MonsterEnvy posted:I am going to predict three matches against Guel. A straight rematch once his Dilanza is fixed where he puts up a better fight, but still loses. And a third match where he goes against Suletta in a Demi Trainer instead of Aerial and still loses, and just realizes that she is better than him. I think that's how it'd go if they want the Guel Redemption Arc sort of thing. If they want to go straight up Guel Villain story I imagine the first rematch would have Suletta in something other than the Aerial and pulling off a close victory, which would be what drives him over the edge for a final showdown when he probably rides a mobile armour or something and blows up for good.
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Oct 7, 2022 06:26
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Gaius Marius posted:Suletta is the worst protagonist I've seen in Gundam FULL STOP. Worse than Kio. Her studdering unconfident demeanor is both loving annoying and boring as all poo poo to watch. This kind of poo poo is why Ferrigno lost the title to Arnold. I hate watching unconfident people. Utena was confident as hell, why couldn't they lift that from the series. Seriously every second that Suletta was on screen was a new low, she is an albatross tied around the neck of the series dragging it into the see of garbage.
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Oct 7, 2022 06:33
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so mad about a girl stuttering that i couldnt use the right 'sea'
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Oct 7, 2022 06:33
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Gaius Marius posted:Let's get into the even worse stuff. The slap was horribly done, this should be a tense scene and they try and play it as a joke. Bad. The gently caress the slap was great. Gaius Marius posted:And then Suletta fucks off and lets the other girl take her robot? What even is this poo poo, when she saves her it feels more like she's offended that she took her robot then that she needs to wipe this rear end in a top hat off the face of the earth Suletta was lost, as Miorine took her map and the keys to Aerial, she never let her take the robot. And Suletta was more offended that she took the robot. As she said Aerial is hers. The rest of your stuff is a more blanket I disagree.
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Oct 7, 2022 06:45
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Gaius Marius posted:Watched the first episode. We gonna have to break this into three parts. Jesus Christ take it to your blog
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Oct 7, 2022 06:48
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Yeah no Suletta rules. "Aerial and I would never lose to the likes of him" is the exact opposite of unconfident so no idea what you were watching.
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Oct 7, 2022 06:48
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MonsterEnvy posted:
That makes some sense. I'd thought that she'd copied her information from her phone not actually taken it. And if she had I wonder why Suletta had such a time getting back, If you can get somewhere you should be able to get back. Anyone remember before AGE came out when the rumor was that Flit's phone controled the gundam and people losing their poo poo about it. It's all I was thinking when she placed the phone in the cockpit. Artum posted:Yeah no Suletta rules. "Aerial and I would never lose to the likes of him" is the exact opposite of unconfident so no idea what you were watching. The entire rest of the episode?
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Oct 7, 2022 06:53
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Artum posted:Yeah no Suletta rules. "Aerial and I would never lose to the likes of him" is the exact opposite of unconfident so no idea what you were watching. Yeah, she's not "unconfident", she's just overwhelmed on her first day of school being around a whole lot of new people and concepts when she's never so much as seen someone her own age before. Put her in familiar circumstances (ie; in the Aerial with something to fight) and she clearly knows what she's doing. As she does right at the start of the episode when she spots someone in apparent distress and is raring to get the Aerial out the door of the transport to save them.
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Oct 7, 2022 06:56
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She was completely uncomposed during the rescue. And being overwhelmed is unconfident. One should go into any place or situation with their head held high and ready to tackle whatever comes. Instead of hiding behind her tablet.
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Oct 7, 2022 07:04
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Tabletops posted:Jesus Christ take it to your blog i think it's ok for someone to post their thoughts and opinions in the Something Awful discussion thread for the show they're talking about, even if i don't like their opinion. i do think it's bad to set an arbitrary standard of particular personality traits and criticize a protagonist on the merits of not possessing them though. i believe in the power of stories to make even protagonists who uh, lack confidence, the center of an interesting narrative and audio/visual experience. i do hope the second episode has more of a fight though. i found the dull part of the fight to be kind of long and the cool part of the fight feels like it ends immediately. it's not bad and while i'm not as big a fan of the pacing i think the basics of the fight are fine, it just didn't wow me and i was kind of hoping it would.
