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How do I convince myself my next car doesn't necessarily have to be faster than my current one?
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Jan 24, 2022 02:19
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DildenAnders posted:How do I convince myself my next car doesn't necessarily have to be faster than my current one? why would you do this
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Jan 24, 2022 02:31
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DildenAnders posted:How do I convince myself my next car doesn't necessarily have to be faster than my current one? Without any context of what you drive now and where you drive, a faster car doesn't correlate to a better driving experience.
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Jan 24, 2022 02:31
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:why would you do this Decent, reliable cars faster than my current one (1st gen Mazda 3) are much more expensive than my meager budget (~$6k).
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Jan 24, 2022 03:34
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DildenAnders posted:my meager budget (~$6k). At that budget you don't get to choose anything. I assume this is a "I need to get to work in the morning" car. Your only choice is the best condition thing you can find at that price.
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Jan 24, 2022 04:20
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DildenAnders posted:How do I convince myself my next car doesn't necessarily have to be faster than my current one? DildenAnders posted:Decent, reliable cars faster than my current one (1st gen Mazda 3) are much more expensive than my meager budget (~$6k). Any running Prius is faster than you can push a broken Mazda.
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Jan 24, 2022 04:35
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Motronic posted:At that budget you don't get to choose anything. I assume this is a "I need to get to work in the morning" car. Your only choice is the best condition thing you can find at that price. harsh, but accurate. the $6k market now is what the $3k market was a few years ago. sorry OP. your other choice is to spend a ton of time working on your car OR be satisfied with something older (realistically, both of those)
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Jan 24, 2022 13:10
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DildenAnders posted:Decent, reliable cars faster than my current one (1st gen Mazda 3) are much more expensive than my meager budget (~$6k). Fix your Mazda3 then. Zoom-zoom!
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Jan 24, 2022 13:17
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My heart goes out to anyone who must by a car in these conditions. Six grand is a third of a well optioned Nissan Versa, which Car and Driver says is a surprisingly good car these days. I wouldn't want to try to talk to anyone into spending three times their budget, but with the used market being so poo poo now it also feels bad sending someone out into this market for a six grand used car.
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Jan 24, 2022 19:47
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"Triple your budget" probably isn't viable. You still can buy a perfectly good car for $6k, it's just that you don't get to be very picky anymore at that price point, especially when it comes to things like "mileage". You'll certainly spend more in maintenance and upkeep but that's a factor of how most new cars no longer need anything but oil changes, tires, and maybe a set of brakes in the first 100k miles. The cheapest/most predictable solution is probably still "buy a $6k Prius" and ignore how many hundreds of thousands of miles it already has on the odometer. In an all-but-worst-possible-case scenario you'll be on the hook for another ~$3k for fixing the HV battery and the brake accumulator and still at half of a new Versa.
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Jan 24, 2022 20:03
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the practical car buying advice at the low end of the market is "fix what you got" unless that is really, really not viable
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Jan 24, 2022 20:11
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Both good points. If the OP values farfegnugen, and it sounds like they do, keeping the Mazda going sounds like the better choice?
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Jan 24, 2022 20:15
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So are they going to start building new cars or where are we on that
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Jan 24, 2022 20:22
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:the practical car buying advice at the low end of the market is "fix what you got" unless that is really, really not viable Jack B Nimble posted:Both good points. If the OP values farfegnugen, and it sounds like they do, keeping the Mazda going sounds like the better choice? Agreed, though given that all we know is "Mazda3" it's quite easily old enough that it's nearly dead from rust alone if the OP lives in a place where that's any problem whatsoever. Especially considering that early Mazda3s were rust-prone in all but the driest of climates.
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Jan 24, 2022 20:37
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Throatwarbler posted:So are they going to start building new cars or where are we on that They are building new cars, you just have to get in line because dealer lots are empty and some of the lines are very, very long. For example a local toyota dealer was taking orders for rav 4 primes 2 years out (?!) and normal hybrids would be at least 6 months.
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Jan 24, 2022 20:48
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Jack B Nimble posted:Nissan Versa, which Car and Driver says is a surprisingly good car these days I had to drive a new 2012 model on the highway for about 32 hours once, what a miserable wreck of a car
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Jan 24, 2022 20:58
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FOMO is beginning to grip me now that they've stopped accepting Maverick orders.Hadlock posted:I had to drive a new 2012 model on the highway for about 32 hours once, what a miserable wreck of a car Yeah but from 2019 to 2020 it goes from a 3/10 to 8/10 at Car and Driver. I've been in older ones and they're poo poo, and I haven't test driven one of the new ones, but it's apparently not so bad and still very, very cheap. Jack B Nimble fucked around with this message at 21:02 on Jan 24, 2022 |
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Jan 24, 2022 20:59
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Good news, my sister is going to sell me her old Prius for whatever her trade in value would have been, so 6-7k, which means I don't have to deal with getting sexually harassed by salesmen, the finance guy trying to shaft me, or my husband getting impatient and just wanting to sign anything in order to get out of the finance office. All in all a win aside from the fact that her new car isn't coming in until mid/late Feb and we'll be sans auto until then. I was seriously getting ready to get a one way flight out to Denver to buy my friend's old car for 2k (200k miles, but he's been maintaining it flawlessly since 90k and I trust him when he says its easily got another two years+ on it) and driving it back to St Louis.
