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withoutclass posted:Only if you touch it. 
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Jul 15, 2022 08:05
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Not sure if this goes in the networking thread, hardware thread, or what, but this seems like the most applicable thread so I'll ask here first. I bought a UDM pro a while ago to replace my old router with the intent of adding cameras later on. I was finally able to snag a few cheap G3 Instant cameras to start with (and will add a doorbell camera later on if they can ever stay in stock for more than 30 seconds, plus maybe 1-2 more exterior down the road). So now I need storage. What's the best drive for a surveillance application? Looking around, the WD Red is geared towards NAS, but they also make a Purple specifically for surveillance. This guy: https://www.newegg.com/purple-wd40p...&quicklink=true Is $90 for 4TB. That should be plenty of storage for me, and the price seems right. Is this a good start, or are there better drives out there for this?
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Jul 15, 2022 13:06
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DaveSauce posted:What's the best drive for a surveillance application? Looking around, the WD Red is geared towards NAS, but they also make a Purple specifically for surveillance. I'm in the same boat here. When I looked at Ubiquiti's guide for picking out a 3rd party drive, they explicitly mentioned you'd want 7200RPM, which I haven't seen on any of the smaller WD purple drives (< 8TB). Would love to know if this cheaper/smaller drive is enough because my plan was to offload video onto my server box with lots of storage anyway. edit: Ubiquity HDD Requirements defmacro fucked around with this message at 15:24 on Jul 15, 2022 |
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Jul 15, 2022 13:56
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defmacro posted:I'm in the same boat here. When I looked at Ubiquiti's guide for picking out a 3rd party drive, they explicitly mentioned you'd want 7200RPM, which I haven't seen on any of the smaller WD purple drives (< 8TB). Would love to know if this cheaper/smaller drive is enough because my plan was to offload video onto my server box with lots of storage anyway. I was not aware of that. Looks like there's a Red Pro 4TB had a price drop across vendors a few days ago... $20 more than the Purple and is 7200 RPM: https://www.newegg.com/red-pro-wd4003ffbx-4tb/p/N82E16822234345 I was initially looking at the Red, but found out the Purple is designed for surveillance. So I guess the question is: is there anything the Purple can do that the Red Pro can't? edit: the 4TB Red Pro is the only one so cheap, anything bigger is a huge jump in price. DaveSauce fucked around with this message at 14:22 on Jul 15, 2022 |
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Jul 15, 2022 14:19
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The number of streams you can write to disk at once will be the main bottleneck. If you've only got a handful of cameras I'd expect any WD Purple to be okay, but worry about getting 7200RPM disks if you have a lot of cameras. I don't know what those numbers would actually equate to since there's different bit rates based on how the stream is encoded and what FPS you're recording events at. However I feel like the general rule of basic WD Purple for a few to higher end for a lot makes sense. I've seen a number of 16 camera NVRs by Hikvision or clones just running with some 1TB disk in them. Maybe it's a purple, maybe not, maybe it's 5400 rpm, but I don't know. A number of businesses have those things run for years on those.
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Jul 15, 2022 15:11
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I stuck a Samsung 870 8TB SSD in my UDM Pro for camera storage. Maybe kind of a waste, but the seek times when scrolling through recorded video is soooo fast.
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Jul 15, 2022 15:40
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I've got three of the G3 Instants and a G3 Flex recording to a 5TB 2.5in 5400rpm SMR Toshiba drive in a CK2+ and writing has been fine. Actually playing back video can be a pretty slow process sometimes though. If that'll work then I feel like almost anything will.
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Jul 15, 2022 15:58
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Thanks for the details y'all! Seems like 5400 RPM will be fine for my use case too.
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Jul 15, 2022 18:03
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defmacro posted:Thanks for the details y'all! Seems like 5400 RPM will be fine for my use case too.  just ordered the 4TB purple I linked above. We'll see how it works!
