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CodfishCartographer posted:
It's because he does/did not realize that he has depicted Tony as an abusive father. It's obvious his goal was to depict Tony as a flawed father who Annie was eventually able to come to terms with and understand that her parents aren't perfect people, so it's a sign of maturity that she accepts him. The incredible backlash towards Tony may have made Tom realize the inconsistencies of how he perceives him and how the text illustrates him, but it is obvious that Tom is not interested in examining why those inconsistencies exist.
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Apr 17, 2023 01:51
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| # ? May 10, 2024 22:19 |
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We already know how Tony won Kat over so easily. Mind control. Sure, Kat’s parents say that’s not true, but how would they know? They’ve been exposed to Tony’s hypnotism rays for years! This will all be revealed as part of the same twist that makes Annie fusion retroactively good, you’ll see.
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Apr 17, 2023 02:22
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Snake Maze posted:We already know how Tony won Kat over so easily. Mind control. Sure, Kat’s parents say that’s not true, but how would they know? They’ve been exposed to Tony’s hypnotism rays for years! This will all be revealed as part of the same twist that makes Annie fusion retroactively good, you’ll see. With all the "shocking twists" and established stuff thrown out the window at a moment's notice. Anything is as likely as anything else so sure. Why not.
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Apr 17, 2023 02:24
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Tom needs to hurry up and bring Tony back into the narrative so we can maintain this level of Tony Posting at all times.
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Apr 18, 2023 06:41
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CodfishCartographer posted:Anxiety brain is powerful, and I can honestly see this counting as Tony "talking" to Annie and thus he'd be unable to. Same with any other proxy way of talking to her, such as asking someone he CAN talk with to relay a message, etc. That being said, it wouldn't hurt to show us Tony trying those things and failing. Or like you said, show him trying to help Annie in ways that don't directly involve talking to her, to show that he truly does care about her. Just because he can't communicate with her doesn't mean he can't work to help her! "..." "Mr Carver?" "...it's fine..." *exasperated sigh* "Hello Anthony, how is the omega project progressing and also I promise not to tell anyone" "Thanks Greg. We've made excellent progress on the transluminar attractor and expect to complete on target. The five-fold path simulation is up to three full folds with folds gamma and zeta at 25% and 75% respectively. How's the wife and kids? Don't tell them I asked."
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Apr 18, 2023 12:26
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Skippy McPants posted:The only way for people to make friends with Tony is off-screen because nothing he can show us will balance out how he treats his daughter. I think this was a huge breaking point in the comic for me as well, especially with somebody who's *had* an emotionally abusive father. Just, saying "everything's cool and solved now, don't look behind the curtain at everything I've set up throughout the whole comic!" is loving buckwild to expect your readers to buy. I haven't kept up with things regularly since the Two Annies/Tony's Bizarre Redemption "Arc" catastrophe.
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Apr 18, 2023 22:09
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Yeah, the more I think about it, the more it seems that the only way the whole thing makes sense is if we genuinely weren't meant to see Tony Carver's actions as actual abuse, just the failings of a flawed father.* That's why we have Kat's father telling Annie about that story with Brinnie, many chapters before Tony returned to the Court and had that whole sequence over the next few chapters read like he is a villain who turns Annie's life upside down. We were meant to "be hoodwinked", so to speak, just like Annie and her classmates (and Kat, initially), but then once Annie got to know her dad better we were supposed to realize he is not a bad person, just flawed, forgive him with her and move on to the next plot. But the problem was that the negative effect Tony had on Annie over the whole story rang way too true to life for that to work out. That was severe emotional damage Annie suffered over her the whole of her childhood and several of her teenage years, not just the unfortunate moments of mild dysfunction that come with being an imperfect human being, raised by other imperfect human beings, to be brushed aside and forgotten once children learn their parents aren't perfect. So to anyone who has witnessed or lived similar life situations, Annie is doing the best she can in her situation, doing all the emotional labor of assuming the best of her father all the time, brushing aside her own feelings to aid in an adult's recovery. And without getting too personal, but being there sucks. It's putting your emotional life and development on-hold until you pass crisis mode and then all the things you had buried will come out when something triggers them, either by entering a new life stage or by reaching enough stability to feel safe enough. And so to anyone that knows what that is like, it's like waiting for the