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Jan 24, 2022 21:08
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IOwnCalculus posted:Agreed, though given that all we know is "Mazda3" it's quite easily old enough that it's nearly dead from rust alone if the OP lives in a place where that's any problem whatsoever. Especially considering that early Mazda3s were rust-prone in all but the driest of climates. I would happily put $6k into it but the rust seems like it'll be terminal pretty quickly (not to mention weird electrical gremlins from lovely aftermarket lights/head unit). If I could spend $6k and get a rust-free, relatively unmolested 1st gen Mazda 3, I'd be thrilled.
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Jan 24, 2022 21:23
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DildenAnders posted:I would happily put $6k into it but the rust seems like it'll be terminal pretty quickly (not to mention weird electrical gremlins from lovely aftermarket lights/head unit). If I could spend $6k and get a rust-free, relatively unmolested 1st gen Mazda 3, I'd be thrilled. If you live in the rust belt, it's possible your only $6k options that involve rust-free anything involve a one-way plane ticket to a non-rust-belt state, or a (higher, lol) cost to have a car shipped from one.
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Jan 24, 2022 21:40
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Can't wait until self driving cars mean that you can just set it to its new owner's driveway and smack it on the bumper on its way out.
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Jan 24, 2022 22:15
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Throatwarbler posted:So are they going to start building new cars or where are we on that I posted a bit about this earlier, the current analysis shows this is probably the peak of the peak of used car market with the current projections starting to show significant improvement in the beginning of next year. Edit - And I hope they are right. Badly. Because I also need to buy a car. Gucci Loafers fucked around with this message at 23:26 on Jan 24, 2022 |
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Jan 24, 2022 23:17
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Have average used car values ever actually gone down? My dad is theorizing the prices may plateau but historically have never gone down year over year. Only up. Im still looking for data that supports his theory.
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Jan 24, 2022 23:37
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After 2008 the government did a buy back of any car that could move under it's own power for... $2500? Which soaked up a looot of 10-15 year old cars in an attempt to keep reliable used cars from competing with new cars and keep auto makers afloat. I'm not sure how many cars they bought but it was enough to improve the value of the used cars that remained, the market before this program was very different
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Jan 24, 2022 23:52
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ethanol posted:Have average used car values ever actually gone down? My dad is theorizing the prices may plateau but historically have never gone down year over year. Only up. Im still looking for data that supports his theory. I think cars have generally gotten cheaper once adjusted for inflation.
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Jan 25, 2022 00:04
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ethanol posted:Have average used car values ever actually gone down? My dad is theorizing the prices may plateau but historically have never gone down year over year. Only up. Im still looking for data that supports his theory. Here is an article on this. Prices of cars on average since 1967 have remained pretty constant relative to inflation. https://wgntv.com/news/the-average-car-now-costs-25449-how-much-was-a-car-the-year-you-were-born/ But cars have improved quite a bit since 1967. Total cost of ownership has probably gone down, since cars today are much more well-made and reliable compared to cars in 1967. edit: Whoops didn't read your post. I'm talking about new cars, but you are interested in used cars. On one hand, new car prices certainly drive used car prices, but you could also argue that improved car reliability has likely drived used car prices up. I'm interested in what others in this thread have to say about this subject. silence_kit fucked around with this message at 14:45 on Jan 25, 2022 |
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Jan 25, 2022 13:37
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The average lifespan of a car has gone up, so if you are taking say, a three year old car in 2019 vs in 1979, the 2019 car will be more expensive in both nominal and real terms, but that's because it has a lot more useful life left. It's generally not super useful to think of 'how much does a car cost" versus "how much utility does the car provide for the price" - a ten year old used car now has probably at least five years of useful life left at minimum, and that certainly wasn't true of a ten year old car in 1979, even if the ten year old car costs $6,000,and a ten year old car in 1979 cost $100 in nominal terms and $400 in real terms. I have no way of actually measuring this but I suspect that much like new cars, the price of used cars when controlling for utility has gone down in real terms or at least stayed constant. However, car prices in general have definitely outstripped median income growth. I suspect OP's dad is talking about prices in nominal dollars, in which case, well, duh.
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Jan 25, 2022 14:36
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Cars also have a lot more technology in them for safety and convenience. Which can make upkeep difficult if, say, a sensor goes out. The 79 special can probably be kept running on a lot of elbow grease but it won't be pretty.
