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Fire Emblem is a fantasy strategy role-playing game (SRPG) video game franchise developed by Intelligent Systems and published by Nintendo. The series first started on the NES in 1990, and has been going strong for over 30 years with numerous installments for different platforms. Each game features its own unique story, with casts of colourful and varied characters with a rich variety of personalities, stats, and backstories. Being a medieval fantasy series dealing with grand conflicts on a scale often spanning multiple countries, the Fire Emblem series inevitably has a large focus on royalty. The main character is often nobility of some sort, usually the prince of a kingdom under seige by a larger and much more powerful threat, who must lead their army to victory against their enemies and reclaim their throne and rule their country as is their birthright. Fire Emblem Fates is no different, featuring a cast of 10 royal siblings and their assorted retainers and servants. All of these siblings have high stats and special dragon blood that grants them awesome power. Not only that, the princes of these families have their own sacred weapons only they can wield, each one imbued with high stats and intrinsic abilities that elevate them far above their peers in terms of combat. Who cares about any of those people, there's an archer girl with terrible stats who's primary character trait is falling into hunting traps. Let's pretend the game is about her instead!!!  This is a let's play of Fire Emblem Fates: Birthright, played on Lunatic difficulty. Much like my recent LP of Conquest I'll be focusing purely on gameplay and skipping over pretty much all of the story. Fates does not have a good story, all the jokes about the bad story have been done already, and Birthright's story isn't even funny bad, it's just kind of lame. Birthright's maps and gameplay might not be as cutthroat or as tightly made as Conquest's, but there's still a lot of room for fun. To make the game a little more interesting I won't be using any of the game's royal siblings - Ryoma, Hinoka, Takumi, Sakura, and Azura, they're all off the table. Corrin has to be brought along for every single map, but as a rule they will be limited purely to a support role from Chapter 7 onwards and forbidden from wielding any weapon. Otherwise I'm playing with the same rules I did in my Conquest playthrough. To summarise, the rules are: - Ryoma, Hinoka, Takumi, Sakura, and Azura are all off-limits. They may be used in their join chapters in which they are forcibly deployed if I want, but otherwise they cannot be deployed in any future map. - Corrin may be used, but from Chapter 7 onwards they are not allowed to wield any weapon. They can however use items, staves, and various skills to support their allies. - No deaths, each chapter must be restarted if a unit dies. - No DLC, free or otherwise. - No clear bonuses. Those are the free items you get for clearing the game's other routes. - No online features. So no castle visits to grind resources or buy items normally limited to the other two routes. - No Einharjar (the weird little card things that let you buy OP units to use in your army). - No "random" My Castle events that involve talking to units, such as temporary stat boosts or dropped items. The Lottery and Mess Hall however are fair game. If you want an in-depth look at Birthright's plot and transcripts of every scene and support log you can check out this LP here. If you want to see my previous playthrough of Conquest, look here. Otherwise this is going to be a more lighthearted and casual playthrough where I mess around with bad or overlooked units without having to worry if I'm sufficiently optimised for dealing with Staff Savant and Inevitable End. Enjoy!
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Dec 5, 2021 20:56
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 Up until the route split, the first 5 chapters of Fates are all the same regardless of which path you pick. They are also very boring and I hate them and I have documented them already, so I'll be summarising very briefly what happened in this first update. I picked the girl in my Conquest playthrough, so now I guess I'll pick the boy. Meet Kevin! Named after Kevin MacLeod, musician and producer of an immense amount of royalty-free music that if you have ever watched a youtube video you most likely have listened to. Fitting for a royalty-free playthrough. I totally stole his appearence and birthday from wikipedia, although I didn't look up anything more than that since I didn't want to be weird. Incidentally, the title card and first image of every update will link to a different Kevin MacLeod song for your listening pleasure. Even the banner in the first post links to one! I am absolutely going to regret this stupid gimmick in a few updates time. The rules forbid this particular Corrin from participating in combat beyond the tutorial in which they are forcibly deployed, so Kevin MacLeod will be optimised for support. As soon as I hit Chapter 7 I'm making him a healer and he's going to heal forever. The Troubadour class has higher mobility than the Monk class, plus it adds some Nohrian flair to an otherwise Hoshido-filled run. Magic will help him heal harder so that's his boon, strength is completely irrelevant and therefore will be his bane.  It's possible to win this prologue by doing literally nothing and while that is very funny, it's not optimal EXP distribution.  A strength bane can increase the number of turns it takes to defeat Xander (and therefore increase his EXP yield!), but Kevin proc'd strength once which unfortunately saved a single turn. Oh well.  Not playing as a girl means Felicia joins instead of Jakob for the starting chapters. She's faster and more magical, but her physical stats are much worse. I personally prefer Jakob, but Felicia does heal a little better while also having the advantage of boosting Gunter's bulk through her Demoiselle skill. Incidentally, Gunter will never be coming back from his trip down the Bottomless Canyon in Birthright. He's totally gone forever.  Gunter's slightly better bulk thanks to Felicia's support makes this version of Chapter 2 a little easier. This time I decided to use the dragon vein instead of fooling around with kiting enemies around the outside...  Nothing about Chapter 3 is at all fun. Felicia unfortunately fares even worse against the Archers and Sky Knight reinforcements, and can be (temporarily) defeated if you're not careful.  This is the reason why I did not start from a Branch of Fate and instead chose to replay the prologue. Rinkah will be a permanent edition to my party, and therefore I'm going to funnel as much EXP into her as possible. Unfortunately her performance in these early chapters really isn't very good...  ...but it'll be all worth it when the route properly begins. Rinkah's initial E rank in clubs is the largest obstacle to her usefulness early on, but reaching D rank will allow her to wield more powerful weapons as soon as I'm able to buy them. Unfortunately my first dragon vein point is going to have to go towards buying the Rod Shop so I can reclass Kevin...  The limited number of healing items made keeping Rinkah alive difficult, but she managed to snag a few levels! I'll post them all at the end of this update.  Normally her role in the prologue is to pair up with Kaze and increase his combat power, but the levels she gained allow her to be of some use here. Unfortunately she faces weapon triangle disadvantage from every enemy here.  That's all the preliminary over! I think that's the most work I've ever had Rinkah put in here. Usually she's glued to Kaze...       I'd call these levels above average, but they're also fairly irrelevant to a unit who's going to be used purely as a staffbot. Seems like his strength bane didn't hold him back.  This level is fairly typical of Felicia. Just like in Conquest I'm likely going to end up pairing her off and limiting her to a support role, so her stats aren't too important.     3 strength procs is very nice. Despite her visible abs, Rinkah's effectie strength growth is a measly 45%. Not unsalvageably low, but not what you would expect from looking at her... I'm firmly under the belief that Rinkah's a perfectly fine unit who's overlooked purely because of her mediocre performance in chapters 4 and 5 and the dissonance between her appearence and her growths, but we'll see. Next time: Birthright begins in earnest.
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Dec 5, 2021 20:57
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Oh boy, going again, huh. I am quite fond of Setsuna and Rinkah, so this is already off to a promising start. Birthright's cast is... significantly less interesting or fun as a whole compared to Conquest's, but there are highlights around, and there are three of the kids I like a whole lot. (I... still primarily hang out in Terrible Balance And Map Design land if I want to use them for cross-country supports and just give up any pretense of not grinding to make my paper dolls kiss.)
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Dec 5, 2021 21:25
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Oh nice. It's always fun to see less popular/powerful units get used.
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Dec 6, 2021 00:27
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Wait, are you going to use both Hayato and Orochi? People thought the Nohrian mages were bad. Also I hope you're using Subaki because he's a good guy.
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Dec 6, 2021 01:23
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Aww yeah more Fire Emblem!midnight lasagna posted:I picked the girl in my Conquest playthrough, so now I guess I'll pick the boy. Meet Kevin! Named after Kevin MacLeod, musician and producer of an immense amount of royalty-free music that if you have ever watched a youtube video you most likely have listened to. Fitting for a royalty-free playthrough. I totally stole his appearence and birthday from wikipedia, although I didn't look up anything more than that since I didn't want to be weird. Incidentally, the title card and first image of every update will link to a different Kevin MacLeod song for your listening pleasure. Even the banner in the first post links to one! I am absolutely going to regret this stupid gimmick in a few updates time.  I did what I called the Terrible Units Run of Birthright a while back (though I only did it on Hard). It'll be interesting to see how our experiences and perspectives diverge on this run. Your Rinkah opening with three strength procs is already going to make her way, way better than mine (though I note she has done her usual thing of being deathly allergic to the HP stat).
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Dec 6, 2021 02:54
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This Kevin gimmick made me lol irl, and I greatly appreciate that. Excited to see where this goes! I don't have a lot of experience with this route, so it'll be fun to see what the Hoshidan units can do. That being said, I definitely have a soft spot for Rinkah. I like her design, and any soldier who gets access to Deathblow is fine by me!
