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Inspector Gesicht
Oct 26, 2012

500 Zeus a body.


Video-games consume your time and money, and require hundreds of bucks worth of hardware to function that also cost money.

If they make it a mission statement to poo poo on the player then they risk that player rightfully never giving them the time of day again. Exceptions of course are Rockstar who have longed thralled its fanbase with whale-bleeding and atrocious remasters.

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Gaius Marius
Oct 9, 2012

They did pull the trilogy remake and offer refunds

kazil
Jul 24, 2005

A fancy little mouse🐁!

Opopanax posted:

why would I want to spend money on something that doesn't respect me and has contempt for me?

and yet MMORPGs are still pretty popular

oldpainless
Oct 30, 2009

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Opopanax posted:

but why would I want to spend money on something that doesn't respect me and has contempt for me?

You’re the one who bought an account!










Jackass

Last Celebration
Mar 30, 2010
(Elden Ring) Crucible Knights suck. Big damage, big poise/super armor, giant shields, and hardly any clear openings once they hit certain HP thresholds (they start doing the dragon dive/tail swipe at half health and sometimes do a giant fuckoff version of the tail swipe at like 25%) man, there’s occasionally enemies I don’t like fighting in a Soulsborne like BB’s Giant Naked Rolling Baby but I feel like these guys are gonna be on a lot of people’s “top ten most groan-worthy Souls enemies”.

Also since I’m here, Giant Naked Rolling Baby from Bloodborne sucks, he’s like a parody of a PVP player that went all in on evasion only he has the fastest attacks in the game with no real windup on a lot of them.

LIVE AMMO COSPLAY
Feb 3, 2006

Inspector Gesicht posted:

Video-games consume your time and money, and require hundreds of bucks worth of hardware to function that also cost money.

If they make it a mission statement to poo poo on the player then they risk that player rightfully never giving them the time of day again. Exceptions of course are Rockstar who have longed thralled its fanbase with whale-bleeding and atrocious remasters.

You gently caress with me and my money goes elsewhere. Now excuse me while I get back to playing the Diablo 2 remaster and preordering the next Witcher game.

Randalor
Sep 4, 2011



Inspector Gesicht posted:

YIIK is well covered example. Back in 1995 is a game a crappy retro-game that apes the old Resident Evil and Silent Hill. only to outright insult players for having nostalgia for the time.

I completely missed the controversy around YIIK (And found out it wasn't pronounced like "yuck" just recently). Care to give a readers digest version of how hosed up the whole thing was? All I heard about it was that it was bad on several different levels.

kazil
Jul 24, 2005

A fancy little mouse🐁!

Last Celebration posted:

(Elden Ring) Crucible Knights suck. Big damage, big poise/super armor, giant shields, and hardly any clear openings once they hit certain HP thresholds (they start doing the dragon dive/tail swipe at half health and sometimes do a giant fuckoff version of the tail swipe at like 25%) man, there’s occasionally enemies I don’t like fighting in a Soulsborne like BB’s Giant Naked Rolling Baby but I feel like these guys are gonna be on a lot of people’s “top ten most groan-worthy Souls enemies”.

Don't forget the part where they sprint at full speed to stab you whenever you touch the flask button!

Frank Frank
Jun 13, 2001

Mirrored

Last Celebration posted:

(Elden Ring) Crucible Knights suck. Big damage, big poise/super armor, giant shields, and hardly any clear openings once they hit certain HP thresholds (they start doing the dragon dive/tail swipe at half health and sometimes do a giant fuckoff version of the tail swipe at like 25%) man, there’s occasionally enemies I don’t like fighting in a Soulsborne like BB’s Giant Naked Rolling Baby but I feel like these guys are gonna be on a lot of people’s “top ten most groan-worthy Souls enemies”.

Also since I’m here, Giant Naked Rolling Baby from Bloodborne sucks, he’s like a parody of a PVP player that went all in on evasion only he has the fastest attacks in the game with no real windup on a lot of them.