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Oct 7, 2022 07:05
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Two things are clear, at least to me: 1. Suletta has no clue how to interact with people on a social level and knows it, and is very unconfident about talking to people. 2. Suletta is a loving badass pilot and knows it, and the concept of losing in a mobile suit just isn't on her radar. You can see it in the way she doesn't hesitate to stand up to Guel in the garden, even though she doesn't know what to say. In the way she shows no fear about being on the grounds when there's mobile suits fighting literally threatening to stomp her. In the way she rushes out to save Miorne in space, or the way that it doesn't even occur to her that fighting a battle as a mecha pilot with someone sitting on her lap might present a problem, because it doesn't. Sure she's a bumbling trainwreck in any situation NOT involving her in a MS, and that's kind of funny, but to just paint her with a wide "unconfident" brush seems way off. She's not unconfident, she's socially incompetent, and maybe doesn't broadcast her confidence competently, and I'm going to guess that's where we're going to see a lot of her character growth over the course of the series.
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Oct 7, 2022 07:07
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Gaius Marius posted:She was completely uncomposed during the rescue. And being overwhelmed is unconfident. One should go into any place or situation with their head held high and ready to tackle whatever comes. Instead of hiding behind her tablet. Uncomposed from *checks notes* seeing someone in life-threatening danger. And yet still executing a complex maneuver to catch a moving spacesuit carefully and bring them into the cockpit of her mobile suit perfectly.
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Oct 7, 2022 07:09
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Gaius Marius posted:She was completely uncomposed during the rescue. And being overwhelmed is unconfident. One should go into any place or situation with their head held high and ready to tackle whatever comes. Instead of hiding behind her tablet. Jesus Christ
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Oct 7, 2022 07:10
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i don't think it's entirely unfair to say suletta isn't confident in social situations i rather suspect people would not be arguing that point if it was made in a post praising the show instead of criticizing it tbh
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Oct 7, 2022 07:11
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Gaius Marius posted:She was completely uncomposed during the rescue. And being overwhelmed is unconfident. One should go into any place or situation with their head held high and ready to tackle whatever comes. Instead of hiding behind her tablet.
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Oct 7, 2022 07:13
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Neddy Seagoon posted:Uncomposed from *checks notes* seeing someone in life-threatening danger. She nearly breaks the restraints on the suit trying to get out their, that is no composed behaviour. Consider a drowning child, if a frantic beach goer dives in after them and barely manages to pull them above water and if a a lifeguard wearing aviators dives in after them after tossing some lifesaver you'd have a same outcome different levels of confidence and composure situation. Thus it is with her rescue
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Oct 7, 2022 07:13
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ninjewtsu posted:i don't think it's entirely unfair to say suletta isn't confident in social situations
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Oct 7, 2022 07:16
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Gaius Marius posted:She nearly breaks the restraints on the suit trying to get out their, that is no composed behaviour. Consider a drowning child, if a frantic beach goer dives in after them and barely manages to pull them above water and if a a lifeguard wearing aviators dives in after them after tossing some lifesaver you'd have a same outcome different levels of confidence and composure situation. Thus it is with her rescue Except she performed the rescue itself perfectly. The only lack of "composure" was her concern over someone potentially dying within minutes and considering herself as the most viable means of rescue, rather than wait for someone else to locate and get to them in a longer span of time. And a valid consideration on her part as she had a launch-ready mobile suit, the location of the person in question, and the skillset to execute the rescue.
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Oct 7, 2022 07:17
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Gaius Marius posted:She nearly breaks the restraints on the suit trying to get out their, that is no composed behaviour. Consider a drowning child, if a frantic beach goer dives in after them and barely manages to pull them above water and if a a lifeguard wearing aviators dives in after them after tossing some lifesaver you'd have a same outcome different levels of confidence and composure situation. Thus it is with her rescue Consider a D&D poster, but they're posting about Gundam.