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Jul 15, 2022 18:32
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fletcher posted:I stuck a Samsung 870 8TB SSD in my UDM Pro for camera storage. Maybe kind of a waste, but the seek times when scrolling through recorded video is soooo fast. This is where I'm at for any application that needs its own physical storage but doesn't need tons of it. If there's not a pressing need for >1TB, SSDs are cheap enough to not even consider spinning disks.
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Jul 15, 2022 18:52
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My friend told me about plex and that whole thing and now I basically have to rethink this build around an 8 drive case now. I think theres a bunch of around 20L cases to pick from, and finding parts to go into those is going to be a lot easier. I think I'll get the dtx version of that board i posted earlier and try to put it in a Silverstone DS380. Since I'm getting a bigger build, I think I'll just host all of my weird microservices on that instead of getting a separate device. If I could find some kind of GPU to fit in that case, would I be able to do plex + nas + misc game servers or would i need something beefier?
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Jul 18, 2022 00:25
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Korean Boomhauer posted:My friend told me about plex and that whole thing and now I basically have to rethink this build around an 8 drive case now. I think theres a bunch of around 20L cases to pick from, and finding parts to go into those is going to be a lot easier. I think I'll get the dtx version of that board i posted earlier and try to put it in a Silverstone DS380. Since I'm getting a bigger build, I think I'll just host all of my weird microservices on that instead of getting a separate device. If I could find some kind of GPU to fit in that case, would I be able to do plex + nas + misc game servers or would i need something beefier? If you want with jellyfin instead of plex you wouldn't need a separate GPU, because the Ryzen 5750g you're planning on has video de/encode on it. Plus you wouldn't need to pay for Plex Pass. Plex is pretty crap IMO, lmao at having a subscription to transcode and still not supporting basic hardware.
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Jul 18, 2022 00:42
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Plex pass lifetime goes on sale for something like $75 a couple times a year. Pretty worth it tbh.
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Jul 18, 2022 00:53
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Oh poo poo and its open source too. Neato. Now I just gotta find ram that'll support ECC and I should be gravy to get this thing built. I'm super excited because I've been wanting to build a NAS for some time and it owns I'm finally gonna have it done.
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Jul 18, 2022 00:56
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I think my friend bought me the lifetime pass a couple years ago, but I'd have to dig through my stuff to see if that happened or not.
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Jul 18, 2022 00:56
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Plex is, when you think about it, not that far away from being something that could be called a scam, in that you're paying money for them letting you use code already built into the program using an API from Intel that's freely available to anyone who cares to look it up. I wouldn't be surprised if it'd be possible to flip the switch using dtrace -w (destructie mode).
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Jul 18, 2022 14:55
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It's fine to charge money for doing work, and the plex people do work to make plex the easiest setup for non-nerds. But it's frankly embarrassing to charge money and then be poo poo at the thing you're charging for. If you charge money for transcoding but fail to support 1/3rd of major GPUs for years and years, and users in your forums are demonstrating it's possible by hacking it in, that's a giant fail. The scam is not charging money to support some open-source APIs, the scam is being bad at said support. (And anyone nerd enough ITT to be building a DIY home NAS, is probably nerd enough to set up jellyfin instead of plex.)
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Jul 18, 2022 15:11
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Half the point of Plex is about the front ends and apps IMO rather than the backend services. iOS, Media Player, tvOS, etc. are all better experiences than, say, Infuse Pro (I have a sub for that too in interest of supporting competition). Frontend work takes a lot of blood sweat and tears that lots of OSS folks just won’t do nor have the capability to do with their resources. What bugs me about Plex is more that they’re trying to be a content portal or something rather than be a digital age TiVo.
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Jul 18, 2022 15:23
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The frontend is why I use Plex. I was previously running multiple Kodi instances linked to a shared MySQL database, I have no problem nerding out on setting things up, but Plex "just works" on basically every smart device platform I might want to run it on. Smart TVs, game consoles, even cable boxes. If it has Youtube, Netflix, and Prime clients it probably also has Plex. Nothing else competes on that metric.
