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shimmy shimmy posted:Kind of seems like a bad move on her part if she missed out the more generous severance package. Shes been working for Twitter in Ireland for over 10 years so under Irish law shes entitled to 21 weeks of redundancy pay at a minimum (its 2 weeks per year worked for the firm + 1 week on top), significantly more than his offer to staff of 12 weeks. EU employment law is pretty incredible for employees.
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Dec 3, 2022 00:39
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Blut posted:Shes been working for Twitter in Ireland for over 10 years so under Irish law shes entitled to 21 weeks of redundancy pay at a minimum (its 2 weeks per year worked for the firm + 1 week on top), significantly more than his offer to staff of 12 weeks. How does Amazon warehouse staff in the EU?
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Dec 3, 2022 00:47
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BiggerBoat posted:Further, when we work a table ( my job is to read hands, count chips and ensure that bets are paid out correctly and no one cheats or fucks up),
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Dec 3, 2022 01:03
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Twerk from Home posted:How does Amazon warehouse staff in the EU? How do they employ them do you mean? By complying with local employment law, Amazon doesn't have a choice in the matter. It varies a bit from country to country but the headline stuff would be approx 6 weeks a year of paid leave, 6-12 months of maternity leave, a week of paid sick leave per year, a maximum working week of 48 hours, meeting quite strict rules for dismissal if you want to fire someone where you have to provide valid justification and give lots of notice, mandatory scaled payments for redundancy based on duration of employment, break entitlements during the work day etc. (figures are for Ireland mostly because I know them offhand, but other countries like France tend to be even more generous) I still remember the shocked reactions of American colleagues when I worked for a tech firm that had offices in both the US and EU when they found out the differences in what EU staff were entitled to vs what they got in the US for very similar roles. Employment laws in the US are a bad joke.
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Dec 3, 2022 01:05
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Conversely US staff makes 30-50% more. How housing / COLA scales I have no idea.
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Dec 3, 2022 01:25
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BiggerBoat posted:True but, OK. In my particular case I was working in a franchise sign making shop so make of that what you will. It was overkill. I have a part time job working with a housing program for the homeless, we are deliberately low tech as all get out and everything is on paper, works pretty well overall and the audits go smoothly because the government agencies can just go "yes these people have their documents (they needed them to get in.) their rents have been paid (paper receipt book with triplicate carbon paper. Takes them seconds and it takes me the time it takes me to scrawl my monthly meeting note with my people on a sheet of paper that goes in their file. MEANWHILE. I took someone to an urgent care yesterday, they do not have a phone, the entire sign in process requires a cell phone to operate, them not having a phone literally shut down the front desk while they tried to figure out what to do about it.
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Dec 3, 2022 01:44
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Thanks Ants posted:lol if they don't have a freeze on shipping new features during that time of year, why do they need people in Just the opposite, he wants new features added as quickly as possible. https://twitter.com/bestofdyingtwit/status/1598801624042209280
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Dec 3, 2022 02:49
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Also that, oh "we implemented that feature in five minutes". Like the gently caress, you don't want to test it first, have one or two eyes go over it? Have a bit of a chat with people in other groups who work on parts of the site the feature might affect? No, okay. Well sure that's all going to work out fine.
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Dec 3, 2022 03:16
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Arsenic Lupin posted:Start a thread? I'd love to hear more about your job. I thought about it but there's already an Ask/Tell casino thread. Technically I don't work in a casino but it's close enough. I'll post more about it in this thread but, six months in, most of the stupid poo poo they do has a reason behind it.
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Dec 3, 2022 03:24
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Remulak posted:Conversely US staff makes 30-50% more. How housing / COLA scales I have no idea. I'm not in tech and it's not EU either, but I took about a 45-50% paycut to come to Japan and I have significantly more disposable income than I've ever had in my life, a much bigger house, and far more time off and less stress. It is insane how bad working conditions are in the US across almost every industry.
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Dec 3, 2022 03:32
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I get more pto working catering at a UK university than twitter people got before the latest dumb musk move
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Dec 3, 2022 03:34
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dr_rat posted:Also that, oh "we implemented that feature in five minutes".
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Dec 3, 2022 03:47
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dr_rat posted:Also that, oh "we implemented that feature in five minutes". gently caress it, we'll do it
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Dec 3, 2022 03:48
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I’ve definitely implemented features in five minutes that got shipped with minimal revision… after a month’s worth of testing and a certification process. Surely this is what they mean, right? Right?
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Dec 3, 2022 03:56
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Guys when Elon says that features were implemented in five minutes he means that he told someone to code, then posted "working on it".