other shoe to drop. Annie is portrayed in that conversation with Jones like someone who has reached some sort of zen state of profound realization and emotional maturity, but the truth is that she is taking on a huge debt her future self will have to pay and the rest of the comic pretends it isn't so, and that really really sucks to see. edit: * Because maybe the point of contention for the author here is that intent doesn't decide effect when it comes to abuse? Tony isn't a monster, he cleary doesn't mean to hurt Annie. That doesn't mean he isn't doing it. Someone being sorry doesn't mean you have to continue subjecting yourself to pain, or pretending like the pain isn't there, or like it was worth it and things will be better now if you grin and bear it. I mean I'm preaching to the choir by now because anyone who didn't already side-eye how the comic developed Tony's relationship to Annie is probably long gone from the thread but it feels like I have to write it anyway isasphere fucked around with this message at 23:12 on Apr 18, 2023 |
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Apr 18, 2023 23:06
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I think it comes down to the fact that Tom, as the comic made clear eventually, doesn't see Tony as abusive. I think this was meant to be a story of Annie having trouble coping with her father's absence, because she didn't know enough about him. Kat's sudden turnaround was supposed to be surprising, but also an early clue that Annie was missing something. Tony turns out to have a heart of gold underneath it all, happy ending. Of course if you recognize the abuse, then the rest of it is a mess. E: lol I sat on this post on my phone for way too long, beaten. Ditocoaf fucked around with this message at 23:26 on Apr 18, 2023 |
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Apr 18, 2023 23:22
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Ditocoaf posted:I think it comes down to the fact that Tom, as the comic made clear eventually, doesn't see Tony as abusive. lol, at least it's not just me edit: also I think this point has been made before in the thread but gently caress if my memory can pull the posts up to the surface isasphere fucked around with this message at 23:31 on Apr 18, 2023 |
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Apr 18, 2023 23:28
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isasphere posted:lol, at least it's not just me Tony has come up so many times I think every point that could be made has probably been made multiple times including this one. But to be fair Mindcage in particular and it's terrible "resolution" to the whole Tony thing was the moment that really turned people away in droves from the comic. So it's a pretty important topic to discuss and probably more interesting than whatever is happening in the comic now. Even if the same sort of points are being made each time it comes up.
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Apr 19, 2023 00:25
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isasphere posted:lol, at least it's not just me No it’s definitely not just you. Tom might be the only person on earth who didn’t read Tony as abusive.
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Apr 19, 2023 06:01
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Yeah, like, you can go back and look in this very thread. Every single person read Tony as an antagonist. It seemed obvious, even after his backstory and motive were revealed because none of that justified abusing his child. It was even good, at the time, because he was a well-written and well-characterized piece of poo poo. We were all waiting patiently for the arc to pay off. But then it... uhh. It didn't.
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Apr 19, 2023 07:39
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I said this a while back, quote:I think the ultimate problem with Tony is that the comic was actually too good, artistically speaking. Because Tony is a masterclass in how to introduce an incredibly loathesome villain. The pump is primed with all his prior behaviour trickled in - his neglect and how it harms Annie - while Kat acts as an audience surrogate seething over the abuse. When he finally bursts onto the scene, it is horrific and incredibly effective.
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Apr 19, 2023 08:01
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Oh hey, the zombie apocalypse happened because Skynet had a reasonable breakup. Why the gently caress was the first page on the last chapter if it turns out "undead rovot apocalypse" was just "the dormant robots wanted to cheer up their goddess'?
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Apr 19, 2023 12:05
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In this chapter, we discover that the entire purpose of the robot cult storyline was to lure Loup and Laina from hiding. 
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Apr 19, 2023 12:17
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This page is very pretty!
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Apr 19, 2023 13:15
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Randalor posted:Oh hey, the zombie apocalypse happened because Skynet had a reasonable breakup. Why the gently caress was the first page on the last chapter if it turns out "undead rovot apocalypse" was just "the dormant robots wanted to cheer up their goddess'? I can see Kat going "no it's fine, I'm sad but it's ok" and the robots going "NO IT'S THE WORST" because they have no concept of a reasonable breakup, their only metric is Diego. We'll see, I'd completely forgotten about that page.