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Dec 6, 2021 03:40
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I felt I was unecessarily cagey about my unit plans in Conquest and people are asking who I'll be using already, so I think I'll just announce who I'm planning on using right here and now. This is just my planned pairings, I won't be limiting myself to just these units! Reina and maybe even Yukimura will get a chance to do something too. Kevin/Scarlet Rinkah/Kaden Setsuna/Azama (or kaze, it doesn't matter too much since she's unlikely to spend much time paired up anyway) Subaki/Orochi Hayato/Felicia Hana/Hinata Mozu/Kaze (or azama?) Scarlet is one of the best units in BR, but I feel as if she's underappreciated enough to justify using. I'll be making her a Malig Knight so at the very least she'll be different... Jadecore posted:Oh boy, going again, huh. I am quite fond of Setsuna and Rinkah, so this is already off to a promising start. Birthright's cast is... significantly less interesting or fun as a whole compared to Conquest's, but there are highlights around, and there are three of the kids I like a whole lot. (I... still primarily hang out in Terrible Balance And Map Design land if I want to use them for cross-country supports and just give up any pretense of not grinding to make my paper dolls kiss.) I'm even less familiar with BR's kids than Conquest's, but there's some that have fun personalities. Mitama is hilarious and for all the problems the localisation has, their handling of her haiku gimmick was not one of them. Walla posted:Wait, are you going to use both Hayato and Orochi? People thought the Nohrian mages were bad. That someone else is Subaki. I want to show off his usefulness too! theshim posted:Aww yeah more Fire Emblem! midnight lasagna fucked around with this message at 13:43 on Dec 6, 2021 |
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Dec 6, 2021 13:17
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 We've embraced the darkness, time to walk the path of light instead. As much as I prefer the Conquest route itself, something about these soothing bright colours makes this choice feel like the better one. Remember to click the title card of every chapter for some royalty free music!  The intent of Birthright is that you'll have access to much more EXP and gold through grinding. You will certainly have more than both if you do choose to grind, but if you play it like a traditional Fire Emblem game then you'll actually have less - Conquest offers you a lot of gold through optional incentives, and the higher level of enemies across the board means your units will level up much faster. Of course when the enemies are weaker it doesn't matter as much if you're lower levelled.  Even the dialogue boxes are brighter now. This seems like a fairly obvious conclusion to come to after Garon's various murder attempts - it might be understandable that Corrin would want to side with the family they've known since childhood instead of some strangers (falsely!) claiming to be their blood relatives, but it's frustrating to see them pretend Garon isn't very obviously evil. They certainly come across as smarter in this route...  Fighting the Nohrians feels wrong after playing Conquest... It's funny, on my first playthrough of this game it felt wrong to side with Nohr since they were so obviously evil, and yet when I bought Birthright and played that it felt wrong to side against the siblings I'd grown to love. Every choice is the wrong one!  Here it is, the first Birthright exclusive chapter in the game. I think this one's actually harder than CQ's - the enemies are weaker, but so are your allies. There's also more of them. I'm also not entirely sure how Xander's AI works...    Fitting with this being the easier route, we've got all our allies from the last two chapters in our army, along with Felicia. These three however aren't real party members just yet. Ryoma's stats are lower than they will be when he joins for real, but otherwise Takumi and Hinoka do have their genuine join stats. Ryoma's still by far the best unit here though, and your only real method of defeating Xander.  Xander can move right off of the bat. I think he'll always move to attack Ryoma unless he's out of range, but I'm not sure? I want to say I've had failed attempts where he's gone for one of my other units and killed them instantly, but I can't remember for sure. The wiki doesn't say anything helpful...   Leave the royals to kill each other with their fancy toys, my other units will take down the generics. There's only 3 in total but they take a surprising amount of effort to take down.  Rinkah gets a boost from Azura to take down this guy all by herself. This'll be the last time I get to use Azura for anything, so I'd better treasure her while she's here!   Takumi and Hinoka team up to take down this generic Cavalier. Neither of them are much use against Xander, but I'm pretty sure they can both tank a hit.  Xander will go down easily in two rounds of combat...  ...but for safety's sake I'll have him block the bridge. Ryoma's performance against Leo here is pretty much how the rest of the game reacts to him.  I don't like this... It feels like it should be a game over. Although it is a little theraputic to punish Leo for his terrible luck with his growths.  Sakura will stand next to her siblings to boost their bulk a little. Her passive aura is weaker than Elise's, but it also extends further.  Yep, seems like Xander's out for Ryoma. His hit is higher on enemy phase where Ryoma's Duelist Blow skill isn't active, so he actually has a decent chance of hitting him.  This feels like a betrayal somehow. You're supposed to be on my side, Elise! Come betray Nohr with me!!!  You know what, there's only 3 units left on the map. Let's rout it. Camilla might be tough to take down without the help of the Hoshidan royals, but not impossible...  I just need all my units to chip in. That's the last combat Kevin will ever see!  This is no longer Camilla's Quest. The time of Rinkah is upon us. As a member of the Flame Tribe, she gets a cool fire effect to all of her physical attacks. It's a little distracting!  Looks like she finally got that HP. Otherwise this is a fairly standard Rinkah level - skill, speed, and defense.  Now this is just the exact same level you got last time, Felicia! You have to do better than this!    Shooting unarmed healers? Yeah this is definitely the good guy route. I'll pretend this was necessarry to stop Xander from benefitting from her passive.  There goes Xander, sent tumbling through the air with the force of a single swing. He and his horse are absolutely dead.  Entire map routed in 2 turns. That was fun! I can't wait to spread peace to all of Nohr : )  May as well do the castle stuff now since this update was so short. Unfortunately in order to reclass Kevin I'll need to build this, both denying Rinkah an Iron Club for another chapter and taking the only Heart Seal until Chapter 13 in the process. Birthright is a lot more stingy with them than Conquest.   I also can't talk to Felicia to swap her out for a different assistant because she'll give herself a buff and that's against the rules >:[. I think Jakob did the same thing in my last run...   Fish for speed, Jade for forging bows... Wow, it's the exact same as last time! How disappointing. At least a steady supply of jade will help me forge weapons for Setsuna? Speed is also very good for meals but I do wish I got something different.  These fish are very big. Is Lilith a fish too? She looks like one.  You can heal is what you can do now. And nothing else! The male Troubadour outfit is quite nice, I think I'd prefer to see it in cutscenes than the Nohr Prince outfit. It has shoes for one thing.  Hoshidan Rods are weaker than staves, but have more range. Felicia's bad bulk matters less when she can heal from a slight distance, and her high magic somewhat makes up for their lower power. Maybe she is better than Jakob in this route?    C supports for all. While I have no intention to use Kaze beyond S supporting him with someone to grab the Dragon Herbs, I do want to get him to an A support with Kevin just so he doesn't get his stupid plot death. Unfortunately that might be a little difficult to engineer...     Here's all the units I'm allowed to use right now. I'll still be writing analyses for each one, but I won't have much to say about the units I've already used in Conquest - I'll just update their available A+ supports and maybe give a couple of lines on how they perform differently in this environment. Next time: Chokepoint heaven
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Dec 6, 2021 13:18
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 Corrin Nohr Prince (HS: Troubadour) A+ Support Partners: Any male unit Personal Skill: Supportive (+2 damage dealt, -2 damage taken, and +10 hit to lead unit if supporting a C supported or higher partner) Pair-Up Stats (C B A S): Mag Res Spd Mag+Res Growths (With Default Class) [Troubadour]: HP: 45% (60) [45] STR: 35% (50) [35] MAG: 50% (60) [60] SKL: 35% (45) [55] SPD: 50% (60) [60] LCK: 45% (55) [60] DEF: 30% (40) [30] RES: 30% (45) [45] See previous analysis It's Corrin! Corrin's always good, but Birthright changes their dynamic a tiny bit - they now promote into the Hoshido Noble class, which uses staves instead of tomes and has a focus on physical stats and skill instead of magical stats and speed. The Yato's bonuses also change - it offers extra strength and speed instead of defense and resistance. For that reason you're probably better off focusing on a more physical than magical Corrin, although if you still want to go magic there's nothing stopping you, and you'll probably wreck just as much face with a tryhard Malig build regardless. Ninja will be a great class for them if you want powerful physical 1-2 range, but keep in mind that Corrin can very easily grab that class tree from multiple units so it may not be wise to set it as their talent.  Felicia Maid (HS: Mercenary) A+ Support Partners: Hana (Samurai) Personal Skill: Devoted Partner (Gives +2 damage dealt and -2 damage received when supporting Corrin) Pair-Up Stats (C B A S): Spd Res Mag Spd+Res Growths (With Default Class): HP: 40% (40) STR: 10% (20) MAG: 35% (45) SKL: 30% (45) SPD: 40% (55) LCK: 55% (65) DEF: 15% (20) RES: 35% (45) See Previous Analysis Felicia gets to be my starting servant this time. I feel as if she's a bit happier here than in Conquest - Rods allow Felicia to heal from a slightly safer distance, and shurikens make much better weapons than knives. She does unfortunately have to wait an extra two chapters to get the Flame Shuriken, and she can't obtain the Levin Sword or the Shining Bow to use in her reclasses. Felicia's ability to pass down promoted Nohrian class skills easily makes her quite valuable - I'm planning on having her pass Sol down to Rhajat so she can pretend she's a Dark Mage with Nosferatu. Her A+ support with Hana is pretty worthless unless you want to mess around with early Swordfaire and Life and Death. I guess the combination of both would amount to a +15 increase in damage...  Azura Songstress (HS: Sky Knight) A+ Support Partners: Sakura (Shrine Maiden), Hinoka (Sky Knight) Personal Skill: Healing Descant (Allies within 2 tiles recover up to 10% of their HP at the start of player phase) Pair-Up Stats (C B A S): Spd Skl Spd Spd+Lck Growths (With Default Class): HP: 25% (25) STR: 50% (60) MAG: 25% (25) SKL: 60% (70) SPD: 60% (70) LCK: 40% (60) DEF: 15% (15) RES: 35% (35) See previous analysis Azura's a dancer, she does dancer things. I may not be allowed to use her, but there's no reason for you not to. She's got much more availability than in Conquest, but she's slightly less useful due to the circumstances of Birthright - the wide open map design and higher focus on enemy phase combat makes her refreshing slightly less impactful, and can make keeping her out of enemy range a little tricker. There's also less units with the Shelter skill to pull off multiple refreshes in one turn. Her access to the Sky Knight class is no longer unique or interesting, and Shigure's paralogue being free EXP is less meaninful when the game gives you the option to grind... But she is still great and should be deployed every single chapter to get the most out of her ability. I guess you could also use the Guard Naginata to increase her survivability if you somehow manage to grind her to C lances, but that's really not worth the hassle. Making Azura a Shrine Maiden would 100% be a waste of her talents, and she can already go Sky Knight. Don't bother with either of her A+ supports unless you're just messing around.  Kaze Ninja (HS: Samurai) A+ Support Partners: Silas (Cavalier), Saizo (Samurai) Personal Skill: Miraculous Save (When a partner in a support pair, grant lead unit a Luck% chance of surviving a fatal hit with 1 HP remaining if HP > 1. In other words, it gives the lead unit the Miracle skill (luck stat used is lead unit's, not Kaze's)) Pair-Up Stats (C B A S): Spd Skl Res Skl+Spd Growths (With default class): HP: 55% (60) STR: 40% (45) MAG: 0% (0) SKL: 45% (65) SPD: 65% (85) LCK: 20% (20) DEF: 20% (25) RES: 35% (50) See previous analysis Kaze's got much more availability than before, and he's got access to a huge amount of cool shurikens... Unfortunately being a Ninja no longer makes him special. Saizo, Kagero, and Asugi are all Ninjas too, and multiple characters have it as their heart seal option. Worst of all, Kaze will suffer an entirely pointless plot death if he's not A supported with Corrin by the end of Chapter 15... He's still very useful though. His poor bulk isn't quite as much an issue with weaker enemies to face, and Rinkah makes an excellent support partner to keep his strength and defense up. Saizo might tank better than him and Kagero might outdamage him, but more of a good thing is not bad. He can pick up some cool skills from Cavalier but otherwise he wants to stay as a Ninja. Don't A+ support him with his brother, he gains nothing from it. Unless you really want him to be a Samurai and don't have any more Heart Seals...?