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Jul 18, 2022 16:52
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withoutclass posted:Plex pass lifetime goes on sale for something like $75 a couple times a year. Pretty worth it tbh. Nah
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Jul 18, 2022 17:43
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necrobobsledder posted:Half the point of Plex is about the front ends and apps IMO rather than the backend services It's this. Plex (the video player) is well supported across drat near every way to watch streaming content, including the lowest-possible-denominator options for Fire TV / Roku sticks. It would not be difficult for me to set up Jellyfin instead but that's a lot of not-very-computer-literate people I'd have to educate and... nah.
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Jul 18, 2022 20:18
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Jellyfin has a bunch of apps too though? https://jellyfin.org/clients/ Its a Plex clone so I don't see why it would be any harder for non-technical people to use.
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Jul 18, 2022 20:23
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VostokProgram posted:Jellyfin has a bunch of apps too though? https://jellyfin.org/clients/ Jellyfin runs on all the major multi-vendor platforms and Apple devices, but it has extremely limited support for vendor-specific platforms. No Tizen, extremely limited WebOS support that just came out weeks ago, no game consoles, no TiVo, etc. All platforms on which I have used Plex in the last year, Xbox and an unsupported CX OLED being two of my three main viewing platforms. Not the biggest deal in the world for home use by any means, there are enough cheap devices out there that it's not like it's hard to work within the limits, but I like the fact that when I travel if there's a smart TV in my hotel/airbnb it almost always supports Plex. If I'm visiting a friend and crash on their couch they definitely have something that supports Plex. No matter where I am, if I'm in front of a TV that's connected to the internet there's a pretty good chance I can watch something from my server without having to hook up any of my devices, I just download an app and enter a code on a web site. wolrah fucked around with this message at 22:14 on Jul 18, 2022 |
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Jul 18, 2022 22:11
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Imagine setting up a home media server just to keep using whatever poo poo os shipped with your tv and not like using a $20 firestick or chromecast that is universal and not a piece of poo poo.
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Jul 18, 2022 22:54
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is it normal for amazon to basically just break drives on purpose when they ship them? i ordered 4x WD Red CMR 12tb drives to go in my synology; they arrived in a large cardboard box with a couple of those plastic pillows and the drives were loose in antistatic bags. one of them won't do anything or report health status, and the other will boot but has >1400 bad sectors and isn't usable in any way. ok, i figure i can get replacements. those arrive in individual antistatic bags in a plastic mailing bag like you'd use for a tshirt. no cushioning or other packing. believe it or not, neither will report health status or do anything, one makes a very loud repetitive clunking when trying to start up. i guess i could keep playing the replacement game until i get 2 functional drives but this seems painfully stupid. i also figure there's like a 100% chance these go back into inventory when i send them back, right? at least the warranties check out on the WD page
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Jul 18, 2022 23:38
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Are you ordering them from a third party seller? I'm just one anecdote and its been a while since i ordered a drive from Amazon but IIRC they always had adequate shipping protection. You might try returning the ones that are busted and ordering from a different website, you should try and not buy a bunch of the same disks at the same time from the same seller. You tend to get disks all from the same manufacturing batch / lot # and disks from the same lot usually fail around the same time. Getting fastballed into the fedex truck notwithstanding. Mr. Crow fucked around with this message at 23:49 on Jul 18, 2022 |
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Jul 18, 2022 23:46
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these are/were through amazon but who knows. i'll just refund the two bad hdds and pick up a couple from somewhere else.
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Jul 19, 2022 00:09
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I’ve had multiple hdd shipments from Amazon that arrived individually packaged with the little plastic holders that keeps the drive suspended in the middle of the box. No problems. I did not expect to be endorsing Amazon when I woke up this morning.