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Apr 19, 2023 14:07
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Skippy McPants posted:Yeah, like, you can go back and look in this very thread. Every single person read Tony as an antagonist. It seemed obvious, even after his backstory and motive were revealed because none of that justified abusing his child. It was even good, at the time, because he was a well-written and well-characterized piece of poo poo. We were all waiting patiently for the arc to pay off.
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Apr 19, 2023 14:42
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Splicer posted:And that arc didn't even have to end with Tony as an antagonist. Again it's been said before, including by me, but the thing about a redemption arc is it has to include some actual redemption. it's not supposed to be a redemption arc, it's supposed to be a "growing up and coming to terms with other people and their flaws" arc, and it completely fuckin missed the mark on that, and left a lot of people feeling insulted that the moral seems to be "just forgive your abuser and be happy anyway."
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Apr 19, 2023 17:00
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https://www.gunnerkrigg.com/comics/00002773.jpg So sad can we get an F in the chat?
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Apr 19, 2023 17:20
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Our goddess is single? Perhaps it is time for Boxbot to make his move
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Apr 19, 2023 17:22
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Ngl I immediately thought 4 chan npc memes with the grey masses.
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Apr 19, 2023 17:32
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So-called free thinkers when their beloved angel loses her consort
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Apr 19, 2023 18:16
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Ah poo poo, she got Diego'd
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Apr 19, 2023 19:05
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I'm actually now very glad that Paz is going back to her family, I didn't think of how the robots would have taken their break up.
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Apr 19, 2023 19:16
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the comic has just become an extended metaphor for how everyone with the brains and means to do so are getting out of britain while the gettins good
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Apr 20, 2023 20:22
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Tree Reformat posted:the comic has just become an extended metaphor for how everyone with the brains and means to do so are getting out of britain
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Apr 20, 2023 20:57
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oh christ please no
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Apr 21, 2023 08:01
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A big flaming stink posted:oh christ please no me: oh it can’t be THAT bad, at least Kat is centre stage I am a fool. A dunce. A clown.
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Apr 21, 2023 08:05
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coolusername posted:me: oh it can’t be THAT bad, at least Kat is centre stage
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Apr 21, 2023 08:09
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Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
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Apr 21, 2023 08:23
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ahahahaha, amazing. You thought this chapter wasn't about Jerrek? Realize the depths of your naivete, as we suddenly check in on Jerrek in a featureless room somewhere. He's been reading over your shoulder this whole time. The real Gunnerkrigg Court starts now. edit: ...poo poo. I think this reaction means I've finished mourning, and am now just fully hate-reading GC. I don't wanna do that. Maybe time to stop reading again for a while, until curiosity draws me back again like it did last time. Ditocoaf fucked around with this message at 08:53 on Apr 21, 2023 |
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Apr 21, 2023 08:49
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Here we, here we go again!
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Apr 21, 2023 08:55
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Ditocoaf posted:ahahahaha, amazing. You thought this chapter wasn't about Jerrek? Realize the depths of your naivete, as we suddenly check in on Jerrek in a featureless room somewhere. He's been reading over your shoulder this whole time. The real Gunnerkrigg Court starts now. It will still be bad when you come back, leading you to hate read anew.
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Apr 21, 2023 08:56
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Jerrek more like Jerk! t
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Apr 21, 2023 08:59
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Finally, an interesting character!
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Apr 21, 2023 09:02
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Ohhhhh maybe this whole storyline is supposed to be farcical. I kept hearing the Curb Your Enthusiasm theme while reading this page. I genuinely doubt it, but it makes more sense if we're supposed to interpret this as a comedy of errors.
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Apr 21, 2023 09:09
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It's pretty interesting and a bit unexpected that Loup seems to have fully internalized the viewpoint robots have about Kat, to the point he calls her "angel".
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Apr 21, 2023 09:22
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Lt. Lizard posted:In this chapter, we discover that the entire purpose of the robot cult storyline was to lure Loup and Laina from hiding. Also nice call 
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Apr 21, 2023 09:26
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MOTHERFU
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Apr 21, 2023 09:47
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