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Dec 6, 2021 15:19
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 Rinkah Oni Savage (HS: Ninja) A+ Support Partners: Orochi (Diviner), Kagero (Ninja), Oboro (Spear Fighter) Personal Skill: Fiery Blood (+4 damage dealt when unit is not at full HP) Pair-Up Bonuses (C B A S): Def Spd Str Spd+Def Growths (With Default Class): HP: 20% (40) STR: 25% (45) MAG: 15% (25) SKL: 50% (50) SPD: 45% (55) LCK: 35% (35) DEF: 45% (65) RES: 20% (20) Here she is, the much maligned Rinkah. Is an E rank in clubs rather prohibitive for your only axe user until Chapter 14? Maybe. Is an 8 strength base and 25% base strength growth bad for a unit with visible abs and large biceps? Kind of. Are Rinkah's growths completely contrary to the typical Oni Savage, despite her being the only one you can obtain without reclassing in the entire game? Yeah... Thankfully Rinkah manages to carve out a niche for herself by having a combination of both speed and physical bulk, something rather rare in Birthright. A 65% effective defense growth is very high even for a game like Fates in which units tend to have high growths across the board, and in Birthright the enemies you face will be weaker than those you would be seeing in other routes. While a base speed of 8 isn't particularly great, the huge number of units in classes that provide speed boosts as support partners make it likely you'll have at least one unit spare to attach themsleves to Rinkah in the early chapters to give her a leg up until her high nautral speed growth kicks in. Rinkah's 20 base health and 40% growth aren't particularly inspiring, but compared to the rest of the cast she's hardly unique in not having very much HP. She'll still most likely be one of your bulkiest units by comparison. Her underwhelming strength growth and early reliance on her Bronze Club are offset somewhat by her great personal which boosts her attack output by 4 so long as she's taken any amount of damage. If you're struggling to weaken Rinkah to activate her personal you can always buy a HP tonic each chapter to guarantee she won't be at full HP, but as front line unit she shouldn't have to worry too much about going out of her way to take damage. And if she is having difficulty taking damage then you have a godlike tank on your side and shouldn't be worrying anyway. Much like the Fighter class in Conquest, the Oni class is great for the pair-up bonuses it provides. Rinkah will reward whoever she's paired with +4 strength and +2 defense, something which will help just about anyone but will be most appreciated by fast 1-2 range attackers such as Ninjas. Rinkah's personal pair-up bonuses are also great, granting further strength defense and speed to whoever she's paired with. Death Blow's not a bad skill for her spouse or children to pick up either, and Shove is great for positioning if you can remember that it exists. The only real downside to Rinkah as a wife is that her children will be a little weak offensively, but they will also inherit her great defense and speed. Subaki's daughter Caeldori has a personal skill that allows her to benefit from significantly lower offenses than her opponent's, so Subaki's not a bad partner for her. Rinkah's biggest problem is probably how terrible her start is. As an attacker she's outshined by both Corrin and Kaze in the prologue chapters, so unless you're deliberately feeding her kills she'll most likely be stuck serving as a support partner for one or both of them. Her E rank in clubs is terrible, and clubs themselves are easily the worst of the Hoshidan weapons, being noticeably weaker than axes for the almost entirely irrelevant bonus of +5% crit. Grinding out her weapon rank as soon as possible is the key to making her useful if you do want to use her. There is an unfortunately babysitting period required to make Rinkah good and if her growths fail to kick in to save her from her underwhelming bases then she might be stuck as a support partner forever. Oni Chieftain is probably her best class, it's stronger and bulkier than Blacksmith as well as giving Rinkah a big boost to her magic. E rank tomes aren't likely to help a unit with as mediocre magic as her, but the boost does help her become devastating with the Bolt Axe - reliable 1-2 range is very handy on a fast and bulky unit in a route full of weak and slow enemies, especially with a support partner like Orochi or Hayato to help her. Otherwise Blacksmith's not a bad choice if she's going purely physical and needs the extra speed and accuracy, but even then it's not always the best choice. Ninja is unfortunately a terrible fit for Rinkah and shouldn't really be considered unless she's got some initial strength procs to coast off of, her base strength will be terrible and an effective growth of 30% will not make it any better. Stealing the Diviner class from Orochi could work as a gimmick, although its terrible class bases would cut into her bulk. Spear Fighter Rinkah from Oboro might also work and will have some nice skills to offer, but isn't really an improvement on her default class. Pros
Cons
My Thoughts: Should have had a blue oni counterpart unit, maybe a sibling?  Sakura Shrine Maiden (HS: Sky Knight) A+ Support Partners: Hinoka (Sky Knight), Hana (Samurai), Azura (Sky Knight) Personal Skill: Quiet Strength (Allies within 2 spaces receive 2 less damage in combat) Pair-Up Bonuses (C B A S): Mag Spd Lck Spd+Res Growths (With Default Class): HP: 45% (45) STR: 30% (35) MAG: 50% (60) SKL: 40% (50) SPD: 40% (55) LCK: 55% (70) DEF: 30% (30) RES: 20% (40) The luck based nature of Fire Emblem's character growths inevitably makes it hard to make fair judgements on units without being too influenced by your own personal experiences... This is absolutely the case for my view of Sakura because I think I have a cursed copy of the game in which her defensive growths are about twice as high as they should be. Yeah I know in practice Sakura's defenses are merely "above average for a typical healer", but in my world she's built like a brick hospital and never dies. Sakura is Birthright's counterpart to Elise. Her stats are much less extreme, but she's still got a high emphasis on magic and luck and mediocre to bad physical stats. Her base strength growth is still higher than Rinkah's, though... As a healer she does perfectly fine. Healing rods are imo more useful than staves, and her personal skill lets her boost her allies bulk witout having to be right next to them like Elise does. Out of all her competition, only Felicia is likely to rival the strength of her heals, and even she'll eventually be outclassed when Sakura's growths kick in. The combination of her passive and the skills your initial servant comes with will let you make some very formidable chokepoints. Sakura doesn't have any particularly bad flaws. At worst she's a competent staffbot, at best she'll be able to join your other combat units in battle once she promotes. She's a bit frail, but not as much as Elise or Felicia would be. The usefulness of 1-2 range spells off of her superior magic stat make Onmyoji the superior promotion choice despite Priestess having the same or higher points in literally every single stat, but the latter is just about workable if her strength is good enough or you want to mess around with bows. Priestess feels a little less like a joke option than making Lissa a War Cleric, anyway. Onmoyji doesn't even have superior heals thanks to both classes having the same magic stat. A different alternative to either is to Heart Seal her into a Falcon Knight - she'll keep her ability to use staves, and with a C rank in lances she'll make great use of the Bolk Naginata. It'll take some work and/or resources to get her there, but she can be surprisingly effective as a frontliner. As a mother Sakura is pretty decent. She'll pass on her dragon blood to her children, and her growths are high enough across the board that she can't really ruin physical based children like some other mages do. Shrine Maiden unfortunately is not a very useful class though, so it's unlikely you'll be marrying her off to pass on that. Also her base resistance is weirdly bad despite being a cleric, I somehow never noticed that until now. Two out of three of her Friendship Seal options are redundant with her Heart Seal class, and Samurai isn't very useful for her. You can make her one and it'll work because this game isn't too difficult, but it's not something you'd ever do because it's optimal. Pros
Cons
My Thoughts: I'd rather Elise be my sister
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Dec 6, 2021 19:07
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I always use Rinkah. And Subaki actually. The 2 of them have never turned out horrible. At worst they're simply mediocre, and sometimes they can surprise you.