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Oct 7, 2022 07:17
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Endorph posted:she is awkward and uncertain in social situations but that is a bit different from 'confidence' as a general personality trait. i know people who are confident and can barely get a sentence out when talking to someone. social awkwardness, stuttering, difficulty communicating your thoughts, etc are much more complicated than just a lack of confidence. id have a problem with implying that there was even if it was in a post saying this was the greatest work of art ever made. i'm kinda thinking of the part where she slaps a guy's rear end and then immediately cowers behind one of his friends when he, uh, asks her what her problem is there's certainly an argument that confronting him in the first place is a huge show of confidence and that being scared isn't a disqualifier but i also think arguing about the nuance of what is and is not confidence is a little dumb. suletta is timid but righteous enough to do the right thing despite being scared (and curious enough to act against her fears to be inquisitive). i think it'd be more accurate to say she's brave than to say she's confident.
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Oct 7, 2022 07:22
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Neddy Seagoon posted:Except she performed the rescue itself perfectly. The only lack of "composure" was her concern over someone potentially dying within minutes and considering herself as the most viable means of rescue, rather than wait for someone else to locate and get to them in a longer span of time. And a valid consideration on her part as she had a launch-ready mobile suit, the location of the person in question, and the skillset to execute the rescue. She didn't perform the rescue perfectly. She nearly damaged her ship and her suit because she didn't wait for proper authorization.
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Oct 7, 2022 07:22
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And Mio would have died if she hadn't, dumbass.
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Oct 7, 2022 07:23
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Gaius Marius posted:She didn't perform the rescue perfectly. She nearly damaged her ship and her suit because she didn't wait for proper authorization. So what you're saying there is she had the confidence to act on her own to try and save someone?
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Oct 7, 2022 07:23
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ninjewtsu posted:i'm kinda thinking of the part where she slaps a guy's rear end and then immediately cowers behind one of his friends when he, uh, asks her what her problem is i think she's confident in certain scenarios but feels awkward and unsure in others. she's had very little socialization with anyone her age (or socialization in general) so it seems like rather than lacking confidence she has just literally never developed the baseline skills to manage it. its like driving a car, if someone put a kid whod literally never seen a car before in his life behind the wheel and the kid was nervous, you wouldn't really say the kid 'lacks confidence.'
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Oct 7, 2022 07:25
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Neddy Seagoon posted:So what you're saying there is she had the confidence to act on her own to try and save someone? No she was too unsure of herself and her abilities and tried to force the situation. Ranzear posted:And Mio would have died if she hadn't, dumbass. Irrelevant
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Oct 7, 2022 07:25
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This is the weirdest loving doubling down I've ever seen and I read my own posts.
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Oct 7, 2022 07:27
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Endorph posted:the mental illness understander has logged on isn't even a mental illness thing. their assertion is loving wild lol.
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Oct 7, 2022 07:30
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Gaius Marius posted:No she was too unsure of herself and her abilities and tried to force the situation. Uhh, if she was unsure of herself and her abilities, why was she actively launching a mobile suit to engage in a complex rescue maneuver against the suggestion of the shuttle crew that she sit tight and let a rescue launch pick the spotted person up?  The only thing in her way was the shuttle crew not really wanting to let her out of the ship (and a sensible consideration on their part as it was clearly a bit off-protocol), but her launch and rescue were clearly textbook. Bullseye grab on a small moving object in space, got an apparently-panicking person into safety without losing them or putting herself at risk (which is a difficult thing for experienced rescuers during beach rescue work, to use your own example), and pressurized the cabin.
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Oct 7, 2022 07:31
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Tabletops posted:isn't even a mental illness thing. their assertion is loving wild lol.
