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Mulva posted:Fundamentally Goku is a colossal gently caress up that only really focuses on fighting. Luffy actually cares more about his crew and adventure than fighting. They are still in the same ballpark of figure, but Luffy is not a Goku in the way some other protagonists are. Goku cares about things other than fighting. Like literally the most pivotal moment in the series is him losing his poo poo over his friend getting murked. Goku really really loves fighting, and is an idiot, but jokes aside(TFS' DBZA has become the "canon" that people think of when they think of the characters") Goku extremely cares about his people.
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Mar 6, 2022 15:51
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He cares about people, but it's not what gets him going. What gets him going is fighting. He'll go off if you kill his friends, and he'll care if they have a problem, but absent that his default motivation is "Fight". Luffy's isn't. It's to go to some weird mystery island and hang out with his friends. He's strong because he's a pirate, and pirates get up to some poo poo. It's not the point for him. He'll fight if circumstances warrant it, but absent anything else his motivation is "Adventure". They aren't the same dude.
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Mar 6, 2022 15:58
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Same dude no, same archetype yes. Goku also doesn't ever really go seeking a fight. He seeks self improvement. He loves training. He goes on adventures and fights to protect or save those he cares about.
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Mar 6, 2022 16:02
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Tbf there’s literally a part of Dragonball where Goku begged Krillin not to kill Vegeta, the guy who then went on to literally murder a village of Namekians and later gloated about it, because he’s a fight junkie. Like it definitely gets exaggerated as a joke but that’s at least one time where Goku got people killed indirectly.
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Mar 6, 2022 16:02
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Last Celebration posted:Tbf there’s literally a part of Dragonball where Goku begged Krillin not to kill Vegeta, the guy who then went on to literally murder a village of Namekians and later gloated about it, because he’s a fight junkie. Like it definitely gets exaggerated as a joke but that’s at least one time where Goku got people killed indirectly. Goku has gotten people killed directly lol, I'm not saying he's not an idiot But also him keeping Vegeta alive kinda saved the universe so you know... It's like the Gohan thing, extremely bad parenting, but Goku correctly realized that he had no chance of beating Cell and only Gohan at the time had any chance. The Sensu bean was him being an idiot tho.
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Mar 6, 2022 16:07
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goku's an idiot but having access to dragon balls since he was a kid has completely warped his understanding of consequences.
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Mar 6, 2022 16:15
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The Senzu bean thing was another example of Goku not really understanding that not everyone loves fighting as much as he does. Like, he obviously cares about Gohan and can be a good dad when not dealing with end of the world threats, but it took Piccolo yelling it in his face for him to understand that his son wasn't a fight junkie like him.
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Mar 6, 2022 16:16
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"Too much, dude! Also, who are you?!" Nope, Sakamoto Days still owns 
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Mar 6, 2022 16:38
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Earthchild: This is going to end in child abuse and/or neglect, isn't it?  Witch Watch: They're in, boys! They did it! They said the title, sorta! Ayakashi: Huh, a relatively porn-light chapter with some intresting story. Nice good to see Kentaro has it in 'm.
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Mar 6, 2022 16:45
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Mar 6, 2022 16:52
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drat, I thought this only happened to us gaijins…
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Mar 6, 2022 16:55
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I’m dropping Earthchild. I just don’t care. It’s such a boring mess.
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Mar 6, 2022 17:01
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If it doesn't get U19'd then there's something seriously wrong at WSJ HQ.
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Mar 6, 2022 17:04
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Oxxidation posted:midoriya had his character flattened into "determined stare, shouts a lot" years ago, he no longer really shows any of the calculating nature that first defined him as protagonist Itadori's reasonably intelligent. Like he's not particularly smart but he's not a dumbass like most shonen protags.
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Mar 6, 2022 17:26
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Akane no you have to read the feedback!!!
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Mar 6, 2022 17:33
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The Black Stones posted:I’m dropping Earthchild. I just don’t care. It’s such a boring mess. i thought it might have such an odd structure because it was going for something different. but no, i think it is just inept writing.