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Dec 7, 2021 00:11
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The Rinkah paradox is that she has good speed and excellent defense, but those are undercut by mediocre strength and awful HP and resistance. Even if she's only taking chip damage from most enemies, they'll still kill her fairly quickly thanks to having almost no health to back it up, and mages wipe the floor with her (and even have WTA to add insult to injury). Fiery Blood helps a lot early on, but she'll often end up unable to meaningfully contribute late game. The Bad Units Run instance of Rinkah ended up a mediocre mixed attacker with clubs and the Bolt Axe and was mostly relegated to backpack duty, but there were a few chapters around the midgame where her high defense let her hold a couple positions that were difficult for anyone else to block. She's playable, and if you toss a bunch of stat boosters on her she can be competent, but even among the generally poor quality of the non-royal Birthright units she's on the low end. I feel like if she was in a GBA game she'd also have like 6 Con just to really drive the point home 
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Dec 7, 2021 01:55
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It'll never not be darkly hilarious that, in another line in the long saga for FE: Fate's absurdity that the royal who's blatantly designed to go into Priestess, and does in basically all the spinoffs like Warriors, has the the best bow for them not available in their base route. Because the Shining Bow (magical 1-2 range) is only available in Conquest via a My Castle Armory upgrade(who's even using a magical bow in Conquest?), and in Revelations via a map drop. Technically you can get one on any route as a ranking reward from the My Castle battle ranking, but that's a hilarious joke at this point - and to an extent always was.
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Dec 7, 2021 02:29
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theshim posted:I feel like if she was in a GBA game she'd also have like 6 Con just to really drive the point home Lord Koth posted:It'll never not be darkly hilarious that, in another line in the long saga for FE: Fate's absurdity that the royal who's blatantly designed to go into Priestess, and does in basically all the spinoffs like Warriors, has the the best bow for them not available in their base route. Because the Shining Bow (magical 1-2 range) is only available in Conquest via a My Castle Armory upgrade(who's even using a magical bow in Conquest?), and in Revelations via a map drop. Technically you can get one on any route as a ranking reward from the My Castle battle ranking, but that's a hilarious joke at this point - and to an extent always was.
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Dec 7, 2021 19:01
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  Time to uphold our vow! I think it's our vow anyway. I don't actually remember what the vow was. Maybe I would know if I didn't skip every cutscene.  Kevin's taken up the life of a healer, so presumably he's here at this makeshift hospital to assist in clerical (hehe) duties.  Conflict already? We didn't invade Hoshido until like Chapter 16 in Conquest... I guess Garon needs something to do if he's not busy torturing Corrin for no reason.  Corrin feels both more intelligent and quicker witted in this route. Sometimes they make the occassional joke and it catches me off guard.  Here's the first real Birthright exclusive map. Fort Jinya's looking a little different than it did in Conquest, but I guess this is a different part of it. This map is structured like a defend map, but the object is just to rout. It's very chokepointy and easily turtleable, but there is a chest that's at risk at being opened by an enemy if you take too much time. Standards for Chapter 7 aren't super high in Fates but I've never liked this map.  All the way in the bottom left is Silas. He's the boss of this chapter. He'll join automatically at the end of the map, you don't have to recruit him or anything. He'll stay in the corner and only approach if you aggro him for a while, but eventually he and his Cavalier friends will start moving on their own. His weapon ranks are high because he's an enemy in Lunatic. They unfortunately will not carry over when he joins, but they are higher than what he starts with in Conquest.  There are various chokepoints in this map blocked by paired-up enemies who don't move. Sometimes Birthright likes to pull a mean trick on you and have a non-moving enemy paired up with a moving one, but that's not the case here. Not having to deal with the entire map having Grisly Wound makes for a nice change of pace!  All tucked away in the very top of the map are Sakura's retainers, Subaki and Hana. They are not particularly useful in this map and starting so far away from the action does not help.  Subaki's got a similar reputation to Rinkah as being a very weird unit with rather unfitting stats for his class. He's somewhat tanky but not very powerful, and his poor speed means he'll struggle to double on enemy phase when he can't make use of Darting Blow. He doesn't quite deserve the hate he gets but this map is really not made for him - flier utility doesn't mean much in a map with no terrain and tight corridors, and his bulk is offset by all the Outlaws who can shoot him down.  Hana isn't particularly useful in this map either... or ever, imo. I've definitely been burned by bad RNG on Hana many times before but I've never liked her as a unit. She starts way too underleveled and her niche of being a fast and frail player phase attacking swordlocked foot unit just is not useful at all in Birthright. Maybe I'll come around on her though! It's hard for her to do much here when this map is so chokepointy and there's so many lance users with high bulk, but I'll try my best to get her kills.  Those empty deployment slots are taunting me... Troubadour Kevin means I don't have to worry about missing a healer, but not having Azura is going to make this map a little slower.  Silas claims to be Kevin's childhood friend, but he doesn't remember him. This guy is totally sus, let's kill him for EXP!  First on the agenda: rob the hospital we're supposed to be defending. Fire Emblem games always let you steal from your allies like this and they never seem to complain.  I'm going to try my best to make better use of my stat boosters this time... I do also kind of want to give them all to Setsuna because it would be funny. Rinkah seems like she would be an obvious recepient for this.  Hana hitches a ride with Felicia to get her to the frontlines faster. They do have a support together which I don't think I've ever seen...  Unfortunately nobody can quite reach this guy to attack him. Rinkah can at least stand where he can throw something at her to lower her HP.  Unfortunately it's really hard to see through those weird Knight helmets and he misses the shot.  Kaze's robbery puts him in range of an Outlaw who somehow shoots him through a solid wall, and also somehow teleports his adjacent friend over said wall. I had straight up forgotten enemies deliberately engineer dual attacks outside of Conquest, I need to get my act together!  There's a big queue of guys outside all waiting to get beat up. The enemies themselves might not be very strong, but they are all clustered together and you will need decently tanky units like Corrin or Rinkah to hold chokepoints.  Hana's bases are... not very good. Once her amazing strength and speed growths kick in she can at least cleave through enemies on player phase, but right now she's not doing much of anything without a support partner. Even her good avoid here is only because of Duellist's Blow, she'll be much more vulnerable on enemy phase.  Rinkah will choke this point for now. She's bulky enough, and the paired up units in front of her won't be moving to let any more attackers in anyway.  Weakening this guy with everything I have still isn't enough for Hana to make the kill. Hmm...  Subaki pairs up with Kevin, Kevin brings him to Hana. Maybe now she'll be fast enough to double?  Yeah that's better. That dodge was necessary for her to live - the stationary Knight would have killed her with a Javelin if she had been weakened. Thanks to Fates's hybrid RNG a 27% hit is literally a 27% hit, so dodge tanks aren't quite as reliable as they were in past games.  Hana's personal skill damages surrounding enemies when she makes a kill. It's like a worse Savage Blow. It's not bad, but it's hard to make use of...  Rinkah's got a much more meaty damage output when Fiery Blood is active. With so little HP it's a little risky for her to be weakened, but she's not taking much damage from these enemies.   This is not Conquest so this Outlaw will happily shoot Rinkah and get his resistance sealed for absolutely no reason. I don't have any magical attackers that could take advantage of this, but it is funny.  The stationary Knight was blocking this dragon vein. It turns the surrounding area's floor into heal tiles. It's not useless, I guess? I've never found it too helpful though, and I would like to be advancing forward rather than staying here forever.   Oops, I just played myself out of a kill by healing Rinkah out of Fiery Blood range before having her attack. You have to pay attention to these things...  It is vital that Kaze get healed by Kevin as often as possible so they can build supports from this. I have until Chapter 15 to get their A support...  Rinkah's getting all the EXP funnelled into her. I can't complain with great levels like these, but she is already quite overleveled and is earning less and less EXP from each kill...  This is a neat little positioning tool if you remember it exists. It works similarly to the Shove mechanic from the Tellius games, except you can only shove allies but there's otherwise no limit on who can shove who.  This Outlaw won't move and will happily stand here to block all his friends from making a move. Convenient if you want to stay alive, annoying if you're trying to muscle past this chokepoint to chase a thief.  My slow progress has led to this side of the map becoming clogged. I was hoping to send in Subaki and Hana to get kills, but Rinkah might have to stay on the frontline until they're all gone...  Time to speed things up a little. With Hana's support, Rinkah will be able to double all of these enemies...  ...and ORKO them all besides the Knights. Wasteful in terms of EXP, but effective!  There's an Armourslayer in the chest I've yet to reach. It would be really helpful right about now!  I guess this is just what Felicia's levels look like now. Be fast if you'd like...  Even Kaze and Felicia are seeing more action than Hana and Subaki thanks to their ranged attacks. This map isn't really designed for them to do well anyway, but I feel as if I could be doing this better.  At least they can still earn EXP while paired up. This level fills me with hope - I've had Hanas before that absolutely refused to gain speed at all. Just like Charlotte she needs a lot of effort to start doubling.  Nice! As soon as this chapter is over I'm buying Rinkah a Steel Club, she deserves it.  At the beginning of turn 7 this guy will show up to rob the place. You can tell he's going for the chest because he's the only Outlaw with Locktouch... He's also carrying gold because that's how Birthright distributes most of its items.  Things are looking a lot emptier now. Usually it's Corrin I end up feeding half the map to... At least now I can have the newbies come and clean up.  