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Jan 25, 2022 14:50
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increasing safety and convenience increases utility as well, though. important sensors are cheap these days, getting to them is kind of the hard part and so it can be non-economical to repair modern cars. the main limitation is stuff like infotainment systems and collision avoidance systems, that tends to be very specialized and expensive. and cars in 1979 rusted like a mother fucker, the only things that are near as bad in the modern era are like mid 2000s Mazdas
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Jan 25, 2022 15:26
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:and cars in 1979 rusted like a mother fucker, the only things that are near as bad in the modern era are like mid 2000s Mazdas Someone has never made the mistake of owning a Dodge Caliber 
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Jan 25, 2022 15:41
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:important sensors are cheap these days, getting to them is kind of the hard part and so it can be non-economical to repair modern cars. the main limitation is stuff like infotainment systems and collision avoidance systems, that tends to be very specialized and expensive. Yeah, some of them seem expensive, but they're far cheaper than typical industrial use cases. For example, I work in combustion and we often measure O2 for efficiency purposes. One of the ways some vendors have come up with to bring the costs of these systems down is by using car O2 sensors from O'Reilly's just down the street. $100 vs $1000+ adds up pretty quickly over 100 systems a year. Of course, the auto one doesn't work in all scenarios, yada yada, you get the point.
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Jan 25, 2022 16:27
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Explosionface posted:Yeah, some of them seem expensive, but they're far cheaper than typical industrial use cases. For example, I work in combustion and we often measure O2 for efficiency purposes. One of the ways some vendors have come up with to bring the costs of these systems down is by using car O2 sensors from O'Reilly's just down the street. $100 vs $1000+ adds up pretty quickly over 100 systems a year. Of course, the auto one doesn't work in all scenarios, yada yada, you get the point. Nice username/post combo 
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Jan 25, 2022 17:18
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FilthyImp posted:The 79 special can probably be kept running on a lot of elbow grease but it won't be pretty. KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:important sensors are cheap these days, getting to them is kind of the hard part and so it can be non-economical to repair modern cars. the main limitation is stuff like infotainment systems and collision avoidance systems, that tends to be very specialized and expensive. I think the bigger issue with (most) modern cars is mechanical complexity. Old engine designs generally come with the benefit of not having to remove X other parts completely unrelated to your repair just to get them out of the way. A modern overhead cam direct-injected and possibly turbocharged engine you have hours of things to get out of the way. And when you're doing that repair at 150k or 200k miles, those things are probably at the point where just the act of removing them will cause damage or outright failure. This isn't a perfect blanket statement because some cars and manufacturers are far better (and some are far worse) than others in this regard. But in general, an older car is easier to keep shambling along on a long string of inexpensive repairs. A newer car will run hundreds of thousands of miles with minimal repairs, but the repairs more quickly become "replace engine" instead of "repair component on engine". The ideal happy medium here is "modern but uncomplicated". This is a relatively narrow window because the buyer of a brand new car doesn't care if it's complicated to repair, they're not going to own it that long. But they do care about the extra horsepower and fuel economy that come with more complex systems like direct injection and variable valve timing.
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Jan 25, 2022 18:10
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IOwnCalculus posted:This isn't a perfect blanket statement because some cars and manufacturers are far better (and some are far worse) than others in this regard. I would love, love a list of "best modern vehicles to work on", please. I'm a very mediocre mechanic and give up quickly when extra stuff is in the way
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Jan 25, 2022 19:05
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Lada Niva
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Jan 25, 2022 20:35
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Motronic posted:Lada Niva  Sold in the USA and designed in the last 10 years.
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Jan 25, 2022 21:25
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Jack B Nimble posted:I would love, love a list of "best modern vehicles to work on", please. My 2013 CR-V was great in this regard. Also, basically nothing broke on it over five years and 170k miles. The one exception to both was the AC expansion valve but that's a royal nightmare on most cars since it's buried up against the firewall in the passenger compartment. Extrapolating from there I'd recommend any other Honda from before they went direct injected - similar year four cylinder Accord, Civic, etc.
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Jan 25, 2022 21:36
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I've had no complaints working on my WRX. Oil changes are hilariously trivial with the filter on top of the engine in the front. Getting the front bumper off to deal with things in there is also really easy. The only real complaint is that some of the bolts (namely the bolts holding the downpipe onto the turbo, and the passenger seat bolts) are cross threaded from the factory and an absolute bitch to deal with as a result. That said, that's more of a comedy answer than a good one. There's a lot that can go wrong on it and some other things are a colossal pain.
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Jan 25, 2022 22:09
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shortspecialbus posted:I've had no complaints working on my WRX. Oil changes are hilariously trivial with the filter on top of the engine in the front. Getting the front bumper off to deal with things in there is also really easy. I haven't done anything but oil changes on my Crosstrek, but I'm in love with the engine bay. I migrated from a Dodge Caliber, where the alternator was under the engine, and the AC compressor needed to be removed to access it, making it a two day operation at the shop. With the Crosstrek, I can see it, and although I'll probably still take it to the shop, I could probably do it myself. It takes having a bad car that's lovely to work on to see a good car that's easy to work on.
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Jan 25, 2022 22:22
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plugs and gaskets on a lot of Subaru engines have been a pain in the rear end due to the layout
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Jan 25, 2022 22:49
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