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Mar 6, 2022 17:55
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I think I'm also done with Earthchild, it's just kind of all over the place. Even after 3 chapters I still don't really know what the hook is, and it can't help but speed through a whole bunch of random world building details without lingering on anything substantive. One of manga's big strengths is their tendency to decompress and let a scene breathe, but in this chapter alone we've got the secret café for the rich and famous that's a cover for the even secreter government organization, the reveal of Kareri's body in space, the bridge crew pulling the "We're family (just forget how we tried to kidnap your son and mindwipe you last chapter)" card, domestic life with bad humor and what I'm sure was supposed to be a heartwarming moment, all interspersed with two different kinds of narration from two different characters over the same events.
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Mar 6, 2022 17:57
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ConanThe3rd posted:Earthchild: This is going to end in child abuse and/or neglect, isn't it? it's a mess of a series but i'm not sure how the heck you pull this out of it at this point the impending shift into following the kid might be enough for it to find legs, albeit very standard ones. ch2 is still a huge weight the series doesn't escape until it ends or somehow goes long enough to shed from collective memory (e.g. MHA Vigilantes) though.
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Mar 6, 2022 18:18
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also with Dr Stone ending, it's funny to think back on all those early questions of how Senku would deal with Tsukasa's ideology and other general problems of politics and power structures when this is where we end up we did it (just offscreen)!
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Mar 6, 2022 18:28
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Seems to be a common problem, you either gloss over it or just come up with an easy out like Beastars did.
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Mar 6, 2022 18:51
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dogsicle posted:also with Dr Stone ending, it's funny to think back on all those early questions of how Senku would deal with Tsukasa's ideology and other general problems of politics and power structures when this is where we end up I mean, they did a LOT of stuff offscreen after a certain point of Dr Stone.
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Mar 6, 2022 20:06
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Jujustu Kaisen decided to have the single best spread of this week with a double tetsuzanko and my god was it glorious. I'm also really liking the new girl in Sakamoto days.
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Mar 6, 2022 20:28
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dogsicle posted:also with Dr Stone ending, it's funny to think back on all those early questions of how Senku would deal with Tsukasa's ideology and other general problems of politics and power structures when this is where we end up Well it’s still better than when he didn’t skewer Ryusei when he started introducing money and poo poo.
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Mar 6, 2022 21:00
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Oxxidation posted:midoriya had his character flattened into "determined stare, shouts a lot" years ago, he no longer really shows any of the calculating nature that first defined him as protagonist Deku was doing a bunch of calculating to figure out how to beat Nagant, which was his last "proper" fight. Him going to gritting his teeth as a fallback has been a thing since the start, but he at least tries to think things through first. If Senku is your standard, then yes. Not many protagonists will be "intelligent as such", because very few of them are ten billion percent sure they could get the Nobel before finishing high school. But at the moment, the Elusive Samurai and Morihito in Witch Watch are portrayed as of at least average intelligence, as are the leads in Blue Box and Sakamoto Days. Jump's still got its dumbasses (like Marou in Ayashimon) but "can maintain a B average" looks more common in Jump at the moment than it was at Goku's peak of influence.
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Mar 6, 2022 23:31
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If I can just ramble a bit about Luffy for a second ('cuz I think you're all talking MHA manga spoilers). he's never gonna be my fave shounen hero or anything but I've rewatched Sabaody to the flashback arc a couple times now. And after all that, I definitely did appreciate Luffy more. I think it's all captured brilliantly in one of my favorite anime openings ever https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PAWnYutDQiE&t=118s Luffy was in Hell, the absolute pit of despair, first with losing his crew, and then with losing Ace. My heart bled for this poor child after everything he went through and when he was screaming for his brother. And that's why I was so happy to see him smile again, to take up his hat and rediscover hope. I feel like he "earned" his happiness at this point, it wasn't just his stock state with no real change or growth. That made me respect his character more.
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Mar 7, 2022 00:00
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Don’t worry, when World Trigger goes back to weekly we’ll have another smart protagonist to root for!
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Mar 7, 2022 00:07
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World Trigger works better as a monthly though.
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Mar 7, 2022 00:37
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Next week is Mashle 100 and after 99 I'm not really sure if it'll be a special one or not. Also, more weights.