Subaki's not so bad now, but his bad strength and speed growths will catch up with him. Without help he'll struggle a lot to do meaningful damage.  Hana unfortunately is not a GBA Myrmidon and you cannot just through her at all the earlygame axe users and have her dodge everything. She still can't double without help either...  This next stretch of the map is a little annoying, there's a lot of enemies here who will end up getting baited all at once. The Cavaliers will also begin charging in through the left chokepoint soonish, but I don't know when.  Rinkah will be baiting them. She chugs the free HP tonic I got in Chapter 5 to give her enough HP that a heal won't take her out of Fiery Blood range...  Nice! This is very good for Kaze, a shame he's unlikely to be used too much this run.  The Outlaw will need to escape with his treasure after taking it so you have much more time than you might think at first. The only way he's getting out is through the front entrance, he won't disappear down the stairs.  I'm feeling a lot more optimistic about Hana now. Not that this is all too unlikely when her speed growth is something like 70%, but...   Here come the horse boys. I need to choke this point before they overwhelm me.  ...you'll see this a lot from Subaki. I guess it's a little novel to see HP and luck instead of HP and skill.  Rinkah will choke the point handily here, but she's reached the point of only getting 3 EXP per kill. I should really swap her out as soon as I can.  At least she can't kill Silas. He hits a little hard but he's not so tough.  Time to feed this kill to someone who needs the EXP. Subaki's been eating scraps all map...   It's true, he did not need to get that crit.  Now the danger is mostly gone, Hana can take the lead. With Rinkah giving her strength and defense she suddenly becomes quite good!  Here's the guy with the loot. Very nice of him to come to me after grabbing the treasure for me... In a meaner game he'd escape from the stairs in the treasure room.  The rest of the enemies will just sit there until you come to them. The Knight in the middle is guarding a dragon vein and won't move...  Why do Troubadours have such high skill in this game? They straight up lose some when reclassing to Strategist, the version of the class that actually has weapons, and even Butlers/Maids have a lower growth in it iirc. I suppose offensive staves do use it for accuracy, but it's such an odd choice.  Oh and I guess I only gave Kevin one of these and it was mostly used up already. Whoops!  Getting rid of the remaining Knights is easy now I have the proper tools. I wasn't expecting this to OHKO.  The strength streak ends, but the speed streak continues. Please keep getting faster!  17 turns mostly spent sat at the same chokepoint. Hana and Felicia got to be MVPs because they built the most support points together.  See, this Corrin is way smarter. Thinking murderdad is evil is a low bar to clear, but they have cleared it.  Ryoma and Takumi are missing and we've got to find them. My ruleset forbids me from using either of them, so can I just leave them behind? I'm sure I could invade Nohr with my current army...  Silas joins us with weapon ranks 1 higher each than what he had in Conquest, as well as some better weapons. The Javelin I think is the only one available all run, so it's quite important. The Steel Sword could be nice for Hana, but she can't use it yet.   Oh and these two are here now as well. Saizo is the better of the pair so obviously he's the one I'm benching. Next time: The world's easiest desert map
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Dec 7, 2021 19:01
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Ugh god Birthright frontloading all of its units means I'm going to have to write so many of these in a row. It's fine!!! I like doing it. Just maybe not four and a half of them at once. Subaki Sky Knight (HS: Samurai) A+ Support Partners: Saizo (Ninja), Azama (Monk), Hinata (Samurai) Personal Skill: Perfectionist (+15 hit and avoid when unit is at full HP) Pair-Up Stats (C B A S): Def Skl Def Skl+Res Growths (With Default Class): HP: 55% (55) STR: 30% (40) MAG: 20% (20) SKL: 50% (60) SPD: 20% (35) LCK: 25% (45) DEF: 45% (45) RES: 5% (25) Ah, (T)Subaki. When somebody claims to be perfect, spite often draws others to find all the ways in which they are flawed. There are quite a few ways in which Subaki is flawed, so that's probably why so many people don't like him! Subaki is weird. His stat growth total is one of the lowest in the game, and they're kind of all over the place. Fitting for his over-compensating perfectionist nature, Subaki's highest natural growths are in stats Sky Knights are normally bad at, and his lowest ones are in stats his class are good at, resulting in a unit with underwhelming but consistent growths across the board. Just like Rinkah, he does somewhat make up for his bad stats by having a lot of them invested into his physical bulk, something that most Birthright exclusive units are lacking in. It's hard for fliers to be bad in Fire Emblem games, especially ones with a rescue or pair-up mechanic that allows them to pick up other, better units and get them to the frontlines faaster. Subaki's always going to be better than the likes of Setsuna or Hayato so long as there's good allies for him to pick up and carry. Otherwise Subaki's not got much going for him over other fliers besides his availability and his bulk, and even then Hinoka joins in the chapter immediately after he does with equal or better bases and a Guard Naginata that she can wield at base and he can't. A trained Subaki will be bulkier than all your other flies, but not by a large amount. Being outclassed as a flier by at least 3 other units doesn't make him bad or not worth using in addition to them, but it does hurt him somewhat. If you're keeping Subaki as a Sky Knight he'll need good weapons to make the most of himself. Mediocre offenses matter a lot less with the large amount of effective weaponry available in Birthright, and once he's able to use the Guard Naginata he'll be a lot tankier than Hinoka. A Bolt Naginata build is entirely possible if he's got a magic-boosting support partner like Orochi, and that is in fact what I'm planning to do with him. Falcon Knight gives him the speed and magic to make the most use of it, and his 20% magic growth isn't awful, although it's not really worth much coming off of his 0 magic base either. Kinshi Knight isn't a bad promotion choice for Subaki if he's marrying Setsuna, allowing him to get Quick Draw for free which combined with Darting Blow will fix his mediocre offenses on player phase. Otherwise if you want Subaki to actually tank things you're probably better off reclassing him. As a Master of Arms he'll keep his lance rank while also having higher bulk and no weakness to effective weaponry, although it will make him even slower and rob him of his flying utility. Subaki's got some decent A+ support options. Ninja lets him be a 1-2 range tank while still bolstering his bad speed and resistance, although his offenses will be worse than all of your other ninjas. As a Great Master he can be a tanky grounded unit while also still getting to use his weapon rank in lances, although if he doesn't need the extra bulk he should just stay a Falcon Knight. Hinata just gives him Samurai which he already has. Perfectionist might be good on other units, but it's really not suited to Subaki. As a slow and already accurate tank he's not going to make much use of the bonuses it gives him, and his HP growth is high enough that he'll most likely have to be healed up after each level anyway. At least Camraderie can fix that if he's near allies? If reclassed to Samurai it might go well combined with Duellist's Blow, but Subaki's not really the kind of unit to be cutting down enemies on player phase. Pros
My Thoughts: Did you know his growth total is the exact same as Selena's? Hana Samurai (HS: Shrine Maiden) A+ Support Partners: Sakura (Shrine Maiden), Felicia (Troubadour), Setsuna (Archer) Personal Skill: Fearsome Blow (When unit triggers battle and defeats an enemy, enemies adjacent to user lose 20% of their max HP) Pair-Up Stats (C B A S): Spd Str Skl Str+Spd Growths (With Default Class): HP: 25% (35) STR: 55% (65) MAG: 10% (10) SKL: 45% (60) SPD: 55% (75) LCK: 25% (40) DEF: 20% (20) RES: 30% (40) Hana. I've not used Hana a huge amount, and the Hanas I have used haven't turned out all that well. She's probably a little better than I'm giving her credit for, but only a little. Hana is Birthright's Charlotte, right down to the point where she starts very underleveled for no good reason. Her strength and speed are excellent (her base growths are better than Charlotte's!), but her bulk is not. She is very clearly intended to be a player phase juggernaut, but that's not really a type of unit Birthright's densely packed maps have much room for. With some investment she'll cut through most enemies like nothing, but they'll cut through her just as easily. Hana's biggest obstacle is her bases. If she can't double enemies then she's unlikely to be able to kill them, and if she can't kill them she's not getting much EXP. If you want to make the most use of her she needs tonics or someone to pair up with her to make her faster in the first few chapters while she works on getting those vital speed procs. Once she's out of that rut, she'll be fast and strong enough to one-round most enemies with the right weapon, and with Duellist's Blow she'll have a decent chance at not getting hit when she attacks either. That's basically all she does. Fearsome Blow helps make her a little more useful on player phase, but its damage radius is so small you'll find it hard to hit more than one enemy at a time with it. Otherwise she's a sword-using infantry unit with no good 1-2 range who dies to any good physical hit or a few magical ones. Her HP and defense are terrible, her luck is dubious enough to cut into her avoid and let enemies get crit chances on her, and her resistance is not good enough to make up for all of those other flaws. Swords aren't a bad weapon type to be stuck with in Birthright thanks to all the cool katanas you can buy, but you've got quite a few other swordies to do the job better. Even Hinata's better than her for a while thanks to his good bases. With the right pair-up partner Hana can fix some of her issues, but she'll be much more useful as a stat backpack for someone else than they would be for her. Master of Arms can be good for Hana if you want her to die less, otherwise Swordmaster's the way to go. It plays to her strengths more as well as increasing both her crit and avoid further. With an Armourslayer and a Dual Katana she can do most of what she'd be doing with the other weapons regardless, and the combination of Swordmaster's innate avoid, Duellist's Blow, and the Sunrise Katana can be stacked quite high. Shrine Maiden is not useful at all, but I guess Hana could just about function as a Priestess if you wanted her to. Onmyoji has nothing for her. A+ supporting Hana with Sakura is redundant thanks to her Heart Seal class, Archer gives Hana some very nice player phase skills and synergises well with her high offenses and terrible bulk, and Troubadour is about as bad an option as Shrine Maiden. Hana might be able to get use out of bulkier sword using classes such as Great Knight from Silas or Blacksmith from Hinata, but I've never tried them. I guess she'd do pretty well as a Master Ninja too? Pros
My Thoughts: I deliberately did not mention being outclassed by Ryoma as a flaw for her since being outclassed by Ryoma is a flaw for everyone.