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Dec 3, 2022 04:00
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dr_rat posted:Also that, oh "we implemented that feature in five minutes". The only one he denied is where someone suggested he stops trying to trade sex for horses. Or maybe that was the 5 minute approval.
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Dec 3, 2022 04:24
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Hey, some features don't need that much rigor to deploy. I think they could replace the Twitter logo with a swastika in five minutes.
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Dec 3, 2022 07:35
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See, that would be blocked by i18n and legal Wait, I hear that those brakes aren't there anymore, full steam ahead!
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Dec 3, 2022 07:37
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Remulak posted:Conversely US staff makes 30-50% more. How housing / COLA scales I have no idea. Not always, the staff in my ex-company that were doing similar roles in the US and the EMEA HQ in the EU were on a pretty much identical wage, maybe 5-10% difference due to currency differences. In general it true that there is a big salary drop though. But when you're working 25%+ less hours per year, and on top of that not paying for health insurance or carrying any college debt to pay off the actual disposable income tends to even out unless you're in a very highly paid job in the US ($150k+). Plus obviously a much higher quality of life with all the holidays, shorter work week, employment security etc (I also used to work in the US and took a paycut to move back to Europe but would do it 10/10 times again)
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Dec 3, 2022 11:22
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dr_rat posted:Also that, oh "we implemented that feature in five minutes". It's kinda funny, back when I was in uni and Agile development was the new hotness, this was the exact thing we were warned against. The general idea with agile is that you quickly slap together a barely working prototype to see if you're on the right track, and then iterate on that based on feedback. And I still recall almost word for word the "downside" section of that approach: "The greatest risk with agile development is managers believing it can be used to achieve finished products more quickly, when that is explicitly not its purpose". Yes, you can get something that technically works quite quickly, but you still need to do the actual legwork of validating it, technical cleanup, documentation, and so on. Trying to skip those steps is a typical pitfall of startups, but to see an actual multi-billion company going that way is just  .
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Dec 3, 2022 12:03
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Perestroika posted:It's kinda funny, back when I was in uni and Agile development was the new hotness, this was the exact thing we were warned against. The general idea with agile is that you quickly slap together a barely working prototype to see if you're on the right track, and then iterate on that based on feedback. And I still recall almost word for word the "downside" section of that approach: "The greatest risk with agile development is managers believing it can be used to achieve finished products more quickly, when that is explicitly not its purpose". Bear in mind teslas have been on sale for a decade or whatever and the software still isn't finished.
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Dec 3, 2022 12:25
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NotJustANumber99 posted:Bear in mind teslas have been on sale for a decade or whatever and the software still isn't finished. Yeah people routinely get locked in/out of their Teslas due to bugs that haven't been fixed, and to say nothing of the occasional battery fire. Also their build quality is crap (see that tweet before about a guy whose steering wheel came off)
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Dec 3, 2022 12:36
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blastron posted:I’ve definitely implemented features in five minutes that got shipped with minimal revision… after a month’s worth of testing and a certification process. Surely this is what they mean, right? It's cute that you think front end apps have robust test suites.
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Dec 3, 2022 14:22
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Perestroika posted:It's kinda funny, back when I was in uni and Agile development was the new hotness, this was the exact thing we were warned against. The general idea with agile is that you quickly slap together a barely working prototype to see if you're on the right track, and then iterate on that based on feedback. And I still recall almost word for word the "downside" section of that approach: "The greatest risk with agile development is managers believing it can be used to achieve finished products more quickly, when that is explicitly not its purpose". Yeah, management sees 'fast results' and then that becomes religious dogma for literally the entire sector.
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Dec 3, 2022 16:22
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Perestroika posted:you quickly slap together a barely working prototype to see if you're on the right track, and then iterate on that based on feedback. Done right it's not "barely working" but "working just enough". A big part of (healthy) Agile is the concept of the Minimum Viable Product. At the start you pick out the most essential User Stories and get that into production. Say you've been tasked with developing an in-house employee database. The MVP would have all the fields you'll want in the database, the most essential reports a button click away, but if anyone wants a report that won't get used often or you can live without, they get to write some SQL. Once you have the MVP going, you work on the project backlog and implement new features in each sprint. If you did a thorough job of creating User Stories, you'll have fields in the database that won't get used for months or even years after the MVP launches, but they're part of the database from day one, just waiting to be used.