Crucible knights are just “hey do you know how to parry?” bosses. The moment you figure it out they’re super easy. Just for laughs I took one on in Farum Azusa in NG++ with a buckler and a misericorde and killed it without getting hit

Edit: to my knowledge they cannot be poise broken and are immune to all status. You can beat them down with persistence but parrying is so much easier

Frank Frank has a new favorite as of 03:59 on Apr 9, 2022

hazardousmouse
Dec 17, 2010

credburn posted:

Is that where you hug the wall and make incremental hops up the slope? Haha I used to call it the Morrowind Hop. But I guess it's built into all Elder Scrolls games.

Speaking of open world RPGs, I just got Outer Worlds and there are two things that immediately annoy me. The first is that there is no mantling. I believe we are at a place where first person games that allow you to jump around all over the place should also allow you to mantle. A jumpy FPS without mantling feels as weird in this era as an FPS without jumping did by the late 90s.

"mantling, to mantle
intransitive verb

1: to become covered with a coating
2: to spread over a surface"


what are you saying?

Zil
Jun 4, 2011

Satanically Summoned Citrus


Jump over a chest high wall.

hazardousmouse
Dec 17, 2010
oh a little hup moment, eh?

Philippe
Aug 9, 2013

(she/her)

The Outer Worlds is very colourful, but there's no variety in the colour grading (lighter or darker colours, for instance). Nothing really stands out.

And the lack of hup is of course awful.

The Lone Badger
Sep 24, 2007

Randalor posted:

I completely missed the controversy around YIIK (And found out it wasn't pronounced like "yuck" just recently). Care to give a readers digest version of how hosed up the whole thing was? All I heard about it was that it was bad on several different levels.

It's pronounced "yeek".

Sally
Jan 9, 2007


Don't post Small Dash!

hazardousmouse posted:

"mantling, to mantle
intransitive verb

1: to become covered with a coating
2: to spread over a surface"


what are you saying?

it's a rock climbing term that has been applied to video games: https://frictionlabs.com/blog/how-it-works-the-mantle

Philippe
Aug 9, 2013

(she/her)

Otherwise, the only videogame franchise with mantling would be The Elder Scrolls.

John Murdoch
May 19, 2009

I can tune a fish.

Randalor posted:

I completely missed the controversy around YIIK (And found out it wasn't pronounced like "yuck" just recently). Care to give a readers digest version of how hosed up the whole thing was? All I heard about it was that it was bad on several different levels.

Off the top of my head:

- Based a plot point on the actual death of a real woman.

- Has an entire dramatic story turn, iirc, focused on suicide that is then interrupted with some wacky lol monkeycheese randum bullshit in a complete loving misfire of tone.

- Went past the tipping point of "heavily inspired by" and straight up copied passages from an author they liked wholesale and needed to be shamed into adding a citation to their credits.

- The main character is a self-insert of the dev, and he is an insufferable and altogether unpleasant piece of poo poo all game long. :actually: <- That's him.

- The main character wears a shirt that's a reference to the dev's previous game, which was not well received for being buggy as poo poo and is no longer even sold on Steam on account of it.

- Despite the game taking place in the year 1999, the characters talk about their favorite video games in a noticeably anachronistic way. As in, there's a conversation about what an instant classic a bunch of Square RPGs are as if they didn't just come out a few years ago.

- The final big plot reveal is that every single character in the game is actually an alternate dimension version of the main character in one big solipsistic orgy of Evangelion-esque proportions .

- Game is doing the "wacky Paper Mario minigame timing combat" schtick but every single attack is a completely different wacky minigame that takes forever to go off, turning combat into a total slog.

- The level up system is completely goddamn obtuse and is a perfect example of "we're the wacky ~post-modern~ RPG so everything has to be wacky and ~post-modern~" with no thought given to basic usability or aesthetics or quality of life or really anything other than that they just had to reinvent the wheel and put their own ~cool spin~ on leveling up. I'm not sure I can even coherently describe it other than that you have to pick your stat bonuses from doors in a 2D hallway, one at a time, and there's a bunch of redundant dialogue and screen loading/refreshing and other such bullshit involved. If I remember right, it's an "other place" out of something like Persona or Killer 7 except it's also literally inside the protagonist's head.