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Dec 8, 2021 14:18
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Seeing that Hana can get Archer and her growth spread, Archer Hana looks a lot better than regular Hana at least?
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Dec 8, 2021 18:24
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I went and dug out my copy of Fates to look at how my dudes were doing in the Bad Units Run. Kinda fun to look back on this stuff, though I don't remember who I used stat boosters on, so it won't be especially accurate as a bellwether. Subaki is an enigma. I get that they were trying to make an unusual unit, but they forgot to give him something he's actually good at besides Skill. He can be an okay physical wall, especially with the Guard Naginata and switched over to Master of Arms, but it comes at the cost of absolutely wretched Speed and no Res to speak of at all, making him easy prey for lategame Berserkers and Sorcerors (and there are plenty of both). His killing power is pretty pathetic as well, and his personal skill isn't even useful to dodgetank with because of his awful base evade. The fact that he's a flier alone gives him some base usefulness, and even being outclassed horribly as a combat unit he can still provide some utility, but he's just a mess. I was barely able to do anything with him in my Bad Units Run (he was mostly on or over his averages, except a couple points low on defense) and I look forward to seeing you make actual good use of him, because you're a lot better at Fire Emblem than I am Fun fact: the only stat Subaki will cap on average (going through the default of Falcon Knight at 20) is Skill. He's well short of everything else. Hana is a glass cannon. She will almost always cap Strength, Skill, and Speed, and she packs a surprisingly decent Res, but everything else is awful. She's really good at deleting a target on Player Phase and that's about it. There's a decent argument to be made towards sealing her over to Archer so she can hang back a bit more. She does need to gain a few points of speed early on to be useful but that's not too big an ask with her 75% growth. The Bad Units Run Hana ended up even glassier and cannonier (that's a word shut up), capping Strength and Skill by level 12 promoted. I think I let myself use the free DLC seals for fun so she went through Great Lord for a while, but I don't know if that helped or hindered her to be honest.
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Dec 8, 2021 23:45
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This just shows me that I had a really goddamn weird Hana in my Birthright game. She wound up with stats I'd associate with Effie, not Charlotte.
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Dec 9, 2021 01:02
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The other reason why I'd recommend Hana to Archer up is the excessive fragility. She was in one-shot range of enemy berserkers, and had a more -than-zero chance of getting hit on my file.
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Dec 9, 2021 03:56
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The only problem with Archer Hana is that Birthright absolutely throws archers at you. Setsuna, Takumi and Reina all in the early game, plus Hinoka and Subaki can promote into Kinshi, and 3 units who can seal into Apothecary, and 3 ninjas for mechanist, and Yukimura and Shura. Also Sakura for good measure. Ninja is a better class for her anyway since she can still use swords and will probably end up faster and stronger than Saizo. Subaki is a lot like Odin. He's not great, but he's solid in several of the early game chapters and only really falls off after you have Reina and Scarlet. I generally use him in place of Silas. Setsuna is a perfect pairing for him and both make respectable kinshis.
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Dec 9, 2021 04:49
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Hana would be a clear contender for best unit in a game with a 2RN hit chance Even though Birthright throws a ton of ninjas at you, Master Ninja Hana sounds like a good time?
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Dec 9, 2021 05:13
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Carlosologist posted:Hana would be a clear contender for best unit in a game with a 2RN hit chance I guess it does sound a little contradictory. I've never had good luck with Saizo or Kagero. Both are a little slow when they join and struggle to reliably double. Also Vantage Master Ninja is a thing and Hana uses fewer resources to get there. She'll double more reliably than Saizo and hit almost as hard as Kagero, and Vantage plus effective weaponry makes her shaky durability more manageable. Also also, she'll probably have C swords if you wait to get Vantage which will let her use the best swords as a Master Ninja.
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Dec 9, 2021 17:24
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Kagero's Skill base and growth are so shaky that she can't take advantage of her massive strength
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Dec 9, 2021 21:20
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 Felicia is fired from being my assistant for illegally trying to boost her own stats. This horrible shambling monstrosity won't try to cheat!  Now I can buy this to get some actual weapons for Rinkah. The Lottery Shop also tempts me, but that's got to wait a chapter.    Did you know that the iron version of all 3 Hoshidan weapons have 6 might? Clubs really drew the short straw here, +5 crit is useless for anything but making enemies have annoying 1% crit chances against you.  Each different scroll boosts a different stat. The Ox Spirit will make Orochi a little bulkier as well as helping her hit harder, I'll get one for her.  The Sheep Spirit is tempting. I probably would have bought it if I hadn't already bought an Ox Spirit first. Whoops!  Hana's luck is weirdly bad so she gets the Goddess Icon so she doesn't get crit. Rinkah also gets the Robe. I might still be giving most of my stat boosters to Setsuna, but she wouldn't benefit much from these anyway.    More C supports. Just 2 more Kaze supports to go before he doesn't die!!!       Statz. Rinkah's looking a lot tankier now, and Hana won't be facing any more 1% crits. Silas, Saizo, and Orochi aren't listed because they'll be included in the  below.Silas Cavalier (HS: Mercenary) A+ Support Partners: Jakob (Troubadour), Kaze (Ninja), Ryoma (Samurai) Personal Skill: Vow of Friendship (+3 damage dealt and -3 damage taken if Corrin is under 50% HP, regardless of position on map) Pair-Up Stats (C B A S): Str Skl Spd Str+Def Growths (With Default Class): HP: 40% (50) STR: 45% (60) MAG: 5% (5) SKL: 50% (60) SPD: 40% (50) LCK: 40% (55) DEF: 40% (50) RES: 25% (30) See Previous Anaylsys Silas is back! He joins a single chapter (half a chapter, even) later with one extra rank in each weapon. This time he's got the advantage of being the only Cavalier instead of one of many. I'll be honest, I've never actually used him as anything but a pair-up bot in Birthright... I'd assume he's better in BR than in Conquest where his mediocre speed is less of a downside and his class and high physical bulk make him more more unique. He can also achieve the Sol Master Ninja combo with much less difficulty, and thanks to facing weaker enemies will have a much lower chance of dying while using it too. He's a good unit in a route with worse standards for units overall, it's very hard to imagine he's not better. Is unfortunate that the first chapter after he joins is a desert though. Samurai's not a bad A+ support choice if you want to fix his speed, but I can't see it offering him anything that Master Ninja doesn't already. Ryoma probably appreciates taking Paladin from Silas more than Silas appreciates taking Samurai from him. Saizo Ninkja (HS: Samurai) A+ Support Partners: Kaze (Samurai), Subaki (Sky Knight), Ryoma (Samurai) Personal Skill: Pyrotechnics (When unit triggers battle at under half HP, user and enemies within 2 tiles lose 20% of their max HP) Pair-Up Stats (C B A S): Lck Spd Skl Str+Lck Growths (With Default Class): HP: 40% (45) STR: 50% (55) MAG: 45% (45) SKL: 60% (80) SPD: 30% (50) LCK: 55% (55) DEF: 45% (50) RES: 10% (25) It's Saizo, the "Angry Ninja" as Heroes calls him. I never really thought of him as angry, more disappointed. I married him in my first playthrough of Revelation with a Corrin that had giant spiky blue hair that made her look like Sonic the Hedgehog. I straight up think Saizo is the best non-royal unit in all of Birthright... which is why I'm not using him. Master Ninja is imo easily the best combat class in the game, and Saizo's weird growths compliment it well - much like Subaki he has high growths in stats his class is bad at and lower ones his class is good at, except unlike Subaki his growths are not terrible and in fact are the highest out of any unit in the game, not counting Mozu or her children with Aptitude. A significant amount of that total comes from a high magic growth he doesn't really use so it's not quite indicative of his usefulness, but it's an achievement all the same. His strength and defense are both very high, his poor speed and resistance are made up for his class bases and the speed bonus and WTA against tomes that shurikens give him, and even his high luck stat helps make him just a little harder to kill. His skill is also incredible but that doesn't really mean a whole lot for him. Saizo's one flaw is that his mediocre HP isn't helped in any way by his class, but his high defense, passable resistance, and consistent abiliy to fill his dual guard gauge help keep him alive. He's the closest thing you have to Ryoma until the man himself joins your party. Like a lot of characters in this route, Saizo does need some help. Without a pair-up partner or tonic his speed is a little shaky, and if he can't double than despite his high strength he likely can't do much damage either. But when most units in BR need a good support partner and Saizo goes from good to amazing with the right one, it's hard to hold that against him. Anyone who boosts his speed will do in his early levels, but a single tonic to take his bases up to 15 speed with a shuriken will do fine too. All of the ninjas in Birthright are great and they'll all do fine, but Saizo's trait of being hardest to kill puts him above the others for me. Not being as fast as Kaze won't matter so long as he's able to double consistently, and even if Kagero's a bit stronger the both of them will be ramming their strength caps some time after promotion regardless. He might need a little support with his speed, but Kaze will need help with his strength and Kagero will need help with her bulk and it's not as if speed-boosting support partners are at all rare in Birthright. Large