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Oct 7, 2022 07:31
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Endorph posted:no need to be a dick, dude. im talking about personal definitions of something with a lot of nuance to it. i dunno if he was nervous thinking he wouldn't drive well because it was his first time i think i would indeed call that lacking confidence. sorry for being a dick. i'm of the opinion that gaius marius isn't right but of all the things he said about the show this is an oddly specific detail for the thread to focus in on, it feels a lot like wanting to attack him for something but not wanting to engage with the actual meat of his critique. i certainly shouldn't be throwing stones about doing that though, i split hairs about tiny nuances all the time and i also do not want to engage with the meat of his critique. i will say that while i disagree with your example here, on review of some of the scenes i do think suletta is confident. when she chooses to take an action i don't think she has any doubt that she'll succeed, whether that's rescuing miorine or stepping in to get guel to stop harassing miorine or when challenging him to a duel. she's not well composed and certainly does not project confidence, but i'm not seeing anything that indicates she doesn't believe in her own abilities. ninjewtsu fucked around with this message at 07:38 on Oct 7, 2022 |
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Oct 7, 2022 07:35
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yeah that metaphor wasnt quite right? let me be more literal. early social development literally affects how a child's brain grows. a child who misses or never gets a chance to hit key social development milestones - first friend, first secret, first time sneaking out the window to go to the movies (not literally that one but you know what i mean) - is gonna function differently in a social situation. suletta's trying to adjust for skills she's never developed, or that have atrophied. if i can take a second stab at a metaphor, rather than the car thing, its more like if you took a kid whod never been out of bed for 5, 6 years and then told them to walk down the street. the capacity to walk is there, but they have to redevelop the muscles, or develop muscles that never got a chance to fully grow in. they're gonna stumble. i focused on this specific part of gaius's critique because most everything else he said was largely subjective, or things i even somewhat agree with, but i disagree with his read on suletta's character.
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Oct 7, 2022 07:48
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sure, i think that's a good explanation for suletta's character. she isn't projecting confidence because she has not developed the social skills to know how to do that or have practiced it at all, but not being able to directly communicate confidence is not the same as lacking confidence. thanks for explaining that, i thought this was a dumb conversation but i was wrong, i do genuinely understand the character and the story better for it.
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Oct 7, 2022 07:59
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this is why gaius marius' posts are good even though i hate reading them
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Oct 7, 2022 08:01
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Gundam, as a franchise, is filled with awful, boring, downright annoying or uncharming protagonists. They are consistently the worst or weakest part of the series. Suletta is an absolute breath of fresh air imo.
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Oct 7, 2022 08:01
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i do not agree with that
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Oct 7, 2022 08:03
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this convo was interesting but you do not, in fact, gotta hand it to beatrice
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Oct 7, 2022 08:03
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Suletta is an enormous cringe baby but I wouldn't have it any other way
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Oct 7, 2022 08:09
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drrockso20 posted:Suletta is an enormous cringe baby but I wouldn't have it any other way She's a disaster and I want to see where she goes
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Oct 7, 2022 08:13
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ninjewtsu posted:
I think that's because, and I'll probably know if this is a compliment by the end of this post, Gaius is really hard to argue with. There's an elegant mix of shitpost and genuine intelligent argument to Gaius's analysis that makes it seem easy to find flaws in them, only for it to turn out that, even when you disagree, they've got a lot of backing and thought put into them that makes a reflexive counter much less effective than it seemed. I've agreed with him and greatly disagreed, but I've often been forced to seriously consider positions I'd normally dismiss in a blink, and that's a lot of work. Easier to latch onto a small point than tried to disassemble the whole. (Also, in the interests of full disclosure, I'm pretty much on Gaius's side on this one at the moment, but that's a side note when discussing general trends.)
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Oct 7, 2022 08:15
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Gaius Marius posted:Suletta reading a checklist isn't exactly a compelling opening concept. Gaius Marius posted:That sort of shot of the descent into hell you see in Bob, La Flambeur
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Oct 7, 2022 08:21
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