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Jul 19, 2022 00:12
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the milk machine posted:is it normal for amazon to basically just break drives on purpose when they ship them? That sounds maddening. I recently ordered two drives from Amazon (separate orders) and they were each sent in a ready-to-ship box with hollow plastic pieces that held the drive in place in the middle. One of them even went the extra mile and came with the box further wrapped in one of those white bubble-wrap Prime envelopes. Haven't tested them yet, but unless they were grossly mishandled in transit I don't expect to have any issues.
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Jul 19, 2022 00:16
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Hey thread! So my partner and I bought a new camera and it's caused our storage usage to go up tremendously. I'm not sure I'm going to want to do a NAS, but maybe sometime in the future. Hoping you can help out with some quick answers? I have an 8TB WD elements I bought a while ago. Being dumb, I partitioned it into 3 partitions: 1 = ext4 and the other two are exFAT (or vFAT?). I've got it hooked up through USB3 to an old laptop I use as a ghetto home server. Guess who installed CentOS8 right before it was killed off? This guy... It's on my todo list to move to another distro. Anyway, all of these partitions are shared out using Samba so windows/macs can see it easily. Here are my questions: 1) I can't seem to copy files larger than 4GB or so to the two exFAT Samba shares. I can just fine to the ext4 share. Is this a limitation of exFAT over samba? or did I misconfigure it somehow? 2) What's the best FileSystem to use if I want to be able to hook the drive up to linux/windows/mac either over the network AND occasionally locally via USB. NTFS? I'd normally think exFAT, but the above networkshare issue is freaking me out. 3) We're planning to get a 14TB WD Elements from MicroCenter this week since we're running out of space. Should I partition at all? or just one huge one using the FS above? does it matter? I feel like I messed up the partitioning on our 8TB drive. I'm using old habits from back in the day since I haven't had to deal with drives/storage in a while. I'd like to learn and not repeat the same mistakes. 4) I'm currently backing up (disaster recovery) to Azure, but want to move to something else... any recommendations? Finally, I'm sure this isn't the thread for it, but here goes: 5) Knowing that phones/cameras aren't doing much processing on movies to optimize them. what's the lossless codec people use to encode their footage nowadays? Encoding time isn't that important right now, but with the new camera, I recognize that saving raw 4k files is a losing game. Hope this isn't too ramble-y. I try to stay up to date with this thread, but have like 1000 unread posts and can't afford the time to catch up right now. Thanks so much!
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Jul 19, 2022 00:22
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Add me to the "pleasantly surprised" pile of anecdotes regarding Amazon's shipping of HDDs. I also got cardboard boxes with those plastic sleeves that suspend the drive away from the box edges. In fact, I ordered from from Amazon instead of directly from WD because WD's website was full of reviews ranting about how terribly WD packages their HDDs, which seems absolutely insane for a HDD company.
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Jul 19, 2022 00:28
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Mr. Crow posted:Imagine setting up a home media server just to keep using whatever poo poo os shipped with your tv and not like using a $20 firestick or chromecast that is universal and not a piece of poo poo. Also, not about to put any more adware and spyware company hardware in my home than is required to go about my business. Regardless of the technicals, the truth is that usability of apps while having some HCI constants does come down in the end to personal taste which can vary widely. I've had nothing but problems dealing with my mother in law's Chromecast while with the Apple TV and Plex apps she uses at both her home and when she's over it's been surprisingly consistent. Consistent, mostly static interfaces really does matter for a lot of non-nerds that learn computing user interfaces very differently (it's more like rote memorization like how we'd remember phone book entries, not necessarily concepts of taxonomies) than from most of us prosumer type users.
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Jul 19, 2022 02:46
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Technically isn't WebOS from Palm and then HP? Built on beOS yes but in the same way OSX is mach/bsd hybrid at its core? It really has nothing to do with how easy it is to program for.
