt Zerella posted:

Anyone who finds any kind of empathy for anyone in Succession is telling on themselves.

Meanwhile people hoot and holler about how cool Axe is.

Axe is clearly a villain, but the best film version of what Musk probably thinks he looks like.

Hakkesshu
Nov 4, 2009


Rise of Skywalker is one of the worst films I have ever seen

Cael
Feb 2, 2004

I get this funky high on the yellow sun.

It's absolutely insane how in the span of two months the discourse for Succession went from zero to goon. I started binging the show only after season 3 began and flipping through the older threads as I watched it was a light discussion and chat about a cool and good TV show. But now it's classic TV IV of people arguing / completely misinterpreting what the show literally tells you / wild speculation. This isn't directed at any one poster or posters in particular, people are just acting at times like the characters are playing 12th dimensional chess and nothing in the show tells us they're THAT competent. And it extends beyond SA.

I don't think it's the most overrated because that's a knock against its quality, but it's in the running for most over-discussed show for the moment. It's a pretty straightforward family Shakespearean drama and it's great, but it doesn't need this much in depth analysis.

Matt Zerella
Oct 7, 2002

Norris'es are back baby. It's good again. Awoouu (fox Howl)

LionArcher posted:

Axe is clearly a villain, but the best film version of what Musk probably thinks he looks like.

He's still got that sheen to him that Logan doesn't have but then again I have to remind myself that a Sorkin is involved so making horrible people look cool and likable comes with the territory (like Toby).

LionArcher
Mar 29, 2010


Matt Zerella posted:

He's still got that sheen to him that Logan doesn't have but then again I have to remind myself that a Sorkin is involved so making horrible people look cool and likable comes with the territory (like Toby).

It's because the actor is so drat likable. It's a bit how Hannibal (tv show) sometimes make him seem a little too cool as well.

Matt Zerella
Oct 7, 2002

Norris'es are back baby. It's good again. Awoouu (fox Howl)

LionArcher posted:

It's because the actor is so drat likable. It's a bit how Hannibal (tv show) sometimes make him seem a little too cool as well.

Don't you dare. Don't. You. Dare.

LionArcher
Mar 29, 2010


Matt Zerella posted:

Don't you dare. Don't. You. Dare.

don't I dare say that Mads Mik is an incredibly charismatic actor who can make a horrific villain in moments seem likable?

cant cook creole bream
Aug 15, 2011
I think Fahrenheit is better for weather

LionArcher posted:

What’s the most overrated popular show currently on TV? My vote is succession.

I'd say Squid Game. I did like it, but it really didn't stick the landing and the morale is more shallow than you'd think.
It's not even my favorite Korean crime drama. I want a season 2 of Extracurricular!

Gonz
Dec 22, 2009

"Jesus, did I say that? Or just think it? Was I talking? Did they hear me?"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhUTqO4Ci68

Milky Robbits and Space Lamprey: Season Two

isaboo
Nov 11, 2002

Muay Buok
ขอให้โชคดี
Looks hosed up. I'm in!

nate fisher
Mar 3, 2004

We've Got To Go Back
I’m sorry but Billons is trash in comparison to Succession. I say that as a fan of Billons (although it is long in the tooth with the Chuck vs Axelrod bullshit) and someone who has issues with Succession.

muscles like this!
Jan 17, 2005


I had to laugh at a DBZ reference in this week's Joe Pera. In the first episode when the women are helping Sarah after she gets knocked down one of them gives her a flask and says "Here, it's like a senzu bean."

Sumo
Jun 17, 2005

Khanstant
Apr 5, 2007

zoux posted:

And because I know the difference between TV and the real world, the show doesn't make me have bad politics (the most important consideration when deciding if it's ok to enjoy a show) and I can still continue to despise the rich. Though I shan't eat them.

For every rich you don't eat, I'll eat three

is just one of the slogans I will be including in my Shark Tank pitch for a monthly subscription box built using a patented anti-capitalism technology.

Oasx
Oct 11, 2006

Freshly Squeezed
Axe and Chuck are two super charismatic people, and you cheer for them despite knowing that they are bad people.

I'm sure that Succession is a better show, but I couldn't make it past the first episode because every character is an rear end in a top hat.

Mr Ice Cream Glove
Apr 22, 2007

Another stellar episode of Yellow Jackets

Escobarbarian
Jun 18, 2004


Grimey Drawer

cant cook creole bream posted:

I'd say Squid Game. I did like it, but it really didn't stick the landing and the morale is more shallow than you'd think.
It's not even my favorite Korean crime drama. I want a season 2 of Extracurricular!

Yeah I agree with this. My actual answer for most overrated show is Arcane or Squid Game but that’s referring to normies more than goons

Shageletic
Jul 25, 2007

zoux posted:

It's Arcane. I think arcane is very, very good. But it's developing a performatively competitive fandom like it's a Kpop group ft. Beyonce.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jllmfRcol0c

Like a cargo cult of TV quality. Cool song drops, and three way shot rashoman scenes must make this the best show ever (I think someone here said it was the best show that had ever seen?)

Shageletic
Jul 25, 2007

I just wanna say a buddy turned me onto the comedy South Side and holy poo poo it's my fav new show. Hilarious about poo poo you don't see on TV.

Not quite as acerbic or insane As Always Sunny, but alot more real and you like the characters better. But it's also not as sweet as a Mike Schur joint.

It's a little of both I'd say. Blazed thru the first season in a day and trying to savor the second right now

DaveKap
Feb 5, 2006

Pickle: Inspected.