groups of hard-hitting magical attackers like Sorcerers are the one thing he won't deal with better than the other two. The reason why I've not mentioned the Flame Shuriken as a plus for Saizo despite listing the Bolt Naginata as a plus for Subaki even though his magic base and growth are both worse is that... I really don't think Saizo needs it? His strength is already very high and once the weapon shop hits tier two you'll have Dual and Sting shurikens to deal with the physically bulky enemies you'd otherwise want to take down with magic. A magic build for Saizo could absolutely work and if you paired him with Orochi it would probably be very fun, but I'd save the Flame Shuriken for Felicia or Asugi, Saizo's son who has a 50% natural magic growth. I guess if you wanted the most magical Asugi possible you'd be pairing Saizo with Orochi or Sakura anyway... Master Ninja is such a good class that I don't think Saizo should seriously be considering anything else. Mechanist will help his strength and defense even more, but I would recommend against it as it would cut too much into his speed and avoid. Duellist's Blow, Vantage, and Astra could all be helpful, but he wouldn't want to stay a Swordmaster for very long. Darting Blow from Sky Knight could help his speed but he's much more of an enemy phase tank anyway. If you married him to Orochi you could probably have a lot of fun with a memey Basara build, his skill would be high enough that he'd be hitting Rend Heaven constantly. Oh and his personal sucks. It is actively detrimental. It doesn't come up much since it only activates on player phase and that's not where he'll be doing most of his combat, but I would make sure Saizo carries around a Vulnerary to use instead of attacking whenever he's on low HP. All 3 ninjas in this game have sucky personals but Saizo got stuck with the worst one! Pros
My Thoughts: Only wears the mask to hide his baby face Orochi Diviner (HS: Apothecary) A+ Support Partners: Rinkah (Oni Savage), Oboro (Spear Fighter), Kagero (Ninja) Personal Skill: Capture (Can select the "capture" command to send a generic enemy to My Castle's prison if defeated) Pair-Up Stats (C B A S): Mag Skl Res Mag+Res Growths (With Default Class): HP: 35% (35) STR: 5% (10) MAG: 65% (80) SKL: 50% (60) SPD: 15% (30) LCK: 35% (40) DEF: 25% (25) RES: 45% (55) Orochi! She was the first unit I married in Birthright. Between her, Benny, and Saizo, it seems I have a type (slow). I think the Fire Emblem devs saw how overpowered Robin and Nosferatu were in Awakening, and came to assumption that mages themselves were way too good and needed to be nerfed. It's not an entirely incorrect deduction, especially in Fates where 1-2 range with no drawbacks kind of invalidates the game's balance, but they might have hit the mages in this game a bit too hard. Orochi has exactly 3 stats and very little of everything else. Her magic growth is obscene at 80%, and both her skill and res are high enough that she's not unlikely to cap them both at 20/20. Her defense isn't unworkable by mage standards, but unfortunately her terrible speed really drags her down. Neither of them are impossible to fix thanks to the easily obtainable Horse Spirit, but you won't get that for another 6 or so chapters and Orochi's unfortunate bases will drag her down too. Orochi's speed might be bad, but it's not unfixable. Fates is full of ways to boost a unit's stats such as tonics and meals, and the cast of Birthright features many units who can boost speed as a pair-up partner. 7 speed is an unfortunate base stat to have when the enemies in the chapter after she joins have 8 speed at minimum, but Nohrian enemies are slow and enemy stats don't increase very fast, I think you'd get more out of Orochi by doing the best you can to increase her speed rather than going all in on her magic or bulk. I tend to use Orochi as a support partner for my magic weapon users or as a mother for kids who will double more consistently than her rather than a combat unit in her own right, so I've not got a huge amount to say about her. She's easier to use than Hayato is at least! Otherwise Orochi is fragile and slow and being fragile and slow makes it hard for you to make the most of otherwise unconditional 1-2 range. An 80% magic growth is obviously really good but her magic base is surprisingly mediocre, she's not going to be exploding enemies in a single hit. She definitely wants you to buy an Ox Spirit for her to increase her initial damage and shore up her physical bulk a little. Her high accuracy and damage output do at least make her ideal for using Capture - she'll miss a lot less than Niles does. Capturing isn't really as valuable in Birthright, but it's still something you might want her to do. Orochi will get much more use out of rods than she will naginatas, but Onmyoji over Basara isn't a clear cut decision - the extra bulk can justify not being able to heal other units after promotion, and she would have to grind her rod rank to make much use of it anyway. Rend Heaven is also nice on a unit with as high skill as Orochi, she'll be activating it very frequently. Don't bother with her naginata rank though, the only thing she'd ever want to use is the Bolt Naginata and she'll easily do much more damage for much less effort with a tome forge. Apothecary is 100% not worth it unless you really want the skills it gives. Orochi could make a good Oni Chieftain if you support her with Rinkah, her speed would take even more of a hit but she'd become a lot bulkier. Ninja's not good for anything but the skills on her and Spear Fighter's only worth it if you really want her to get Swap and Seal Defense as a Basara for whatever reason. Pros
My Rating: Looks very odd from the front
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Dec 9, 2021 21:36
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I understand how he’s supposed to be good, but I’ve never had Saizo work out well for me. He always seems to get speed screwed which hurts his usefulness dramatically. Orochi, on the other hand, I always make a point to make her work. Partially because I think she’s useful and partially just for the name.
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Dec 9, 2021 23:53
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Carlosologist posted:Hana would be a clear contender for best unit in a game with a 2RN hit chance Nah, even with 2RN the post-Shadow Dragon weapon triangle doesn't have enough effect on hit/avoid for her to go full GBA Myrmidon.
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Dec 10, 2021 01:08
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My only real problem with Saizo is by the time he shows up Kaze is level 9 and can double most enemies with the steel shuriken. He does put in solid work in chapters 9 & 10, and Birthright chapter 10 is a significant challenge compared to the rest of the route.
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Dec 10, 2021 01:11
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Saizo is another oddity. His total growths are very high, but so much of them is dumped into Magic and Skill, stats he doesn't really have that much use for. You can give him the Flame Shuriken and he's fine with it, but he can also use Sting Shuriken for taking out armored units and nothing else really has the defense that Saizo's better off with it. His Speed and Res base growths are also shaky, so he's not going to want to switch around to anything but Master Ninja very much. Orochi, Orochi, Orochi. You'd be perfectly justified in looking at her HP and Speed growths and immediately dumping her. She'll hit like a truck, but never twice, and she spends most of the game in range to be ORKO'd by nearly any enemy. She does have Capture, but it's so much worse on Birthright - in the main campaign there is exactly one (1) boss you can capture, and they are unimpressive. Some of the kid chapters do have better bosses worth nabbing but it's not nearly enough to justify using her for most of the game. I've used Orochi twice. Once for my Captured Units Run, and once for the Bad Units Run. For the former she was simply serviceable, but for the latter she became one of my best units. Her speed never rose above mediocre, but somehow she ended up with remarkable defenses, especially once I moved her over to Oni Chieftain, finishing the run with a staggering 30 in both defense and resistance. She still occasionally got one-rounded by Berserkers but on the whole she ended up an incredible mixed tank that could hold huge portions of maps on her own and dish it back with capped magic. I recognize that this is not the typical Orochi experience, but it's given me a huge soft spot for her.
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Dec 10, 2021 01:45
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The nice thing about Saizo is that his kid is actually a perfectly valid mage if you want to go that route, so you can safely dump Felicia or Sakura onto him and come out with a decent Master Ninja/Onmyoji/Strategist Asugi. Orochi still screws up any kid because of how badly she dumps speed. Oh, Orochi. Like, I want to say she's the worst mom, because even for the few kids that want her MAG growths, she sacks SPD, which is almost a death knell. Would be nice for Oni Chieftains... but Rhajat can do better since she actually has a SPD growth, and the only other kid with natural access to it is Hisame, who's very much not a mage. Her consolation is that she starts off better than Hayato, but honestly, she's bad. Even if you give her a speedy unit to pair up, she offers nothing in return.
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Dec 10, 2021 06:15
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Since you said you're not using Saizo due to this being the garbage unit run essentially, I sort of want to talk about Asugi, his kid. Asugi shares Saizo's trait for very high growths across the board, to the point where as mentioned he can also be a mage perfectly fine. It's also not hard at all to pair him with Sakura since he tends to counteract a lot in his use and she's the healer. Bonus points for having her next to him while that's happening if you can manage it due to a choke-point or whatever. In fact, they were my first exposure to the 'oh, gross' and 'what the hell?' part of Deeprealms here. I find Asugi weird primarily because any mother is going to lower his growths in some aspect due to his master-of-all-trades growths. Even Sakura lowers his growths in more than just strength. This makes him very moldable, even if mine ended up kind of useless due to it being a blind first-time playthrough for me.
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Dec 10, 2021 12:48
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Keldulas posted:Seeing that Hana can get Archer and her growth spread, Archer Hana looks a lot better than regular Hana at least?