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Dec 3, 2022 17:14
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mllaneza posted:If you did a thorough job of creating User Stories, you'll have fields in the database that won't get used for months or even years after the MVP launches, but they're part of the database from day one, just waiting to be used. It's more than just creating user stories. In your example someone needs to turn that into something that looks a whole lot like a "plan" or "design document" to distill all of the basic "not boxing ourselves into a corner" things that need to be done or not done along the way. I see this part skipped routinely in some places I've been. One time I was told that it's because "that's not very agile". And of course that came out of the mouth of a non-technical product manager.
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Dec 3, 2022 17:20
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mllaneza posted:Done right it's not "barely working" but "working just enough". A big part of (healthy) Agile is the concept of the Minimum Viable Product. At the start you pick out the most essential User Stories and get that into production. Say you've been tasked with developing an in-house employee database. The MVP would have all the fields you'll want in the database, the most essential reports a button click away, but if anyone wants a report that won't get used often or you can live without, they get to write some SQL. Once you have the MVP going, you work on the project backlog and implement new features in each sprint. If you did a thorough job of creating User Stories, you'll have fields in the database that won't get used for months or even years after the MVP launches, but they're part of the database from day one, just waiting to be used. Of course, what's the realistic chance that you got the schema for the fields you are not actually using right, and there are no bugs in what's in them/oversights in test coverage of them?
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Dec 3, 2022 17:27
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Weird how all software development methodologies still wind up producing worthless trash, way behind schedule.
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Dec 3, 2022 17:49
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mllaneza posted:Done right it's not "barely working" but "working just enough". A big part of (healthy) Agile is the concept of the Minimum Viable Product. At the start you pick out the most essential User Stories and get that into production. Say you've been tasked with developing an in-house employee database. The MVP would have all the fields you'll want in the database, the most essential reports a button click away, but if anyone wants a report that won't get used often or you can live without, they get to write some SQL. Once you have the MVP going, you work on the project backlog and implement new features in each sprint. If you did a thorough job of creating User Stories, you'll have fields in the database that won't get used for months or even years after the MVP launches, but they're part of the database from day one, just waiting to be used. It's not always clear where the iterating is supposed to happen though. Just like with waterfall, a bunch of executives sit in a room at the beginning at the project and come up with the project objectives. Then these get turned into epics and then stories and are added to the backlog. When users have problems these get registered as bugs and are added to sprints along with stories for developers come up with a band-aid for. Without a way for user problems to cause basic assumptions to get reconsidered, there's no iteration. It's just waterfall with agile terminology.
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Dec 3, 2022 17:53
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cat botherer posted:Weird how all software development methodologies still wind up producing worthless trash, way behind schedule.
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Dec 3, 2022 17:54
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That's why you don't let execs plan poo poo
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Dec 3, 2022 18:00
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Dalmuti posted:That's why you don't let execs plan poo poo Nobody is allowed to plan anything. Just do stuff and hope you have a different job when the stuff you did explodes.
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Dec 3, 2022 18:13
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SaTaMaS posted:It's not always clear where the iterating is supposed to happen though. Just like with waterfall, a bunch of executives sit in a room at the beginning at the project and come up with the project objectives. Then these get turned into epics and then stories and are added to the backlog. When users have problems these get registered as bugs and are added to sprints along with stories for developers come up with a band-aid for. Without a way for user problems to cause basic assumptions to get reconsidered, there's no iteration. It's just waterfall with agile terminology. Unfortunately, yes, "hybrid agile" is the approach I've typically seen where there's a fundamental misunderstanding of things like minimum viable product. I recently left a job where I was constantly being asked when a new feature was going to be implemented, a new feature that wasn't needed while we were working on MVP.
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Dec 3, 2022 21:16
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The only conditions I’ve seen to support true minimum viable product development are seed stage startups where the founder has prior product experience or companies where the PM has complete autonomy over their product and execs just look at spreadsheets all day.
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Dec 3, 2022 21:58
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nachos posted:companies where the PM has complete autonomy over their product and execs just look at spreadsheets all day Do these places exist?
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Dec 3, 2022 22:08
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Bel Shazar posted:Do these places exist? Briefly. Then they are gone or become successful enough to get loving ruined. (no, I'm not bitter. Oh wait....yes I am)
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Dec 3, 2022 22:29
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theres no place in capitalism for heroics
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Dec 3, 2022 22:32
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I've said before that a lot about capitalism makes sense when you realise the role of an executive is that of feudal nobility, who is assigned a fief to do with as they wish, except it doesn't even matter if they burn their fief to the ground because they'll be given another one.
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Dec 4, 2022 04:24
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https://twitter.com/samwcyo/status/1597792097175674880
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Dec 4, 2022 23:26
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That’s so similar to the Indian banking app attack where you could auth as your user but just supply the account ID of someone completely different and it would accept it
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