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Mar 7, 2022 02:06
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Akane-banashi: Still really good and engaging, I'm digging how the performers all have their own style. That said, Akane's pretty much copying her dad's style, so I'm wonder if she'll continue down this path (to prove her dad was good) or start making modifications to create her own path while still keeping the basics of her dad's style. I also wonder why the dude expelled all those students 6 years ago, the newly introduced dude says that the old dude is trying to create a new wave of young talent, but Akane's dad wasn't really old, and it wasn't like his style was sticking to old traditions. So I'm excited to see how the story unfolds. Ayashimon: Time for the small ceiling boy to prove what he can do! Elusive Samurai: History tells us that the Emperor did not die in a bath, so I'm excited to see how things go wrong. Also I love the corrupt priest dude. Nice touch that a dude whose expression is unreadable has his face permanently covered in shadows, too. Mashle: Egh, more mid-bosses. Roboco: I'd give this a 1.2 knees out of 2 (knees). Sakamoto: Impromptu second test! Good poo poo, nice to see what the new kid's skill are, and who the heck was that 5th guy???? Well, the 5th dude doesn't even have a bullet so he's not getting any further. Looks like a bunch of other dudes survive the fall, wonder how they did it??? The examiner part was pretty funny too.
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Mar 7, 2022 02:06
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Darth TNT posted:Well it’s still better than when he didn’t skewer Ryusei when he started introducing money and poo poo.
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Mar 7, 2022 02:31
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My favourite One-Piece world-building detail is Ace's tattoo. The kind of guy who has his own name, misspelled and corrected, as a tattoo. A
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Mar 7, 2022 03:57
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Elfface posted:My favourite One-Piece world-building detail is Ace's tattoo. The kind of guy who has his own name, misspelled and corrected, as a tattoo. A Isn't the crossed out S supposed to be a reference to Sabo or is that just a fan theory?
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Mar 7, 2022 04:01
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Like, in the what-if cover image where Sabo never got separated from Ace and Luffy, Ace's tatoo just says ACE.
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Mar 7, 2022 04:02
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ZepiaEltnamOberon posted:Like, in the what-if cover image where Sabo never got separated from Ace and Luffy, Ace's tatoo just says ACE.
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Mar 7, 2022 04:21
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Oxxidation posted:midoriya had his character flattened into "determined stare, shouts a lot" years ago, he no longer really shows any of the calculating nature that first defined him as protagonist Sakamoto is a smart guy!
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Mar 7, 2022 10:12
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A Sometimes Food posted:Itadori's reasonably intelligent. Like he's not particularly smart but he's not a dumbass like most shonen protags. Jujutsu Kaisen has a lot of stuff that sort of feels like it fits stereotypes at a glance (like the main trio), but doesn't once you actually read it.
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Mar 7, 2022 11:00
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The Witch Watch crew are... well, they're all dumbasses, but not rocks-for-brains dumb, just very focused on their own particular quirks. Mash is good at mathematics, we've just seen how well he can square numbers.
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Mar 7, 2022 11:04
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Does Witch Watch even count? It’s one of my favorite things in Jump right now but it’s more of a slice of life/romcom than just punching guys with some jokes like One Piece/Sakamoto Days.
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Mar 7, 2022 11:31
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Akane-Banashi: They introduce another likable character here, and the artstyle really helps convey the differences between his and Akane's performance. The whole "this master is hiring youths for some vague revolution" is a massive red flag though. Earthchild: No, seriously, this shady government agency knew your wife was still alive and their first response was to brainwipe you and steal your kid. Any potential trust between you two should be completely destroyed. You should be flipping them the bird, not getting all buddy-buddy with these assholes. High School Family: The plot thickens. Blue Box: I am sick and tired of how all these kids put in their best effort and just lose all the time. Show-ha Shoten: While I'm really liking this so far, one thing that makes me wary is how Mizuha being someone that Shijima wants to meet one day when he's the top stand-up comedian and Hanamori deciding she's gonna be the duo's biggest supporter has some similarities to Miho and Kaya from Bakuman, respectively. The fact that this has a different writer is the only thing giving me hope that maybe they'd handle the female characters better. Doron Dororon: So this new guy is basically the Kuwabara to Dora's Yusuke? I got a good laugh over his disappointment that their roles got reversed as Samurai and now he can't get a good fight with his rival. Sakamoto Days: The guy who joined them in the parachute has a "Kill Baby" bandanna and now I'm curious what's his assassin gimmick. 
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Mar 7, 2022 11:43
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amigolupus posted:Sakamoto Days: The guy who joined them in the parachute has a "Kill Baby" bandanna and now I'm curious what's his assassin gimmick.
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Mar 7, 2022 11:58
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