Cael posted:

It's absolutely insane how in the span of two months the discourse for Succession went from zero to goon. I started binging the show only after season 3 began and flipping through the older threads as I watched it was a light discussion and chat about a cool and good TV show. But now it's classic TV IV of people arguing / completely misinterpreting what the show literally tells you / wild speculation. This isn't directed at any one poster or posters in particular, people are just acting at times like the characters are playing 12th dimensional chess and nothing in the show tells us they're THAT competent. And it extends beyond SA.

I don't think it's the most overrated because that's a knock against its quality, but it's in the running for most over-discussed show for the moment. It's a pretty straightforward family Shakespearean drama and it's great, but it doesn't need this much in depth analysis.
There's like maybe 2 people in the Succession thread who are interpreting 12 dimensional chess while everyone else is pretty chill about it. You might be conflating SA with Reddit and Twitter, though I honestly don't read the couch thread enough to know if this is where you're getting all this.

That said, I love the show and think it deserves awards but it's by no means a tour de force piece of art that needs to be watched by everyone, which is all I ever hear about, say, Arcane and Squid Game. It's just a fun to watch show. Getting anything more out of it is kinda wacky.

Escobarbarian
Jun 18, 2004


Grimey Drawer

Shageletic posted:

I just wanna say a buddy turned me onto the comedy South Side and holy poo poo it's my fav new show. Hilarious about poo poo you don't see on TV.

Not quite as acerbic or insane As Always Sunny, but alot more real and you like the characters better. But it's also not as sweet as a Mike Schur joint.

It's a little of both I'd say. Blazed thru the first season in a day and trying to savor the second right now

The second season is some of the wildest poo poo I ever seen. I really enjoyed it

Shageletic
Jul 25, 2007

LionArcher posted:

No. I like a ton of popular things. But my issue is when things are hyped up to a degree by a group of people that have an underlying vibe of "we know best". In this case, with Succession, it's the twitter creative community. Something awful has it's issues, but one of the things I like about this place is that it's geeky as hell and never (or at least not now,) no longer cool.

My issue with Succession is it's take on capitalism, and how it feels very centrist libs adore it.

I vastly prefer Billions which has the writing style of playwrights on cocaine (not saying it's better than the other, but in my mind it's more fun) and more importantly, it's less mean, while doing a better job of criticizing capitalism without coming off like it's idolizing it to a degree.



From what I saw (the first season and what I picked up catching bits on TV) Billions is a hagiography to capitalism. How does it change that? It was all look at these rich amoral people show how smart they are and how cool their lives are.

One of the exec producers is a journalist so enamored with billionaires he's been nicknamed the billionaire whisperer

nate fisher
Mar 3, 2004

We've Got To Go Back
Oh Billions does idolize capitalism in the end. It does it best to make Axe to look like a rock star and even if you are team Chuck, he still has a firm foot in capitalism and his own self interest. Also everyone in Billons is pretty much a bad person one way or the other too.

That said Billons and Succession are completely different shows with the only common factor being they deal with wealth. Billions for sure is an easier show to watch, because it is goofy and it is more in line with a typical TV show. Succession does this thing where it feels more grounded in reality while being so outrageous at the same time that you feel like no way people are like this in the real world. I can see why that turns some people off.

I do believe despite my love for Succession it is not true prestige TV. It doesn’t reach the level of shows Mad Men or The Leftovers. Still it is many times more interesting than the typical show that Billions tries to spoon feed it’s audience (let’s sprinkle in some bondage so we can feel edgy).

Shageletic
Jul 25, 2007

But then again I can't think of alot that matches up to Mad Men.

Succession is a swerve and subversion of what you tradionally see in depictions of the rich going back to Dallas, bc all these rich motherfuckers are incompetent. And that's a def a very rare in American media.

Open Source Idiom
Jan 4, 2013
Succession is an excellent show, though I don't think it's great because of the wealth stuff. (I did like that basically the entire crew were packed off to Italy for the most recent episode, and not a single character took a moment to appreciate the fact -- except poor Geri, and even then only barely.) It's just a well done character show, with a lot of cool bits and pieces and well constructed scenes / episodes. It's spectacular at the basic fundamentals that television is based on (pace, structure, being interesting), in a period when a lot of television is struggling to even get those basics consistently right, and it also has strong dialogue and acting. Particularly this season, it's been a great loving show.

But HAHAHA oh my god, Arcane. That sloppy mess. That sloppy loving mess.

nate fisher
Mar 3, 2004

We've Got To Go Back
Funny my main concern with Succession is the same issue I am having with Billions. With Billions the Chuck vs Axe thing gets old after awhile, and they are so invested in that story that you know the outcome of this episode or even a whole season doesn't really matter in the end. They got to keep that story rolling until the series finale. With Succession it feels stuck, that it invested so much in Kendall vs Logan, that it doesn't know where to go. To be clear that doesn't mean we don't get some great TV out of it, and the last episode was amazing and I do feel like we are finally getting movement. Still where does it go from here? I am curious to see what happens in season finale which should dictate the direction of the next season. I do see a direction they could go to refresh it some (Kendall needs a really big win that is truly a big win), but so far most of this season has felt like the same arch of season 1.

Shageletic posted:

But then again I can't think of alot that matches up to Mad Men.

True but I guess goes back to a discussion we had earlier about how they are no dramas airing currently that are truly at that top level of prestige TV (or are we just to spoiled by the golden age of HBO/AMC that it is harder for a show to reach that level?). I would argue possibly The Crown comes close, and the other show I would guess that is close is Better Call Saul (which I haven't watch at all, but I plan to before the final season) from what I heard.

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zoux
Apr 28, 2006

Hey, 13 new MST3K episodes on March 4. Though I'm skeptical of this gizmoplex thing...

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