John Murdoch has a new favorite as of 07:44 on Apr 9, 2022

moonmazed
Dec 27, 2021

by VideoGames

John Murdoch posted:

- Despite the game taking place in the year 1999, the characters talk about their favorite video games in a noticeably anachronistic way. As in, there's a conversation about what an instant classic a bunch of Square RPGs are as if they didn't just come out a few years ago.

this explains the title holy poo poo

RareAcumen
Dec 28, 2012




John Murdoch posted:

- The level up system is completely goddamn obtuse and is a perfect example of "we're the wacky ~post-modern~ RPG so everything has to be wacky and ~post-modern~" with no thought given to basic usability or aesthetics or quality of life or really anything other than that they just had to reinvent the wheel and put their own ~cool spin~ on leveling up. I'm not sure I can even coherently describe it other than that you have to pick your stat bonuses from doors in a 2D hallway, one at a time, and there's a bunch of redundant dialogue and screen loading/refreshing and other such bullshit involved. If I remember right, it's an "other place" out of something like Persona or Killer 7 except it's also literally inside the protagonist's head.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eBKZ25PLgM

Also, you're not insulting the dialogue enough.



You did mention that part already^

Philippe
Aug 9, 2013

(she/her)


I wonder, is the creator of YIIK a ginger guy with a beard and glasses?

Randalor
Sep 4, 2011



John Murdoch posted:

*A lot of words about :actually:*

Okay, that does sound absolutely terrible. At first I thought you mistook YIIK for Pokemon Reborn, how many games decided to be edgy flesh-eating ghoulsdouchbags by incorporating someone's actual suicide into their games?

Amoeba102
Jan 22, 2010

Wait, that smilie isn't caleb bond.

Len
Jan 21, 2008

Pouches, bandages, shoulderpad, cyber-eye...

Bitchin'!


Randalor posted:

Okay, that does sound absolutely terrible. At first I thought you mistook YIIK for Pokemon Reborn, how many games decided to be edgy flesh-eating ghoulsdouchbags by incorporating someone's actual suicide into their games?

Google tells me it was Elisa Lam and somehow that doesn't surprise me

Dewgy
Nov 10, 2005

~🚚special delivery~📦

Philippe posted:

I wonder, is the creator of YIIK a ginger guy with a beard and glasses?

He’s a straight up self insert, yes.

Oxxidation
Jul 22, 2007

Randalor posted:

I completely missed the controversy around YIIK (And found out it wasn't pronounced like "yuck" just recently). Care to give a readers digest version of how hosed up the whole thing was? All I heard about it was that it was bad on several different levels.

this scene was how the forums became aware of the game and it hit like a meteor strike

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52CKHbf2C3U

Frank Frank
Jun 13, 2001

Mirrored
What the gently caress

Inspector Gesicht
Oct 26, 2012

500 Zeus a body.


That fight goes on for 15 minutes. That's every combat encounter in the game.

There's also the 'commentary' where if you fight a cop, they only attack your black party members.

Inspector Gesicht has a new favorite as of 14:47 on Apr 9, 2022

Kit Walker
Jul 10, 2010
"The Man Who Cannot Deadlift"

Randalor posted:

Okay, that does sound absolutely terrible. At first I thought you mistook YIIK for Pokemon Reborn, how many games decided to be edgy flesh-eating ghoulsdouchbags by incorporating someone's actual suicide into their games?

There are definitely ways to do it tastefully. Making that person your protagonist’s love interest is not one of them

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

John Murdoch posted:

- The main character wears a shirt that's a reference to the dev's previous game, which was not well received for being buggy as poo poo and is no longer even sold on Steam on account of it.

holy poo poo, please tell me they arrested him!

marshmallow creep
Dec 10, 2008

I've been sitting here for 5 mins trying to think of a joke to make but I just realised the animators of Mass Effect already did it for me

Frank Frank posted:

Crucible knights are just “hey do you know how to parry?” bosses. The moment you figure it out they’re super easy. Just for laughs I took one on in Farum Azusa in NG++ with a buckler and a misericorde and killed it without getting hit

Edit: to my knowledge they cannot be poise broken and are immune to all status. You can beat them down with persistence but parrying is so much easier

I parried the one in Farum Azula, saw my +25 greataxe tickle him because his health and armor are so stupid high, and said gently caress it and hit him with rot breath. My friend did one better and kited him to a jump. Crucible Knights can't jump and will fall to their deaths.

marshmallow creep has a new favorite as of 17:08 on Apr 9, 2022

RareAcumen
Dec 28, 2012




Inspector Gesicht posted:

That fight goes on for 15 minutes. That's every combat encounter in the game.