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Jul 19, 2022 02:54
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namlosh posted:I have an 8TB WD elements I bought a while ago. Being dumb, I partitioned it into 3 partitions: 1 = ext4 and the other two are exFAT (or vFAT?). I would not bother partitioning a new drive. I'm not clear on why you'd do it in the first place. If it's just organizational, folders are much easier to deal with if you don't get things right from the start. All the free space is dynamically available for whatever needs it.
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Jul 19, 2022 03:58
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Mr. Crow posted:Imagine setting up a home media server just to keep using whatever poo poo os shipped with your tv and not like using a $20 firestick or chromecast that is universal and not a piece of poo poo. That's what I do*, but it's not what everyone else who uses my Plex server does. *or I buy a Roku TV because you can't not get a smart TV at this point and I'd rather have that than most other options. the milk machine posted:is it normal for amazon to basically just break drives on purpose when they ship them? Yeah, HDD packaging is all over the place, especially since Amazon mixes all inventory of a SKU regardless of who the "seller" is. I'd stick to buying retail-boxed from Amazon in most cases, since that takes out most of the variables. A WD Easystore/Elements is already packaged pretty safely, for example. I remember buying my 5TB Toshibas as actual retail-boxed bare drives from Amazon, but that was five years ago. I actually just bought a bunch of used 10TB SAS drives on eBay. I was a bit worried when I saw they were literally crammed in the smallest box possible with basically no padding between drives, but they were surrounded by at least some padding in the box - and so far they're close to 72 hours in on an nwipe run with zero errors across them.
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Jul 19, 2022 04:19
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I have a plex user running it from a PS3 of all things.
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Jul 19, 2022 07:38
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I set up Jellyfin yesterday since I hadn't given it a proper shot. Last Plex alternative I tried was Emby, which completely failed the non-technical user challenge. Jellyfin would probably be fine if it was just for me, someone that has been using software built by pirated media nerds since the original xbmc. As soon as the client asked me to enter an IP or server name I had to rule it out as a suitable candidate for my parents and in-laws in their 70s and 80s. In Plex all they have to do is click a link in an auto-generated email and they are able to start watching stuff on my server. 75% of my Plex users aren't technical enough to handle or even care about switching to direct play, so anything that causes even minimal friction on setup is a non starter.
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Jul 19, 2022 12:38
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Flipperwaldt posted:Centos does not have exFAT support out of the box, from a superficial googling, you would have to have intentionally enabled it. If you're slightly uncertain about what filesystem you actually used, it seems entirely more likely that you formatted the partitions as FAT32 instead, which does indeed have a hard 4GB file size limit. ExFAT does not have this limitation and is currently what I see being recommended for maximum interoperability with most modern operating systems if you need to connect the drive through usb. Thanks for the reply. Wow, I must have totally misremembered and messed that up hard when I set up the ghetto server and 8TB drive. How embarrassing… I used to know this stuff. Either way, looks like I’ll be looking for a Linux distro that supports exFAT and samba so I can reinstall ghetto server a lot sooner than I thought. Thx again
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Jul 19, 2022 13:07
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namlosh posted:Thanks for the reply. Wow, I must have totally misremembered and messed that up hard when I set up the ghetto server and 8TB drive. How embarrassing… I used to know this stuff. You can probably enable exFAT support from EPEL. Is it possible to mount an exFAT filesystem on Red Hat Enterprise Linux? And I wouldn't really say CentOS 8 was killed, they just ended the support earlier and you need to upgrade it to Stream, which may be suitable distro for your needs.
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Jul 19, 2022 13:27
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| # ? Apr 29, 2024 18:43 |
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That’s fair, I had looked at doing that when the change happened, but felt like stream would cause me to have to touch it more often. I have bad luck with Linux kernel updates, but maybe I should consider it again. I remember when I was looking that a new Distro called Rocky was going to take up the space left by CentOS LTS. Did that ever gain traction? Is anyone using it?
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Jul 19, 2022 13:37
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