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Dec 10, 2021 17:21
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  Oh no, it's the wind chapter!!! Nah just kidding this version has a different map and is way less annoying. I still don't like it though, I've never had fun playing this map.  This is a very mean thing to show as an introduction to someone who's coming in blind from playing Conquest, if they saw that right after the mention of the Wind Tribe it would probably kill them.   This is not the time for stair-based humour. As someone who grew up reading Homestuck in my formative teen years it takes an immense amount of mental fortitude to not make a lame outdated reference every time the Endless Stairway comes up.   Lacking any equippable weapons with which to hurt enemies, Kevin instead brandishes around a Heal staff that he does not actually have in his inventory. It does look more menacing than the Bronze Sword he would be waving around in cutscenes instead...  Iago is written like he's got some sort of immense grudge against Corrin and has it out for them specifically. He is absolutely just a dick who likes being cruel for the sake of it, but I feel like there must be something special he has against them.  No wind! No platforms! Just a big desert map full of enemies. Like most deserts in Fire Emblem, this one slows down the movement of all units except for fliers and mages. Unlike most deserts, this one does not have buried treasure you have to painstakingly comb the map for or consult an online guide to find. That is a good thing.  Fuga himself is however still a jerk. Not hugely threatening, but very hard to kill. His personal skill boosts his avoid when injured, and he's got Seal Strength to nerf your attackers. Most of your units won't be much help against him.  Hinoka and her retainers are also here, 2 chapters earlier than Camilla! You recruit all 3 of them by talking to Hinoka with Corrin, and the three of them will head towards them immediately.  There are exactly 2 dragon veins you can use to clear the sand from the surrounding area and turn the tiles into regular ground. Doing so helps you move a lot faster and makes it easier for Silas to get around, but imo the enemies benefit more from higher movement than you do. There's no time incentive here so it's easiest to let them come to you.  I'm pretty sure if the Wind Tribe had an alignment they'd be Chaotic Evil. Hopefully I never have to show off the Revelation version of their map, it manages to be even worse than Conquest's by virtue of being extremely boring as well as annoying.    Azama and Setsuna make a fun comedy duo. Being terrible at their jobs is kind of their gimmick, both in terms of personality and in stats.  I want Subaki and Orochi to S support one another, but right now they do nothing for one another when paired up. Subaki can't use magic for anything and Orochi's too slow to double even with the extra speed she gets. Keeping them like this lets them support each other with dual attacks.   Getting around this map sucks if you can't fly or are a mage. A crueller Fire Emblem game would have made Butlers/Maids count as physical units for the purpose of moving around in sand.  The early chapters of Birthright really like to pair up enemies. Even if their stats don't help each other at all, having a guard gauge and blocking dual attacks makes them harder to kill.  This is how Subaki's combat usually goes, he deals very little damage and doesn't take much either. Having a powerful unit to support him helps him to kill a little faster.  This is the typical Subaki level. Not bad, being defensive is all I really want from him.  Some of the enemies start moving immediately, the others will wait for you to arrive. They like to dart between non-sandy spots to move faster so it can be hard to tell where they'll end up.   Hinoka and friends will head over to make recruiting them easier. I don't think Setsuna should be standing there... I don't actually know if the enemies will target her, but I'd rather they don't.  It's easy to forget Rinkah's Seal Resistance skill since she doesn't really benefit from it herself, but she makes a good combo with Orochi when the two of them aren't strong enough to defeat enemies by themselves.  I have no intention of using Silas for anything so he can function as power armour for Hana. If I weren't already planning on pairing her with Hinata I think they'd make a decent S support...  Kevin being stuck on a horse made this take a little longer than needed. Hinoka's no Camilla, but she's very nice to have in your party this early all the same.  Here's Hinoka! I think her base stats are better than Subaki's in literally every single way... Her Guard Naginata boosts her defenses by a lot, but it also cuts into her offense. You might want to buy a Steel or Iron Naginata to give to her as soon as she joins. I'm allowed to use her for this chapter but I'll try and limit her contributions to just using her passive aura personal skill and maybe providing pair-up bonuses.  Azama is what people like to pretend Moulder from Sacred Stones is, which is an insanely buff healer with very good bulk and amazing strength. His magic is his lowest stat... He'll still heal good thanks to the power of the Sun Festal though.  Setsuna is this game's obligatory terrible green Archer. She's fast and that's about it. Her bases are at least competent for how low level she is. It is because she is bad that I will do my best to make her as good as possible!  Finally, Felicia gets magic! Not that it really matters... I guess I could make her an Onmyoji after she marries Hayato?  I wanted to give Rhajat Sol, but this would probably make more sense. It's not as cool though.  It'll take some work to make Setsuna good. If I do support her with Azama then he's not going to be much help.  Bulk! And no speed, but not getting speed on a 75% growth in 1 out of 4 levels makes sense. Hana's not quite ORKOing enemis yet, but she's close.  It's turn 5 and I've barely moved from where I've started. It's hard to play fast without feeding all the kills to my already good units! I'm sure Rinkah could wipe this map but I don't want her to.   More levels for the power couple. Orochi's level is pretty standard, but speed on Subaki is nice.  Oops! An Iron Yumi would have killed him. Suffering weapon triangle disadvantage against bows sucks when you're a flier...  Setsuna's design and outfit are so cool, I think they're partly why I wrongly assumed she was a very competent too cool to be phased by anything type of character when I first fought her in Conquest. I guess a third of that assumption was true.  It's weird to call 2 stat levels like this RNG blessed, but that's definitely what they are. Rinkah's easily my best and strongest unit right now.  Moving halfway through the map triggers some long-distance boss dialogue. I don't think it signifies anything important...  Oh, this dragon vein is way more effective than the last. I don't think I ever bothered to check it in all my past playthroughs of this map... Or maybe I just forgot.  I'm not exactly sure what it is that baits this pair-up couple, but they don't seem to want to move. Their position is surprisingly well fortified.  Good, I was worried Hana might stop gaining speed just to spite me. She's pretty comfortably able to double anything that's not a Samurai now.  I knew an enemy would drop one of these but I was too impatient to wait. I can always forge it with Rinkah's existing club.  Multiple turns have passed and this pair has not moved, no matter who I put in range. I'll just come to them...   I sometimes forget the Supportive skill works when Corrin's not in a defensive pair-up, but it does. Building supports with a healer is hard but I'm trying my best!  This guy would rather attack Hana at range for 0 damage than move to actually hurt someone. I am stumped. Eventually I checked the wiki and it turns out he and one of the other pairs just doesn't move at all, despite their movement not being listed as 0.  Birthright loves to give you healing rods for free. You could probably get by without having to buy a single one?  This is uncharacteristically bad for Azama, but it does at least show off his best stat.  The one benefit of Setsuna's low join level is how fast she earns EXP. Speed is her one good stat and the high power of yumis can carry her as soon as she starts being able to double.  This guy does not move either. I wasted so much time trying to bait him and play around his movement...   Orochi somehow misses magic and gets speed, Kaze gets a level I don't care too much about since he's mostly here to build supports.  Setsuna can double some enemies with Hinoka's help, I'll be sad to have to bench her as soon as this map is over. Birthright has lots of rout maps so you'll fairly often find yourself taking out unnarmed healers...   Vantage! Vantage is one of the many skills I forgot exists and therefore am not good at taking advantage (hehe) of. I'll try my best not to do that.  Time for the boss. Fuga is standing menacingly in front of the palace you fight him in in the other two routes, but thankfully you never have to go there. An Ox Spirit would deal more damage but I'm using the Rat Spirit to boost Orochi's crit avoid. I am doing this because I am very smart and know that when Fuga switches to his ranged club on his turn he'll have a 1% crit chance I need to avoid, a fact I knew from careful calculation.   It would have been pretty embarrassing had I not been smart enough to know that.  Orochi could chip at him for EXP all day but I'd rather just beat him now and be done with it. It still took a few turns for Rinkah to reach him...  Her attack whiffed but the seal res was all I needed. Die Fuga!  Luck and defense! This will help her not die from crits.  Most of those turns were spent waiting for immobile enemies to move and Rinkah to slowly make her way over to the boss. It wasn't a particularly fun chapter.  See? This guy only ever tortures you for the fun of it. I think we should execute this war criminal!    Mastered a number of unique skills such as: Next time: Mozu gets to side with the country not responsible for the death of all of her loved ones this time
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Dec 10, 2021 17:22
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One of the issues that Birthright has is its barrage of early game units, some of which are kinda bleh. You start chapter 7 with Jakob/Felicia, Azura, Kaze, Rinkah, Sakura, Hana and Subaki. By the end, you get Silas, Saizo and Orochi, and then in chapter 8 you get another four units (Hinoka, Azama, Setsuna, and then Hayato when you finish). Conquest is not only better at spreading out the rate at which you get new units, but also balancing their join time with their power level. I think the only unit that's underlevelled at join time is Charlotte (and maybe Peri, but you can catch her up quickly if you wanted to). Meanwhile you get a level 3 Setsuna and a level 1 Hayato here.
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Dec 10, 2021 17:34
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I don't get why Hayato's bases are so terrible. Seems like it's a combination Birthright unit thing + non-royal thing?
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Dec 10, 2021 19:55
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It's mostly a Birthright thing. I imagine the philosophy is since you can freely grind then they don't need to worry as much about balance. I think Hayato is the last though. The next 3 chapters give you 3 of the best non-royals in the game, and you have a full roster by Chapter 14 except for Jakob, Izana, Shura and Yukimura. Azama and Setsuna are 2 of my favorite units in the game. A 10/1 Great Master Azama will legitimately carry you through the mid game easily until you reach Wolfskin Peak at least. Similarly, a 10/1 Kinshi Knight Setsuna is essentially a player phase Reina and will easily perform well through the late game.
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Dec 10, 2021 23:41
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Personally Birthright’s distribution and map design are both very lazy in general.
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Dec 10, 2021 23:56
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filler so my next update isn't stuck at the bottom of the page
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Dec 11, 2021 17:15
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