There's also the 'commentary' where if you fight a cop, they only attack your black party members.

This sounds like something the South Park games would do, if Token's even a playable character in those. Or if you max out the difficulty and thus make yourself black in the character creation menu at the beginning.

Len
Jan 21, 2008

Pouches, bandages, shoulderpad, cyber-eye...

Bitchin'!


RareAcumen posted:

This sounds like something the South Park games would do, if Token's even a playable character in those. Or if you max out the difficulty and thus make yourself black in the character creation menu at the beginning.

I'm pretty sure this is a thing


https://www.polygon.com/2017/10/9/16435592/south-park-race-difficulty

Frank Frank
Jun 13, 2001

Mirrored

marshmallow creep posted:

I parried the one in Farum Azula, saw my +25 greataxe tickle him because his health and armor are so stupid high, and said gently caress it and hit him with rot breath. My friend did one better and kited him to a jump. Crucible Knights can't jump and will fall to their deaths.

The only way I’ve ever seen one fall is if they do that flying/wing attack and it takes them off a ledge. I’ve never seen one just walk off.

marshmallow creep
Dec 10, 2008

I've been sitting here for 5 mins trying to think of a joke to make but I just realised the animators of Mass Effect already did it for me

Pretty sure he baited an attack like that, but he had jumped to an island of floating debris first.

The thing about Crucible Knights is they are just so tedious. I know what to do--parry-- but that still means waiting out their non parriable attacks and outrunning breath weapons and rolling through the tail swings until they do the thing I can punish if I time it right. At least other enemies let me punish between most any attack, but crucible Knights just eat up time and are not fun.

marshmallow creep has a new favorite as of 18:19 on Apr 9, 2022

Len
Jan 21, 2008

Pouches, bandages, shoulderpad, cyber-eye...

Bitchin'!


Commander Niall and that whole fort are just an unfun slog

marshmallow creep
Dec 10, 2008

I've been sitting here for 5 mins trying to think of a joke to make but I just realised the animators of Mass Effect already did it for me

Learning that going right after entering Niall's boss fight will draw the first guy to you for a one on one, then going left gets the second guy for another one on one, and then you can just take Niall alone made that fight worlds easier.

kazil
Jul 24, 2005

A fancy little mouse🐁!

I've done Niall several times now after struggling hard on him the first time. Still think he is a lovely boss.

Kaubocks
Apr 13, 2011

Len posted:

Commander Niall and that whole fort are just an unfun slog

niall is where i uninstalled the game, idk. i resent how it makes me look like some nobody from a piece of side content made me ragequit, but it was just enough general negative opinions about the game piling up and he was the tipping point to me.

i actually enjoyed the fort itself for the most part. i recently respec'd into a greatshield build, and it was fun going one-on-one against the banished knights and feeling out guard counter windows. but getting to the boss, finding out it's Another Multi Enemy Boss, finding a finger remedy on the shortcut to the boss as if being told "yeah, we know", finally getting the adds down after a few attempts, but then still just getting my health bar utterly rocked by 1-2 attacks (through 50+ vigor and decently heavy armor), meh, nah. just kinda done with it.

Owl Inspector
Sep 14, 2011

increasingly being driven insane at the sheer number of enemies and bosses in elden ring that are far too big for the camera. at melee range you can see all of 10% of them at a time, and you either have to learn their telegraphs based on ankle movements or awkwardly angle the camera straight up so that you can't see the terrain or where you're hitting anymore. it's understandable to have one or two cases of incoherent bad gameplay like this throughout a whole game, but elden ring reuses these fights everywhere to the point of absurdity. difficult to see how this many of them got past development with nobody saying "uhh you can't actually see anything in melee range of these enemies, maybe we should zoom the camera back more during their fights or scale them down?" monster hunter rise releasing immediately before elden ring really made this stand out because that is a game exclusively about fighting giant monsters which does not have this issue

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Oxxidation
Jul 22, 2007
i've long grown used to most of those bosses but the fire giant felt like a joke at my expense

Oxxidation has a new favorite as of 20:10 on Apr 9, 2022

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